Panasonic PT-AE4000 MSRP $1999 - Page 156 - AVS Forum
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post #4651 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

I'm just not sure if I need it lower or not for my needs? The projector will be about 11' away from ~100" 16:9 diagonal screen with 8' tall ceilings. How will I know if I need the extension piece or not?

I'm kinda in the same boat. I decided to go with a 16:9 screen, so I'm thinking I can get away with the projector being mounted closer to the ceiling. I bought the 11-18" extension, but if I can get away with a lesser drop, I will be doing that. I'm hoping the vertical shifting has some decent play. I'll probably try a 6 or 8" pipe.

One nice thing about this mount is that the extension is just a 1.5" NPL threaded (male on both ends) pipe. It should be fairly easy to find in a hardware store. I'm thinking I wasted $12 on the adjustable piping (it is well designed and made), but I should be able to sell it or something. One caution with the adjustable pipe. You won't be able to use the the finishing plate (part B) because the adjustable pipe uses a larger diameter pipe for the top portion. I guess you could mount it with the smaller (1.5") piece on the top, but it's not really designed for that kind of mounting.

John
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post #4652 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by wizzack View Post

... I just don't want vibrations/rattling to affect the inner workings of the PJ.
...

I see. I didn't even think about that. Now I'm really worried ....

I do have insulation (R30 I believe) throughout the ceilings in the basement, hopefully that dampens most if not all smaller vibrations.

If it's not too much, do you mind showing a picture what you will do? Thanks.


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post #4653 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by azgard View Post

Is it variable Vert and Horz? Can I mask the image to fit my screen format i.e. 2:1?

It has both vertical and horizontal masking. And I believe they should have enough range to hide enough of the sides of the scope image, and certainly enough of the top and bottom of the 16:9 image, so that they fit into your 2.1 screen.

But, are you sure that's what you want to do? For a scope movie, you are crop out almost 15% of the image?


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post #4654 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J4yDubs View Post

I'm kinda in the same boat. I decided to go with a 16:9 screen, so I'm thinking I can get away with the projector being mounted closer to the ceiling. I bought the 11-18" extension, but if I can get away with a lesser drop, I will be doing that. I'm hoping the vertical shifting has some decent play. I'll probably try a 6 or 8" pipe.

John

Hi, J4yDubs, and WillamG: If you don't do CIH, the max vertical shift is 100% off center from the screen. For a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen (49" tall), the highest you can position the center of the projector lens is 49" from the CENTER of the screen, or 24.5" from the image area top. For an 8' ceiling, you may not even need an extension pole, when you consider the thickness of the mount itself, the distance from projector box top to the center of the lens, and the height you plan to mount your screen.

BTW, there is a way to go scope screen with a flush ceiling mount. It will involve a Constant Image Area (CIA) setup with dual screens. I know this sounds crazy and costly, but I just couldn't resist the urge to point it out as an option for those who prefer to hide their projectors as much as possible, but also want to have the immersive experience of the 2.35:1 screen. There are also other benefits with this setup.

Thanks a lot.


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post #4655 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 06:13 PM
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I am glad I went 16x9 for several reasons. I game and do some HTPC and watch hockey and other HD programming which is all 16x9. MAny movies today are in fact 16x9. I watched Broken Embraces and it had subtitles that would conflict with CIH screens and puts them in the masking/bottom bar area. If you only watch movies on the projector I would say CIH, is the way to go, but if you do even 1/3 of your viewing of sources in 16x9 then I would recommend 16x9. I don't mask the bars, but like my RPTV, I block them out like I do with background noises or a noisy air conditioner.
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post #4656 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 07:26 PM
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Thanks for the reply, jjmbxkb. I really appreciate that. Looks like I'll be able to flush mount.

The manual does say, though, that for the best picture you want it to be directly in the center of the screen. How much picture "degradation" is there by having the projector above the screen?
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post #4657 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 08:39 PM
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Hi, WilliamG: That is certainly the tradeoff and could be a reason to use some extension to avoid max lens shift. My guess is for most installations, lens shift does not introduce noticeable distortion, otherwise the positioning adavantage of LCD projectors because of lens shift would not have been cited everywhere as an advantage.

I found the following recent thread on this. It kind of compares keystoning and lens shift: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...php?p=18013242. Among the posters on that thread, I think CT_Wiebe frequents this thread. As usual, I found his post knowledge and insightful. Hopefully he sees this and answers your question. Or you can PM him. BTW, he said he uses almost max lens shift with his current projector. I hope he meant this particular model. There is also the point that manufacturers usually set the lens shift limit way below the actual range to minimize picture degradation.

Thanks very much.


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post #4658 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 08:51 PM
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Thank you once again for the reply. I've learned a ton since deciding to go the projector route.
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post #4659 of 8516 Old 03-29-2010, 10:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

I am glad I went 16x9 for several reasons. I game and do some HTPC and watch hockey and other HD programming which is all 16x9. MAny movies today are in fact 16x9. I watched Broken Embraces and it had subtitles that would conflict with CIH screens and puts them in the masking/bottom bar area. If you only watch movies on the projector I would say CIH, is the way to go, but if you do even 1/3 of your viewing of sources in 16x9 then I would recommend 16x9. I don't mask the bars, but like my RPTV, I block them out like I do with background noises or a noisy air conditioner.

Hi, Hughmc:

There is another potential development that could increase the importance of the 16:9 screen. I think if the 3D push has any leg, it's going to be in the area of 3D sports broadcast, which will be in 16:9 format.

It utilimately depends on viewing preferences and priorities. Just as an option, with the zoom memory function on this projector, there is a way get the best of both worlds, plus the benefit of full masking for aspect ratios and flush ceiling mount.

Thanks.


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post #4660 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azgard
Is it variable Vert and Horz? Can I mask the image to fit my screen format i.e. 2:1?

It has both vertical and horizontal masking. And I believe they should have enough range to hide enough of the sides of the scope image, and certainly enough of the top and bottom of the 16:9 image, so that they fit into your 2.1 screen.

But, are you sure that's what you want to do? For a scope movie, you are crop out almost 15% of the image?





It's my only option at this point. But will give the best of both worlds.

Question?

Is there a mask memory? i.e. if I zoom to fit scope or 16:9, and various aspect ratios the mask will need to be different in each case.
Will the mask have a memory same as the zoom memory or will I manualy have to crop it for each change of aspect ratio?

Thanks
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post #4661 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J4yDubs View Post

Where are you going to have the power outlet? Above the ceiling or do you plan have it flush (exposed) in the drywall?

I guess that's what I'm asking you guys. What do most people do with mounts like this when it comes to the electrical outlet? I'm not using a drop ceiling. I assume it's against code to mount the electrical outlet up in the ceiling (above the drywall), considering it is a basement so I can't get access to it by going into an attic or something. Maybe people come up with some way to still get access to it if they take the mount down? I'm having a hard time seeing a good way to make use of the cable management feature, when it comes to the power cord.... or do most mounts have the type of cable management feature that has a hole at the top of the pipe so your outlets/wall plates would be flush with the ceiling and thus most people don't worry about trying to hide the outlet?

Oh, and I most likely won't be using that extension pipe you mention.
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post #4662 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azgard View Post

Question?

Is there a mask memory? i.e. if I zoom to fit scope or 16:9, and various aspect ratios the mask will need to be different in each case.
Will the mask have a memory same as the zoom memory or will I manualy have to crop it for each change of aspect ratio?

Thanks

The mask settings are part of the lens memories. Set them once, and you can load them up automatically.


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post #4663 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by raster8 View Post

Wojtek you are indeed correct, but most users will have a hard time knowing what mix of settings are correct for their devices. The manufacturees have done a great disservice to the consumer by writing the same thing different ways, most will have no idea what to set them to:


Actual________________0-255_______16-235
Panasonic AE4000 ______Enhanced____Normal
WD TV Live____________RGB High____RGB Low

So in the above setup most people would be unlikely to know that Normal=RGB Low and Enhanced=RGB High.

This is the type of thing I see when visiting a people who just built a new HT and want to show it off and the black crush is so huge because the levels are mismatched. I just wanted to point out that looking at the levels reported in the Panasonic is an easy way to tell that things were amiss, so that they could be properly corrected by matching the source to the display.

What are we talking about here? I am not following, maybe I missed something? There are HDMI settings on the AE4000, enhanced and normal, that should be set according to the source feeding it? Please clarify.

Thanks.

2 wrongs don't make a right, but 3 lefts do...
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post #4664 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by jjmbxkb View Post

The mask settings are part of the lens memories. Set them once, and you can load them up automatically.

This is an excellent solution. I'm surprised no other co is offering a mask/ lens memory. I'd much rather see less light with "real resolution" than an interpolated scale with anamorphic lens.

Only wish this was offered as a dlp rather then LCD, I'd prefer the sharper dlp image.
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post #4665 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by azgard View Post

This is an excellent solution. I'm surprised no other co is offering a mask/ lens memory. I'd much rather see less light with "real resolution" than an interpolated scale with anamorphic lens.

Only wish this was offered as a dlp rather then LCD, I'd prefer the sharper dlp image.

I have been a DLP guy for quite sometime and currently own 720p DLP Sharp projectors, XV-Z3000 and XV-Z12000. The AE4000 is sharper than both.

I want to hear opinions from people who don't have a dog in the fight.
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post #4666 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 11:23 AM
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I find the 4K sharper than my previous DLP projector as well.
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post #4667 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Alex solomon View Post

I have been a DLP guy for quite sometime and currently own 720p DLP Sharp projectors, XV-Z3000 and XV-Z12000. The AE4000 is sharper than both.

This should be expected, as 720p is much lower that 1080p. But DLP technology is much sharper than LCD or LcoS.
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post #4668 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 11:34 AM
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I'd love to tell you how sharp I find my 4000, but right now it's on a FedEx truck coming from Florida, and I'm in Seattle. Talk about opposite ends of the country!
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post #4669 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 11:41 AM
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This thread has strengthened my resolve to not have kids. Ever.

Quote:
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... I've learned a ton since deciding to go the projector route.

I hope that "ton" does not include the point about kids. Cannot be responsible for that big a decision in life.


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post #4670 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by azgard View Post

This should be expected, as 720p is much lower that 1080p. But DLP technology is much sharper than LCD or LcoS.

Partly true. I had the JVC RS2 which is a 1080p, albeit a LCOS technology, for a short period of time and I find the Sharp 720p DLP was sharper than the JVC.

I want to hear opinions from people who don't have a dog in the fight.
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post #4671 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 12:53 PM
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Quote:


jjmbxkb wrote

The mask settings are part of the lens memories. Set them once, and you can load them up automatically.

I have recently visited two video shops to see this 235:1 option in person. Neither shop could demonstrate because they did not even know it was an option on the 4000.

I played with the remote a bit and saw there is a lens memory page with several settings, I suppose that could be it and further think that I would have to set it somehow. then it would just be the case of selecting memory lens one or two to switch between 235:1 and 16:9 material.

I still cannot fathom how if I were to lower a 235:1 screen in front of a 16:9 how when the image is formatted it will not be spilling off in one form or another and visa versa.
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post #4672 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by kiwi2000 View Post

I have recently visited two video shops to see this 235:1 option in person. Neither shop could demonstrate because they did not even know it was an option on the 4000.

I played with the remote a bit and saw there is a lens memory page with several settings, I suppose that could be it and further think that I would have to set it somehow. then it would just be the case of selecting memory lens one or two to switch between 235:1 and 16:9 material.

I still cannot fathom how if I were to lower a 235:1 screen in front of a 16:9 how when the image is formatted it will not be spilling off in one form or another and visa versa.

lens memory, set up both 16x9 and 2.35:1

the idea is that the black bars will spill off the top and bottom of the 2.35:1 screen. while with a 16x9 u will be filling a good deal of the screens top and bottom with bars.
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post #4673 of 8516 Old 03-30-2010, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by kiwi2000 View Post

...
I still cannot fathom how if I were to lower a 235:1 screen in front of a 16:9 how when the image is formatted it will not be spilling off in one form or another and visa versa.

Hi, kiwi2000: I think it's a valid concern, but my experience shows it shouldn't be a problem.

To drop a 235:1 screen in front of your 16:9 96" fixed frame, you may have light spillover at the bottom onto the underlying 16:9 screen, depending on the size of the scope screen, and how low you want to drop it. But that light will be part of the bottom black bar.

I have the "vise versa" setup, with a fixed scope screen, and a 16:9 screen electric drop down, There is no light spillover whatsoever, since the image fills up the entire screen. The following are some pictures (sorry for my picture taking skills and/or the point-and-shoot camera):

The 115" fixed frame scope screen (I think it was Gran Torino being played):



While we are at it, a screen shot of State Of Play (Surprisingly good movie):



Amadus:



Pitch Black (Or should it be called "The Origin of Riddick"?)



Now, the electric drop down, 106" 16:9:









Chicago:



Fargo (A slow fast movie):



Before The Devil Knows You Are Dead:b



The Oscar night (In the brightest Dynamic mode):



The Wizard Of OZ (4:3 movie on the 16:9 screen):



I was planning to use theater style curtains to cover the sides of the scope screen, but don't see the need for it after actual viewing. They don't bother me or any of my guests at all. They at least feel much darker than what the pictures show, maybe because your eyes are just drawn into the images on the 16:9 screen and what's happening in the movie. Of course, everyone has different priorities and preferences. BTW, I have dark screen wall, light colored ceilings and side walls, and we sit 15' away.

In your case, the scope drops down and should cover the top and the entire width of the 16:9 fixed frame. Speaking for myself, I know I won't notice part of the bottom bar landing on the 16:9 screen during movie sessions.


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post #4674 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjmbxkb View Post

I see. I didn't even think about that. Now I'm really worried ....

I do have insulation (R30 I believe) throughout the ceilings in the basement, hopefully that dampens most if not all smaller vibrations.

I wouldn't worry about it too muchjust think how much vibration your sub puts on everything in the room (including the projector).

Sometimes when my subs really crank up, I can't tell whether the picture shimmy is caused by the projector vibrating or my skull rattling.


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post #4675 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 07:22 AM
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Hi, ziptiecowboy: Excellent point.

BTW, what brand/model are your dual subs? What about your speakers?

Thanks.


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post #4676 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 07:49 AM
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has this projector ever been offered with a free bulb or has it always been the 2yr extend warrenty?

Thanks
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post #4677 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 09:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjmbxkb View Post

Hi, ziptiecowboy: Excellent point.

BTW, what brand/model are your dual subs? What about your speakers?

Thanks.

Subs are Def Tech PF1500's. Mains are BP30's, center CLR2000 and Surrounds are BPX's all driven by Adcom amps (GFA5500 & 5503). I've had 'em since 1997.


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post #4678 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 03:51 PM
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Hi All,

Thinking of pulling the trigger on the AE4000 replacing my PEAX-100U. I'm going for a 2.35:1 110" high contrast Grey screen and only using the projector for those sized movies. The screen will be in front of a 58" plasma which I will be watching other sized content like 4x3 or 16x9 ratio images when the projector is not in use. My questions being is do I use and anamorphic lens with the AE4000 as I do and don't with the 100U? Or will the AE4000 give me very good picture quality without the added lens when using this screen? It's doesn't seem to me that the AE4000 is really increasing the use of the lcd panels as I am with the 100u using the lens to stretch the image. Or is it? Is the AE4000 just zooming the image and still displaying the black bars at the top and bottom thus you can see them in say your masking area of the screen or spilling out off the picture edge? Any thoughts on if I'm going to be happy with this projector change besides that it does have 1080p vs 720p?

Thanks,
Chris

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post #4679 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

I'd love to tell you how sharp I find my 4000, but right now it's on a FedEx truck coming from Florida, and I'm in Seattle. Talk about opposite ends of the country!

I see you went with PP ...Should have ordered from Visual Apex located up in your neck of the woods.

I know how you feel as I ordered from Visual Apex and I'm in NYC.

I could have went with PP but felt the customer service was a tad better with VA via email and phone conversations I had with both.

See My AVS Classified Ad .
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post #4680 of 8516 Old 03-31-2010, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziptiecowboy View Post

Subs are Def Tech PF1500's. Mains are BP30's, center CLR2000 and Surrounds are BPX's all driven by Adcom amps (GFA5500 & 5503). I've had 'em since 1997.

Really nice! What's great about speakes is that investment in them will last a long time, as they don't change as much as in the video world.


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