Viewsonic Pro8200 -- it exists. - Page 17 - AVS Forum
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post #481 of 1090 Old 01-27-2012, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

No, it's under Others > Zoom in the menu.
You can zoom the picture in digitally and reduce the size of the black bars for 2.35 movies.

It reduces resolution and crops the left and right part of the image, so I only use it occasionally, but it's still very nice to have. Also, I generally only reduce the SIZE of the black bars to half normal instead of getting rid of them completely, as getting rid completely reduces resolution too much. The feature is also best used only with 1080p sources, otherwise the resolution loss is too noticeable.

Thanks, I found it. I don't think I'd ever use it, since the side cropping looks horrible. I'll stick with my triple velvet masking.
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post #482 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 08:50 AM
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I received the new projector from Newegg (their service is outstanding).

It did the same thing! Highlights are blown out, not able to adjust the 90% white scale. OK, so it's not the projector.

Doing some internet perusual, I found out the Panasonic BDT210 player has two screens for setting up the display. You would assume the settings menu would handle the setup of the player, but there is also settings when you use the display button and you can only access that button during playback, and the default setting enables "advanced chroma". Turning that off, and I got a proper signal to the projector.

As far as I can tell, this projector wants a standard RGB signal. I would suggest you check your setting in your bluray player or dvd player. You would assume the more 'modern' signal YCbCr 4:4:2, would be the setting for HDMI, but I believe you'll get your best range of picture with RGB standard. You can confirm this by putting a grayscale test on and check the black and white levels.

For just setting the brightness-contrast, the AV709 test pattern under the basic menu is excellent.
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post #483 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bse53 View Post

I received the new projector from Newegg (their service is outstanding).

It did the same thing! Highlights are blown out, not able to adjust the 90% white scale. OK, so it's not the projector.

Doing some internet perusual, I found out the Panasonic BDT210 player has two screens for setting up the display. You would assume the settings menu would handle the setup of the player, but there is also settings when you use the display button and you can only access that button during playback, and the default setting enables "advanced chroma". Turning that off, and I got a proper signal to the projector.

As far as I can tell, this projector wants a standard RGB signal. I would suggest you check your setting in your bluray player or dvd player. You would assume the more 'modern' signal YCbCr 4:4:2, would be the setting for HDMI, but I believe you'll get your best range of picture with RGB standard. You can confirm this by putting a grayscale test on and check the black and white levels.

For just setting the brightness-contrast, the AV709 test pattern under the basic menu is excellent.


Hopefully Coderguy will get his equipment soon to double check everything.

It will be interesting if Coderguy having 500 hours on bulb gets same results or different results. Is the blown highlights something that could be corrected for by adjusting individual colors gamma, hue, etc. I know on new bulb it's very bright, but if after a couple hundred hours on bulb everything settles down in "good" way, we could call it "break in "period . This could be a way to think about your findings I guess.
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post #484 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgtaa View Post

Hopefully Coderguy will get his equipment soon to double check everything.

It will be interesting if Coderguy having 500 hours on bulb gets same results or different results. Is the blown highlights something that could be corrected for by adjusting individual colors gamma, hue, etc. I know on new bulb it's very bright, but if after a couple hundred hours on bulb everything settles down in "good" way, we could call it "break in "period . This could be a way to think about your findings I guess.

Everything is fine now. Getting deep blacks good whites. It was all in the settings. Had to turn the Chroma off on the Panasonic and send RGB Standard over HDMI.
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post #485 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bse53 View Post

Everything is fine now. Getting deep blacks good whites. It was all in the settings. Had to turn the Chroma off on the Panasonic and send RGB Standard over HDMI.

That's good news. So I guess maybe next time you calibrate use a few sources to double check it's not a player or PC or gaming machine that would tilt results. So the calibration is within acceptable range for this priced projector?

If you come up with settings that work for you , please share them since you have 2 machines you can play with until you send the other one back.
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post #486 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bse53 View Post

Everything is fine now. Getting deep blacks good whites. It was all in the settings. Had to turn the Chroma off on the Panasonic and send RGB Standard over HDMI.

I was going to warn you about that, but I didn't want to sound like a smarty pants since it seemed like you already had a handle on it.
I have done that on accident before, I hate it when that happens, I had an older bluray player that would keep switching randomly between STD and ENHANCED. A lot of these cheaper projectors don't deal with BTB (blacker than black) or WTW (whiter than white).

BTW, the ehanced black level settings (Video Level 0 ABS black instead of 16 ABS black) are not encoded on any current media, so it's a worthless feature. Now whiter than white (super white), whatever you want to call it, can be encoded on some, but it only helps with small gradient details in clouds, 99% of the time people wouldn't notice it.

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/ca...vels-xvycc-rgb


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post #487 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 07:26 PM
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Actually I had set it up sending YCbCr, which was a problem, but the advanced Chroma in the other menu was the real culprit. My experience, at this point, is the best signal from a dvd player would be RGB Standard.

I'd be interested hearing if anyone is using the YCbCr signal to the projector without affecting both the black and white level. I'll check it again, but I think the YCbCr signal was a problem.

There is nothing inherently wrong to using the RGB signal, or anything to be gained using the YCbCr signal. If I am mistaken, I'd like to know.

Thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

I was going to warn you about that, but I didn't want to sound like a smarty pants since it seemed like you already had a handle on it.
I have done that on accident before, I hate it when that happens, I had an older bluray player that would keep switching randomly between STD and ENHANCED. A lot of these cheaper projectors don't deal with BTB (blacker than black) or WTW (whiter than white).

BTW, the ehanced black level settings (Video Level 0 ABS black instead of 16 ABS black) are not encoded on any current media, so it's a worthless feature. Now whiter than white (super white), whatever you want to call it, can be encoded on some, but it only helps with small gradient details in clouds, 99% of the time people wouldn't notice it.

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/ca...vels-xvycc-rgb

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post #488 of 1090 Old 01-28-2012, 07:32 PM
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I think you are right, most projectors you can just calibrate VL 0 as if it is VL 16 from the PLUGE and get the same effect, but I've heard some people saying there are side effects on certain projectors to doing this, but not on others. Not sure about the Viewsonic. I guess one side effect could be if you run out of room on your controls.

I finally found my old meter, I will be taking measurements in a second on the old eye-one, but we'll have to compare them to my NEW meter when I get it back (the certified C6 Spectracal) as this OLD eye-one has probably drifted way off, but I'll give it a shot anyhow.


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post #489 of 1090 Old 01-29-2012, 02:54 AM
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First Calibration Charts being posted here;

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post21564597

Pre-Calibrated Color is really not so bad, the CIE chart is more accurate than I thought it would be. The Gamma is also not too bad, but there is some room for improvement. The color temp is off a bit, but not terribly so. This is what I would call a better than average OOTB factory color mode after 700 hours on the lamp (STD ECO - LAMP LOW).


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post #490 of 1090 Old 01-29-2012, 06:03 AM
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Just ordered this on impulse refurbed from ebay.. this will be my first projector.. plan on using it in a bedroom. I have a desk with a hutch with 3 levels of shelves I can put the projector on depending on how high it throws the image(I've read it's extra high). I knew the smart thing to do would be to calculate throw distance and screen size and stuff but I was lost in the moment and just ordered this one. It's half the price of the epson 8350 I was looking at so no matter how it performs it's going to be a good value I suppose. I was also looking at the dell m110 projector.. but for (price removed) it didnt' seem worth it vs the (price removed) I got the pro 8200 for on ebay, since the m110 only does 720p and is way lower lumens
edit: oh also.. I'll be using it with a mac mini HTPC.. it's within 10 feet of it so I'm just going to run an hdmi cable.. the htpc also plugs into my 24" dell u2410 monitor via mini displayport to displayport cable

Gear list: Main setup - Kef Q900, Svs sb12-nsd subwoofer, onkyo 609 receiver, epson 8350 projector, elitescreens sable 92" screen, mac mini htpc
bedroom setup: PSB Image B5, maverick tubemagic a1 amplifier, hifimediy sabre9023 dac, ZMF Fostex T50RP modded headphones
preordered gear: Light Harmonic Geek Pulse X dac and headphone amp
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post #491 of 1090 Old 01-29-2012, 04:13 PM
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Coderguy can you make a recommendation for a screen? I'm going to use this projector in a bedroom where I can control the lighting and make it really dark whenever I want, so I think that means a white screen is appropriate for me? I'd like a screen that I don't have to mount on a wall permanently in case I decide to move the projector to another room. Also, if you use a screen that's bigger than the image you can project, does it look really bad? I wouldn't want to go with a small screen only to realize I can project a larger image than the screen. I suppose I could wait til I have the projector set up, and that will tell me exactly how big a screen I need but I'd like to get a head start, so maybe if there is a no brainer starter screen that's 100" or so I can order that right away. My projector still hasn't shipped from the company I bought it from yet.
edit: yikes shipping for screens to where I live (hawaii) is crazy expensive. Maybe I should try using that special screen paint on a wall first
edit2: it looks like my only local choice for a screen would be best buy.. they have one called a Projecta pull down screen 106" for relatively cheap
edit3: realized I would never get a 106" image in my small bedrooms, so I just ordered one of these: Elite Screens ER92WH1 Sable Fixed Frame (92" 16:9 AR) - amazon free shipping to hawaii ftw

Gear list: Main setup - Kef Q900, Svs sb12-nsd subwoofer, onkyo 609 receiver, epson 8350 projector, elitescreens sable 92" screen, mac mini htpc
bedroom setup: PSB Image B5, maverick tubemagic a1 amplifier, hifimediy sabre9023 dac, ZMF Fostex T50RP modded headphones
preordered gear: Light Harmonic Geek Pulse X dac and headphone amp
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post #492 of 1090 Old 01-29-2012, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uncola View Post

Also, if you use a screen that's bigger than the image you can project, does it look really bad?

What are the light controlled conditions of the room you will be watching in at first, and then it sounds like you are moving it to another room eventually?

Do the rooms have white walls or white ceilings, light carpet, etc?

Any ambient light coming from outside or from other rooms, any bright reflective surfaces?


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post #493 of 1090 Old 01-29-2012, 08:07 PM
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The rooms are painted light blue, they have white fuzzy insulator ceilings that are about 9 feet high. Carpeting is dark brown. The windows have venetian blinds with heavy curtains in front of them that block out light very well.. I do have mirror surface closet doors which is probably bad but I can leave one side open so it's half as much reflective surface visible. The rooms are really dark when I draw the curtains and close the doors, except for midafternoon when some leaks through past the blinds and curtains. I'm thinking about getting some black out material for the curtains to improve it even more.. but I do most of my movie/tv viewing at night so it shouldn't be a problem. I know for "light cannon" projectors some people recommend grey screens but I do most of my movie watching at night so I can have it super dark in my rooms.. I'm going to use it in my bedroom where I have my computer desk and sleep, but I was thinking of trying it out in my larger bedroom that I mainly use for home theatre since I already have a big tv in there. So if I did that, I'd probably move that big tv to this bedroom to use as a pc monitor, so I could project to where that tv used to be. It depends, I kind of want to do some experimenting.. If I use this smaller bedroom as the room for the projector I have some nice shelving already there with 3 levels where I could set the projector

Gear list: Main setup - Kef Q900, Svs sb12-nsd subwoofer, onkyo 609 receiver, epson 8350 projector, elitescreens sable 92" screen, mac mini htpc
bedroom setup: PSB Image B5, maverick tubemagic a1 amplifier, hifimediy sabre9023 dac, ZMF Fostex T50RP modded headphones
preordered gear: Light Harmonic Geek Pulse X dac and headphone amp
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post #494 of 1090 Old 01-30-2012, 08:23 PM
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You have two main considerations, the projector will be a bit bright at first for a 1.0 to 1.3 gain screen for a 100" to 110", but since your room is mostly light controlled, that is probably what I would do and buy you a $50 ND-Filter to pair it with. You could also look into 0.8 gain gray screens. Even with 0.8 gain, you may need an ND filter for the first 200-300 hours. It will be watchable, but REALLY bright. It might bother your eyes the first 100-200 hours, I don't think it will after that. At 700 hours, I am able to use a 1.3 to 1.5 gain screen and do just fine. It is giving me a little more brightness than I need, but not too bad, I was able to calibrate Theater mode down to pretty low lumens.

Check out the Da-Lite Manual C Pulldowns or Manual B. The Manual B ones are fine but they don't always roll-up correctly (you have to unscrew the sides if you hit this problem to roll it up). Although many people never need to roll up the screen unless moving it, so only need to do it once. The Manual B's are easier to mount, they are light weight so you can mount them with cork-screw metal sheetrock inserts at home depot that are rated at only 50 pounds. I have my 106" mounted like this, no issues at all. No 2x4 boards or stud mounting necessary, just mounts straight to sheet rock. If you go over 106" on the Manual B's, then you might need a different type of mounting, into the studs most likely.


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post #495 of 1090 Old 01-30-2012, 08:31 PM
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@OTHERS

---MOTION---
Everyone needs to make sure to set their bluray player to output in STANDARD HDMI / STD COLOR (not enanced), and to make sure to output 24p (Movie or Film Mode as it is called on some bluray players). The projector does very well in 24p motion 95% of the time even in pannings. There is less motion blur than my JVC or than most LCD projectors. The panning bug is a non-issue in 24p, it is very rare to see it. I ran many many motion tests from the DVE and Spears and Munsil test discs. Also, I never saw it get overly jerky or inconsistent, the only thing that really happens is a very slight loss in smoothness, but it's very rare to see it in normal viewing. Now if you are feeding the projector a 60hz signal from your bluray player, then yah it'll look MUCH MUCH choppier from the 3:2 pulldown conversion which combines to add judder and blur. I haven't tested sports motion on it, but it definitely handles 24fps FILM at 24hz better than it handles 60hz conversion (which is normal and expected). So this projector can take a 24p signal and duplicate it to 48hz with no issues. The horizontal panning issue is mostly only noticeable when feeding a bluray movie at 60hz instead of 24hz (which is how you should do it). There is also absolutely NO MOTION issue in gaming, far better motion than my JVC has in gaming. Never saw the panning bug yet in gaming (and have over 50 hours of gaming on it). There is a tiny bit more RBE at 24hz vs. 60hz, but not very much more.


PIXELATION
There is a very rare issue where you could see some sparklies or pixelation happen in white scenes in certain blurays (but again rarely on good ones), so it is pretty uncommon and not bothersome to me at all. It mostly happens when the projector hits a very specific type of scene (most likely related to gamma response mixing with CMS adjustments), but it is fine overall. Most of the time the imag e is pretty noise free. A post-calibrated theater mode so far probaly has the lowest noise in my image compared to the other modes, while still giving good contrast. Overall the amount of noise is fairly average, although some more expensive projectors like a Mits hc4000 can beat it for noise (but the Mits projector beats almost every projector at low-noise, so not really a fair comparison).

Compared to my JVC, the JVC has about the same amount of noise, albeit a different type of noise. The noise level on the JVC is a more consistent textured like noise, and on this projector some scenes are completely noise free but others will have more. So I feel the noise is not an issue overall on this projector unless someone is super picky (pickier than me, and I am picky).


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post #496 of 1090 Old 01-31-2012, 09:37 AM
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I see some people are having issues with HDMI cables. I am using a 3 year old 50ft HDMI cable from monoprice with no problems. Not sure if it makes a difference but I am using a HTPC (Dell XPS8300 with intel HD2000 graphics).

I am still amazed with blurays at the 160" image with ambient light projected on a textured beige wall. DVDs and ATSC HD is sometimes a little lacking, depending on the quality of the show/movie but still bright, big and watchable.

My kids told there is no need to go to the movie theater any more this is much better.
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post #497 of 1090 Old 02-03-2012, 08:17 AM
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I was wondering the type of screen menu you guys got, because this link is from review page of pro8200 and it looks very different than mine. Go to middle of page where it discusses menu features.
http://www.projectorreviews.com/view...o8200/tour.php
It has Advanced Iris and Cinema Black Pro and other stuff there I don't see in my menu system. I was wondering do you guys from last year have that type menu?
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post #498 of 1090 Old 02-03-2012, 08:37 AM
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nope.
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post #499 of 1090 Old 02-03-2012, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgtaa View Post

I was wondering the type of screen menu you guys got, because this link is from review page of pro8200 and it looks very different than mine. Go to middle of page where it discusses menu features.
http://www.projectorreviews.com/view...o8200/tour.php
It has Advanced Iris and Cinema Black Pro and other stuff there I don't see in my menu system. I was wondering do you guys from last year have that type menu?

I don't have it either, I was wondering if those pictures showed the service menu, or if it was an older firmware.
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post #500 of 1090 Old 02-04-2012, 09:53 AM
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it's not the service menu.
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post #501 of 1090 Old 02-04-2012, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

BTW, for people with the older firmware like me, I found a trick that allows you to change the noise reduction controls and the OVERSCAN, but I'm not sure if it is applying the change immediately or after the first power cycle, but either way the settings are holding between Power On/Offs. I think the NR feature is not actually used in most sources anyhow.

Here is the trick:
Go into the Viewsonic's menu option that lets you set the ability of the function key on the remote. Set the function key to Overscan. Now change the source to S-VIDEO even though you have nothing connected, once the white screen comes up hit the Function key on the remote. You should now be able to change the Overscan settings. After changing it, switch back to your active source (HDMI1 or whatever), and the setting should hold across sources and remain even from power on/off. Some of you might not even need to use the function key, odd thing is once it let me do it without it but another time I had to use it.

This also works for a couple of the other settings that are stuck so to speak.

Hi coderguy, I found your post via Google. I was very disappointed that I could not change overscan (HDMI source) on my Pro 8200 just by going in the menu normally. After reading your trick, I tried it and it worked perfectly. Overscan and noise reduction could be changed for s-video or component sources for me, and as you said, the changes held.

My problem was the screen (top, bottom, and sides) was cut off when my laptop was set at 1920x1080p 60Hz and other standard resolutions as well. The aspect ratio in the menu was set at 16:9, which should be correct. Unfortunately changing overscan to 0 might have improved the problem but did not fix it completely at all. I tried changing the aspect ratio in the menu. For some unknown reason, the AUTO setting fixed my problem. So now at 1920x1080p 60 Hz, I can see the full screen with nothing cut off. Awesome! Thanks for your post coderguy.
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post #502 of 1090 Old 02-04-2012, 03:27 PM
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Welcome to the forum.

In space, no one can hear you scream . . .
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post #503 of 1090 Old 02-04-2012, 05:54 PM
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That is a good point above, about switching the Aspect Ratio.
For me it's reverse, switching from Auto to 16:9 corrects it, but for some it will be the other way around. It depends on how your bluray player or source auto-outputs the aspect I think.

I actually mistakenly thought this projector was 16:10 at first, because one of the places I looked online had a misprint, but it is 16:9, just have to get rid of the overscan and adjust auto aspect or what not.


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Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
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post #504 of 1090 Old 02-07-2012, 11:14 AM
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What type of plug is used for the 12volt trigger? My old projector used 1/8 mono plug. Is there a 1/8 mono to whatever that plug is cable?
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post #505 of 1090 Old 02-09-2012, 01:06 PM
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Not sure, BTW folks, here is my final calibration with a certified colorimeter (Spectracal C6 with NIST CERT).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post21564628


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #506 of 1090 Old 02-18-2012, 08:26 PM
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I couldn't stomach the cost of the grey screens so I got a 1.1 gain white one instead. The contrast doesn't bother me at all, it's the awful awful lack of brightness in the dark scenes. I haven't put it up yet but I'm really hoping it helps tremendously. I rented Thor on amazon unbox last night and the beginning very difficult to see. The "fantasy" worlds were very very dark as well even with the brightness turned up to 90 in standard mode. I've tried all the gamma modes and none of them make a big difference except gamma 6 which blows out everything. I need another person or 2 to get the screen set up and the projector aligned perfectly on it .
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post #507 of 1090 Old 02-18-2012, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlvonde View Post

I couldn't stomach the cost of the grey screens so I got a 1.1 gain white one instead. The contrast doesn't bother me at all, it's the awful awful lack of brightness in the dark scenes. I haven't put it up yet but I'm really hoping it helps tremendously. I rented Thor on amazon unbox last night and the beginning very difficult to see. The "fantasy" worlds were very very dark as well even with the brightness turned up to 90 in standard mode. I've tried all the gamma modes and none of them make a big difference except gamma 6 which blows out everything. I need another person or 2 to get the screen set up and the projector aligned perfectly on it .

That sounds like a setting in your dvd player (assuming that's the source). Do you have the same problem playing a dvd/bluray disk?
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post #508 of 1090 Old 02-19-2012, 06:55 AM
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dlvonde: your source (streaming) is crap. there is no good streaming solution for a projector that I have seen. vudu HDX is the best I think, but it's still nothing compared to a blu-ray disc.
if you're not watching a blu-ray, you're missing out. Thor was excellent on this pj, as well as the 80+ other movies I've watched. streaming companies call it HD, but it's really not. the resolution might be, but the bitrate is way low, which is where you get the detail. a dvd bit rate is about 5000. most bluray's I have ripped are 25,000-30,000. the streaming bit rate is generally lower than a dvd if I remember right.

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/ou/dont-be...ate-hd-lie/959
http://www.tested.com/news/when-is-h...efinition/297/
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post #509 of 1090 Old 02-19-2012, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reebok View Post

dlvonde: your source (streaming) is crap. there is no good streaming solution for a projector that I have seen. vudu HDX is the best I think, but it's still nothing compared to a blu-ray disc.
if you're not watching a blu-ray, you're missing out. Thor was excellent on this pj, as well as the 80+ other movies I've watched. streaming companies call it HD, but it's really not. the resolution might be, but the bitrate is way low, which is where you get the detail. a dvd bit rate is about 5000. most bluray's I have ripped are 25,000-30,000. the streaming bit rate is generally lower than a dvd if I remember right.

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/ou/dont-be...ate-hd-lie/959
http://www.tested.com/news/when-is-h...efinition/297/

I agree with reebok. It is the source. I see a big difference between streaming movies and even the highly compressed DirecTV HD channels. The streaming stuff just doesn't have the details. After using coderguy's settings this projector is solid with details, color, and contrast.
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post #510 of 1090 Old 02-19-2012, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reebok View Post

there is no good streaming solution for a projector that I have seen. vudu HDX is the best I think, but it's still nothing compared to a blu-ray disc.

I've seen VUDU get VERY close to bluray quality, but it depends on the encoding transfer, some of their movies are encoded better than others. It also depends on your connection speed, and some other stuff. I've noticed streaming services are at their worst on Fri,Sat due to heavier traffic, they are best after midnight on weekdays. Some of their pipes get overloaded sometimes.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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