2008 Samsung DLP's Discussion (HLxxA650/A750) - Page 49 - AVS Forum
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post #1441 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by StevenZ View Post

I wouldn't get hung up on the published CR spec. For what it's worth, Rahull posted some outstanding calibration results in an earlier post, including a contrast measurement here.

Not sure I understand that reading but is that measuring 3,018:1? Is the 750 series supposed to be 10,000:1? I am also interested more in the 650 series.
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post #1442 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jhferry View Post

Your right, the only way Samsung will know about these issues is If you scream about them. When I called about my second 6176 they actually acknowledged issues with the set. Of course that makes it all the more disappointing that they didnt fix the bowing...

I was casually interested in this TV so I went to two stores near my house in the Toronto area. These are 2 independent dealers, on who carries Sammy, the other doesn't. Both stated that Sammy will be done with rear projection TV's within the next 4-6 months and the only person left standing on the RPTV will be Mitsu. I was a little shocked to hear that given that the new LED's have arrived. Has anyone heard about this? It could explain why they don't seem to be putting all the effort in to fix the issues...
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post #1443 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JD44 View Post

After my last post a bit earlier today, I immediately got on the phone w/ Samsung (for the second time). The csr was much friendlier and more willing to help this time around.

I mentioned the power cycling issues I am having along with my specific scenarios - it appears to happen when I'm running in a 1080p resolution w/ any device - I have not had an instance yet in 1080i with Blu-Ray or XBox 360 but time spent in these resolutions is very limited. I did also mention that others ("thru a forum I read") seem to be having power cycling issues in different scenarios as well.

I stated I would like from Samsung:

1) acknowledgement that there is an issue w/ unexpected power cycling
2) immediate notification when a resolution is found

I let the csr know that a very similar situation has been occuring with the LNnnA650 LCD sets and that I am hoping a simple firmware upgrade (as delivered to those set owners on 4/04) will handle the issue.

I also let it be known that while I think the set (HL61A750) is very nice, one of the key decision points for purchase was the ability to do 1080p. If the TV is unable to do this w/o problems, I will most likely return the set.

The csr has stated that the issue will be forwarded to ECR (I believe the acronym expands to "Executive Customer Relations" - but I was driving at the time and could not write it down) and I can expect a response within 5 days (I assume 5 business days).

Captain obvious statement: The csr also mentioned that the more voices that are heard concerning this issue, the more likely they (Samsung) are to address the issue in a timely fashion. Reiterating jhferry's statement, all of those having these power cycling issues, let's get on the phone with Samsung and let them know. Hopefully we can start enjoying the sets as we intended to sooner rather than later.

The number I dialed for Samsung support was 800-762-7864.

- Jim

Well, I called. First attempted was disconnected but with a helpful agent. Second attempted was unfortunately not disconnected with a useless agent. He indicated that firmware upgrade wouldn't fix this at all it was a hardware issue that required an on-site visit. :-(
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post #1444 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonde View Post

I was casually interested in this TV so I went to two stores near my house in the Toronto area. These are 2 independent dealers, on who carries Sammy, the other doesn't. Both stated that Sammy will be done with rear projection TV's within the next 4-6 months and the only person left standing on the RPTV will be Mitsu. I was a little shocked to hear that given that the new LED's have arrived. Has anyone heard about this? It could explain why they don't seem to be putting all the effort in to fix the issues...

All sign point to this unfortunately, I dont know about 4-6 months but I am guessing this is the last year. It looks to me like they rebadged last years LED with a new model name (Last years got a bad name from the bowing/Halo issues) and they took the 76 series bulb, took it out of that ultra slim cab and put it back into a slim cab. Hey, maybe they are leaving RPTV because they CANT fix all the issues. They know they cant sell unless they are thin and the thinner they go the more problems they have.
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post #1445 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhferry View Post

All sign point to this unfortunately, I dont know about 4-6 months but I am guessing this is the last year. It looks to me like they rebadged last years LED with a new model name (Last years got a bad name from the bowing/Halo issues) and they took the 76 series bulb, took it out of that ultra slim cab and put it back into a slim cab. Hey, maybe they are leaving RPTV because they CANT fix all the issues. They know they cant sell unless they are thin and the thinner they go the more problems they have.


If you really believe all that, why would you possibly still be interested in one of these sets?

Just wondering..

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post #1446 of 5059 Old 04-05-2008, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JD44 View Post

I finally hooked up the Xbox 360 via Component - I set the resolution to 1080p and had no problems with the dashboard (switching tabs and other various tasks). I fired up Rock Band and got to jam to a little Boston for all of...45 seconds. I then had three power cycles in a matter of one minute.

I have watched two movies or so in 1080p/24 with only one power cycle. It recycled during a fast action screen... I'm wondering if it could be a bandwidth issue.

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post #1447 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I have watched two movies or so in 1080p/24 with only one power cycle. It recycled during a fast action screen... I'm wondering if it could be a bandwidth issue.


That reminds me... I had a TV that would flash on/off on high speed action sections of DVDs... or if there was a sudden bright flash (like lightning on a black screen) the TV would almost do a restart... this was a EDTV CRT set from..... samsung! Any chance this is the same type of issue???

Has everyone's reset happend during fast movement or bright flashes etc??... or have some been during slow moving garden or cooking shows?

TK
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post #1448 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 04:23 AM
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Well the 61" DLP was on my short list; but if the thing turns on and off, that does not work for me.

For those with problems, please post the results.
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post #1449 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 04:38 AM
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What's the best way to get it to try to turn off? I have a HTPC hooked up to it at 1080p with 60hz, a PS3 hooked up (but no Blu-rays just yet), a 360 hooked up via component (until I get my HDMI cable) and a DVR hooked up via component also.
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post #1450 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I have watched two movies or so in 1080p/24 with only one power cycle. It recycled during a fast action screen... I'm wondering if it could be a bandwidth issue.

You may be on to something.

The short 30 min I got to spend with the 61A750 (the one with red convergence errors on the top 30% of the screen); I noticed each time I change menu screens, the screen would go black for 1 and sometimes 2 seconds before it would light back up again. It sort of reminded me of the Mits' ATSC tuners from 5 years ago and you would changed stations from 11-1 to 11-2 and waited up to 5 seconds at times.

The reason that got my attention on the A750, was because my last few HLT and HLS (with bulbs), changed all menu screens instantly. With the A750 (like when changing form "standard" to "movie"), that black out for almost 2 seconds sort of spooked me, until it lit back up. To me, that meant the set is "working" on stuff inside before it is ready..........in other words not enough processing power and/or bandwidth pipe to get the job done.

If you are feeding the set some of these newer heavy duty blu-rays at 1080p etc. with lots of fast action stuff, the set may not have the muscle to get the job done?
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post #1451 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Teknomedic View Post

Has everyone's reset happend during fast movement or bright flashes etc??... or have some been during slow moving garden or cooking shows?

That does it for me. In 1080p Xbox 360 Halo 3 I can repeat it over and over. Take a grenade into a dark corner and drop it at your feet. When it explodes TV resets every time. Very easy to repeat. In 1080i it works fine with no resets. I am connected via component cable.

P.S. My Harmony works great on the inputs I just used the old 89s as my tv selection and HDMIv2= HDMI1 HDMIv3=HDMI2
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post #1452 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I have watched two movies or so in 1080p/24 with only one power cycle. It recycled during a fast action screen... I'm wondering if it could be a bandwidth issue.

I don't believe so as it happens with standard OTA signals too.
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post #1453 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by ztkp01 View Post

I don't believe so as it happens with standard OTA signals too.

Is it possible that it's only happening with really bright (lots of white) scenes? If so, it's possible that these really bright scenes are overloading the power supply and triggering the TV to shut down. Just a thought, but if so it's possible that reducing the brightness could reduce or eliminate the problem (if nothing else it would help confirm that this is the problem).
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post #1454 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by EHUPP01 View Post

That does it for me. In 1080p Xbox 360 Halo 3 I can repeat it over and over. Take a grenade into a dark corner and drop it at your feet. When it explodes TV resets every time. Very easy to repeat. In 1080i it works fine with no resets. I am connected via component cable.

Wow...are these EMP grenades you keep dropping? Sorry, couldn't resist. Too funny that the "grenade" takes our your TV every time.

It actually is very good that you can repeat this phenomenon in a reliable fashion though (good for troubleshooting... not good for you). That's one of the first key steps to troubleshooting and (hopefully) finding a fix. The more often you can create the situation the more often you can start to observe the problem.

Now... how do we get Samsung to hook up their XBOX 360 and pop in Halo3 on 1080p and blow themselves up a few times in a dark corner??

Are you able to get this to happen over HDMI as well? Are there different TV settings you can try this on to see if other settings affect your ability to recreate? (ie, game mode, movie mode, etc... sorry I don't have the set yet so kinda guessing). Can you try other component/hdmi input ports and see if it's unique to all video inputs or just a few?

good work!
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post #1455 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Is it possible that it's only happening with really bright (lots of white) scenes? If so, it's possible that these really bright scenes are overloading the power supply and triggering the TV to shut down. Just a thought, but if so it's possible that reducing the brightness could reduce or eliminate the problem (if nothing else it would help confirm that this is the problem).

That's a good thought, gsr. Although how does this TV create "white" on the screen? I thought to make black it points the mirrors away (into a light "sink") 100% of the time duration so to make white does it point the mirrors toward the screen 100% of the time duration?

While I don't think the tilting of the micromirrors could make the power supply overload it is possible that there is something linked to processing lots of very dark and very white effects on the screen which occur suddenly which is causing the digital processing IC to consume more power than the power supply designers were asked to deliver. If this occurs then the voltage rails to the digital components will droop and probably invoke a reset of the digital board.

When the TV turns off/on does it seem to take the same amount of time as if you turn off/on the TV with the remote? Can anyone tell if the TV completely shuts down and restarts or does it seem to only power cycle some portion of the TV? (if there is a fan, does it shut off? can you tell if the light source shuts off completely and comes back? etc?)

As a side note: I was a my local BB yesterday and asked them to finally setup their floor model of the HL61A750. Within about 5 minutes of the TV working the curious floor agents had a screw driver in hand and had the side access panels popped off to look inside. After a brief period of "shadow puppets" by the BB agents (ROFL!!!) my wife and I looked inside the TV with the side access ports. We were surprised at how empty it looked in there. I also think it would be fairly easy to reach in and clear a majority of the inside of the screen this way(depending on your arm length).
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post #1456 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 08:17 AM
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so the new sammy projections arent great either just like the 650 LCD?? or are the new Samsung DLP's better than teh 650 LCD?? Can someone tell me what the major problems are for this TV please?? im lookin at teh LCD 650 but it has the reset problem still and i found the 650 DLP on CC for like 1500!!!!!! what a bargain and this 3d technology sounds sick as hell!!! can some give me some info on what would be the better buy...ive had to return and exchinge so many samsung TV's cuz in my opinion do not have good build quialty, becasue i had to go through 3 71's and finally got rid of it becasue of all the problems...so i dunno if im going to stick with samsung cuz i dont trust their life quality but info on this TV would be great cuz it is such a bargain
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post #1457 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 08:21 AM
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I will try the Halo 3 issue later today, just peering in to check the thread out before my g/f yells at me to keep cleaning
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post #1458 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonhawk View Post

If you really believe all that, why would you possibly still be interested in one of these sets?

Just wondering..

I had a Samsung HLS5087w that I am replacing. The one thing you never hear from me is anything negative about the picture. For the price point I am in, Samsung DLP cannot be beat for performance. I also have a 1080p Samsung LCD but when you hit 50" or more the price is through the roof. I dont have any issues with features/performance. I dont think any other DLP vendor comes close to the Samsung.
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post #1459 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Is it possible that it's only happening with really bright (lots of white) scenes? If so, it's possible that these really bright scenes are overloading the power supply and triggering the TV to shut down. Just a thought, but if so it's possible that reducing the brightness could reduce or eliminate the problem (if nothing else it would help confirm that this is the problem).

Keep calling Samsung guys... Especially If you can replicate the problem.
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post #1460 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 08:26 AM
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My guess is that the 61A750 wants to be transported "tall", standing up in its box (60.0" x 20.2" x 42.6", according to Samsung). I was hoping to cart this bad boy home, myself, but I don't have a vehicle with 43" of clearance -- though I could handle 43W x 60L x 20-35H. So I'm wondering two things:
  1. Do the carton's this-end-up arrows point at the 20" dimension, the 43" one, or to both/either?
  2. Has anyone loaded up and taken home a 61A750, laying down (20" tall), and subsequently found it to be free of the geometry problems some have reported?
I realize I could go with white glove delivery, but I want to retain the option to return and swap it with another unit or three if the first ones smile, tilt, or frown too much.

Edit: FWIW, a pleasant Samsung CSR just told me it could "damage the set" if the were laid down on its face or its back. Anyone feel otherwise?
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post #1461 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 09:05 AM
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Ok, just got off the phone with "Arlene" at Samsung, she just wanted to send a tech (which I explained to her was going to be a waste because it is probably a firmware issue, isn't just my TV (I've had blacking out on both sets I've had and power cycle (it didn't come back on) on the current one). I said I just wanted to be added to the list of people that had the problem. She said there is no list, no firmware upgrade (duh, its a new set) and at that point just wanted to get off the phone with me .

Earlier today, I was able to reproduce weird video issues, black screens, and just one time I had a power down on the 360 menu, if I go into the "Inside Xbox" section and flip through the screens (these are bright screens). I also have the Xbox video camera hooked up which makes my background unique.

I will try the Halo 3 thing soon.

Does not happen on anything except 1080p, I only have component, no HDMI on my Xbox.

I am going to try some more with my HTPC and see what I can do in the HDMI realm.

Matt
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post #1462 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknomedic View Post

That reminds me... I had a TV that would flash on/off on high speed action sections of DVDs... or if there was a sudden bright flash (like lightning on a black screen) the TV would almost do a restart... this was a EDTV CRT set from..... samsung! Any chance this is the same type of issue???

Has everyone's reset happend during fast movement or bright flashes etc??... or have some been during slow moving garden or cooking shows?

Perhaps with the XBox, yes, but not so far with Blu-Ray playback (via PS3). The resets all occurred during rather slow paced sequences. No Country for Old Men, Spider-Man 3, Good Luck Chuck (wife chose that one!). I tried playing back the same sequences to see if I could get the power cycle to happen again immediately with no luck.

As mentioned, though, if I run all devices @ 1920 x 1080i, 60 Hz, I haven't had an issue (yet). Made it through one movie last night and another this A.M.
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post #1463 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 09:10 AM
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After my poor experience with Samsung phone support this morning I'm ready to call in the big guns with any reproducable behavior we can confirm in this thread across the board (or should we start a new thread?).

I've had e-mail contacts before with both Steve Panosian and Carolyn Segura at Samsung before, I believe Steve is still there, not sure about Carolyn.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mistergadgett View Post

Now... how do we get Samsung to hook up their XBOX 360 and pop in Halo3 on 1080p and blow themselves up a few times in a dark corner??


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post #1464 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 10:03 AM
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I can get the 360 to go to black screen for a second or two quite frequently during the opening movie of Viva Pinata Party Animals and also during the "Beached" racing game.

Matt
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post #1465 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 11:18 AM
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Please forgive me if this is a stupid question. I just received my HL50A650 which should be 120 Hz. My questions is how do I get it to perform at 120Hz? I have a directv hd-dvr hooked up via hdmi and it is at 60hz.
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post #1466 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rliguori View Post

Please forgive me if this is a stupid question. I just received my HL50A650 which should be 120 Hz. My questions is how do I get it to perform at 120Hz? I have a directv hd-dvr hooked up via hdmi and it is at 60hz.

You do nothing. It is always doing 120Hz processing. When you press the display or info button and it shoes 60Hz, that is showing you the frequency of your INPUT. The set internally runs at the same rate, just like the resolution the set displays is always 1920x1080p, regardless of what you feed it. That's just how these DMD sets work.

Sheesh! No offense, but getting tired of the same old questions asked over and over again. It is 120Hz.


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post #1467 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenZ View Post

Has anyone loaded up and taken home a 61A750, laying down (20" tall), and subsequently found it to be free of the geometry problems some have reported?

According to the manual if you place the set face down it may cause dirt to become attached to the inner screen. I believe the arrows on the box point to the front of the set.

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post #1468 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenZ View Post

My guess is that the 61A750 wants to be transported "tall", standing up in its box (60.0" x 20.2" x 42.6", according to Samsung). I was hoping to cart this bad boy home, myself, but I don't have a vehicle with 43" of clearance -- though I could handle 43W x 60L x 20-35H. So I'm wondering two things:
  1. Do the carton's this-end-up arrows point at the 20" dimension, the 43" one, or to both/either?
  2. Has anyone loaded up and taken home a 61A750, laying down (20" tall), and subsequently found it to be free of the geometry problems some have reported?
I realize I could go with white glove delivery, but I want to retain the option to return and swap it with another unit or three if the first ones smile, tilt, or frown too much.

Edit: FWIW, a pleasant Samsung CSR just told me it could "damage the set" if the were laid down on its face or its back. Anyone feel otherwise?

I took it home in a car laying down with the screen facing upward. I have no geometry issues (at least I can notice without the grids) and just a speck or two of "dirt" that isn't visible unless my nose is touching the screen.
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post #1469 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 12:10 PM
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I called about the reset issue and level two tried to bump me up to level three... all I got was our corporate office is now closed please call back during business hours.

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Charles R is offline  
post #1470 of 5059 Old 04-06-2008, 12:19 PM
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I tried the "Halo 3 EMP Test" and my set passed with flying covers. No resets or anything, I think I'll keep playing for a bit

I did it in the map Foundry in a corner on multiplayer over HDMI (I have it set to 1080p but I think Halo 3 is 720p).
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