Official Mitsubishi hc4000 ONLY Thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 03:56 AM
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Just got my HC4000 today. I also have the vibrating image going on. It isn't that noticeable on my unit. Only notice it when I first turn on the Playstation 3 and see static menus. Watched a whole movie and didn't really notice it then. I did switch between low and high lamp mode and it did seem to lessen on high lamp mode. May try running it on high for 10 hours as was suggested.
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post #632 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 04:19 AM
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This projector is an amazing bargain. The image it throws is jaw-dropping at times. The high ansi-contrast is clearly noticeable on many scenes. The sharpness is great as well. Even the contrast doesn't leave much to be desired. Colors look great. Watched the remastered Gladiator. The detail was astounding! Looking forward to watching the EE Lord of the Rings Trilogy.

Keep in mind, my previous projectors were an RS1 and an RS40. I think I wasn't too blown away by the RS40 because it was more similar to the RS1 than not. I noticed that mid to bright scenes just started to look flat. Change can be good, so going dlp again is refreshing. Maybe in a year or two I'll miss the ultra-high on/off contrast of lcos. However, it seems to me that most movies today seem to be made to favor a high ansi contrast display instead of a high on/off contrast display, so maybe I won't miss the lcos look after all.

Comparing the 2d image of the RS40 to the HC4000 imho is a draw. They both excel at the other's weakness, yet neither are really deficient at anything. I know the RS40 has a ton more features, plus 3d. However, just comparing what I see on the screen in 2d, they should be the same price.

I am using a 106" High Power Screen, with 3 clicks of keystone (don't notice any degradation). My screen goes around 8" off the floor, so I am maintaining quite a bit of gain. I actually have an ND2 filter on for now since it's so bright! The filter I have actually fits perfectly right inside of the front of the lens of the pj. It's a Hoya ND2 67mm. I thought that such a large offset would defeat the purpose of a High Power but with some creative mounting and some keystone, it's not a problem.

Thanks to all who posted their positive impressions about this projector. After buying such a high quality projector for a little over 1k, I don't see why I would ever need to spend more than that ever again. Boy have digital pj's come a long way!
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post #633 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 05:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

This projector is an amazing bargain. The image it throws is jaw-dropping at times. The high ansi-contrast is clearly noticeable on many scenes. The sharpness is great as well. Even the contrast doesn't leave much to be desired. Colors look great. Watched the remastered Gladiator. The detail was astounding! Looking forward to watching the EE Lord of the Rings Trilogy.

Keep in mind, my previous projectors were an RS1 and an RS40. I think I wasn't too blown away by the RS40 because it was more similar to the RS1 than not. I noticed that mid to bright scenes just started to look flat. Change can be good, so going dlp again is refreshing. Maybe in a year or two I'll miss the ultra-high on/off contrast of lcos. However, it seems to me that most movies today seem to be made to favor a high ansi contrast display instead of a high on/off contrast display, so maybe I won't miss the lcos look after all.

Comparing the 2d image of the RS40 to the HC4000 imho is a draw. They both excel at the other's weakness, yet neither are really deficient at anything. I know the RS40 has a ton more features, plus 3d. However, just comparing what I see on the screen in 2d, they should be the same price.

I am using a 106" High Power Screen, with 3 clicks of keystone (don't notice any degradation). My screen goes around 8" off the floor, so I am maintaining quite a bit of gain. I actually have an ND2 filter on for now since it's so bright! The filter I have actually fits perfectly right inside of the front of the lens of the pj. It's a Hoya ND2 67mm. I thought that such a large offset would defeat the purpose of a High Power but with some creative mounting and some keystone, it's not a problem.

Thanks to all who posted their positive impressions about this projector. After buying such a high quality projector for a little over 1k, I don't see why I would ever need to spend more than that ever again. Boy have digital pj's come a long way!

Glad to hear....I think most folks that are not RBE sensitive it just plain and simply the best bang for your buck, blacks are the weakness but it excels in almost every other place...I have almost 400Hrs on mine and just love it...

War Eagle!!!
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post #634 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

blacks are the weakness but it excels in almost every other place...I have almost 400Hrs on mine and just love it...

Well, the blacks get better as time wears on
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post #635 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

Well, the blacks get better as time wears on

Ya know what has impressed me is that after 400 hours, I haven't notice much light drop off...I need to get me a meter..I really would like to track it...


geez, I'm such a geek

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post #636 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 12:49 PM
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You guys have convinced me to want to purchase this baby but my only problem is offset. The calculator shows I need a 20" offset as I have a 128 diagonal 16/9 screen that is currently mounted 8" below the ceiling. My old PE8700 had very little offset. I can lower my screen some but don't want to go 20" as my back row of seats (6" platform) will suffer.

I was hoping I could tilt the HC4000 down and keystone correct it lets say about 10". Am I dreaming here?
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post #637 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRLJAMR View Post

You guys have convinced me to want to purchase this baby but my only problem is offset. The calculator shows I need a 20" offset as I have a 128 diagonal 16/9 screen that is currently mounted 8" below the ceiling. My old PE8700 had very little offset. I can lower my screen some but don't want to go 20" as my back row of seats (6" platform) will suffer.

I was hoping I could tilt the HC4000 down and keystone correct it lets say about 10". Am I dreaming here?

Nope, I do the same in the opposite direction, I raise mine since I have low ceilings, in fact I raise it about the same amount...you will loose 1:1 pixel mapping and Maybe, you could see it if you were projecting a computer screen, but for the life of me I cannot see any degradation of picture when playing games, tv or movies, I'm glad I went with the mits...it took about 2 clicks of keystone.. for me to do something similar, other folks I have read will say the same, and some says it matters, only your eyes can be the judge, I have LOTS of pictures that I have taken and posted, do a search for my userid and you can look for yourself, oh and welcome to the forum and the mits thread

*insert lawyer language, YMMV as always

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post #638 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

Nope, I do the same in the opposite direction, I raise mine since I have low ceilings, in fact I raise it about the same amount...you will loose 1:1 pixel mapping and Maybe, you could see it if you were projecting a computer screen, but for the life of me I cannot see any degradation of picture when playing games, tv or movies, I'm glad I went with the mits...it took about 2 clicks of keystone.. for me to do something similar, other folks I have read will say the same, and some says it matters, only your eyes can be the judge, I have LOTS of pictures that I have taken and posted, do a search for my userid and you can look for yourself, oh and welcome to the forum and the mits thread

*insert lawyer language, YMMV as always

Thanks a million bishopt as this has been killing me evern since my BenQ went out a couple of months ago. I love DLP and love Mitsubishi Electronics. I have a Mits 27" tube tv that is 25 years old and still works great. I will order an HC4000 shortly and report back to this thread the results as to help others.
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post #639 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

Just got my HC4000 today. I also have the vibrating image going on. It isn't that noticeable on my unit. Only notice it when I first turn on the Playstation 3 and see static menus. Watched a whole movie and didn't really notice it then. I did switch between low and high lamp mode and it did seem to lessen on high lamp mode. May try running it on high for 10 hours as was suggested.

Can you feel any vibration if you put your lightly on the unit?

Michael
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post #640 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 05:09 PM
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put your on the unit...and this used to be such a nice family forum.
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post #641 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post

Can you feel any vibration if you put your lightly on the unit?

Michael

Yes I can feel a slight vibration. I haven't trying much to stop it yet. Only had it for a day.
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post #642 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

Yes I can feel a slight vibration. I haven't trying much to stop it yet. Only had it for a day.

Hmm, I have absolutely none..wonder if one of the fans is not balanced....keep this in mind, they will swap out for new in less than 30 days, after that they will replace with a pre-owned unit...just something to keep in mind...

War Eagle!!!
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post #643 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 07:20 PM
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Thanks for the heads up. I'll check again.
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post #644 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 07:37 PM
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Was wondering if the Mits HC4000 will work in my setup. Room is 11 x 16 with 10 foot ceilings. Planning on a 110 or 120 inch 16x9 diagonal dragonfly matte white screen. Plan on sitting 10- 11 feet away from the screen. Room is pretty well light controlled.

Mostly using for sports and occassional movie. Also would it be better to shelf mount or ceiling mount. Other option is the Epson 8700UB but like the cost of the mits better and the raves it gets for PQ.

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post #645 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by alwaysgolf View Post
Was wondering if the Mits HC4000 will work in my setup. Room is 11 x 16 with 10 foot ceilings. Planning on a 110 or 120 inch 16x9 diagonal dragonfly matte white screen. Plan on sitting 10- 11 feet away from the screen. Room is pretty well light controlled.

Mostly using for sports and occassional movie. Also would it be better to shelf mount or ceiling mount. Other option is the Epson 8700UB but like the cost of the mits better and the raves it gets for PQ.
You have plenty of ceiling height to easily go 110 or 120....the mits calculator does the best with all of the details...but you should not have any problem..here is the link, select the model, select reverse for ceiling mount, enter drop tube and then ceiling height....if you have any questions let us know

http://www.mitsubishielectric.com/bu...s/prjcalc.html

War Eagle!!!
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post #646 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post
Hmm, I have absolutely none..wonder if one of the fans is not balanced....keep this in mind, they will swap out for new in less than 30 days, after that they will replace with a pre-owned unit...just something to keep in mind...
Honestly, I don't think it will make much of a difference. I went through 3 HC3800's and they all had varying levels of vibration from the fans. It seems to be more of a resonance thing than vibration (the end result is vibration). I think that the 2 fans that are mounted side by side on the side of the PJ are suspect. My guess is that they spin in the same direction and that as their RPM's match (or un-match, i dunno), their resonance doubles up and the unit starts to shake. probably wouldn't be an issue (i think?) if they had the fans spin in opposite directions.

In any case, the solution seems to be with the mounting of the PJ. Gotta beef up the mount or get some picture hanging wire and some small turnbuckles and make a few stabilizing 'strings' to stop the vibration.

And Bishopt> Your mount is probably just soaking up the resonance, so you don't see/feel it....
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post #647 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 09:02 PM
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bishopt, so would it be better to ceiling or shelf mount. Also screen size is still being debated. Would like the 120, leaves about a foot on either side for speakers, but can't really move seating back any furhter since I am planning on a bar counter at the back of the room for 3 barstools for overflow seating. Also would their be enough FL for brightnes with the increased screen size.

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post #648 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

In any case, the solution seems to be with the mounting of the PJ. Gotta beef up the mount or get some picture hanging wire and some small turnbuckles and make a few stabilizing 'strings' to stop the vibration.

What about a coffee table? Would that be too flimsy?

Michael
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post #649 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post
What about a coffee table? Would that be too flimsy?

Michael
On the units that I had, that shook on the ceiling mount, when table mounted there were no issues. The resonance is very very lite, but on a mount with fulcrum points, and a PJ hanging from 3 swing arms, the mount can start to resonate (mount dependent!). No issues like that at all with a coffee table
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post #650 of 2858 Old 06-30-2011, 11:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post
What about a coffee table? Would that be too flimsy?

Michael
I'm not a physics guy, but I'll give it a true NERD effort, so I think what we have here is a combination of resonant vibrations and harmonics. Securing the projector should help, but you may find just by varying the type of object it sits on that you have large variations in the amout of vibration, even if one object is not as secure as another.

This is probably becuase there are certain physical characteristics in the transfer of resonant energy when trying to implement vibration dampening. I would say yes, it would help to shelf mount but it depends how secure the object you shelf mount is, and also should depend on the vibration absorption characteristics.

I have seen the Mits vibrate on a shelf mount just a tiny bit, but none from a floor mount. That generally tells us that if you can "stiffen" the projector's position, it's probably going to self-absorb the resonance without the optics vibrating internally. I've seen some devices actually vibrate the optics when mounted too tight and you had to do the opposite (loosen the mount), but with the Mits just make it as tight as possible most likely, so just experiment.


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post #651 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 04:51 AM
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I have my pj mounted on the monoprice ceiling mount with an 18 inch extension. I can notice the shaky image only if I really focus on some text. I seems to pulsate a bit. I think it gets a little better on high lamp mode.

I also have another issue. The lamp timer doesn't seem to be working. Stays at zero hours.
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post #652 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 04:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleaman View Post

Honestly, I don't think it will make much of a difference. I went through 3 HC3800's and they all had varying levels of vibration from the fans. It seems to be more of a resonance thing than vibration (the end result is vibration). I think that the 2 fans that are mounted side by side on the side of the PJ are suspect. My guess is that they spin in the same direction and that as their RPM's match (or un-match, i dunno), their resonance doubles up and the unit starts to shake. probably wouldn't be an issue (i think?) if they had the fans spin in opposite directions.

In any case, the solution seems to be with the mounting of the PJ. Gotta beef up the mount or get some picture hanging wire and some small turnbuckles and make a few stabilizing 'strings' to stop the vibration.

And Bishopt> Your mount is probably just soaking up the resonance, so you don't see/feel it....

Yeah could be, my mount is way overkill for the projector, its solid steel and rated for 33 lbs, I don't recommend it http://www.amazon.com/Atdec-TH-WH-PJ.../dp/B000BSFY48 since it's not a good fit for the mits (the mits mount holes are raised and I had to modify the adapters to work with the mits)and it's sloppy to adjust. It is solid and held the Benq w6000 when I had it just fine also which is twice as heavy, I have absolutely no vibration with mine, infact I can hang from my mount

and your probably right Senor the one side has those 2 fans and that is what I would suspect...however I think a more solid mount would probably do the trick...

War Eagle!!!
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post #653 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 04:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

I have my pj mounted on the monoprice ceiling mount with an 18 inch extension. I can notice the shaky image only if I really focus on some text. I seems to pulsate a bit. I think it gets a little better on high lamp mode.

I also have another issue. The lamp timer doesn't seem to be working. Stays at zero hours.

Yeah..so if you beefed up your mount all of that would go away, I have heard that the monoprice mount is pretty light, plus the 18" extension and that would do it...as for the timer...trust me once it hits 10 hours, you will see it start counting....

thats the way it works on the mits...

War Eagle!!!
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post #654 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 05:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alwaysgolf View Post

bishopt, so would it be better to ceiling or shelf mount. Also screen size is still being debated. Would like the 120, leaves about a foot on either side for speakers, but can't really move seating back any furhter since I am planning on a bar counter at the back of the room for 3 barstools for overflow seating. Also would their be enough FL for brightnes with the increased screen size.

I would go for the ceiling mount, gets it up and out of the way, you will have to figure out how high you want your screen mounted and that will help drive you to know what length of drop tube to have..thats what is nice about the mits calc, it will help you figure all of that out...if you have a light controlled room, you will have no issues filling up a 120" screen, IMHO....the one other thing that you may want to consider is going 2.35 CIH, thats what I wish I would have done....you basically make the screen really big for 2.35 and then hit the aspect ratio button for 16:9 stuff, if you search for username curttard he is one of the guys running a 2.35 setup...really cool, something else to consider/think and read up on..


I have a 106" screen and we sit approx 12-13' back and it's almost to big for me, but when watching 2.35 movies I could go much larger than I am now...I have grown more comfortable with the 106" 16:9 as time goes but for me a 120" 16:9 would be to big for me at my distance..but only you can decide that, lots of rules to help figure it out but it comes down to your comfort level....

War Eagle!!!
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post #655 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

Yeah..so if you beefed up your mount all of that would go away, I have heard that the monoprice mount is pretty light, plus the 18" extension and that would do it...as for the timer...trust me once it hits 10 hours, you will see it start counting....

thats the way it works on the mits...

Thanks!
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post #656 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 02:02 PM
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I just recently bought the HC4000 and am loving it! Great picture etc, etc.....However, I noticed one problem with a vibrating image during motion shots (I have read earlier questions on this thread, discussing vibrating images during still shots). I was watching an HD documentary on Yellowstone and during an Ariel view, with the camera panning over a large mountain, I noticed the trees vibrating. My girlfriend immediately noticed this and asked why. I backed up the video and watched again, and it was still there. I haven't noticed this with any other videos (I haven't had this pj very long) So this is my question: is something wrong?

Thanks for any input!
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post #657 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 03:21 PM
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Everyone seems to agree that this Mitsubishi projector has a great image and is a great value. But it could be better.

There seem to be three features that would make it better:
  • Dynamic Iris
  • Tilt - zoom
  • Frame interpolation

My guess is that Tilt-Zoom is a major reengineering project. That means I don't think it can be added to the existing HC4000. Presumably the light path would have to be changed. After those changes the machine would not really be an HC4000 anymore.

Frame interpolation however should be just a new chip. Or am I wrong?

Similarly a Dynamic Iris should be an add-on.

I would like to see an enhanced HC4000 that costs maybe a hundred dollars more than the current model but includes a dynamic iris. Such a machine could advertise a 50,000 to 1 contrast range like the 3LCD machines yet would retain all the other advantages of DLPs.

An HC4000 with Frame Interpolation would also be worth another $100 to me.
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post #658 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 04:01 PM
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I personally have no interest whatsoever in frame interpolation. What is tilt-zoom, do you mean lens shift? Most of us would love that. Dynamic iris, I have no interest unless it's totally undetectable in action.
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post #659 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PLB View Post

Everyone seems to agree that this Mitsubishi projector has a great image and is a great value. But it could be better.

There seem to be three features that would make it better:
  • Dynamic Iris
  • Tilt - zoom
  • Frame interpolation

My guess is that Tilt-Zoom is a major reengineering project. That means I don't think it can be added to the existing HC4000. Presumably the light path would have to be changed. After those changes the machine would not really be an HC4000 anymore.

Frame interpolation however should be just a new chip. Or am I wrong?

Similarly a Dynamic Iris should be an add-on.

I would like to see an enhanced HC4000 that costs maybe a hundred dollars more than the current model but includes a dynamic iris. Such a machine could advertise a 50,000 to 1 contrast range like the 3LCD machines yet would retain all the other advantages of DLPs.

An HC4000 with Frame Interpolation would also be worth another $100 to me.

Yeah..that's not gonna happen for a $100. lol
You'll need to spend on average $800 to $1800 more to add those features. Just the nature of the beast.
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post #660 of 2858 Old 07-01-2011, 09:02 PM
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I figured out a way to drastically reduce the image shaking. I placed a thin sheet of grippy rubber on the pj, right under the ceiling mount. Then I placed a thin iron plate on it. It's right over the area where the lens is. Big improvement.
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Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

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Mitsubishi Hc4000 300 Inch 1080p Front Projector
Gear in this thread - Hc4000 by PriceGrabber.com

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