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CRE X1000 Worlds First 3 LED 3 LCD 1080p Projector..Anybody heard of these guys?

224K views 1K replies 107 participants last post by  Verge2 
#1 ·
#479 ·
Sell me junk


Those settings are not color temp settings they are chroma and or luminis settings.


Color temp is a different animal. color temp is measured in Kelvin and should be set to 6500K i.e. D65 for standard.
 
#481 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohanna /forum/post/20514858


The link you posted was dead and after about 20 MINUTES of goggling I found some Zeiss site that related to dome projectors so WTF is so important about this report??? Could you at least C/P the relative text you are referring to?????????


Did I say the link??? I ment BOTH links that were attached to your post.

Bohanna

That link DID work. I found a new link but I'd advise saving this reference document this time as it contains too much truth to stay online.
http://www.vision.zeiss.com/C12567B0...Schorcht_e.pdf
 
#482 ·
 http://www.dcviews.com/press/Zeiss-Velvet.htm

"Carl Zeiss presented a novel type of video projector which by far surpasses the contrast offered by all existing projector solutions. The new VELVET projector has been designed for use in planetarium domes and other dome theaters. It is based on the DLP chip technology from Texas Instruments, and while projectors from other manufacturers feature a contrast ratio of only 30.000:1, the new projector achieves a ratio that is larger by a factor of 83, i.e. 2.500.000:1...

"




Looks good hifi, & you believe theres a home cinema version coming out?
 
#483 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohanna /forum/post/20514858


The link you posted was dead and after about 20 MINUTES of goggling I found some Zeiss site that related to dome projectors so WTF is so important about this report??? Could you at least C/P the relative text you are referring to?????????


Did I say the link??? I ment BOTH links that were attached to your post.

Bohanna

I read that and closed the window. I reread that and have to say that it is very informative. Very informative. Of course I am a DLP fanboy what with owning a Sammy 61" RP LED DLP TV that is still kicking arse today. No colorwheel there. I would really like to see that same "old" tech applied to a new PJ. Seriously, no colorwheel and LED lighting. This is old tech that ought to be brought forward in FP systems.


I recently did a cleanup of my light engine which was very dirty after several year of heavy use. I can post about that if there is interest but a basic cleanup. It was filthy. I look forward to several more years of use with this unit and I use the hell out of it. Yay LED DLP. I say proven concept.


Edit: I thought about this after posting and realized that based on my exerience the light engine on my 61" Sammy is every bit as big or larger than most PJs today. It is that way due to huge PC like heat sinks and fans and that may present a problem, albeit a small one for a good manufacturer.
 
#484 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents /forum/post/20519789


I read that and closed the window. I reread that and have to say that it is very informative. Very informative. Of course I am a DLP fanboy what with owning a Sammy 61" RP LED DLP TV that is still kicking arse today. No colorwheel there. I would really like to see that same "old" tech applied to a new PJ. Seriously, no colorwheel and LED lighting. This is old tech that ought to be brought forward in FP systems.


I recently did a cleanup of my light engine which was very dirty after several year of heavy use. I Mam post about that if there is interest but a basic cleanup. It was filthy. I look forward to several more years of use with this unit and I use the hell out of it. Yay LED DLP. I say proven concept.

I own the 67" model. Have had it for three years. ISF calibrated when new and just keeps ticking with no change to picture that I can see. How did you clean it?
 
#485 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JackB /forum/post/20519842


I own the 67" model. Have had it for three years. ISF calibrated when new and just keeps ticking with no change to picture that I can see. How did you clean it?

Yeah, these are great TVs. I had some issues with my screen and pretty much disassembled the TV to clean it. I need to post what I did in the appropriate section. The screen got dirty/muddled in one area due to candles, smoking, fireplace etc. I simply disassembled it and gave her a good cleanup. It is like new now as opposed to the Mitsu that a family member bought with a lamp. That thing failed. My TV still looks as good as his with the new lamp. That is a testament to LED lighting and even if one of those fails, easy replacement. Did I mention no colorwheel? Geez, this seems like a no brainer to me.
 
#486 ·
Without blowing this thread apart, I simply disassembled the TV and cleaned the screen. When I examined the light engine I saw it was full of dust on the coooling fins/tubes and even the fan blades. Those appeared to be high quality so I blew them off with compressed air. Going good now for over 300 hours. There are 3 LEDs that power these units and they do a good job. How hard is it to put this in a PJ?


On a seperate note, the first thing that will cause this system to fail is a failed fan in the light engine. I removed a lot of dust on the primary fan as well as the others. 2 others actually.
 
#487 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents /forum/post/20519976


There are 3 LEDs that power these units and they do a good job. How hard is it to put this in a PJ?

they have em.Its not hard to do-but is a niche market = big$

They have had em in 1080p since mid 2009.
 
#488 ·
My e-mails been playing up. Those questions i asked about the inorganic panel never reached, tho will try again.


Quite frankly the paranoia over polarization & screen burn. Clearly my 1st x1000 was faulty+ & on return they tested it for other issues too which give me a renewed sense of confidence, & now thats its been repaired its working great.


I`m back to using the x1000 every evening about 8 -10 hours at a time. + after it was repaired, when i asked to check about how long is safe to run the x1000, they replied confidently upto 12 hours.

OK i`m not a major expert, but rather than just LCD, I`d like to know how the 3 LED`s work in conjunction with the 3LCD

as surely LED runs cooler than both traditonal organic & inorganic LCD projectors? (x1000 power consumption is 160w).
 
#489 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sellmejunk /forum/post/20522854


OK i`m not a major expert, but rather than just LCD, I`d like to know how the 3 LED`s work in conjunction with the 3LCD

as surely LED runs cooler than both traditonal organic & inorganic LCD projectors? (x1000 power consumption is 160w).

I am not sure they run cooler as opposed to longer but just speculation on my part after pulling the light engine on my RP Samsung. That light engine had the biggest heat sinks and cooling tubes to radiater fin assmbly I have ever seen and I build my own computers. Let me sum it up by saying that my Hawk GTX-460 with dual fans has nothing on the cooling assembly I saw in my TV.


Now of course this makes sense if you think about it. Any DLP unit will have to put out light to be viable. In the case of an LED unit, that will produce heat and needs to be cooled or game over. I would like to see a schematic of how the light engine works in your unit. For all we know the LEDs might be on the top of the unit by the menu control buttons thus making it a LED unit.


I would venture to say that your unit may not be LED lit because if it was, it would need to be a lot larger perhaps, based on my RP TV experience and front PJs need a lot of light, more than my RP unit.
 
#490 ·
lol mike, thats funny. Led yeh maybe!


Owning a projector, has made a completly different animal out of me, i have always been intresting in buying a projector as any typical young boy dreams of having his own cinema.


Non the less as a new owner i am still a green noobie, but thxs to this forum & all the intresting information i can now look back at the old posts & now understand the technical jibberish!


I`d like to get to the bottom of this, as well as the skeptics .^^. so i`ve decided with all your help to compose a list of questions to ask about X1000.



List them in a logical order & i`ll paste it into an e-mail.


How about these?

1. Can we have some pictures of inside the X1000

2. Are the LED s located behind the LCDs

3. Hows the cooling work

4. Something about quality of resistor? transistors?

4. Do you do an Inorganic version of the X1000

5. etc your ideas here,,,,


I`ll give it a a day or two then send it, & see what they say.


Cheers


SMJ
 
#491 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sellmejunk /forum/post/20524211


How about these?

1. Can we have some pictures of inside the X1000

2. Are the LED s located behind the LCDs

3. Hows the cooling work

4. Something about quality of resistor? transistors?

4. Do you do an Inorganic version of the X1000

5. etc your ideas here,,,,


I`ll give it a a day or two then send it, & see what they say.


Cheers


SMJ

Those look pretty good SMJ for a start point. Smarter folks than me will weigh in. I am curious about the light engine path in this unit and how it produces the image. As for the rest of the fluff here, I say enjoy the PJ and thanks for your efforts informing us about the unit.
 
#492 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sellmejunk /forum/post/20522854


Quite frankly the paranoia over polarization & screen burn. Clearly my 1st x1000 was faulty+ & on return they tested it for other issues too which give me a renewed sense of confidence, & now thats its been repaired its working great. ).

Hey SMJ it's not paranoia,,, Its a reality and Majusto picking the organic vrs inorganic is HUGE especially since the panels are being marketed as immune to breakdown. The chances are that most people will not read the fine print.



Quote:
Originally Posted by sellmejunk /forum/post/20522854


I`m back to using the x1000 every evening about 8 -10 hours at a time. + after it was repaired, when i asked to check about how long is safe to run the x1000, they replied confidently upto 12 hours.

OK i`m not a major expert, but rather than just LCD, I`d like to know how the 3 LED`s work in conjunction with the 3LCD

as surely LED runs cooler than both traditonal organic & inorganic LCD projectors? (x1000 power consumption is 160w).

I think the words hotter and brighter are misused a lot with it comes to LED's


The thing that will eventually breakdown a panel is brightness. If the cooling is inadequate it may dramatically increase the breakdown but I think the level of UV light bombarding the panels is the real issue of concern

Bohanna
 
#493 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohanna /forum/post/20524824


I think the words hotter and brighter are misused a lot with it comes to LED's


The thing that will eventually breakdown a panel is brightness. If the cooling is inadequate it may dramatically increase the breakdown but I think the level of UV light bombarding the panels is the real issue of concern

Bohanna

I'm pretty sure we established that these LEDs produce light at very specific wavelengths, which is why the colors produced are so pure. They are designed to be very efficient and not produce UV or IR light. In fact, Luminus released a revision for the blue LED that shifted the color of blue up by a few nm.


If these same LCD chips by Epson are used in normal lamp based projectors, I don't see why they would not work just as well, if not better, with an LED light source.
 
#494 ·
Ok if i can phrase that into a question.


i.e

Does the x1000 filter out or produce UV light/IR light?


If that sounds ok, I`ll add it to the list of questions.

Feel free if you have a specific question or can think of a better way of wording.


I remember bohanna theorized about the LED may be positioned behind the LCD so i thought it would be a good one to ask.


So far we have


1. Can we have some pictures of inside the X1000

2. Are the LED s located behind the LCDs

3. How does the cooling work.

4. Something about quality of resistor? transistors?

4. Do you do an Inorganic D7 panel version of the X1000

5. Does the x1000 filter out or produce UV light/IR light?

6. Your ideas here ...etc.


Q4 Bohana mentioned in an earlier post about the quality of the capacitors, transistors etc? what would a good whay to phrase

Q4.


How about...

i.e what is the make of transistors/ resistors that are used in the X1000? ..
 
#496 ·
look at the ight output rating too. The company has a serious issue witht he way they represent their specs.
 
#497 ·
Here ( below) a link to an article that refers to the Blue Panels in LCD projectors. Although its bias in favor of DLP projectors some of its points are still valid. It reinforces just about everything I have been writing about the blue Panel LCD issues. The trade off is the DLP's have a color wheel that can and could fail long before the projector expected life span.


Bohanna

http://www.insightmedia.info/news/Re...estioned-2.htm
 
#498 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by rovingtravler /forum/post/20526513


look at the ight output rating too. The company has a serious issue witht he way they represent their specs.

According to the Luminus website, the PT-120 is capable of Over 3,000 white lumen at 8000K color temperature from a single RGB chip-set under continuous operation. Of course we target 6500K for movie viewing and there is also the loss of light as it passes through the LCD panel, prism, lens, and polarizing filter if used. The claimed 3,000 lumen output by Cre probably comes from this number, but there is no way it could possibly reach that under normal operating conditions. I would guess somewhere in the 500-600 lumen range.
 
#499 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohanna /forum/post/20526618


Here ( below) a link to an article that refers to the Blue Panels in LCD projectors. Although its bias in favor of DLP projectors some of its points are still valid. It reinforces just about everything I have been writing about the blue Panel LCD issues. The trade off is the DLP's have a color wheel that can and could fail long before the projector expected life span.


Bohanna

http://www.insightmedia.info/news/Re...estioned-2.htm

This information comes from a study started in May of 2002. The projectors used in the study were never revealed. Only 7 projectors were used in the study, 5 of which were LCD, and the other 2 were DLP. I remember reading this study and it was very controversial at its time of print.


In the last 9 years there have been several advancements in LCD technology, surely they have tried to minimize this phenomenon.


I too have had issues with my projectors, but nothing related to the blue polarizer, and no yellowing. I have seen red, green, and blue bleeding through the lcd panels but not yellow.
 
#500 ·
3000 as you said at the source and at a higher lumen value. The usable value of the light ranges from a low of 600 to a high of 1000lumen at full blast in a projector.


I believe the wolf is rated at 600 the Runco at 700, the Sim2 Mico 40 at 700, the Mico 50 at 800 and the Vango in overlap at 1000. Of course they all put out about 450 to 625 calibrated to D65.
 
#501 ·
The x1000 has 1 medium filter, + 1 tiny filter on each side of the projector that slot out of the bottom.


I`ll ask about sealed light path, i dont think there are any LCD projectors that have sealed path but cant hurt to ask.


The light output question i`m not sure how we can get a good answer, they probably would quote the manual of 2800 -3000 lumen, unless someone can word it for me, in a way to get a proper reading reply from them,to get actual lumens.


Also the sound question; being the same case 10db would probably be their answer (like the manual)


To be fair my x1000 does in fact run quiet tho couldnt say how loud. Maybe i can find some free PC software to use the pc microphone as a Decibel reader.



Bohannas link on reliability is a intresting link, i could cut paste some of that into the questions. The only thing is that reliabiity study is 2003, so i`m not sure how much projectors have progressed since that date.


Question 6 should cover it, or if u wish to add to it so we can get a better reply from them:


So far we have


1. Can we have some pictures of inside the X1000

2. Are the LED s located behind the LCDs

3. How does the cooling work.

4. Something about quality of resistor? transistors?

(better wording needed plz.)


5. Do you make an Inorganic D7 panel version of the X1000.

6. Does the x1000 filter out or produce UV light/IR light?

7. Does the x1000 have a sealed light path

8. Whats is the lumen output in regards to actual lumen rather than specification. (better wording needed plz)

9. Your ideas here ...etc.


Feel free to post some technical questions as they have a technician they can ask.


I`ll send the list to them on late sunday evening & hopefully we get some indepth replies.

Till then keep the questions coming.


SMJ
 
#502 ·
SMJ


You could ask what the rated output is at the lens, but I think you are right; they are going to default to the oputput of the LEDs. I would assume, you know what that means
, somewhere around 200-300 calibrated lumens. I say this as LCDs have a lower transmission of light than DLP and the DLPs are getting about 450-575 without overdriving the LEDs.


maybe even a little less than that. without a light meter of some sort or an SPL (Sound pressure Level) meter for sound you will not know. MY radio shack digital SPL only goes down to 50decibles. In order for my projector to register I have to have the meter against the case and at that point it could be the pressure of the wind and not the fan
 
#503 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sellmejunk /forum/post/20519175

http://www.dcviews.com/press/Zeiss-Velvet.htm

Looks good hifi, & you believe theres a home cinema version coming out?

Try this technology comparison:

"Other imaging devices, especially those based on liquid crystals, suffer

quality losses with increasing operating hours. The symptoms vary; there

may be fading colors, gradual increase of defects in color (“discolored

edges”), losses of homogeneity (the background becomes speckled), etc.

The introduction about five years ago of reflective liquid crystals based on

inorganic materials has brought discernibly higher image stability. However,

there is no secure testimony for long-term stability. It can be expected

that after two to three years of continual operation, similar degradation

effects will also influence the newer LCoS systems. In addition, LCoS

necessitates polarized light, which requires about double the wattage

of illumination, and accordingly, double the power consumption to

achieve the same brightness. The LCoS projection technology requires

special filters, which are wearing parts that need replacement after a

few thousand operating hours. Costs for filter cleaning and replacements

do not arise with DLP® technology."
 
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