CRT, Light Guns, 1080i HD, and Multiscan. For retro game center. - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 6 Old 07-24-2013, 05:40 AM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
daibido1123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Winston-Salem, NC, USA
Posts: 7
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hi all, I am looking into HD CRT's that use Multi Scan tech to allow for the different refresh rates need for light guns from older consoles to work.

Right now I have been looking at the Monivision DM-7352SF, but I am not sure if that will work. So I am deferring to you all for information that can help me find a display that fits what I am looking for, and where I may find one, or if push come to shove at least helps me find the right direction in looking for a display that can do what I am looking for.

So let me list what i am looking for and we can go from there. Composite, S-Video, Component, and VGA Video inputs, with receiver outputs for 5.1 via optical, CRT 16:9 Tube with Multi Scan for video signals from 50Hz to 100+ Hz, and Max resolution of 1080i and lowest resolution 240i. From what I can find the other option I have is looking for a broadcast level display, with a deck that converts those inputs to BNC RGB signal.

I hope I can get some help in finding the right direction to go in.

Thanks all.
daibido1123 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 6 Old 07-30-2013, 02:36 PM
Member
 
homeomnimax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: midwest USA
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by daibido1123 View Post

Hi all, I am looking into HD CRT's that use Multi Scan tech to allow for the different refresh rates need for light guns from older consoles to work.

Right now I have been looking at the Monivision DM-7352SF, but I am not sure if that will work. So I am deferring to you all for information that can help me find a display that fits what I am looking for, and where I may find one, or if push come to shove at least helps me find the right direction in looking for a display that can do what I am looking for.

So let me list what i am looking for and we can go from there. Composite, S-Video, Component, and VGA Video inputs, with receiver outputs for 5.1 via optical, CRT 16:9 Tube with Multi Scan for video signals from 50Hz to 100+ Hz, and Max resolution of 1080i and lowest resolution 240i. From what I can find the other option I have is looking for a broadcast level display, with a deck that converts those inputs to BNC RGB signal.

I hope I can get some help in finding the right direction to go in.

Thanks all.

Hi, i'm looking for something similar, but my current research is incomplete.

The only 'multiscan' HD CRT's i'm aware of are presentation monitors - which Viewsonic made up to "42 inches" (really 40 comparing to consumer screens) but able to display 1024x768, which beats any consumer HD display I was aware of. They accept a 1280x1024 input but it's not native/gets a bit blurry. They could also run the 800x600, 640x480 type resolutions which look gorgeous. They probably wont run "SDTV" directly, but i *think* they might work with light guns if you used the right 60hz hardware line doubler (but not deinterlacer), though I haven't tried it nor has anyone else I know of.

Otherwise the top CRT's made were Sony's Super Fine Pitch stuff http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FD_Trinitron/WEGA which were 1440x1080i (1440x540p, they will not 'native' 720p in term of scan lines available but it accepts it as an input and converts it internally), however i'm TOLD such sets don't seem to work with light guns by some sources, even though they should do the same line doubling of the proposed above setup. Sony's SFP beat the res of any other consumer HD CRT i'm aware of, though there's only one 36" 4:3 set and nothing in a 40, more choices in 32's.

Next step down is Sony's HiScan, 853x1080i (853x540p), (see same http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FD_Trinitron/WEGA for specific models) and everyone else that had an HD CRT, which should be about the same resolution. Sony made up to a 40 inch 4:3 in the HiScan line, so did a few others. I'm still told HD CRT's in general either may, or always do (depending on person claiming) have problems with SDTV light guns though. It's possible that consumer HD's try to deinterlace, this throws off the light gun timing. One downside i've heard is some iffy reliability on certain larger Sony sets, sudden death without warning. I don't have a convenient reference for the larger comparable sets from other manufacturers though.


You may be best served by having more than one CRT - this is the solution I may end up going with, esp with the ridiculously cheap used price of non HD SDTV's right now. I planned at least one direct view CRT and a screen that pulls down in front for the projector, but having a 2nd or even 3rd if needed CRT would be no big deal. I could even put them on a rotating carousel if I want each one viewable dead front and center in front of the couch.
homeomnimax is offline  
post #3 of 6 Old 07-31-2013, 07:09 PM
Senior Member
 
LiquidSnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 319
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I'm not aware of any broadcast monitors made by Viewsonic, ever, the largest I have ever encountered first or second hand from them was 22".

No CRT in the world has a native resolution, either, only a limit to the highest resolution it can resolve, which is physically imposed by nature of the screen used. When resolution approaches dot pitch limits, you can get some blurring, but I have CRT monitors (including broadcast monitors) which are sharp at 1600x1200 or higher.

Broadcast monitors are indeed great for video game use and very versatile with resolutions, but not always for input. If you cannot use RGB, or do not know how to adapt a cable to your unique monitor's plug, and cannot spend the time to learn how to do it yourself, this is not a good hobby for you. Just spending the time finding these kinds of monitors, suited for your size and use needs, can be nigh impossible considering the equipment that still exists is so coveted, or ready to be put to rest from use and abuse.

Normally I would come in here with a long list of broadcast monitors to look for, but you are so much more likely to have a working consumer CRT in your hands with satisfactory or excellent results so much sooner that I just don't advise anyone starting out now to go to broadcast monitors first. Just do your reasearch and buy a Sony Trinitron from Craig's list as you find it in good condition. You'll be a lot happier, a lot sooner that way.
LiquidSnake is offline  
post #4 of 6 Old 07-31-2013, 08:20 PM
Member
 
homeomnimax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: midwest USA
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Possible thats a miscommunication, i'm referring to presentation monitors like found in an office boardroom before the overhead projectors took the majority of that market, not RGB broadcast monitors like found in a studio with BNC connectors. The ones i'm referring to have a SVGA input and routinely drive 800x600 or 1024x768 in sizes above normal computer monitors which never got larger than the FW900 at about 23 inches. I'm about 90% sure the 40 inch monster (sold as a 42) said 'Viewsonic' on it, they look like a TV but have different controls up front like a computer monitor to adjust to the changing multiscan resolutions you input. Web info seems pretty sketchy unlike older TV models.

Use of native resolution is probably the wrong term, but yes, what they can resolve with absolute clarity. The monitors i'm referring to resolve higher than any consumer CRT HDTV set i've ever seen which is why I recommended them. A 1024x768 windows desktop looks great, so does a 720p HD feed fullscreened but barely scaled down to that computer res desktop. Sharper and bigger than a Sony SuperfinePitch HDTV did with a 1440x540p resolution. Some resolve 1280x1024 at smaller sizes like 27 inches though, the above one I mentioned looked blurry at 1280 res for use as a windows desktop.

EDIT: Dont know what happened to double post, i'm sure I only clicked it once. :P Someone please zap the double?
homeomnimax is offline  
post #5 of 6 Old 07-31-2013, 08:20 PM
Member
 
homeomnimax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: midwest USA
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Possible thats a miscommunication, i'm referring to presentation monitors like found in an office boardroom before the overhead projectors took the majority of that market, not RGB broadcast monitors like found in a studio with BNC connectors. The ones i'm referring to have a SVGA input and routinely drive 800x600 or 1024x768 in sizes above normal computer monitors which never got larger than the FW900 at about 23 inches. I'm about 90% sure the 40 inch monster (sold as a 42) said 'Viewsonic' on it, they look like a TV but have different controls up front like a computer monitor to adjust to the changing multiscan resolutions you input. Web info seems pretty sketchy unlike older TV models.

Use of native resolution is probably the wrong term, but yes, what they can resolve with absolute clarity. The monitors i'm referring to resolve higher than any consumer CRT HDTV set i've ever seen which is why I recommended them. A 1024x768 windows desktop looks great, so does a 720p HD feed fullscreened but barely scaled down to that computer res desktop. Sharper and bigger than a Sony SuperfinePitch HDTV did with a 1440x540p resolution. Some resolve 1280x1024 at smaller sizes like 27 inches though, the above one I mentioned looked blurry at 1280 res for use as a windows desktop.
homeomnimax is offline  
post #6 of 6 Old 08-05-2013, 12:49 PM
Senior Member
 
LiquidSnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 319
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I know exactly the sort of monitors you are referring to. For the record, these were the same monitors that were marketed to television studios. Some of them just happened to be for use in front of the camera as well as behind it, several sony "ProFeel" or PVM series monitors reflect this look of a muted decor but also have BNC, RCA and even D-sub and other various connectors for their RGB inputs--of which SVGA is a part. I'll say it again, I have never seen a Viewsonic CRT larger than 22", and they have maintained a tonne of documentation for their product line through the years. When you say you saw a 40" CRT I'm certain it wasn't made by Viewsonic. Much more likely this was one of the Mitsubishi Megaview line. They had a 40" CRT in that series that would do 1024x768, and at the time it was made (mid-90s), that resolution was actually rather high for any practical use. Mitsubishi made several other CRT monitors larger than 20 inches, all with the Megaview name, probably the best of which was the XC2935C. At "only" 29 inches, it had a much higher usable resolution of 1600x1200, comparable to the best CRT monitors of its time. I've still got mine and it is in regular use, looks great with an XBox 360, PS3, or even a PC, and yes, razor sharp even at that high resolution, the highest that the monitor can handle.

And native resolution is absolutely the wrong term, but "what they can resolve with absolute clarity" is the wrong phrase as well. A CRT can resolve with absolute clarity every resolution that it is made to operate with. This is why 640x480 can appear razor sharp yet still be a "low" resolution. And anyway, I'd still recommend that you or anybody else just get a consumer television CRT. They're just plentiful. The stuff you are asking about is harder to find than hen's teeth right now, much of it that you actually do come across that someone is willing to sell is in such shoddy shape that you wouldn't want it for all the hell it's been subjected to..
LiquidSnake is offline  
Reply Direct View (single tube) CRT Displays

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off