Problem with my P225f CRT computer monitor - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 38 Old 02-01-2014, 06:49 AM - Thread Starter
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I upgraded my computer. Have a new ASUS motherboard and and new i7 4770k CPU. My Viewsonic P225f CRT monitor is working well, I have the drivers installed. For some reason I cannot bring up the OSD (on screen display) If I try it the screen just goes black until I push the button again and the monitor display comes back.

Can't imagine what the new mobo would have to do with this, but could it be some setting in the BIOS? Otherwise the monitor is working normally and windows 7 sees the P225f like it should.
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post #2 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 08:59 AM
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The problem you are having has nothing at all to do with your PC, and everything to do with the monitor. It sounds as if the circuit that drives the OSD has gone south. I would open the case, with the usual warnings of high voltage dangers, and look at the parts with a flashlight and maybe a magnifying glass. Look for possible shorts, burn marks or bad components. Do a Google search for bulging capacitors. Look at the capacitors in your monitor and see if any are bulged, or worse, exploded. And anything else that may appear to be burned out. Anything you spot that is out of order will need to be replaced.

Alternatively, if you find no bad components, then you have another problem on your hands.
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post #3 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 10:07 AM
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Before you start taking apart a working monitor and risk a shock hazard, have you tried this?
Quote:
OSD Lock Settings

You have the option of using the On Screen Display (OSD) locking feature,
OSD LOCK, to prevent unwanted changes to the current image settings.

• OSD Lock: Press and hold the [1] and [▼] buttons on the face of the monitor
for 5 seconds. The message “OSD LOCK” will then display briefly,
indicating that the OSD image settings are now locked
.
• OSD Unlock: Press and hold the [1] and [▼] buttons again for 5 seconds. The
message “OSD UNLOCK” will then display briefly, indicating that the OSD
image settings are now unlocked.
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post #4 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 11:22 AM
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And here we go again: Did the monitor exhibit this problem before the "new mobo?"

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post #5 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 12:46 PM
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It's probably safe to assume that the OP has no idea or forgotton since the OSD wasn't used/needed until the upgrade.

Either way, (if the OP checks back) let's eliminate (or not overlook) the obvious before raising the Titanic. smile.gif

Curious... to which poster is the "here we go again" targeted?
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post #6 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 01:30 PM
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It is probably safe to assume that Ratman has never used this monitor. If he had, he would already know that any time the OSD Lock is in place, the monitor tells you so. Seriously, the words "OSD LOCK" appear inside a colored box, informing you that the OSD is, well, locked, so that you can perform the above procedure to unlock it and change settings. The overlay for the OSD Lock notice does not work, and as he said, causes the screen to blank. It is reasonable to assume that an unlocked display showing the picture settings would exhibit the same effect.

Honestly, "here we go again" describes most of the problems I see on this board, and when it comes to issues of nonfunctionality, it is most reasonable to presume a problem with parts, particularly when dealing with functionality that once worked (because this OSD feature "just works" as a matter of course, and I should know, I have an identical monitor). Whether it ever worked for the OP or if it is a recent acquisition that has failed prior to his use, this is a basic function that should work, i.e. this is absolutely not how the OSD Lock should behave, even if it is in fact locked. This is absolutely a failure and it is only likely that a component is worn or shot. If you aren't aware of how to prevent shock hazards then obviously, this is not the board or the general product for you, as vintage tech such as this is only going to deteriorate with age, regardless of use. Worn capacitors are a prime cause of failure of electronics of all ages, and the older it gets, the more likely it is to happen.

That's the bad news. The good news is, an adult with no skills at all can identify and repair this stuff safely by acquiring the proper tools, and flexing Google a bit. It is not as difficult or as unsafe as you pretend. But clicking the face buttons hoping for a miracle is not going to solve this problem.
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post #7 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 03:38 PM
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Basically, it's probably safe to assume that every problem anyone has with a CRT is due to a bad capacitor. rolleyes.gif
Sorry about the 'face button'

To the OP:
any issues or questions that you may have should be asked directly to LiquidSnake. That way no one else will detract from the expert assistance.
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post #8 of 38 Old 02-02-2014, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Okay thanks for the responses! The reason I suspected the computer rather than the monitor itself is because it was working fine when I unplugged it from the old computer. It sits on my desk for 3 days powered down and unplugged, hook it up to the new computer and the OSD won't come up. It just seems so unlikely that something blew at the exact time I hook it up to a new computer. There was no sign of trouble like smoke or a popping noise. Oh well, if I get it figured out I'll post back with the solution.

edit: Actually I really don't know that the OSD was working fine when I unplugged it from the old computer because I haven't had to bring up the OSD in some time. All I can say is the OSD was working fine the last time I used it, but that has been weeks ago. So the OSD may have been broken for sometime without my knowledge.
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post #9 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 08:28 AM
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This is not just "any problem." The OSD, whether it shows a locked state or the actual used features, is an overlay that displays on top of the video that is shown on the screen. So if it isn't displaying, and is blanking out all video coming from the computer, this is a failure of feature. Ratman might like to think that something like this could just happen without any physical cause, I suppose, but in the real world physics govern functionality and this goes for whether the thing works or not. It worked before, if it doesn't now, there has to be a change involved. It easily might not be a capacitor, it could be a bad volt regulator, or any other part that activates the circuit that drives the OSD overlay. But it won't just stop working by magic.

You don't have to be an expert to figure this stuff out, either. I'm absolutely not an expert but I've repaired multiple televisions, monitors, computers, laptops and old video games, and I'm just a hobbyist. A frequent cause of failure in electronics this old in my experience has been capacitors going south. I realize it isn't for everyone, opening up an old tube and looking around for something you can sort out, but then, CRTs aren't for everyone at this stage either. He has very little to lose by opening it up for a butcher's look.

Lucky, what is the manufacture date of this p225f? And out of curiosity is its case black or white?
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post #10 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 09:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratman View Post

Curious... to which poster is the "here we go again" targeted?

'Us.' The general lack of critical info to help diagnose the problem that we've experienced in recent threads, causing us to spend half the thread asking for more info or arguing with each other over assumptions. Maybe I'm just not cut out for this. biggrin.gif

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post #11 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 10:48 AM
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Neither am I. I just get miffed when every question/problem from a poster seeking help is usually always suggested (assumed) to be a bad cap.
Sometimes, there could be an easier solution. We're all here to provided help. All suggestions should be considered before jumping to conclusions.

The Snake has it all under control. tongue.gif
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post #12 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 12:52 PM
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Well there's something to be said for that when considering safety, intrusiveness, etc. We don't know their experience and I've noticed a lot of New Members lately. Maybe I'm lazy but I like to try the easiest chit first.

In defense of bad caps, there are getting to be a lot of old CRTs out there. smile.gif

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post #13 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 01:38 PM
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And there are more electronic components in a circuit other than just capacitors that can go bad. wink.gif
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post #14 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 03:25 PM
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Womens' cosmetic manufacturers should make age-defying electrolytics.

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post #15 of 38 Old 02-03-2014, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratman View Post

And there are more electronic components in a circuit other than just capacitors that can go bad. wink.gif

Yes, absolutely true, which is why he should look for any potential problem. Voltage regulators poop out over time also, even a dead fuse would be an easy fix and an obvious find. And none of these would necessarily come with a pop, hiss, fizz or telltale column of smoke. There is little to lose, given that he is probably predilected to his CRT, to rolling back his sleeves and looking for a fault. You could always advise that he look for a repairman, but it's getting tougher to find anybody willing to work on these professionally with every passing day. The whole reason I ever started messing with this stuff was because I could find no local repair shop that would touch these things anymore. And there are a lot of threads here over the years where folks have pooled their experience for repairs, testament enough to the cause.
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post #16 of 38 Old 02-04-2014, 06:44 AM
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Hey, by all means, see a bad cap, go ahead and replace it. That does not mean it will resolve the issue. When that cap failed, who can be certain what component failed "down the line" due to the bad cap. Sometimes a failed component will not have any visible/obvious signs. Add a new cap and not a bad diode or bad resistor... Ooops! Now I see smoke. smile.gif

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
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post #17 of 38 Old 02-04-2014, 11:19 AM
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Of course he can try and find another one (or similar) on CL for free or dirt cheap, plus not too heavy to carry unlike many CRT TVs being given away. Although I suspect this is an upper echelon model. I got my Dell UltraScan P1110 pro/CAD monitor that way.

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post #18 of 38 Old 02-04-2014, 02:20 PM
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Yup. Keeping in mind that the OP stated that the monitor works. Only the OSD is not working. It's possible that the video card in the PC can provide the necessary adjustments.

In the worst case, ship the monitor to LiquidSnake for repair. Turnaround should be quick since it's supposed to be a simple problem. biggrin.gif
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post #19 of 38 Old 02-05-2014, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratman View Post

Hey, by all means, see a bad cap, go ahead and replace it. That does not mean it will resolve the issue. When that cap failed, who can be certain what component failed "down the line" due to the bad cap. Sometimes a failed component will not have any visible/obvious signs. Add a new cap and not a bad diode or bad resistor... Ooops! Now I see smoke. smile.gif

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

How many CRTs do you own? I still pick them up when I can, and if the phosphors are good the first thing I do is replace all caps. That's right, all of them. Then I have no worry about any other components failing from weak caps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Floydage View Post

Of course he can try and find another one (or similar) on CL for free or dirt cheap, plus not too heavy to carry unlike many CRT TVs being given away. Although I suspect this is an upper echelon model. I got my Dell UltraScan P1110 pro/CAD monitor that way.

The p225f and p225fb were Viewsonic's flagships at the time, made over a wide range of years. Could be anywhere from 2000 to 2005.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratman View Post

Yup. Keeping in mind that the OP stated that the monitor works. Only the OSD is not working. It's possible that the video card in the PC can provide the necessary adjustments.

In the worst case, ship the monitor to LiquidSnake for repair. Turnaround should be quick since it's supposed to be a simple problem. biggrin.gif

You've never picked up an iron in your life, have you? You're really quick to persuade someone to not even try. For those who dare, life holds rewards that the sheltered will never know.

How many CRTs do you own?
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post #20 of 38 Old 02-06-2014, 06:46 AM
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All of 'em. C'mon Sparky.
I've been inside numerous TV's from the 60's (you know.... tubes?) up until I sent my F38310 to the graveyard (you know, with the notorious DM1 power module problem with bad caps and diodes?).
I've built Heathkit and Dynaco amps, tuners, equalizers over the years.
Was in a musical group late 60's - 70's and made numerous quick repairs on the fly to amps, speakers and cables.
Worked in Data Processing and Communications for 35 years. So yeah... I'm familiar with solder.

EDIT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidSnake 
You're really quick to persuade someone to not even try. For those who dare, life holds rewards that the sheltered will never know.
No... I'm quick to warn someone that replacing components, desoldering, resoldering, may not be as "simple" as some suggest. Just replacing a bulging capacitor may not always be the solution. I merely suggest that not everyone has the skills that some have come across naturally, by experience or sheer luck. Also, you need to be able to identify those components to be replaced. You just can't go to a Radio Shack and ask, "Hey Mister! I need a resistor!". smile.gif

For those who dare, life also has unexpected surprises that can render a marginally working device useless... or worse. wink.gif
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post #21 of 38 Old 02-06-2014, 10:03 AM
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Wow 'Snake that's a lot of caps unless you're just replacing particular [more age/failure prone] types like 'lytics, etc. MTBF and all.

Yeah I figured that p225f was 'up there' after a quick 'net search. Probably worth trying to fix first as that genre becomes more of a needle in a haystack to find on CL.

"Sparky," lol I haven't heard that in awhile. That's what the ME's nicknamed us EE's at Motorola. tongue.gif sprockets.

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post #22 of 38 Old 02-06-2014, 12:17 PM
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Yeah... back in the old days, Sparky was a nickname given to the electronic wizards (kids) that thought they knew it all. biggrin.gif
They burned more parts than a Cub Scout with a lighter.
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post #23 of 38 Old 02-06-2014, 02:37 PM
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When a TV, or monitor really, is over ten years old, even functional caps do not have the *ahem* capacity they did when new. Without the AC modulation they provide for, at the tolerances required across the circuit, you can get all kinds of undesirable results. And when I consider any television I come across today, or in the past few years that I've been looking out more for that matter, are at least or almost that old, absolutely, a cap replacement is in order. Some of the nicest, newest CRTs of various brands are victim to some of the crappiest, cheapest capacitors, all kinds of electronic products made from around 2003 to 2008 suffered this, and those most desirable CRTs happen to have a good cross section in that timeframe. If you have a service manual it's simpler with a parts list, but even an amateur can look up the rating, digikey and others have low prices, less for certain volumes which you just might come across multiples in a single board. That, an iron, and a multimeter, and you're ready to do something about your problem and learn in the process.

If someone doesn't know what electricity is, or what ground is, and how they are important together, if they've never attempted to bridge a wire, have an iq of less than 100, or what have you then I suppose, sure, it is not "simple" to get going with this stuff. But honestly, I don't see a normal human being setting the house on fire, killing the cat, or even destroying the board. It really is not as difficult as you make it out to be. With google on your side, youtube tuts galore, and even testimonials in this forum, the last thing I'm going to tell anyone is not to even try.
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post #24 of 38 Old 02-06-2014, 02:45 PM
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And neither would I. Learning by mistakes is the the best teacher.
Just making them aware that there are caveats to "experimenting" without some exposure/experience with electronics.

As long as one doesn't care about worst case scenarios... safely have fun and good luck!
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post #25 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 08:36 AM - Thread Starter
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I come back to check on this thread and it has really taken off, lol

The monitor was manufactured in November 2003 and has the black case. I picked it off craigslist several years ago. Used it for a while then I picked up a FW900 off craigslist and retired this P225f. A few months ago the FW900 finally died after months of degrading, so I brought out this P225f from retirement.

Last summer we had an electrical storm and I thought it blew this P225f. It wouldn't power on at all and I really thought something had blown. I watched these videos on utube about fixing CRTs by Randy Fromm and I thought I would take this one apart and see if I could find any obvious problems. You know what? I couldn't see any problems at all. Everything looked pristine. I was thinking it might be something like a bad fuse that would be simple to take out and replace. But the fuse looked perfect and besides it was soldered to the board so it would have been a little more complicated to replace than I had in mind.

Then I thought if I can't see anything wrong with this monitor maybe I should put it back together and plug it back in just to see what happens. Test it one final time before taking it to the recycle. Bingo! the the thing degausses and came to life like nothing was ever wrong with it. It still works great today except that the OSD menu doesn't come up.
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post #26 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 10:11 AM
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Ahhhhh (post #10). wink.gif

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post #27 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 10:14 AM
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Ahhhhh (post #18) wink.gif
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post #28 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky Ducky View Post

A few months ago the FW900 finally died after months of degrading...

Probably bad caps. biggrin.gif
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post #29 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 11:12 AM
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Interviewer Q: "Sir, are you a skeptic?"

Interviewee A: "I DOUBT IT!"

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post #30 of 38 Old 02-07-2014, 12:00 PM
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Q: Do you know what you're doing?
A: I think so.

This is not the person you want working on anything.
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