Vertical bar on Sonys when viewing 1080i - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 918 Old 12-20-2002, 04:41 PM - Thread Starter
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It happens all the time but its not always visible due to program content. To me its mostly visible in darker scenes and sometimes in flesh tones. To the best of my knowledge, its only visible when viewing 1080i signals on the component video or DVI inputs. I've had two 40XBR800's and its been visible in both. I noticed the problem within a couple of days of getting the first set. It took a couple of more days for me to decide it was in the TV - not something else in my system.

I talked to a helpful person at Sony today ("Darlene in Florida"), she asked a few questions then told me who to call locally to have it looked at. Unfortunately, they won't be here 'til Jan 2nd.

Gary A.
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post #92 of 918 Old 12-21-2002, 11:15 AM
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I've been a lurker here for awhile. I decided to register so I could thank you all for posting your experiences and working so diligently to get Sony to address this problem. I purchased a 34XBR800 a week ago, even after hearing of this issue, because I felt confident that after so many complaints, Sony would be compelled to issue a fix. I don't have an HD tuner and I haven't tried 1080i yet so I don't know if my set is affected. If I do experience the "vertical line syndrome", I'll have a wealth of information at my disposal, thanks to this forum.

Andy64, I live in your area, so I'll be interested hear who does your repair and how it goes. Thanks again.
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post #93 of 918 Old 12-21-2002, 02:49 PM
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got my 34XBR800 yesterday, HD-DTV today (scientific atlanta 3100HD). no lines yet, though i haven't watched it too closely yet. i'm not sure which stations are 1080i either... does anyone know what WNET13 (New York PBS) uses for their HD demo station? if that's 1080i, i think i'm definitely in the clear. it's about the clearest HD i've ever seen - my set looks really good, don't seem to have any focus or convergence problems. some minor geometry anomalies that i'm still in the process of tweaking out but otherwise looks fantastic. FYI, my set is very new, manufacture date November 2002, so perhaps it was corrected in the latest production units.
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post #94 of 918 Old 12-23-2002, 11:37 AM
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been watching plenty of HDTV on my 34XBR800, including 1080i (PBS, NBC) and no sign of vertical lines. perhaps sony has fixed the problem in newer production units, or i got lucky with my set. i'd be curious to poll what percentage of XBR owners here have the problem and when their sets were made.

this tv is awesome! best picture i've ever seen short of a high-end projector or maybe the Grand Wega II LCD, but that doesn't have as good blacks.
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post #95 of 918 Old 12-23-2002, 11:47 AM
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My 34XBR800 was made in Oct. 2002. I have Time Warner cable with the 3100HD box. Haven't seen the described problem while watching prime-time programming on CBS. (Unfortunately CBS is the only network HD channel we get here in Minneapolis with Time Warner.)
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post #96 of 918 Old 12-23-2002, 03:02 PM
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I've been following this thread since it started. I'm using my 34XBR800 with a 3100HD (about two and a half months now) and have seen none of this symptom. Apparently it is a compatibility issue with certain STBs, but not (thankfully!) with the 3100HD.

Phil
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post #97 of 918 Old 12-23-2002, 09:23 PM
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Not true Phil, at least in my case. My Sony SATHD-200 worked fine with my initial 34XBR800 but my replacement set (replaced for other reasons) showed the defect immediately. It's something in the set that apparently can be fixed. Still waiting for my tech to come on the 31st but waiting even more anxiously for someone else whose tech comes sooner.
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post #98 of 918 Old 12-23-2002, 10:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Its the horizontal deflection circuit getting coupled into the video signal. In the 1080i case they typically differ in frequency by about 1 cycle per second - hence the moving bar across the screen. For other types of inputs (480i, 480p, 720p) the frequency difference between the horizontal scan and the video sync is much larger (about 2.7kHz for 480i signals). In that case, the coupling is still there but its effect is essentially invisible.

I actually modified the video frequency of a Tektronix TSG-90 NTSC signal generator to check for the effect. With only the generator (and nothing else) connnected to the TV, the problem was still there. I even used quad shielded coax for the connection and ran the generator off of a power inverter so that it would be completely isolated from the TV's ac power source.

Based on comments on this thread, it may not be present in all XBR800 series sets. I've had two 40XBR800s with the problem. Sony claims to have a fix but no one's reported the results back to this thread yet.

Gary A.
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post #99 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 06:59 AM
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You can add me to the list of owner's without the problem as well. I have a E86 stb. I have a concern that this problem may not surface until I am forced to move to a dvi capable stb (at which point my warranty may expire). It sure seems like most of the complaints come from users with the new generation of stbs and cable boxes. Does anyone have this problem with the older stbs? I don't know the build date of mine, but I've had it about 4-5 months.
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post #100 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:40 AM
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A very professional and polite service technician came out to my house yesterday and determined (based on the Sony technical bulletin) that he needed to order a replacement board to resolve this problem.

Apparently, sets manufactured from October to December have a different input board that causes the problem. The problem is supposedly fixed in the most recently manufactured sets from December on.

My set was manufactured in September, and the service technician indicated that the bulletin inferred that sets made before October shouldn't have the problem at all, but I have proof sitting in my living room that at least some do. I'd have to assume that this means the manufacturing process was actually changed sometime in late September.

He said that once he had installed the replacement board, he'd have to do some service mode reprogramming for each input mode. He thought the whole process would take about 1 hour.

He estimated about two weeks to get the board from Sony, with the caveat that he couldn't guarantee the part actually exists yet.
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post #101 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:44 AM
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does that mean i need a new board too... mine was made Nov 2002
those dates don't seem right though. not only is your Sept. set bad as well, but lots of people here have seen this problem for a while now... i'm sure those sets were made even earlier. hmm. does it affect all boards, or only some of them? i guess if it was all boards then they would have to recall them.

must be a PCB layout problem or something?
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post #102 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:51 AM
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The problem affects a single board that can be easily swapped out.
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post #103 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:54 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by dorkus
does that mean i need a new board too... mine was made Nov 2002

How do you determine when it was manufactured? I suspect by looking at the back somewhere, hard in my set up. But, maybe with a mirror and flashlight ....?

Mine was purchased on Oct 12, so it was likely manufactured in Sept or earlier.

Phil
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post #104 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:56 AM
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yup the date is right by the serial number, on the right side (looking from the front) of the set. about the same vertical level as the top of the input jacks, maybe a little higher.
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post #105 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 08:59 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by bocktar
The problem affects a single board that can be easily swapped out.

But in an earlier message you said the part may not actually exist. That would make swapping it not so easy

It would be nice to know the range of serial numbers affected, if indeed, early sets were OK and some later ones had the problem and newer ones do not.

Maybe you can coax that guy out of a copy of the service bulletin you mentioned.

Phil
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post #106 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 09:08 AM - Thread Starter
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FWIW:

The 40XBR800 I currently have is S/N 9008878 and was manufactured in October. The previous one was S/N 9003968 but I don't have the date of manufacture. Both have the problem.

Gary A.
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post #107 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 09:13 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Phil Wheeler
But in an earlier message you said the part may not actually exist. That would make swapping it not so easy

Indeed!

Quote:


Maybe you can coax that guy out of a copy of the service bulletin you mentioned.

I probably won't see him again until he comes to fix the problem, but when he calls back with a better time estimate I'll ask him for the bulletin number.
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post #108 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 09:22 AM
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Bocktar, I had someone read me the bulletin from Sony and it calls for a fix (at least an attempt) using the service mode and then, if that fails, to make a fix on the board or wait until new boards are available (currently no ETA). Did the tech even try to fix it using the service mode? From what I was told there is a whole page of the memo dedicated to a step-by-step service mode fix. I'm eagerly awaiting a visit next Tuesday. Mine too was manufactured in October. The only difference, from what I've heard between those manufactured earlier rather than later, is that those manufactured Oct. and earlier (or perhaps prior to Oct.) have the parts required for the fix (if necessary) on the board already. If the parts are not there, they will have to be ordered. Take heart though, there apparently is a fix!!!!
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post #109 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 09:30 AM
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He did not attempt a service mode fix. He believed that the new board would be required before making the service mode changes.

I'll make sure to mention this when I hear from him again.
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post #110 of 918 Old 12-24-2002, 02:30 PM
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If you want to see the problem, you need a 1080i black screen and high brightness and picture settings. You can see it sometimes without a black 1080i screen but it's a lot easier with the black screen. I get a black screen by tuning my Samsung SIR-T165 STB to some digital channel, then I disconnect the antenna and it goes black with a little rectangle moving about that says "no signal." With this black screen, I then go into the menu and increase brightness/picture until I see the bar.

I've noticed that the bar only shows up when brightness and picture are too high.

BTW, I have a 34XBR800.

Luis P Caamano
Atlanta, GA, USA
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post #111 of 918 Old 12-26-2002, 11:35 AM
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The service technician called Monday and said he had to order a "part" from Sony headquarters before he could execute the "fix." No indication when the "part" would arrive. Has anyone been successful in getting their vertical bar problem corrected yet?
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post #112 of 918 Old 12-28-2002, 12:23 PM
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Well the tech. came and fixed the verticle bar problem. The fix has the tech go into the service menu. Then you send a signal into an input. He then is to change a value. If the screen goes black on the input, then your set doesn't have the components needed inside and a new board will have to be ordered. If the screen stays on after the value change, it can be fixed with a list of service menu tweaks that sony provided. It was a big flowchart of things to be tweaked. The tweaks were first done with my DVI port, then they all have to be done on component input 5 as well. They also have to be tweaked while in a couple different picture modes (Vivid, Standard, etc).
So far I have not seen the verticle bar. Good fix!----- GS kid

Sony 34xbr800
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post #113 of 918 Old 12-28-2002, 07:31 PM
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Congrats GSKid, I was hoping the service menu fix would work. Hopefully I'll have similar news after my tech's visit on Tuesday afternoon. My luck, I won't have the components necessary for the service menu fix and a board will have to be ordered. When was your set manufactured? About how long did the fix take? I hope my tech is up to snuff; I am already a bit concerned, because when he called to confirm the visit I verified that he would be bringing the bulletin as it had extensive, step-by-step instructions on it; he replied that there was no bulletin; I said, yes there is and that I had spoken to such and such a person in his dept; oh, he said, yeah, I see it, thanks. So I'm dubious already, but hopefully as long as he has the bulletin with him and is fairly competent we can work it out. Congrats again and keep your fingers crossed for me and the rest of us -- gee, what will we all have to complain about once all our sets are fixed?
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post #114 of 918 Old 12-30-2002, 03:01 PM
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I have the problem on my KV36-XBR800. I just called to schedule a service appointment, but am using the local dealer tech. Does anyone have a service bulletin number or reference yet? It would be a great help to the rest of us with this problem.

IT WASN'T MY FAULT, I SWEAR TO GOD!
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post #115 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 09:49 AM
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Set Fixed!!!! Okay, my procedure was a bit easier than GSKid's as the tech only had to change one value in the service mode to get rid of the line/impulse. After going into service mode he scrolled through to the code: HDPT (it's very early on in the scrolling process). At the top of the screen are the numbers 4 and 1 in their own little boxes. He changed the 1 to a 0 and then saved (WRITE was the term he used; I didn't see which button he pushed to do any of these so if you want to venture into the service mode make sure you know what you are doing). After making this change we checked and the line was gone on all modes (I triple checked). The service bulletin would have had him do further changes on each mode, I'm supposing, only if the initial change didn't fix the problem. I asked him whether he thought we should do the changes anyway and he said that if it wasn't broken, don't fix it and I guess I kind of agree with that, although I'm really nervous that he was supposed to have done other things but he assured me that the bulletin offered these other changes only if the initial fix didn't work. So, there it is, it's fixable and apparently for some sets, really easy to fix. By the way, my set was manufactured in October 2002. Good luck to the rest of you; I hope the new year finds you free of the dreaded line and many days and nights of enjoyable HD viewing -- Say, does anyone know if the Super Bowl is in HD this year?.
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post #116 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 11:25 AM
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well this setting is in the OP category and its number 4 (hdpt) i tryed this on mine and im going to give it a couple of hours but so far no line anymore. there are only 2 settings for this 1,0 so its not like you can really screw things up and can always put it back to 1. i have the service manual and its on page 122, its the last setting category in service mode.
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post #117 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 12:50 PM
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So are you saying this is an easy fix that I could do myself? I would like to have a Sony person do it, but if it is that easy I would rather not take time off of work to wait for someone to show up.

How do you get in the service mode? Gashog301 can you give simple step by step instructions on how you did it?
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post #118 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 01:09 PM
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Does this problem effect the 40xbr700 model?
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post #119 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 01:12 PM
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so far i have only noticed people having this problem on the XBR800 series.

there is a "write" function in service mode? is this why my settings never seem to stay in place?

max99 look up the rest of the thread and some other XBR800 threads on how to use the service mode, it's a little tricky but once you understand how it works it's simple enough. to enter service mode, start with the TV off, and on the remote in quick sequence press "Display" - "5" - "Vol +" - "Power"
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post #120 of 918 Old 12-31-2002, 01:19 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by dorkus
so far i have only noticed people having this problem on the XBR800 series.

there is a "write" function in service mode? is this why my settings never seem to stay in place?

max99 look up the rest of the thread and some other XBR800 threads on how to use the service mode, it's a little tricky but once you understand how it works it's simple enough. to enter service mode, start with the TV off, and on the remote in quick sequence press "Display" - "5" - "Vol +" - "Power"

To save changes the key sequence is Muting - Enter.

Phil
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