*Official* Epson Home Cinema 8100 owners thread! - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 1942 Old 12-15-2009, 08:23 PM
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I have taken some pics. Here I have set the PJ at 22' distance on a shelf that is level. The PJ tilts slightly backward by design and I have not changed that. This is the best fit I can make by using lens shift and turning the PJ. My screen is confirmed level on all corners.

upper right corner good fit, upper left corner is about 1/8" lower than screen edge, bottom right is off by 1/4" to the left, and bottom left (the worst) is about 1/2" higher than screen bottom
Also, not visible is the upper middle is about 1/16" lower than screen edge, even though the upper corners are almost fine.

What do you guys think, return to BB and get a new one when they have them in stock?


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post #62 of 1942 Old 12-15-2009, 09:00 PM
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It doesn't look that far off, but I guess if you'd already tried to tilt, rotate, etc (looks like you need to turn it left slightly and level slightly) and cannot get it perfect, best try to get a new one depending on how much of a hassle it is, and see if you can line that one up......then you'll know if it is the projector or not.......
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post #63 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmm... too many varibles that could be going on to just blame the projector. (is the projector level? is the screen level? ... Can you notice it when it counts, like watching a movie? Just seems a bit "picky" to me for a $1500 projector. If we were talking a $3g+, maybe, but ya got to except some "issues" for such a cheap price IMO. Maybe it's worse in person ...

I have eight different bosses right now. ...Eight. So that means that when I make a mistake, I have eight different people tell me about it. That's my only real motivation is not to be hassled.
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post #64 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pringals View Post

Hmm... too many varibles that could be going on to just blame the projector. (is the projector level? is the screen level? ... Can you notice it when it counts, like watching a movie? Just seems a bit "picky" to me for a $1500 projector. If we were talking a $3g+, maybe, but ya got to except some "issues" for such a cheap price IMO. Maybe it's worse in person ...

Trust me, I spent many hours trying to correct this. The screen is level. It is not noticeable when watching a movie because I can zoom it enough to override these issues.

I am fine with some imperfections, given that this is my first PJ, I am just trying to decide whether I have a defective PJ or not and those with more experience who owned other projectors can chime in.
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post #65 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 01:29 PM
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you are not crazy dude. I have the same issue. Returned mine (BB) and the new one does the same thing. I have re-mounted and leveled and turned parallel to the screen enough to make my eyes bleed and I can't get it to align. Where I notice it the most is on the DirecTV menus and guides. the bars are keystoned and the thing is level and shooting straight on to the screen. I'm using almost all the Vertical lens shift and barely any horizontal. I think it is the lens shift that is out of whack, not the lcd panels.
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post #66 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 03:56 PM
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[quote=zaldwaik;17728232]I have taken some pics. Here I have set the PJ at 22' distance on a shelf that is level. The PJ tilts slightly backward by design and I have not changed that. This is the best fit I can make by using lens shift and turning the PJ. My screen is confirmed level on all corners.

upper right corner good fit, upper left corner is about 1/8" lower than screen edge, bottom right is off by 1/4" to the left, and bottom left (the worst) is about 1/2" higher than screen bottom
Also, not visible is the upper middle is about 1/16" lower than screen edge, even though the upper corners are almost fine.

What do you guys think, return to BB and get a new one when they have them in stock?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My 8100 is shelf mounted (approx. 14' throw), screen is perfectly level, as is the projector. I am using a small amount of vertical lens shift (down), and no horizontal shift. My screen is off exactly like yours is. (same corner, etc.)
I figure like someone else said it is the lens shift that is off and not the lens itself.
I tried for a few hours and couldn't get it perfectly level.
I decided it is not a big deal as I don't notice viewing movies.

Don't want to return it as I have no problem w/ lcd panel alignment, etc.

I am going to try a bit some more this weekend to align it, will let you know if I am successful, but is not a deal-breaker for me.

This is my first projector as well and I love it.

Thanks. Eric
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post #67 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 05:02 PM
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guys, mine was off at least that bad, I corrected most with leveling of the feet, and I also made sure it was perpendicular to the screen, that helped also, BUT my throw is much shorter than you guys (11.5ft), man I wish I could be of assistance............
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post #68 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 05:43 PM
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Hi Everyone. New to the forums. I am re-doing my HT in my basement and I finally brought my 8100 home yesterday after much research.

I am a projector rookie, and I still don't know what the hell I'm doing but in regards to the problem above, after preliminary trial and error testing I am definitely thinking it is the lens shift.

I plan to ceiling mount at a distance of about 12 feet, but my mount and the rest of the stuff I need to get that worked out haven't arrived yet. But of course I couldn't wait to try it out so I set it on a high top table behind my couch last night. Picture was perfectly straight and beautiful using minimal lens shift.

This morning I decided to move it to the lower shelf of my coffee table in front of the couch to get it out of the way a bit as it may be a few days before I can ceiling mount. Picture was definitely pinched at the bottom a bit, and it was specifically noticeable in the lower right corner. I tried all kinds of things, messing with the feet, shifting it ever so slightly from side to side. Nothing worked.

I just moved it again, this time on top of my coffee table (again minimal lens shift) and it took about 15 seconds to get the picture near perfect again.

I'm a bit worried about when I move it to the ceiling.

BTW first impressions last night when I set it up - I was completely blown away. I just stared awestruck and flipped around to different types of programming with my mouth wide open. Can't wait to get everything set up.
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post #69 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 06:27 PM
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zaldwaik
Damn, you are pretty close. What physical measurements are you taking that convince you everything is set up "perfect"?
"level" is almost meaningless. Your putting a level on top of the PJ? A level on top of the screen? Everything is absolutely perpendicular? How would you know? Way too many variables possible before you blame the PJ. And if it's not "perfect" can your mount adjust for that?

Sorry to seem annoyed, but it seems most with this "issue" are "newbies". I hate to call you that, but it's really pretty tricky to align a projector and a screen to "perfection". Whether you have a nice mount, a crappy mount or are shelf mounting, fine tuning the alignment is really, really, really tricky. It is not the projectors fault.
On the plus side, you're probably returning a bunch of perfectly good projectors that somebody can pick up for a discount. So thanks for that. Sorry to sound like such a @ick, but after seeing that screen shot...? It's obvious you aren't quite yet a projector geek!
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post #70 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 09:00 PM
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Thanks for all who are trying to help. I believe the lens shift is the culprit, they just seem too wobbly to me when being adjusted. I wish I did not notice this, because I watch for it every time I watch something and it is always there. Not bad for 16:9, but you can tell with 2.35 movies

I guess I am not the only experiencing this issue. An easy way to check (that is how I noticed it the first time) is to view a 2.35 aspect ratio movie and then pause it. Measure movie vertical distance between the four movie corners and the screen inner corners. Ideally, and if the PJ is centered, they all would be the same (Unlikely). That way you can see the variations and how bad they are. I did that because I was planning on making masks.

How would I check for LCD misalignment?
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post #71 of 1942 Old 12-16-2009, 10:02 PM
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zaldwaik, when you when you measure vertically, left top corner to bottom left corner, right top corner to bottom right corner, you get a difference....

have you tried to turn your projector until the heights are identical? what does the pattern look like then.........how distorted is the pattern???? i see in the images he left is shorter than the right, meaning you should turn to the left slightly....

you could do the same for horizontal measurements....

my point is trying to force a rectangle regardless of being square.....and see how far off the patern is then......

also have you tried to put the projector closer to the screen and line it up...at 22 feets a mm off will translate to alot more, than if it was mounted closer.......

just a few things to consider.....when i first got my Espon 1080 I had a hard time lining it up at 18 feet, but eventually got it.......
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post #72 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsteves View Post

zaldwaik
Damn, you are pretty close. What physical measurements are you taking that convince you everything is set up "perfect"?

This is not meant to be combative, but... your screen alignment looks pretty damn good to me. When viewing an actual projected image from a movie, you'll perceive no image distortion whatsoever.

I don't mean to sound unsympathetic, and I completely understand the drive for perfection, but I just can't imagine returning a $1,500 projector for this reason. I'd say turn out the lights, and enjoy your beautiful new Eppy.
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post #73 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 08:37 AM
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I'm feeding my 8100 with a PS3. Anybody else had luck getting blacker than black or whiter than white to pass on this PJ? Using the DVE HD basics disc I don't see BTB. Not sure if there's a test for WTW. On the playstation I have tried superwhite on and off, didn't really see a difference. Also not sure if I should force the PS3 to YCrCb or leave it to Automatic?

Current settings on a grey Elite 92" screen:

Eco Theater Black 1
Iris: normal
brightness: -1
contrast: -8
color: +1
tint: 0
sharpness: default
skin tone: default
temperature: 6500k
high altitude: ON (I think this just increases the fan speed?)

-Sean
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post #74 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

zaldwaik, when you when you measure vertically, left top corner to bottom left corner, right top corner to bottom right corner, you get a difference....

Yes, but it is not always the same. One of them will always be shorter than the other depending on adjustments

Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

have you tried to turn your projector until the heights are identical? what does the pattern look like then.........how distorted is the pattern???? i see in the images he left is shorter than the right, meaning you should turn to the left slightly....

Yes. The heights are never identical, either side will be distorted and it is not consistent. Whenever I turn the PJ I have to adjust lens shift, it is impossible for me to only adjust vertical or horizontal shift without, at least slightly, impacting the other. Generally I can get very close to a straight line with no distortion on either the top or the bottom, but not both (in the pics the top looks better)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

you could do the same for horizontal measurements....

my point is trying to force a rectangle regardless of being square.....and see how far off the patern is then......

I understand, it is not possible for me with this PJ to get an accurate rectangle, at least one corner, or side, will be off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

also have you tried to put the projector closer to the screen and line it up...at 22 feets a mm off will translate to alot more, than if it was mounted closer.......

I agree. I initially started with 12' with a monoprice mount. It was difficult to make fine adjustments with that mount and lock them in place. So I removed the mount thinking it was the problem.

I did try a small table with about 10' throw, and the results were better, not perfect. But that was only for testing, I cannot really do that on a permanent basis.

My plan is to do a ceiling mount at 10-12', but I am still looking for one that will allow me to do very fine adjustments and lock them in place (still waiting for feedback from the mount thread).

I noticed that even with 22' throw the picture still looked very bright, so I thought it appears to be a viable option. But as you said, any slight movement will make a big difference. I had this PJ for almost 3 weeks and I really want to start using it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

just a few things to consider.....when i first got my Espon 1080 I had a hard time lining it up at 18 feet, but eventually got it.......

I really appreciate your help.
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post #75 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Walters View Post

This is not meant to be combative, but... your screen alignment looks pretty damn good to me. When viewing an actual projected image from a movie, you'll perceive no image distortion whatsoever.

I don't mean to sound unsympathetic, and I completely understand the drive for perfection, but I just can't imagine returning a $1,500 projector for this reason. I'd say turn out the lights, and enjoy your beautiful new Eppy.

Thanks. I think that is what I will end up doing. I was simply trying to figure out whether I have a defective unit or not. I could have returned it from the first week.
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post #76 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Baboontyme View Post

Lot's o' good stuff.

I picked mine up last night also and I had the same experience when I put it on my coffe table. It was expected to be pinched towards the bottom. I'm just nervous like you that when I get it up on the ceiling mount it won't be square.
I'd have to build some sort of contraption to simulate it hanging from the ceiling. Not gonna happen. Probably won't get to my DIY mount for a couple of weeks.
Anyways the picture is absolutley stunning. I couldn't be any more excited.
Tested out a 1080p movie and some 360 games.
Unbelievable!
And yes a store that showed no stock online actually had one in stock when I got there.
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post #77 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Abs777 View Post

Where is this setting at?

Page 38 of the manual, it's under the Signal sttings on the manual. After testing it, the 2:2 does seem better.

Now, I'm going to see if the Motion Detection helps with SD playback/video images.

FWIW, I too have had problems aligning the lower right corner. I've been using bubble levels on my ceiling mount, and got it tweaked as close as can be, but still had to give up on it. It's pretty darn close but still a bit annoying with the 2:35 films.
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post #78 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 11:28 AM
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zaldwaik, one last question....

Yes. The heights are never identical, either side will be distorted and it is not consistent. Whenever I turn the PJ I have to adjust lens shift, it is impossible for me to only adjust vertical or horizontal shift without, at least slightly, impacting the other. Generally I can get very close to a straight line with no distortion on either the top or the bottom, but not both (in the pics the top looks better)

Have you tried setting up the projector where no lenshift is needed to see how close to perfect you can get??? Then you can get at least get the left height and right height the same and see how the pattern looks......and that will tell you if lenshift is the culprit.....
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post #79 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahro View Post

Where ARE the 2:2, 2:3 pulldowns located in the menu?

If you send the PJ 1080p/24 it will automatically switch to 2:2. Send it 1080p/60 and you get 2:3. No is no way to select either AFAIK.
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post #80 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewke View Post

zaldwaik, one last question....
Have you tried setting up the projector where no lenshift is needed to see how close to perfect you can get??? Then you can get at least get the left height and right height the same and see how the pattern looks......and that will tell you if lenshift is the culprit.....

Someone mentioned that I should feel a click as I am moving the lens shift dial to know the neutral position. I cannot find that. Also, regardless of the position of the lens, adjusting one dimension changes the other (very annoying, am I the only one experiencing this?). Sometimes I have to hold one dial while moving the other.

I am going to try to do that, but it will not fill the screen, as I do not have a table with the exact height to require no lens shift. Great suggestion by the way.
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post #81 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 01:47 PM
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If you cannot hear or feel the click, then replace it. I can hear the cllicks on mine, but with this PJ, you have to adjust it until the image is properly centered. I had a heck of a time with mine, until I change the mount and now it so much better.
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post #82 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 02:04 PM
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Does your lens shift dial have some play when you go from one direction to the other? If I adjust it to the right, then want to back left it doesn't move left right away..meaning I can wheel it left a small bit with no movement but it doesn't feel like it should be moving either. Am I making sense?
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post #83 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stopdog View Post

If you send the PJ 1080p/24 it will automatically switch to 2:2. Send it 1080p/60 and you get 2:3. No is no way to select either AFAIK.

Actually there is a 2:2 on or off setting under the Signal submenu.
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post #84 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Karpediem View Post

Does your lens shift dial have some play when you go from one direction to the other? If I adjust it to the right, then want to back left it doesn't move left right away..meaning I can wheel it left a small bit with no movement but it doesn't feel like it should be moving either. Am I making sense?

Mine reacts the same. The adjustment wheel will move slightly the other way before it "engages" and the lens moves the other direction.

I assumed this was normal.

Thanks. Eric
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post #85 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 03:17 PM
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I read in the 8500 thread that their lens shift is the same. Somebody was commenting that he would v-shift and leave some room and than h-shift and as you h-shift the v-shift comes down a bit to make up for the room you left when originally v-shifting. Hope this makes sense. I tried it last night and mine is way closer than before.
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post #86 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 05:07 PM
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Has anyone tried any DIY material with this specific projector (screen wise). My current screen is made of Doable but was wondering if there would be a material (Wilson art, etc.) that I could get better contrast or black levels with. I am thinking Wilson Art grey would be better. I could be spinning my wheels posting in this thread but just figured I'd give it a try.
Has anyone tried AT material as well. I was also thinking of making a screen from the Dazian material but was worried about moire with this specific projector.
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post #87 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericpizzapie View Post

I read in the 8500 thread that their lens shift is the same. Somebody was commenting that he would v-shift and leave some room and than h-shift and as you h-shift the v-shift comes down a bit to make up for the room you left when originally v-shifting. Hope this makes sense. I tried it last night and mine is way closer than before.


Mine has a little play in it too. It's not too bad. I just slightly wiggle it left to right in the horizontal and get it centered on the click. I then adjust the mount to center it on the screen.

It has been holding for about 2 weeks now.

I haven't had any problems with the H messing with the V, or vise-versa. After I got it adjusted, mine has been holding really well.
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post #88 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orcarola25 View Post

Has anyone tried any DIY material with this specific projector (screen wise). My current screen is made of Doable but was wondering if there would be a material (Wilson art, etc.) that I could get better contrast or black levels with. I am thinking Wilson Art grey would be better. I could be spinning my wheels posting in this thread but just figured I'd give it a try.
Has anyone tried AT material as well. I was also thinking of making a screen from the Dazian material but was worried about moire with this specific projector.

I'm using a 100", WilsonArt DW, DIY fixed frame I built. I have the plans in Sketchup if anyone cares to see them.

So far, I love it.
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post #89 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnsean View Post

I'm feeding my 8100 with a PS3. Anybody else had luck getting blacker than black or whiter than white to pass on this PJ? Using the DVE HD basics disc I don't see BTB. Not sure if there's a test for WTW. On the playstation I have tried superwhite on and off, didn't really see a difference. Also not sure if I should force the PS3 to YCrCb or leave it to Automatic?

Current settings on a grey Elite 92" screen:

Eco Theater Black 1
Iris: normal
brightness: -1
contrast: -8
color: +1
tint: 0
sharpness: default
skin tone: default
temperature: 6500k
high altitude: ON (I think this just increases the fan speed?)

-Sean

Sean, I am also going through a PS3, mine won't show BTB either, my settings came out to be:
Theater black 1
Normal power mode
Brightness +10
Contrast - 14
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post #90 of 1942 Old 12-17-2009, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orcarola25 View Post

Has anyone tried any DIY material with this specific projector (screen wise). My current screen is made of Doable but was wondering if there would be a material (Wilson art, etc.) that I could get better contrast or black levels with. I am thinking Wilson Art grey would be better. I could be spinning my wheels posting in this thread but just figured I'd give it a try.
Has anyone tried AT material as well. I was also thinking of making a screen from the Dazian material but was worried about moire with this specific projector.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WalkinPaul View Post

I'm using a 100", WilsonArt DW, DIY fixed frame I built. I have the plans in Sketchup if anyone cares to see them.

So far, I love it.


I'm using a 120" WilsonArt DW, DIY fixed frame I built. I do not have the plans in Sketchup though.

This is my first PJ and first screen, so I really don't have much to compare it to but I love it. Works good enough for me with some light, and great in the dark.
Karpediem is offline  
Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP



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