How are RCA F38310 owners doing? - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 1202 Old 09-11-2008, 08:01 AM
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Thanks for the insight Ratman.

Are replacement power supply boards available?

If not (or expensive) are the failed components well known/easy to identify & repair?

I am more of an electrician than a electronics' guy. I used to build boards when they were discrete components and only two layers, but I gave up when they became a zillion layers and you need an electron microscope to see the traces!

Thanks for any help!

Snowman
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post #812 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 08:09 AM
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Hello everyone.

I am new to this site because I just purchased an RCA F38310. First of all, this was a beast and needed a couple of nice neighbors to help me get this down my stairs....crap.....I dont want to move this again ( may have to stay with the house when I sell it )

Anyway, I just plugged my HD Directv Sat receiver into it using the component inputs ( only see 1 set) and the pictures look great --- Now I need to upgrade my av receiver and have a couple of question.

1) If I get an newer AV receiver ( thinking Yamaha RX-V450 with 3 component inputs, 2 sets in and one set out) I would have to plug my sat receiver into the av receiver using the component in, then out to the tv....is this correct? This would be the only way to use a 5.1 Surround Sound system that I can see, especially with the limited (1) component input on the tv.

2) I guess the fan runs all the time - is this ok?
3) After programming my Directv remote to the tv and using it to turn both the tv and receiver on and off, this morning, when I went to turn it on, the tv displayed "weak signal" and I had to change inputs .( I guess the component uses "AUX". Is this how it will be? I really dont want to change the input each time I turn on the tv.

Lastly, would it be beneficial to have someone clean and calibrate the tv to perfection....would this be money well spent ( looks prety good now though)

Thanks for any advice and I am sure as I set up my Surround Sound, I may have more...any advice there is appreciated too) BTW, I got the tv and a stand for $275...I hope this was a decent deal ( have the room and cant spend $800+ on an hd tv right now)

Rich
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post #813 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r1behrens@msn.co View Post

Anyway, I just plugged my HD Directv Sat receiver into it using the component inputs ( only see 1 set) and the pictures look great ---

I've got 2 of them and they are wonderful once adjusted properly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by r1behrens View Post

Now I need to upgrade my av receiver and have a couple of question.

1) If I get an newer AV receiver ( thinking Yamaha RX-V450 with 3 component inputs, 2 sets in and one set out) I would have to plug my sat receiver into the av receiver using the component in, then out to the tv....is this correct? This would be the only way to use a 5.1 Surround Sound system that I can see, especially with the limited (1) component input on the tv.

You could do that. I run the component cables from the D* box straight to the TV. I also run analog audio wires straight to the TV and a digital audio cable to the receiver. That way, I only need the receiver when I want the good sound. I don't need or use the receiver for just normal TV.

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Originally Posted by r1behrens View Post

2) I guess the fan runs all the time - is this ok?

That's just how it is.

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Originally Posted by r1behrens View Post

3) After programming my Directv remote to the tv and using it to turn both the tv and receiver on and off, this morning, when I went to turn it on, the tv displayed "weak signal" and I had to change inputs .( I guess the component uses "AUX". Is this how it will be? I really dont want to change the input each time I turn on the tv.

AFAIK, it's a problem. I know of no way to get it to turn on and immediately listen to the new external D* receiver. It always goes to the built-in RCA-100 receiver and reports a weak signal because that receiver is not hooked up to anything. As best I can tell, using the D* remote, you have to press the "TV input" button several times until the TV cycles through all its inputs and eventually gets to the component inputs which appears to be the very last one. I set up the TV so that the component input is set to the "DVD" button on the TV's remote. That way, after I turn everything on with the D* remote, I then use the TV remote once (just to press the "DVD" button) and then use the D* remote for everything else. (I don't know if you can associate the component inputs with a button other than DVD. Maybe you can, I just never tried it because my DVD players are hooked up to other TV's.)

There might be a better solution, but I don't know what it is.

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Lastly, would it be beneficial to have someone clean and calibrate the tv to perfection....would this be money well spent ( looks prety good now though)

I think you can get most of the benefit by using one of the DVD's intended for that purpose. The 2 leading ones appear to be AVIA II (get AVIA II, not the 1st version) and Digital Video Essentials. It's a lot cheaper to do that, and the result is excellent according to my eyeballs.

You don't need both of the DVD's, either one will do. I like the AVIA best, but some other folks like the other one best. It probably doesn't matter which one you use.
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post #814 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 01:29 PM
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[quote]

You could do that. I run the component cables from the D* box straight to the TV. I also run analog audio wires straight to the TV and a digital audio cable to the receiver. That way, I only need the receiver when I want the good sound. I don't need or use the receiver for just normal TV.

QUOTE]

Good stuff - thanks....a couple of follow-ups.

So you use a digital audio cable from the av receiver to the tv....is that what you meant? I didnt think the tv had one.

Also, with the dvd you are mentioning, does this just give you tips how to adjust the tv or does it do something else and you follow-along with the tv menu?

Rich
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post #815 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by russdog View Post

I think you can get most of the benefit by using one of the DVD's intended for that purpose. The 2 leading ones appear to be AVIA II (get AVIA II, not the 1st version) and Digital Video Essentials. It's a lot cheaper to do that, and the result is excellent according to my eyeballs.

You don't need both of the DVD's, either one will do. I like the AVIA best, but some other folks like the other one best. It probably doesn't matter which one you use.

question - while it's been awhile since i used the Avia dvd i remember the on screen menu for the RCA getting in the way to do the adjustments-- am i missing something to do this in a more efficient manner?

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post #816 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r1behrens@msn.co View Post

So you use a digital audio cable from the av receiver to the tv....is that what you meant?

Nope.

I have 2 ways that the audio signals are output from the DirecTV sat box. The analog output (via the normal stereo wires, red-for-right-channel and white-for-left channel) go from the sat box to the TV. The digital output goes from the sat box to the surround-sound receiver. Thus, I have the sound from the sat box going 2 places at once: to the TV and to the surround-sound receiver.

The video signal goes directly from the sat box to the TV. The surround-sound receiver never gets the video signal.

If I want surround sound, I use the surround-sound receiver and mute the sound on the TV. For just normal TV, I leave the surround-sound receiver off and use the TV only. Since I don't care about surround-sound for each and every TV program, this works great for me.

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Also, with the dvd you are mentioning, does this just give you tips how to adjust the tv or does it do something else and you follow-along with the tv menu?
Rich

It helps you see how to best adjust the various settings on the TV. There are a handful settings to adjust using the TV's menus and the TV's remote.
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post #817 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eddieras View Post

question - while it's been awhile since i used the Avia dvd i remember the on screen menu for the RCA getting in the way to do the adjustments-- am i missing something to do this in a more efficient manner?

It's been a long while since I did it. I don't remember having any particular difficulties doing it. 'Not sure what to tell you.

EDIT: I did have to nose around on the internet because a couple of the names for the settings that AVIA used were different names than the names of the settings in the menu for the TV. However, that didn't take long to do. (I forget which ones though...)
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post #818 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 07:50 PM
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thanks russdog for your help - any idea where to buy this dvd? Amazon and places like that or only specialty electronic sites?

Rich
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post #819 of 1202 Old 09-23-2008, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r1behrens@msn.co View Post

thanks russdog for your help - any idea where to buy this dvd? Amazon and places like that or only specialty electronic sites?

Rich

You can get it lots of places. Amazon. Best Buy. Even Walmart has it.
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post #820 of 1202 Old 09-24-2008, 08:50 AM
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Rich- my 2 cents.
I run all my component connections to my Yamaha receiver, then out to only comp input on RCA. Since I use the TVs comp input 90% of the time, I never need to change the TV input.
I power on the TV and cable box from the cable remote. TV stays on last input I used.
I also use the TV remotes "DVD" button to switch to comp input, on rare occasions when I need to (power outage, mostly) Another trick I did when I used the built in D* receiver was turn the TV remote toward me, press "TV" on the remote, and then "POWER" to turn on the TV. This would turn on TV without switching the input.
As for audio, again everything through my Yamaha, then it's just a matter of choosing the source from the Yamaha. TV never gets an audio signal. Simple, yes, but it means I need the receiver to watch (hear) anything. The only other audio path is the optical out from the RCA to my receiver, which I use when I watch HD OTA (currently, only SMALLVILLE, because my cable co doesn't carry the CW in HD)
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post #821 of 1202 Old 09-25-2008, 06:39 PM
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A number of RCA televisions, including the 38310, have a "feature" that cause them to go to the TV input when powered on. If the remote sends a discrete "Power on" message, this will happen. If the remote sends a "Toggle power" signal, however, it will come on to the input that was last used.

DirecTV remotes are a pain because they only use the discrete code, so the TV always goes to tuner, even though what you really want is component.

And yes, the menus obscure a large portion of the screen so using DVDs to calibrate the set can be a little tedious. They are certainly far, far cheaper than having a pro come out and do it, though, so I consider it well worth the trouble.
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post #822 of 1202 Old 09-26-2008, 04:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterbilt View Post

And yes, the menus obscure a large portion of the screen so using DVDs to calibrate the set can be a little tedious. They are certainly far, far cheaper than having a pro come out and do it, though, so I consider it well worth the trouble.

thanks- is there a way around that- any tips?

eddieras
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post #823 of 1202 Old 09-27-2008, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eddieras View Post

thanks- is there a way around that- any tips?

Not much, really. You can adjust the transparency of the menus, which helps a little bit. Mostly you just have to set what seems ok, close the menu, check the results, and if you need to make further adjustments, go back in to the menu. That's what makes it tedious.

Once you get things set you should be pretty happy, though. These sets remind me of a good record player. They may not be perfect, but there is a sort of natural brilliance that you can only get from a big-ass crt.
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post #824 of 1202 Old 09-27-2008, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterbilt View Post

A number of RCA televisions, including the 38310, have a "feature" that cause them to go to the TV input when powered on. If the remote sends a discrete "Power on" message, this will happen. If the remote sends a "Toggle power" signal, however, it will come on to the input that was last used.

DirecTV remotes are a pain because they only use the discrete code, so the TV always goes to tuner, even though what you really want is component.

...

I have a D*TV HD DVR. I experienced this problem until I found the right remote code for the TV. I used 11953. It will toggle the TV on/off using the on button, but will turn TV & DVR off using the off button (and on using the on button).
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post #825 of 1202 Old 09-27-2008, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jstorer View Post

I have a D*TV HD DVR. I experienced this problem until I found the right remote code for the TV. I used 11953. It will toggle the TV on/off using the on button, but will turn TV & DVR off using the off button (and on using the on button).

Wow! Thank you. You are my new hero ;-)
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post #826 of 1202 Old 09-28-2008, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jstorer View Post

I have a D*TV HD DVR. I experienced this problem until I found the right remote code for the TV. I used 11953. It will toggle the TV on/off using the on button, but will turn TV & DVR off using the off button (and on using the on button).

Oh, that's awesome. I quit looking once I got a Harmony remote.
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post #827 of 1202 Old 09-28-2008, 11:21 AM
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I had an el cheapo ( $18 philips ) mechanical component video switch that worked fine for a couple of years and then worn out. When I went to replace it I noticed walmart had a Philips `automatic` switch for $25. Sure enough, the automatic part behaves quite nicely.

The problem though is now with my wii, the switch and my f38310. The top couple inches of my screen now zip zag wildly left and right on most screens. One screen ( weather ) with it's green bankground is actually quite stable.

If I plug the Wii directly into my F38310 it works fine.

Anyone have an idea what the technical name for this is and if there's anyway to mitigate it without returning the video switch? The automatic aspect is so convient and my Wii looks WAY better on my RCA then on my Westinghouse 47".
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post #828 of 1202 Old 10-01-2008, 11:01 AM
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OK, I am going to attempt to repair my free F38310 this weekend that has the clicking failure.

I have obtained the service manual, but one aspect that is not addressed is the removal of the electronics assembly.

Could anyone advise on how the electronics assembly is attached to the main frame?

Also does anyone know the specs for the suspected CR17410 diode?

Thanks!

Snowman
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post #829 of 1202 Old 10-03-2008, 07:52 AM
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snowman: just read your post and the following might be of some help. I assume you have the Thomson service manual on CD as I do. There is a short entry on the removal of the video power supply board in the manual. The safety diode (CR17410) is situated in the rear portion of the board. there's also a diagram that pinpoints the diode's location. You can access that by searching the diagram file using the diode's position number, CR17410. I acquired a couple of these diodes along with a DM-1 power supply from Sear's parts two years ago as a just-in-case purchase. At that time, the doides were about six dollars each. Fortunately for me, I haven't needed to use any of those parts. My F38310JX4 is still performing flawlessly after nearly eight years in operation.

I wrote the above from memory. I just got a new computer up and running and have yet to load the Thomson CD into my new system. Hope this helps. Way back in this thread, by the way, are a couple of posts by Dr. Joe detailing the failure and replacement of the diode and adjacent damaged components, complete with pictures of the CR14710 in its burnt-out state. If his posts survived the great AVS crash of '08, they could help.

I better quit trusting my memory. The correct poster's name is Joe Floyd and not Dr.Joe. Check his post #182 and most of the other posts between there and about post #220. It's a pretty comprehensive discussion regarding the location and replacement of the CR17410 safety diode. Let us know if you can secure the parts and effect the repair. Good luck. It's a great HDTV and worth reviving, dependent on the cost of repair of course.
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post #830 of 1202 Old 10-10-2008, 04:24 PM
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I spent a fair amount of time trying to figure out how to release the electronics from the chassis - I was working in poor lighting & did not want to force anything. I finally figured it out.

The board plugged into the back of the tube pulls straight back after loosening the support clamp around the tube.

The DM1 board on the left side snaps into plastic catches that you need to release to remove the board.

There is a plastic catch on the right side (looking from the back) of the main electronics tray. After it is released the tray slides straight back. See picture.

There are several cables that need to be unplugged. Most of these become obvious as you work. I took pictures of each one before I pulled it so I could figure out where they went later.

Two that are not necessarily obvious are the ribbon cables to the speakers & top switches. The speaker cable is disconnected at the small board mounted at the lower right edge of the case.

You need to pop the switch assembly out of the case with a small screwdriver and then partially disassemble to release the board. The cable can then be pulled off the header and fed back through the hole.

I have attached a picture of the CR14710 location for anyone else trying to locate it.
LL
LL

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post #831 of 1202 Old 10-10-2008, 04:32 PM
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After getting the electronics out of the chassis and finding the suspect CR14710 zener diode, I found it to be in apparently good condition. No sign of overheating.

Would anyone care to offer alternative causes for the clicking cycle when trying to start?

Thanks!

Snowman
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post #832 of 1202 Old 10-11-2008, 11:22 AM
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snowman: just noted your most recent post. I recall(trusting my memory again) a post early on in this thread by Ratman regarding that clicking sound. He identified a flyback transformer as the likely source. Ratman: are you out there somewhere? Can you confirm this for snowman? Appreciate the photos and thorough descriptions on removal of the video board, by the way. Could save me considerable time and expense if the same component(s) in my set fail.

Back with another thought: the failure to power up could be attributable to the DM-1 power supply module. Have you inspected that board for burnt out or bulging components?
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post #833 of 1202 Old 10-11-2008, 11:57 AM
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As I stated previously...
AFAIK, the DM-1 power supply/board should not affect the chassis from powering up. When the DM-1 fails, it only makes the "tuner" (satellite/OTA/RF) inputs inoperable. The set should power up with a failed Dm-1 based on my previous experiences.

FWIW I never mentioned the flyback as a potential problem. I directed snowman to the main power supply circuit.
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post #834 of 1202 Old 10-12-2008, 03:33 PM
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Except for "only" being 1080i and no HDMI, I can't complain. Still working after 6 years. Not bad for RCA/Thompson junk. HD pic blows away my Olevia LCD set.
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post #835 of 1202 Old 10-17-2008, 10:27 AM
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My F38310 went out a couple of nights ago with the main AC line input fuse blowing (6A ,#14200). I've purchased the CD repair manual and started to diagnose it. I can see a burnt component on the hot side of the main deflection/power supply board. Possibly in the standby power supply but I haven't narrowed it down yet. Is this board available at a reasonable cost? I like the picture but I don't want to spend more than the TV is worth.

How do I disconnect the cable that runs from the back right side of the circuit board to the top middle of the tube? I currently have the chassis slid out and on its side with the tuner and other boards still attached. I would appreciate any insight anybody might have.
Thanks
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post #836 of 1202 Old 10-17-2008, 11:09 AM
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Dean12,

See the attached pic. If these are the cables you are referring to, they simply pull off. Also see my notes above.

There does not seem to be a source for the power supply/ defelection board.

However, www.tristatemodule.com will repair the set of boards;

"We don't break this set down into individual modules.* The whole thing is considered a DTV306 which we can repair for $279.95 plus shipping."

In answer to a followup question they responed:

"It's the whole collection of boards.* Almost everything from the guts of the TV"
LL

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post #837 of 1202 Old 10-17-2008, 01:13 PM
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Snowman
Thanks for the source to repair the deflection/power supply board. Your post #830 was helpful. The cable I need to disconnect is a heavy gauge single conductor that can be seen from your photo labeled "CR14710 Location" at #830 post. One end can be seen in the bottom left corner along with another pink wire connected to the board through a white casing. The wire routes to the left out of the picture then to the tube at top center. I couldn't tell if it would unplug from either end for fear of breaking it. If it is a simple single strand wire or ground wire, I could just cut it if needed?
Thanks
Dean
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post #838 of 1202 Old 10-17-2008, 01:36 PM
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Are you looking at the cable that has a large flat plastic disk around it where it plugs into the CRT? See Pics.

It is held in place by a pair of spring clips.

To remove, pull out while twisting it.

Caution - this is a very high voltage lead & the CRT acts a large capacitor. Be sure the set has been unplugged for several days before touching it!!

Do Not Cut It.

Good luck.
LL
LL

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post #839 of 1202 Old 10-17-2008, 01:40 PM
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Snowman,
Thanks, thats the cable.

Dean
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post #840 of 1202 Old 10-24-2008, 09:22 AM
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57,712 hours and still running like a champ. I am glad to see this forum still going, it has really helped me in the past. I'll still be sorry when this tv finally goes, I still believe that the picture is superior to most still being made today. Unless you start getting into the 3-5K catagory. I only wish I could find a way convert from hdmi to component. Bought a new Onkyo receiver and, while I was thinging of the future, it only has two component imputs. I would love to input hdmi to the receiver and out hdmi. anyone know if you can convert back to component?
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