Toshiba 34HDX82 Picture Burn-In Problem? Help! - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 184 Old 01-10-2003, 09:05 AM
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Wish I'd seen this thread earlier. I bought a Tosh 34HF81 almost exactly a year ago, and posted a comment about the brighter vertical line in the center shortly after receiving it. I then decided that it was just an artifact of my antenna (it was glaringly obvious on hockey and football games, but I thought it wasn't present on DVDs). Then I began to notice it on DVDs. Finally, after nine months of living with it, I gave up and called Toshiba, who referred me to the local service center.

Their tech came out in November, immediately saw the vertical band (I was concerned he would deny being able to see it, as it is a faint distortion, though the kind which gets worse in your mind every time you see it). He concurred that a TV this expensive shouldn't have such a glaring defect and scheduled a pickup. Yesterday, two months after they picked it up, it was returned to me. They replaced two resistors, a cap, and a coil (these parts took two months?!?), and pronounced it fixed.

Hah. Of course, the vertical band is still there. Is it as bad as before? I don't know. I do know that I can see it, and I feel like a bit of a sucker for having paid two grand for a tv with such an annoying problem, and even more of a sucker for sending it away for two months with no resolution.

I don't know what my next step will be (call the service center again, call Toshiba and vent, or take a valium and quit watching hockey), but I can at least vouch for the fact that the problem does clearly exist in older models, and it's not caused by halogen lamps (don't have any) or your cable box (ditto). I agree that the severity of the problem is connected to the signal quality (it's pretty plainly visible on OTA broadcasts, much less so on good DVD transfers). Finally, I can state that for sure it's not fixed by waiting two months for a handful of cheap components to be delivered from Japan via rowboat.
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post #92 of 184 Old 01-10-2003, 01:55 PM
 
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I also got a 34HF81 a year ago but have never had any sign of a bright vertical line anywhere on the screen, not even a faint one. I've looked very carefully using different all white, gray, and color full screen test patterns but can't see anything like reported at all. So apparently not all of the units have this problem!
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post #93 of 184 Old 01-10-2003, 04:25 PM
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DonBerg -
Count yourself as a very very lucky owner ... I count myself as very very lucky to have gotten out of the set and to have received a full refund.

After numerous e-mails, I finally got a call-back response from Toshiba, but not from home office as they had promised before. They opened a file for me and they're waiting for me to call back to discuss. The number on the message was the same as 1st level technical support that I originally called, 800-631-3811. I would suggest calling Toshiba Support again and demand that they open a file under your name. If they get enough folks reporting the problem, maybe, just maybe they will be able to eventually come up with a fix. Then again, Toshiba has to be aware of the problem and they just choose to 'ignore' ... why else would they continue to manufacture different models with the same issues - it's going to be a tough battle. I'd also suggest continuing to write to customer_support@tacp.com and demand an answer to the problem. You might even then forward your note with Toshiba's responses via email to the Attorney General of your state or whatever agency seems appropriate.

So ... tonight I called Toshiba and basically requested that they flag my complaint file for review by the next level. I asked her to make a comment in the file that the set is not fixable and that a review of their manufacturing process should be undertaken and/or a recall should be placed on the 34HDX82. She said that someone will call back to discuss. I'll post again after they call me.
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post #94 of 184 Old 01-12-2003, 02:50 AM
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Here's a copy of a post from the "digital home canada" forum. Personally I don't buy it but maybe someone on this board can comment.

Extendedblink writes:

"I recently got a call back from Toshiba Canada's service manager. I waited two weeks for the call. What he actually said was kind of interesting, he mentioned that a lot of the 'big name' TV manufactures were making these what he called transition monitors. He said that they designed the TV's with the HDTV piece and made that look fantastic and then did what they could to make the analog piece look as good as they could.

The faded stripe in the center of the screen is really hard to see when I am playing a DVD and he told me that if I was watching an HDTV signal that it was unlikely that I would see it at all. "

http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/for...?p=26978#26978
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post #95 of 184 Old 01-12-2003, 02:56 AM
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Oops, wrong link. This one goes right to the post I was referring to:
http://www.digitalhomecanada.com/for...?p=26974#26974
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post #96 of 184 Old 01-12-2003, 10:43 AM
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I definitely saw the vertical white center line in all inputs, including HD - for me, it was just as apparent as any other input.
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post #97 of 184 Old 01-13-2003, 03:07 AM
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I just noticed on my Toshiba 34hdx82 that, when viewing a 4:3 source in natural mode (correct aspect with gray bars on the sides), the left side of the image edge was slightly angled. The top edge of the image is about 1/4" closer to the edge of the tube than the bottom. When checking with the Avia geometry test hatch there is a visible bend to the top of the extreme left vertical line. Does anyone know whether this type of distortion is fixable and how common it is??
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post #98 of 184 Old 01-13-2003, 04:37 AM
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I stopped by Audio Encounters and HHGregg this weekend. I didn't really see the problem at Audio Encounters (my first stop), but the material they had playing might not have made it obvious, and it was last year's model. The interesting thing is that they said that they were aware of that problem on the last TWO models, but not on the HDX. They also mentioned that the problems had not been on all the models they sold, luck of the draw I guess. I think they focus more on projection TV's so they didn't have the HDX yet.

At HHGregg (Sawmill Road for those in Columbus), the salesman (Donaus) was real helpful. I didn't see the problem at first on their HDX, but while he was going to get "Ice Age" I went into the service menu and brought up the white screen. I noticed darker areas on the left and right side, but no line in the center. When we put in Ice Age and skipped to the snow parts, some white scenes we couldn't see it, others it was pretty obvious (especially once you are "aware" of the problem). It didn't alway have to be a white scene, some more off-white colors, and certainly solid blue colors, seemed to show it. If I really looked hard, I supposed I saw the white line/blotch in the middle, but that really was so minimal that it doesn't even concern me.

I also talked to the sales manager at HHGregg, the same guy that helped out Cliff in the above posts. It sounds like he actually came to these forums and read some of Cliff's posts, I don't know if he still comes in to look or not. He seemed to think that it is a problem that may not be on ALL of the tv's, but just the majority of them right now. He is really hoping that the next batch they get in the next week or so will be better, I wouldn't hold my breath. He DID seem real willing to work with me on this. He is willing to do multiple exchanges (to a point), and give a full refund if necessary.

I'm real torn about this. I would love to jump to an HDTV right now, but the Toshiba is the only one that would fit our Amish built entertainment center, and I can't talk the wife into getting rid of that! If I felt that Toshiba was working on a fix for this, I'd jump right now, but it sounds like the problem has been there for a while. I might go for it if they are willing to give me the TV plus an extra warranty for under $2k. I feel a discount is justified since I would essentially be buying a "flawed" TV!

Oh well, that's my deal with the 34HDX82. Has ANYONE gotten a response from their e-mail support? I wish companies wouldn't bother with e-mail support if they aren't going to bother to actually use it!

Tim

PS, on a side note, the service menu is a little different on this model than my current SD Toshiba. When I brought up the white test pattern, when I hit TV/Vid again it just switched inputs. I could swear that it gives me other test patterns/color patterns on my TV. Did I do something wrong?

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post #99 of 184 Old 01-14-2003, 06:55 PM
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Anyone Find out anything about this?

I just got a new 34HD82 from Best Buy.... I got a great deal
$1749.99 (+ tax). I got it home and noticed the problem on my set as well. It is very faint, but noticeable.

I have 30 days to find out if this is a real flaw and/or fixable.

I opted not to buy the Extended Warranty, I guess I can before the 30 days is up or possibly go with a 3rd part Warranty (like Warrantech).

So - what is the verdict about the 34HD82 and line?

I sent an email to Toshiba asking for their input.

Thanks,

Mario
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post #100 of 184 Old 01-14-2003, 08:07 PM
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Well, I called the local service provider (Tele-vue, in Denver) and told them the problem was still present (after they had it for two months waiting for parts; see above for more detail). I also told the guy I talked to there that I had found out via the net (ie, here) that there were a lot of other sets out there with the same problem, so I didn't necessarily expect resolution at this point. Nonetheless, he talked to the technician who did the work, and they then called Toshiba. Toshiba, in turn, is sending out a whole new board (I believe he called it the vertical PCB) which they will install on-site. The folks at Tele-vue sounded quite committed to finding a solution for this, which I really appreciate. I don't know if Toshiba was aware of the problem or not, but it's encouraging that the local service shop is working on it. I'll post an update when the next repair happens, regardless of outcome.
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post #101 of 184 Old 01-14-2003, 11:31 PM
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I phoned Toshiba Canada yesterday and was told that the vertical line is a "characteristic" of the 34hdx82 and there was nothing they could do about it. Nice wording eh? To sum it up an engineering flaw that they're too cheap to fix. One word of advice to everyone with this tv, return it if you can and buy anything but a Toshiba.

They made it very clear there was no fix and nothing they would do. I filed a complaint that is to be reviewed by the national service center in Vancouver. But I doubt they'll do anything. I'm going to bring back the tv to the place I bought it from and get something else. Too bad, this tv had great potential.
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post #102 of 184 Old 01-15-2003, 06:00 AM
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If we can at least get an 'official' statement, then everybody that wants out should be able to get a full refund, no matter how long they've had the set. I'm still pushing Toshiba USA for something along those lines.
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post #103 of 184 Old 01-15-2003, 03:54 PM
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I called Toshiba, they said that have NO reports of any problems with this set. I asked them to look into this forum, they claim that is not possible since they don't have internet access.

So maybe no one is calling them to let them know they have a problem?

Any chance we can get alot of your guys to start calling them to address this issue?

I recommend contacting Toshiba Customer Relations Department directly.

Their number is 1-800-631-3811. Be sure to press prompt #1 and then #3.

I am going to give them another week or two, but I do think this TV may be going back.

- Mario
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post #104 of 184 Old 01-15-2003, 04:09 PM
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What a load of !@#$%^&*(_)(*&^%$$)+_)(*&^$#%^&#@$%^&*((&^&*.
Hearing that Toshiba, not only refuses to rectify the issue, but now has the nerve to actually lie about it is enough to guarantee that I NEVER buy another Toshiba product.
Those !@#$%^&*()_!@!@#$%^&*()_@#$%^&*()@#$%^&*()_#@#$%^&*()_#@$%^& *()_#$%^&*()#$%^&*()#$%^&*()$%^&*()#$$%^&*()$%^&*()$%^&*()$% ^&*()%^&*()&*()_^&*(>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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post #105 of 184 Old 01-15-2003, 04:22 PM
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If you take the time to read the posts on this thread you would realize that most of, if not all, the people who have complained have contacted Toshiba with, not one but, repeated phone calls and emails.
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post #106 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 09:27 AM
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I am F^*&ing sick of this $hit, ....... for a $2k set they should be doing ALOT MORE.

I am going to go get a Analog 27/32 or 36 inch set and give up on HDTV
for now.

I will wait for more programming and better quality sets.

This is utterly ridiculous!

I should have known better than to go with Toshiba, I was an early adopter of one of their DVD players that ended up having firmware issues that caused it to be unable to play some DVD's.

After 6 months of fighting with them over it they finally gave me a refund.

This is/was the last stray for Toshiba.


I guess I will stick with Sony (or Zenith, my Zenith 27" has lasted for 12+ years and just now is having problems).

Good Luck to those who stick with their 34HD(x)82.

I my opinion, it is not for me to fight with Toshiba for a Quality set.

This is a FLAW. They claim none exist. Apparently someone is lying.

I just know that I am the customer and my wallet counts as a vote.

I just voted.

- MG
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post #107 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 10:41 AM
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Toshiba Canada confirms the vertical line in the center, however they refer to it as a "characteristic" of the tv and it has no fix. I'm getting out of the set too by bringing it back to where I bought it.

It's very interesting to see how many people are complaining about vertical lines or bright spots in the center of their HDTV set (whether projection or direct view). I too am considering just getting an analog set until these tvs improve. $2k should buy you a flawless set as far as I'm concerned.
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post #108 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 07:50 PM
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Best Buy is once again the owner of one defective/flawed Toshiba 34HD82.

I urge those of you with the same problems to rush back in with them for returns while you can.

I am confident that Toshiba is going to ignore these issues and screw the consumer out of hard earned $$$'s

my $0.02..

MG
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post #109 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 09:04 PM
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My tv is now back to the store where it came from. I feel much better now.

Although, I'm at a loss for what to get in replacement. I've started to look at the RPTVs because there isn't much selection in the direct-view 16:9s. Anyone have any suggestions (direct-view or not) in the same approximate price range?
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post #110 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 11:37 PM
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After how long owning the TV did you guys notice the lines, i was thinking of buying this tv myself because the guy who i generally buy my electronics from has one and was happy with it (100% sure he is not full of ****, he's a old friend)
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post #111 of 184 Old 01-16-2003, 11:38 PM
 
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Sony 34XBR800
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post #112 of 184 Old 01-17-2003, 12:05 AM
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Dego:

Watch an entire hockey game.. If you don't notice in the middle then I'd be surprised.
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post #113 of 184 Old 01-17-2003, 12:40 AM
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I'm not sure I'm ready to give mine up. I havn't decided whether the centre line issue isn't a little obsesive. It took me a month to find, and that's because I was looking. I personally don't watch much hockey and I'm not thrilled with the idea of forking out for a Sony which has it's own line problen and requires a tech to fix (1080i traveling line issue). Not to mention the Tosh has better color out of the box. There's no simple answer in the current crop of 34's.
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post #114 of 184 Old 01-17-2003, 04:33 AM
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GDG, I think I'm with you. I really struggled with my decision to buy this TV, but it was the only TV that was narrow enough to fit on our existing entertainment center. It couldn't have been 1/8" wider! My 34hdx82 was delivered yesterday and here are my thoughts:

Before it was delivered I was concerned because the model in the store had highly visible dark areas on the left and right sides. The center line was there, but it never really made itself all that visible. The store (HHGregg) assured me that if I had problems with the picture they would exchange/refund, whatever I want.

The TV was delivered while I was at work. When I got home I plugged it in and got it running. After immediately switching to "movie" mode, I noticed the picture was horribly dark. After a quick run of AVIA, it looks much better, although I think I'm going to have to run through it again to tweak it a little more. Right now I'm just running s-video, other cables and transcoder for computer hookup are on their way! I did have to go into the service menu and do a couple tweaks to get the height, width, and some minor pincushion taken care of. Again, it still needs some tweaking but I will do that after it has been running for a while.

It seems to do quite well with my DirecTIVO signal. The picture looks much better than on my old SD TV. It does a real nice job of deinterlacing the s-video signal. This is great for DirecTV and movies played on computer or on my old DVD player, but it makes the computer text look a little fuzzier. The "flickering" of my old set seemed to give the impression of sharper text. We'll see how that changes once I've got the stuff to run full HDTV resolution from the flicker.

The picture does appear to be sharper in the center and a little out of focus as you go to the outside edges. I haven't decided if that is normal operation, compared to my old tv it is a few orders of magnitude better!

Now, the "issues" that everyone has with the TV. So far, I have not noticed ANY dark areas on the sides. That is reassuring. I think the line down the center may be a little more visible than the one in the store, but really, for a couple hours of watching and playing with this TV, I only saw it maybe a total of 5 minutes. It has to be just the right color/brightness to make it visible. If I didn't know about it already, I might not have noticed it right away, although a couple times (usually with one solid color like blue or white), it really did seem to jump out.

I don't watch hockey, but I can imagine it is more visible with a hockey game with the white ice. If I did watch hockey, I would probably return the TV for sure. Right now, I'm not totally sure. I've got a couple weeks to decide, and I've got to try to not be obsessive about it. Watching movies on TV shouldn't be about analyzing every minute defect in the TV, it should be about enjoying the movie...that said I will probably be analyzing every minute defect in the TV when I watch the next movie! ;)

Well, back to work...
Tim

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post #115 of 184 Old 01-17-2003, 07:37 AM
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For me it really wasn't an obsessive thing. The center line showed so often with any reasonably light background and the side-shading showed just as often, especially if I used the irritating grey windows-bars for 4x3 viewing. The problems were evident with cable, VCR, DVD and HD viewing. Each set does vary to some degree in these issues, but I wasn't willing to take a second or third chance with a replacement - not when every set I saw locally had the problem equal or worse than mine.

As I had posted previously in this thread, once I returned the set and replaced it with a 34XBR800 - well, I couldn't believe how much better the Sony performed, especially with NTSC. The Sony does not have any center-line issues and I don't have a problem with HD 1080i since I use a SA 3100HD STB. And even if I did have a problem with HD, at least I know it can be easily fixed. The problems with the Tosh very likely will never be fixed. I was supposed to get another call back from Toshiba, but to no surprise, they haven't called in six business days. That is unexcusibly poor customer service.

IMHO, it doesn't really matter if someone's Tosh has better color out of the box (my Sony was better than the Tosh) - everything can be tweaked. The problems with the Tosh also seemed to just grow and grow. The more I saw it and the more Toshiba Service ignored me - it started to become a matter of principal. If Toshiba wasn't going to admit or fix the issue, I'll be damned if I'm going to spend my hard earned dollars supporting and justifying their inferior and flawed product. Not that the Sony Corp doesn't have their own set of problems - but as least with this particular 16x9 set they've got their act together and have been responsive to the consumer.

If you can live with the Tosh's shortcomings and the size of the set matters, it does provide good PQ - but IMHO, there's no comparison when everything is considered. Yes, this is my personal experience and I'm not trying to change anybody's mind, just speaking my own ... so, good luck to those who plan to keep theirs.
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post #116 of 184 Old 01-17-2003, 09:41 AM
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Regarding Toshiba having better "out of box" color than the Sony. I purchased the Sony 34XBR800 about a month ago and calibrated it (yes, I'm isf certified) this weekend. The color temp was very good out of the box ( 7200K max at 100IRE) with little red push. There is a lot of sample to sample variation in sets and it looks like Home Theater's Sony was at one extreme. After cal the set is near perfect, as observed in Home Theater.javascript:smilie(':D')
big grin

Dave Hancock
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post #117 of 184 Old 01-20-2003, 01:39 PM
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Well, I bought the 34XBR82 last week, and played with it over the weekend. In a slightly darkened room, I could see the line down the middle and the two bands on the sides.

I watched the Raiders/Titans game, and it was noticable. Called Toshiba, no knowledge of the problem.

The set is going back ASAP.

To those of you that think that this line is acceptable, please reconsider. The only way the TV's are going to get better is if the manufacturers are forced to fix their problems. The only way they are going to be forced is via their pocketbook, which means returns, don't buy, etc.

Anyone who shells out $2000+ for a TV should get a picture that does NOT have any noticable defects. After all, the picture is the main purpose of the purchase.

I do like the feature set the Toshiba has, as far as different video modes, sound options, PIP (on non HD sources), etc, but for $2000+ the picture quality should match (or exceed) the price.
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post #118 of 184 Old 01-20-2003, 02:35 PM
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ddb_CA,
You bought and returned a 34XBR82? :confused: Oh no! - a Sony/Toshiba hybrid!! Tell us a bit about it ... :D
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post #119 of 184 Old 01-20-2003, 04:36 PM
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I definitely don't get the gray bar complaint. If you want to avoid burning your screen this is the best color to use (think about it). As far as the complaints about bars of any color being annoying, (used to be 4:3 set owners complaining about the black bars on the top and bottom), I don't get that either. You have a picture which is COMPLETELY out of context with the room and environment it's suspended in, and the color around the immediate border is a distraction? Seems to me it's just a matter of one unnatural situation, which people are accustomed to, being substituted for another.
On the question of Toshiba I have an open ended arrangement with FS which allows a lot of options. This flexibility is good because, in my experience, issues become an obsession when you feel trapped. I plan to sit back and rationally make a decision on whether I can or can't live with the my 34hdx82 without obsessing.
Two things strike me at this point. The first is that obviously most people don't find the flaws of some Toshiba's objectionable and find the many strengths offset the weaknesses, or else no one would be buying them. NONE of the issues discussed on this board were mentioned in the Home Theater review so they obviously did not find them problematic. The other thing that jumps out at me is that some people seem to associate their personal identity with the TV (or whatever) they own. Instead of getting rational discussions on the various pros and cons of a product people on this board seem spend a lot of time justifying the superiority of their buying decision and I guess by default, their own superiority.
As I mentioned earlier, the price difference in Canada between the Tosh and Sony is about $500 US. Considering that the HT reviewers claimed they were virtually indistinguishable from each other in picture quality (after calibration) I don't believe the price difference is warranted. Furthermore I don't consider the hardware change required on current Sony's inconsequential. Bottom line is that, on a budget, the saving on the Tosh, for me, are probably more effectively spent elsewhere . For example I would prefer to spend that money on a High Def sat receiver (cheaper in Canada). I'm not going to suggest my setup will be perfect, but for the money the OVERALL experience might be superior. As an audiophile I found that building a truly outstanding sound SYSTEM involved balancing compromises, unless of course budget is not an issue. ie. A good set of speakers does not make a high end system, how the components work together, at a price point, is what counts.
This brings me to the new Sony 34xbr910, which when it comes out, promises to be another story completely and is probably a SIGNIFICANT improvement over the Tosh (and the current XBR). Interestingly, if you check out the thread on the new Sony there are a bunch of XBR800 owners trying to convince themselves that the new generation of Sony's won't be that much better, and they don't like the styling anyway and blah blah blah.... Makes me wonder how many people buy a Sony simply for the status they believe owning "the Best" gives them. It's a little little like high performance motorcycle owners who buy a bike based simply on 1/4 mile specs and the bragging rights that imparts and then think that what they own is trash when the next best thing comes out. I prefer to buy based on value and what meets my needs, nothing more and nothing less.
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post #120 of 184 Old 01-20-2003, 06:18 PM
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I do not have the dark areas on the sides on my unit. Initially I could see the line down the middle, but once I switched to a HD source (960x540p from my computer) the stripe all but disappeared. If I REALLY look for it occasionally I can find it, but watching the same programs on the HD signal, it ain't there when it was there before. I was seriously thinking about returning it until I switched to the HD source. There's no turning back for me now!

Tim

Before you criticize someone you should walk a mile in their shoes.
That way, when you criticize them, you are a mile away and you have their shoes!

Setting up Powerstrip with a Sony A10 LCD RPTV
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