Acer H5360 HD3D (DLP 1280x720) Video Projector - Page 12 - AVS Forum
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post #331 of 1760 Old 12-11-2010, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob7145 View Post

Nvidia is a proprietary system that will go the way of betamax, hd-dvd, the DoDo bird etc. Would not mind trying it myself but I'm not gonna buy a graphics card with it just to see if it works. You could buy a killer BR-DVD player for less, much less!

Will the Nvidia set up work with 1080p 3D? I've got 5 pairs of Nvidia glasses and they work great. At some point I'll upgrade to a 1080p 3D projector (maybe it'll be a downgrade after seeing what a ghost free 720p 3D DLP does) and continue to use my HTPC as my player, so I'm hoping the glasses will still work - I think they should.

My two brothers came down from Toronto today to take in some 3D from the Acer and my HP screen. They've both seen my 1080p stuff before, but this time they were totally knocked out by 3D and just how incredibly good it can look when using the little Acer 720p 3D DLP. I showed them an IMAX documentary, 20 minutes of Avatar and we then watched HTTYD, which neither had seen before.
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post #332 of 1760 Old 12-11-2010, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

Will the Nvidia set up work with 1080p 3D? I've got 5 pairs of Nvidia glasses and they work great. At some point I'll upgrade to a 1080p 3D projector (maybe it'll be a downgrade after seeing what a ghost free 720p 3D DLP does) and continue to use my HTPC as my player, so I'm hoping the glasses will still work - I think they should.

it's not likely, I think that's been part of the beef is that are proprietary to the Nvidia drivers/emitter.

I'll let you know as soon as I get my hands on the RS40 or RS50 which is turning out to be a pain given the limited stock. If I already had a decent 2D projector, I would keep the Acer for 3D only. My Mitsubishi 3LCD 1080P has been shelved for now. Either the 40 or 50 will be excellent for 2D and we'll just to have see for 3D.

since I already have the Acer, I'll be brutally honest comparing the two side by side. No kudos to the JVC just because it's way more expensive.
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post #333 of 1760 Old 12-12-2010, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

it's not likely, I think that's been part of the beef is that are proprietary to the Nvidia drivers/emitter.

I'll let you know as soon as I get my hands on the RS40 or RS50 which is turning out to be a pain given the limited stock. If I already had a decent 2D projector, I would keep the Acer for 3D only. My Mitsubishi 3LCD 1080P has been shelved for now. Either the 40 or 50 will be excellent for 2D and we'll just to have see for 3D.

since I already have the Acer, I'll be brutally honest comparing the two side by side. No kudos to the JVC just because it's way more expensive.

I look forward to your comparison, but I have to admit it's with some trepidation, since I have no doubt the JVC in 3D mode will be excellent. I don't think the extra resolution will be that big a deal, but the black level will be noticeably better, thus giving the overall image more punch and better saturation. The black level with the Acer in 3D mode and glasses on is significantly better than in 2D mode to my eyes. Using an ND filter for 2D, I suspect, would also make a significant improvement to black level and with so many lumens to spare, especially with an HP screen, this sounds like a plan to me for those interested in 2D.

I'm particularly interested in what you'll find with respect to ghosting, colour fringing and flicker. It seems that the Sony, which is much more expensive than the RS-40, has some reported issues, albeit probably extremely minor, with these artifacts. I wouldn't want to be defending a relatively expensive purchase of a piece of equipment that has any of these issues, especially "ghosting". The nice thing about DLP, especially if RBE isn't an issue for you, is that convergence, flicker and ghosting seem to be non-issues, which is a big plus.
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post #334 of 1760 Old 12-12-2010, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post
I look forward to your comparison, but I have to admit it's with some trepidation, since I have no doubt the JVC in 3D mode will be excellent. I don't think the extra resolution will be that big a deal, but the black level will be noticeably better, thus giving the overall image more punch and better saturation. The black level with the Acer in 3D mode and glasses on is significantly better than in 2D mode to my eyes. Using an ND filter for 2D, I suspect, would also make a significant improvement to black level and with so many lumens to spare, especially with an HP screen, this sounds like a plan to me for those interested in 2D.

I'm particularly interested in what you'll find with respect to ghosting, colour fringing and flicker. It seems that the Sony, which is much more expensive than the RS-40, has some reported issues, albeit probably extremely minor, with these artifacts. I wouldn't want to be defending a relatively expensive purchase of a piece of equipment that has any of these issues, especially "ghosting". The nice thing about DLP, especially if RBE isn't an issue for you, is that convergence, flicker and ghosting seem to be non-issues, which is a big plus.
I have no doubt that Z10K will be very fair and honest in his evaluation. Not like another poster (who shall not be named) that is on the verge of insanity when others badmouth his new expensive 3D PJ

Ghosting is the number one most important criteria for 3D. There is no other way to slice it. Flicker is probably second. Ghosting just pulls me out of the 3D experience altogether.
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post #335 of 1760 Old 12-12-2010, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier1 View Post

I have no doubt that Z10K will be very fair and honest in his evaluation. Not like another poster (who shall not be named) that is on the verge of insanity when others badmouth his new expensive 3D PJ

Ghosting is the number one most important criteria for 3D. There is no other way to slice it. Flicker is probably second. Ghosting just pulls me out of the 3D experience altogether.

hehe, i wonder if you are referring to the sony vs JVC thread. It is interesting how defensive some folks gets when they get a new expensive toy. I become the opposite - hyper critical, evaluating all details to make sure I made a wise investment with the hard earned dollars. it's important to be as objective as possible. I am with you, Ghosting would make me nuts and flicker would be right behind it. Both would take away any advantages of other picture qualities such as better contrast, blacks, etc.

I've viewed ~25 3D BD's on the Acer and well aware of the pro's and con's. It will be interesting to see how the JVC compares. Since I am shelf mounting, it's easy to keep swapping back and forth between projectors.
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post #336 of 1760 Old 12-12-2010, 10:28 PM
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In a sense it will partially be a comparison between LCoS and DLP - I'm particularly interested in that aspect. How would a 1080p 3D DLP with a dynamic iris, CMS, lots of lumens etc. costing the equivalent of the JVC RS-50 stack up? It sure would be interesting. The fact that people here are even willing to put the Acer up against the JVCs and Sonys is a real testament to the Acer's 3D capabilities, IMO.
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post #337 of 1760 Old 12-13-2010, 10:04 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob7145 View Post

Edit: Sorry, reread your post.
If you just watch Bluray all you need is AMD 5xxx Vcard card and PDVD.
3DBR requires 6xxx Vcard, a 3D activator (like IZ3D) and PDVD or some other player. .

I'm confused. Friken watches 3D with the ATI 5770, or am I mistaken?

Also, will the Nvidia glasses work with ATI cards--e.g. through a driver change,etc.?
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post #338 of 1760 Old 12-13-2010, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by threed123 View Post

I'm confused. Friken watches 3D with the ATI 5770, or am I mistaken?

Also, will the Nvidia glasses work with ATI cards--e.g. through a driver change,etc.?

Files are 1 thing, store bought 3D BR disks are another. 3DBR may work with a 5xxx series but the 6xxx have hdmi 1.4a. I have not tried it yet, still waiting on glasses. I have tried the Anaglyph (yellow/blue) driver and glasses in games and 2D to 3D conversion (PDVD10)

The Nvidia system is proprietary and requires an Nvidia Vcard, emitter, driver and glasses. The Nvidia glasses have limited range as they are made for computer use.

Edit: Well I'll be darned, 3DBR does work with an ATI 5xxx card and 1.3. Guess you just need 1.4a for an HDTV.
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post #339 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 08:49 AM
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Just got an email from newegg, code EMCZNZR68 for a 5360 for <500 with free shipping, but your email has to be on their mailing list so you might have to sign up to use it. I think the code's valid 'til the 20th.
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post #340 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 08:55 AM
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as someone who uses the Nvidia setup, I can confirm I sit 16 ft from a 142" Screen (using a 10 foot USB extension) with the IR emitter on the center channel. I have not had any issues with the glasses going out of sync and have gone as far as 20ft without a problem.
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post #341 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 09:48 AM
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I'm using the Nvidia emitter with a usb hub and 2 cables. My emitter is ceiling mounted about 2 feet in front of the center seat of the front row. I'm able to get a signal from each seat in the front and back rows. I think the seating area is about 12x8' of coverage.
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post #342 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 02:48 PM
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Hey guys this might be a stupid question but i have a gtx 260 and would just like to take 3D gaming "for a spin" if youwill... preferably as cheap as possible.

Can you use the dlp-link glasses with Nvidia cards successfully, or is that quad-buffering thing i've been reading about a deal killer?

Thanks!

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post #343 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 02:55 PM
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I have, but I thought the 240 was the one you needed for decent 3D Bluray playback?
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post #344 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

please don't take just part of my statement out of context. I was specifically referring to the drop in contrast & color shift in Nvidia vs. DLP link modes. I will take the ~ 1700:1 with the Nvidia glasses vs. ~400:1 in DLP link mode. This was measured by a highly regarded member (pteittinen) in the over 3k forum who does reviews for a living using top shelf equipment. invite him here if you'd like to argue the topic, I'd be interested to hear both opinions.

Maybe different glasses type/brand. That large of a contrast drop I would see when testing between the 3d vision and DLP link glasses I have, but I don't see it. I also am not getting purple blacks or anything remotely like that. Just for comparison, I use the Viewsonic DLPlink 120Hz glasses. I think they may be the same as the Optoma ones. I'll know soon because I ordered a few more pair of Optoma since viewsonic was sold out.
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post #345 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

the contrast measurements are taken off the screen in 3D mode with DLP-Link enabled / Disabled, not through the glasses. Not sure how that would apply to a specific brand of glasses.

I'll pick up a pair and see for myself what's happening between Nvidia IR vs DLP Link.

The Optoma is $99, the Viewsonic is $89.

Oh... I think that explains a lot. If the measurement isn't taken through the glasses then the acer would have a clearly washed out image. The projector definitely changes image quality so that when viewed through glasses you get the appropriate black level and color levels. The difference with/without glasses on is huge. My comparison is viewing movies with 3d vision enabled wearing their glasses or dlplink enabled wearing dlp link glasses. The blacks and colors pop at least as much w/ dlplink as w 3d vision setup.

Interestingly, when comparing the Optoma HD66 and Acer H5360 one of the big differences was the image when dlplink was turned on and off. The Acer drops the image mode presets including user saved prefs and alters the image to look clearly washed out. The HD66 does not have a washed out look with dlp-link enabled and you still have all your image prefs available. However this difference all but vanishes when you put on the glasses. Having both proj side by side w/ glasses on dlp-link enabled they were extremely close in looks. The acer won out though with better color and better dark scene detail. The HD66 could get close to same on image quality in 3d minus the colors. No matter what setting I used the HD66 could't quite pull off as bright of colors.
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post #346 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by threed123 View Post

I'm confused. Friken watches 3D with the ATI 5770, or am I mistaken?

Also, will the Nvidia glasses work with ATI cards--e.g. through a driver change,etc.?

I use a ATI 5770 primarily. I have an NVIDIA 8800GTS I've used w/ 3d vision or the dlp-link glasses. With ATI/dlplink card you get get quad buffering enabled in iz3d for games. With Nvidia cards you can't game w/ dlp link glasses without eye swapping. iZ3d say they are working on it, but nvidia isn't releasing quad buffering yet. Maybe it will be resolved by iz3d without it though. Of course there isn't that issue using 3d vision emitter and glasses.
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post #347 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 08:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racinGSRstyle View Post

Hey guys this might be a stupid question but i have a gtx 260 and would just like to take 3D gaming "for a spin" if youwill... preferably as cheap as possible.

Can you use the dlp-link glasses with Nvidia cards successfully, or is that quad-buffering thing i've been reading about a deal killer?

Thanks!

I was unable to keep it from eye swapping with iz3d driver or tridef driver using nvidia card. The card I was testing with was older, 8800gts. From what I read the issue I had with the game swapping eyes every few seconds happens on all nvidia cards w/ dlp-link glasses. There are a few threads about this issue on iz3D forums. I know they are working on it and trying to find a solution that works even if Nvidia refuses to add quad buffering support to the driver (of course their pro line of cards supports it though).

Just to ensure this post doesn't sound like an ati fan boy, ATI solutions are not 100% either. Their public drivers up to 10.11 (newest still I think) do not have quad buffering either. I did find a pre-release test driver, but OLD 8.78-RC1 that did enable quad buffering. Also, using Nvidia card I had no issue at all with movie playing where with ATI I had to mess with settings in stereoscopic player to prevent split second eyeswap/jerk. The setting is per movie file and annoying to set "left eye one frame ahead" or something like that in the sync setting. I can't wait for a player that doesn't suck Having to select '*.*' for file type every time and then set the sync setting PER movie gets old. I want it working in Boxee or XBMC
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post #348 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 09:04 PM
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I'm on an hd66, but some of these points still apply, so I thought I'd add my commentary anyway

-The DLP Link glasses can be used with Nvidia 3dvision - you just have to have the emitter for the 3dvision plugged in to the pc anyway. With my glasses (x102) the emitter interfered with DLP link reading sometimes, so I had to have the emitter out of sight. I did that for a while on my old gtx 285.

-AMD released new catalyst drivers a couple days ago. I just upgraded yesterday, and on my 6870 I'm not working perfectly, no eye swapping whatsoever, and the iz3d diagnostic shows that quad buffer is active. I had it working before with an annoying registry hack, but with this latest version it's the first time I've ever had it just work right out of the box.

I don't expect we'll ever see the actual 3d vision glasses work with ATI, though. They use a proprietary infared sequence to sync the glasses, and the emitter driver is integrated with their graphics driver. There was a guy that mapped out a lot of the emitter sequence on mtbs3d, so there's hope, but probably not with much commercial support.
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post #349 of 1760 Old 12-14-2010, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by defiancecp View Post

-AMD released new catalyst drivers a couple days ago. I just upgraded yesterday, and on my 6870 I'm now working perfectly, no eye swapping whatsoever, and the iz3d diagnostic shows that quad buffer is active.

Cool, thanks for letting us know the new driver is out w/ quad buffering. The previous reg hack or old unreleased driver was a bit of a hack.
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post #350 of 1760 Old 12-15-2010, 02:18 AM
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Great! Have not tried the new driver yet (only have 5870) but I bought Imax Deep Sea 3D just to see if 3DBD would work with a 5870 and PDVD10 Ultra and it does. I don't have glasses yet as any good DLP-Links are sold out but the 3D settings are available while playing and the screen does look funny ha ha. Anaglyph and 2D-3D works for sure. AMD 6970 comes available today.

Edit: The Viewsonic PGD-150 DLP Link glasses are in stock at Amazon today.
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post #351 of 1760 Old 12-15-2010, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post


the contrast measurements are taken off the screen in 3D mode with DLP-Link enabled / Disabled, not through the glasses.

That explains the poor results. The dlp link relies on a synchronising White flash from the projector that the dlp link glasses removes. He should have measured from behind the glasses.
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post #352 of 1760 Old 12-15-2010, 11:24 AM
 
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I've ordered 3 pair of UltraClear DLPlink glasses (google it)--cost about $50 a pair when ordered in volume. We'll see how they work, they are to be sent out next week. My problem is I have a Mits 3800 that i still need to work for 2D 1080p and with my upgraded PC and an nvidia 450gt, I just get garbage after the initial boot screen when windows 7 gets loaded. i haven't tried my ACER yet, as that is staying the box until I can try it when my wife isn't around...hehe, I wasn't supposed to get one until next year, but the Newegg deal was too good to pass up...hoho, merry xmas.
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post #353 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 02:13 AM
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Does anyone know the color wheel speed and segments of this projector? I am trying to decide on this vs the HD66 and wondering if I am gonna have a problem with rainbows.

I currently have a mits hc3000 with a 4x rgbrgb and never have seen a rainbow. So I am hoping to find something with a similar lay out thanks.
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post #354 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 08:10 AM
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Have not seen any rainbows with mine. Have about 150 Hrs on it.
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post #355 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 11:24 AM
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Hello,

I just purchased the Acer H5360 and bought some DLP Link Glasses off of E-bay. I know for 3d Gaming, DLP LInk glasses and an ATI 6850 work fine. What about for 3d Bluray via DLP Link glasses and an ATI 6850? Would I be better off with an Nvidia Card and the Nvision 3D Kit? Need to know soon so I can have everything arrive simultaneously. Thank you.
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post #356 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 11:51 AM
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I'm using a 6870 for bluray 3d and it works brilliantly with arcsoft totalmedia theatre 5. I actually tried the nvidia 3d vision kit before with a gtx285, and like that AMD solution better.
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post #357 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 12:13 PM
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I got the HTPC going and I'm watching Shrek. The picture is very good in 3D. I have question on the emitter. The dial doesn't seem to do anything for me. Does that adjust the depth of the 3D image? What setting are people using for the Nvidia stuff?
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post #358 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 12:48 PM
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Hello defiance,

Are you using DLP Link Glasses along with the ATI card within TMT5 for 3D Bluray? And if so, is there any where configuration you have to do to get work the first time and/or any time?
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post #359 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 12:58 PM
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I'm using xpand x102 DLP Link glasses with it.

As for configuration:

-I had to use the absolute latest catalyst drivers (released a few days ago). Before that it worked but I had to do a registry hack; the latest drivers worked without any issues or registry changes (FINALLY this is, what, the 4th revision of their drivers since hd3d was launched? 'Bout time it worked without having to manually modify my registry!!).

-Desktop refresh rate set to 120hz

-Go into the 3d settings in tmt5 and set it to AMD hd3d

-play in full screen (tmt5 won't display 3d in a window for whatever reason)

-Each time I start a video (or 3d game) there's a chance of having to set the polarity (set the 3d sync invert ON or OFF in menu).


Other than that it's plug and play. I'm currently using the tmt5 free demo. 4 more days left :P Not looking forward to paying nearly $100 for it; I may just let it expire and wait for my 3dxl, then play bluray 3d from my ps3. It's great software, but $40-$50 great, not $100 great. IMO anyway If I can find it for cheaper or it goes on sale or something, I'm on it though.

Oh, it works with win media center, which I thought was a nice plus. The other software I tried only worked in 2d in WMC.


68sting: the 3dvision emitter 'dial' adjusts the separation in directx applications (games); It probably has no effect on bluray since separation is hard-coded into the image.
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post #360 of 1760 Old 12-16-2010, 01:14 PM
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Thanks for the response. Looks like a 6850 for me and the ultra clear dlp link glasses.
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