Samsung HLS-5679W LED DLP Owners Thread (*NO PRICE TALK) - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 2946 Old 09-17-2006, 12:26 PM
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luidoly: I admit that it was very hard to calibrate brightness and contrast. I wasn't in a dark room and this severely hindered me. It's very subtle on the HL-S5679W so I can definitely see how others come up with very different results. On the sharpness, around 25 was right where one tiny bit of artifacting disappeared. On the test pattern described in Eliab's tutorial, between two of the horizontal cross lines immediately above the center, I saw a tiny pair of spots. At 25 they were gone.

Quisp: Tough choice. If you don't watch the TV for more than a few hours a day, and don't care about 1:1 pixel mapping then I'd probably save some money and get the 6187. If you want the "hopeful" promise of long bulb lifetime then I'd consider the 5679W. I'm convinced I made the right choice for me, but no TV is for everybody. If you can see the 5679W in a store it would probably help, at least if you can go into the user menu and set it to the settings Eliab suggests, and fiddle a bit from there (the color tone was the only significant bit of fiddling I would bother with in a casual viewing; combining it with the movie mode should give you an idea of what I thought was good). If I had it to do over, I'd probably have been more confident had I done exactly that (write down the specific settings and mess with them at the Ultimate Electronics). You'd probably do well to bring a favorite DVD or two as well so you can see good SD material in addition to their Blu-Ray or HD-DVD demos.

And BTW, I didn't see a noticeable difference in quality with 1:1 pixel mapping. I'll care more with the computer on, and it is probably useful to see a little more of the image in the "zoom" modes (which I need when watching letter-boxed SD on cable, to show them full-screen), but since it's tough to see the pixel structure at all, it makes only a small difference. I'm glad to have it though--I knew I would not be happy with a x87 and would have had to get a x88 instead, if not for the 5679W.
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post #632 of 2946 Old 09-17-2006, 04:52 PM
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Two unfortunate little snags, nothing with the TV itself:

1. My Ideal-Lume is dead already. It shipped with 2 3-4 inch self-adhesive Velcro strips. I used these to stick it on the back of the TV, about 2 inches up the "slope" of the TV. Well, the self-adhesive failed at the point of contact with the TV, and the unit fell off and hit the floor. It's now dead. I bought a second bulb so I can verify that it's the light itself. I've called the company and left a message, as I consider this a defect when they ship insufficient adhesive materials and no instructions telling you to "add some duct tape too" or anything like that. Had they not even included adhesive, I would have just duct taped it and it would have held. Oh and also, for a 3-4-foot drop to take out a new light is...disappointing performance.

2. TVA won't allow me to purchase the screen protection warranty. Although their website doesn't say this, they only let you purchase the extended warranty if you purchase the set elsewhere. Screen protection and lamp protection are not available. But the website only indicates that the BUNDLES of plans are available only through TVA. That's pretty lousy. If anyone knows of another place to get a screen protection warranty, including another place selling RepairMaster, please post of PM me. I was peeved enough at TVA to cancel the extended warranty too, for pulling this. It's a real shame because I really had wanted to work with TVA.

Let's see, what else:

When my cable box switches resolutions, the TV set gets weird digital artifacts for a second or two. It's one of the Adelphia DVRs in case that helps...it's no big deal, just a little distracting, and I'm wondering if this is the TV or the cable box doing it. I don't currently know of another way to switch resolutions without also switching sources, but others may have upscaling DVD players where you can switch the resolution (Hmmm, maybe I should check with going to/from progressive mode with my DVD player, I can at least do that).

Also, I'd love discrete codes for Game Mode on, Game Mode off (or toggle), 16:9, 4:3, Zoom 1, and Zoom 2. I called Logitech and they don't have them. I'll try Samsung soon if nobody on here has the codes.
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post #633 of 2946 Old 09-17-2006, 05:58 PM
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Banding is usually the consequence of a HDTV using only 8-bit per color video processing. Although typical HDTV video sources are encoded with only 8-bits per color the better HDTVs use signal processors with 10 or even 12-bits per color and use algorithms to dither the low order bits to reduce or eliminate the banding. What are the specs for the color depth of the video processing (either number of colors or number of bits) on the Samsung?

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post #634 of 2946 Old 09-17-2006, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

Banding is usually the consequence of a HDTV using only 8-bit per color video processing. Although typical HDTV video sources are encoded with only 8-bits per color the better HDTVs use signal processors with 10 or even 12-bits per color and use algorithms to dither the low order bits to reduce or eliminate the banding. What are the specs for the color depth of the video processing (either number of colors or number of bits) on the Samsung?

Ron Jones

10 bits is what I've heard for all the HL-S sets. I have no real way of confirming this though. I can't recall if another user opened his set and checked out whether the processing chips are the same as in the other HL-S sets.
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post #635 of 2946 Old 09-18-2006, 06:55 AM
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Quote:


You should read my post slowly and more carefully,

It would of been easier to read if all the sentences weren't in a single paragraph. Really makes it hard to read. That's probably why the point was missed.

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post #636 of 2946 Old 09-18-2006, 12:33 PM
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Hi everyone, I'm the "Mr. Rivera" that user [luidoly] mentioned as having calibrated his LED-based Samsung. Let me answer a few of the questions that are going around as well post some comments.

First off the set had some considerable colorimetry issues on all the default modes, but before I tackled colorimetry I dealt with white balance (i.e. gray scale). Once again all modes were considerably off, some of them measuring >12,000K across most of the range ! I was able to correct this via the Service Menu (using proper equipment). Next came colorimetry and thankfully the set provides the controls to correct this as well. To clarify my comment on LED vs. bulbs, what I stated was that I had never seen a digital set that allowed me to adjust colorimetry much above or below it's default y axis. This set gave me considerable range, hence I assumed it could be related to the LEDs.

On my follow-up visit I will concentrate on tackling the polarizing effect everyone is reporting and which was extremely obvious on this set as well. I will also create a separate color profile for non-HD content. BTW (and by mistake) I was able to reproduce the effect on my laptop by playing a DVD, bringing up the overlay controls and maxing out the gamma. I was left with a very similar effect when displaying pictures areas with low levels. This leads me to believe we are not dealing with a bit issue but a picture control setting. Unfortunately changing the default gamma to movie mode didn't fix the problem but I'll continue to look into this in the followup.

As other calibrators tackle the set I'm sure we will learn more and more ways to tweak this unit to as close to perfection as possible.

Sergio Rivera - "It can always look better."
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post #637 of 2946 Old 09-18-2006, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by LMDA1 View Post

As other calibrators tackle the set I'm sure we will learn more and more ways to tweak this unit to as close to perfection as possible.

Thanks for taking the time to post about your HL-S5679 work. We are very interested in what you learn.

There is a link at the bottom of my post where I'm trying to keep track of recent owner's reports about their ISF calibration experiences. Your work seems to be the first reported for the HL-S5679 LED set.
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post #638 of 2946 Old 09-18-2006, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by tg2k View Post

luidoly: I admit that it was very hard to calibrate brightness and contrast. I wasn't in a dark room and this severely hindered me. It's very subtle on the HL-S5679W so I can definitely see how others come up with very different results. On the sharpness, around 25 was right where one tiny bit of artifacting disappeared. On the test pattern described in Eliab's tutorial, between two of the horizontal cross lines immediately above the center, I saw a tiny pair of spots. At 25 they were gone.

Quisp: Tough choice. If you don't watch the TV for more than a few hours a day, and don't care about 1:1 pixel mapping then I'd probably save some money and get the 6187. If you want the "hopeful" promise of long bulb lifetime then I'd consider the 5679W. I'm convinced I made the right choice for me, but no TV is for everybody. If you can see the 5679W in a store it would probably help, at least if you can go into the user menu and set it to the settings Eliab suggests, and fiddle a bit from there (the color tone was the only significant bit of fiddling I would bother with in a casual viewing; combining it with the movie mode should give you an idea of what I thought was good). If I had it to do over, I'd probably have been more confident had I done exactly that (write down the specific settings and mess with them at the Ultimate Electronics). You'd probably do well to bring a favorite DVD or two as well so you can see good SD material in addition to their Blu-Ray or HD-DVD demos.

And BTW, I didn't see a noticeable difference in quality with 1:1 pixel mapping. I'll care more with the computer on, and it is probably useful to see a little more of the image in the "zoom" modes (which I need when watching letter-boxed SD on cable, to show them full-screen), but since it's tough to see the pixel structure at all, it makes only a small difference. I'm glad to have it though--I knew I would not be happy with a x87 and would have had to get a x88 instead, if not for the 5679W.

Thanks for the info... I'll try some of your tips when comparing the 5679 to the 87/88
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Originally Posted by LMDA1 View Post

Hi everyone, I'm the "Mr. Rivera" that user [luidoly] mentioned as having calibrated his LED-based Samsung. Let me answer a few of the questions that are going around as well post some comments.

First off the set had some considerable colorimetry issues on all the default modes, but before I tackled colorimetry I dealt with white balance (i.e. gray scale). Once again all modes were considerably off, some of them measuring >12,000K across most of the range ! I was able to correct this via the Service Menu (using proper equipment). Next came colorimetry and thankfully the set provides the controls to correct this as well. To clarify my comment on LED vs. bulbs, what I stated was that I had never seen a digital set that allowed me to adjust colorimetry much above or below it's default y axis. This set gave me considerable range, hence I assumed it could be related to the LEDs.

On my follow-up visit I will concentrate on tackling the polarizing effect everyone is reporting and which was extremely obvious on this set as well. I will also create a separate color profile for non-HD content. BTW (and by mistake) I was able to reproduce the effect on my laptop by playing a DVD, bringing up the overlay controls and maxing out the gamma. I was left with a very similar effect when displaying pictures areas with low levels. This leads me to believe we are not dealing with a bit issue but a picture control setting. Unfortunately changing the default gamma to movie mode didn't fix the problem but I'll continue to look into this in the followup.

As other calibrators tackle the set I'm sure we will learn more and more ways to tweak this unit to as close to perfection as possible.

I'll be interested in hearing about your results...
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post #640 of 2946 Old 09-18-2006, 11:00 PM
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I'll be interested in hearing about your results...

Oh yeah. I'm extremely pleased with how the set looks, but seeing some explanations of a few key areas of the SM would be awesome. Particularly stuff like white balance, Gamma, and CCA I guess. I was tempted to buy a service manual but I keep hearing that it's virtually useless.
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post #641 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 11:59 AM
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Someone pull the trigger for me, please!! I have been wanting one of these for months now. I just can't seem to do it. Almost 4K after TV, stand, and cables. That's tough!! I even have the ok from the "boss" to get it. I guess I am just too big of a tightwad.

I considered just going with the 5687 which is much, much cheaper, but no PIP, bulb life and that freaking grey strip across the bottom steered me away from that one. The I looked at the 5688 which is a nice set. It has PIP and no grey strip, but bulb life is a concern with that one and any other bulb based set. I found the 5688 to be about 2 bulb purchases cheaper than the 5679 (trying to avoid price talk). So if these LED last as long as they are claiming, which I believe they will, the 5688 is actually going to be more expensive in the long run. I have heard the argument that I will buy a new TV by then anyway, but as you can probably tell I am not into spending big chunks on $$ that often. Whatever TV I buy will have to die before I replace it. Which brings me to the evil thoughts I have been having. "If my current TV dies on me, then I will HAVE to get a new one." Someone please come zap my TV for me. Ok I am rambling, I just needed to vent.

I am in the military and I guess I just need someone to tell me what to do.
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post #642 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 12:34 PM
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mnkhunter ,

This thread almost scared me off. Long story short, I got one, and I love it. Once I swtiched to movie mode, picture is beautiful. I like the idea of NO bulb, NO spinning color wheel. To me, this is the technology I was waiting for.

Admittedly, I am not a videophile, but to me the picture is the sharpest microdisplay I have seen, STABLE.

Ken
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post #643 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 02:30 PM
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mnkhunter ,

This thread almost scared me off. Long story short, I got one, and I love it. Once I swtiched to movie mode, picture is beautiful. I like the idea of NO bulb, NO spinning color wheel. To me, this is the technology I was waiting for.

Admittedly, I am not a videophile, but to me the picture is the sharpest microdisplay I have seen, STABLE.

Ken

I bought for the same reasons, of course. But to mnkhunter, I'd think heavily about how much TV you watch a day. Right now at least, my wife stays at home with my son, and the TV can be on for several hours of daytime plus a few at night. The TV can get over 10 hours of usage on some weekdays, maybe more on weekends if we don't go out. And these Samsungs are all nice TVs so you'll want to watch on it. Don't be surprised if you start spending extra time just to see some HD content that may be outside your usual areas of interest.

Given how much you'll watch, calculate out how long for the bulb replacement to become a factor. That will help you make a choice economically, since that seems to be a big deal for you. We can also talk about stability, color wheels, etc. but the fact is that this is still a first-generation technology and none of us know that our wonderful sets won't break down just like a color wheel might. I would definitely factor in an extended warranty for ANY HDTV over $1500 or so, and with the 5679 I'd max it out at the 5 year mark, whereas for a color wheel model you may or may not choose for yourself to get 5 years of coverage.

Oh, here's one other thing to think about, especially being in the military: Make sure you have the space for the box! You may be moving a lot and I wouldn't want to substitute another box, or ship it without a box...too fragile for that.
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post #644 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 02:31 PM
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mnkhunter,

If you have the resources then do it.

I've played around with the basic settings and gotten a very good picture on the TV using my PC and an HDMI connection. Even SD TV looks good through my PC tuners. While I've only done the most basic calibration, the folks here on this board have pointed me in the right direction to get what I consider a reasonable quality picture. I'm now sold on Movie mode -- it actually makes the last "Harry Potter" DVD look ok. It looked crappy on all other TVs I've ever tried it on (including some very expensive, large LCD screens), but now it looks fine on this TV.

Sure beats my old 32" CRT TV: SD DVDs look great and the number of WMV HD samples I've downloaded look just stunning. I simply cannot wait until the rest of the PC high-definition (and HDCP) pieces fall into place.
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post #645 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 07:31 PM
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Thank you all for your input. Like tg2k my wife is a stay at home mom with our 2 year old and 8 month old. The TV is pretty much left on all day, whether it is being watched or not.

tg2k: Good point on keeping the box. Even though the military would buy me a new TV if something happened, I would still be pretty bummed. I have went back and forth on the moving issue. On one hand I could wait 12 years to have nice things and not worry about moving them. That is definitely the "safe" bet, but who wants that. I want it now, so maybe I will make sure I can keep the box. I bet that box is huge.

I will also be replacing a 32" CRT. It sounds like that is what a few other people have been replacing. Time to go big!!! I will have this TV before week 9 of NFL or I will have decided to not get one at all. Time to get off the fence. Again, thanks for the input. I will keep you updated.
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post #646 of 2946 Old 09-19-2006, 07:46 PM
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mnkhunter, in your situation I doubt you'll regret getting the 5679W. The box and styrofoam, btw, add about 6 inches on each side, so just add about a foot to the dimensions of the unit and that should be about the size of the box. I'm not measuring mine as my wife wanted to get it put away in our basement the day the TV arrived--before I even calibrated it or anything!
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post #647 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 02:45 AM
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Just in case you need the extra push, the total cost of ownership may very well be less than any of the other Sammies. Bulb costs have already been mentioned, but LED's take far less power than a big bulb. While it hasn't been confirmed, I'm guessing the LED's probably use less than half the power of a bulb. Factor that over a few years and that adds up too.
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post #648 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 04:28 AM
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Originally Posted by ><</strong> View Post

I'm guessing the LED's probably use less than half the power of a bulb. Factor that over a few years and that adds up too.

Do military people pay their own utilities?

to each his own...
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post #649 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 06:15 AM
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Do military people pay their own utilities?


As long as you don't live on base, you do. Right now I am no where close to a base. The closest base is about 4 hours away.
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post #650 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 07:30 AM
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Even SD TV looks good through my PC tuners.

Great point Tac-Elf. I basically never used the SD tuners on my HTPC becuase the PQ was unwatchable. With the 5679, not only is it watchable, it is "not bad". This set really does a nice job on poor quality sources.
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post #651 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 08:02 AM
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It shouldn't matter. You are using less of a natural resource.

Hasn't anyone measured the current draw of this set yet?? Not rocket science. Get a DVM (with a 10 0r 20 amp scale), make up a adapter cable out of an extension cord with bananna plugs in the middle (break the 'hot') and plug the set in. Take a reading.
Or,
Buy one of those 'Kill-a'Watt" (or similar) plug in devices for $25 and read it that way.

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post #652 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 08:48 AM
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Your work seems to be the first reported for the HL-S5679 LED set.

David Abrams and I will be getting a 5679 in the lab very soon. Suffice it to say - we plan on tearing the thing apart.

Eliab
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post #653 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 09:18 AM
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we plan on tearing the thing apart.

It will probably void the warrenty.

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post #654 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 11:11 AM
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It will probably void the warrenty.

We'll take plenty of pictures so we can go back to where it was OTB....yeah right!

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post #655 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 11:17 AM
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David Abrams and I will be getting a 5679 in the lab very soon. Suffice it to say - we plan on tearing the thing apart.

Eliab

Well hurry up! I need to know if I should buy one before Dave gets here

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post #656 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 11:42 AM
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mnkhunter,

Just do it. I love mine and it is not even tuned up. My friend has the 5687 and he came over and looked at it and commented on the greater perceived depth in the picture over his set. Maybe the increased color gamut? If your wife has the set on all day you will run through multiple bulbs a year if you pick one of the other sets. My friends with the 5687 burnt his first bulb in less than 5 months, his wife stays home with a 2yr old and she runs it all day.

Cheers,
Ty
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post #657 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 01:24 PM
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Well hurry up! I need to know if I should buy one before Dave gets here

I should know by tomorrow how soon it'll be.

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post #658 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 02:59 PM
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does the 5679 accept 1080p over the component inputs (for the xbox360 upcoming patch) ?
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post #659 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 04:10 PM
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does the 5679 accept 1080p over the component inputs (for the xbox360 upcoming patch) ?

So far as I understand, yes it does.
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post #660 of 2946 Old 09-20-2006, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tydirian View Post

mnkhunter,

Just do it. I love mine and it is not even tuned up. My friend has the 5687 and he came over and looked at it and commented on the greater perceived depth in the picture over his set. Maybe the increased color gamut? If your wife has the set on all day you will run through multiple bulbs a year if you pick one of the other sets. My friends with the 5687 burnt his first bulb in less than 5 months, his wife stays home with a 2yr old and she runs it all day.

Cheers,
Ty


Thanks for the info Ty. I think I am going to do it. I can't wait any longer.
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