Official Mitsubishi hc4000 ONLY Thread - Page 46 - AVS Forum
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post #1351 of 2857 Old 09-18-2011, 03:06 PM
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Hmm. I'm kind of a stickler about the image. I hope I don't get one like that. Guess i'll find out soon enough. If it's not distracting from the movie watching then maybe it will work. If it's mostly noticeable on a blue screen or something other than movie video, then I could live with it...... I think.
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post #1352 of 2857 Old 09-18-2011, 03:08 PM
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Did anyone upgrade to this from the HC3800 ?
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post #1353 of 2857 Old 09-18-2011, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squeeks View Post

I dont see it on mine either, the image is uniform all the way across.

Good to hear.. Word to the wise, get a good return policy.
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post #1354 of 2857 Old 09-18-2011, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Good to hear.. Word to the wise, get a good return policy.

Yep. Projectorpeople.com. 30 day money back. Hope it won't be necessary as it sounds like the hc4000 puts up a great image otherwise.
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post #1355 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlitzBasicMan View Post
Yep. Projectorpeople.com. 30 day money back. Hope it won't be necessary as it sounds like the hc4000 puts up a great image otherwise.
Looks like a no-brainer for me.
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post #1356 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:22 AM
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Amazon also has 30 day money back guarantee, and they will even pay for return shipping on defective items. And if you choose to have it replaced they will ships you a new one before you return your old one.
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post #1357 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 11:41 AM
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The only downside with Projector People is that you can only return it for full refund if there are 4 hours or less on the lamp.
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post #1358 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rojofi View Post

First, thanks to all who have posted here and added to the education of people like me.

I bought an hc4000 and have read though these threads to identify my problem. I am seeing the same issue that smonska and a few others were seeing earlier(dimmer right side versus left) and i am currently agonizing on whether i should return because of it. For those of you who have had this problem and decided to keep the projector, did it smoot out? Did it keep bothering you? Mits tech support initially advised to replace the unit with the vendor. After the second unit was the same they said it was the nature of the beast.
Its 11 ft back ceiling mounted onto a matte white 1.0 screen.
Any help in making my decision is appreciated. The left side of my picture on an all white screes is gray and it is noticable on moderately bright video.

I pretty much expected this but it sucks anyway. Mitsubishi got back to me again and said that this is just the way it is and they cannot do anything about it. I consider this a defect and there is no way it is within any kind of spec if you can see it during video. It will be going back to amazon and i will not recommend this unit to anyone. Great components poorly put together. I really want to like this projector but it is just too distracting. Mitsubishi tech support is overrated. I know that not all hc4000's are like mine.
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post #1359 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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I have seen tons of sub $2000 projectors and none are perfect. The Mits lighting uniformity issue is actually almost average for its price. There is some variance noted from past hc3800 models of this issue so that if you exchange them enough, you may get a better one.

I am not discounting anyone's opinion on this at all, but we have seen this issue pop-up before at varying levels, it is not the same on every unit from what we know (I think DaGamePimp can attest to this). I think he went through several hc3800 units until he was satisfied (depends how picky you are). Perhaps some of you are getting ones with excessive brightness uniformity issues, but I cannot say. I have seen some screenshots in the hc3800 thread of at least two units showing a problem much worse than any unit I ever owned (and I had 3 of them in total - 2 hc3800's and 1 mits hc4000), and I've seen 6 of them total in person helping setup a couple for friends.

My feeling is that you should be careful judging the problem on a new lamp, as it takes a while for the lamp to wear in, especially if you are watching too bright of an image.

I have seen LCD's with much worse uniformity. I'm not saying all sub $2000 projectors have this issue, but I am saying you will find something wrong with almost any sub-$2000 projector (convergence, uniformity, color balance, sharpness, calibration issue, best mode brightness, focus drift, firmware issues, IRIS issues, short lamp life, contrast, etc...).

Pick your poison, they all have issues guys, sorry it is that way with projectors, but it's just the nature of the beast.

The Mits is a very good deal at its current pricing, but if you want something with perfect uniformity, look to more expensive projectors like expensive JVC's. Even some $5000+ Sony's have occasionally come off the assembly line with uniformity issues just as bad or worse than this Mits.

Getting the HP screen and mounting it correctly to offset the difference may in fact lessen this issue, but I cannot guarantee it.

Otherwise, I am not sure but the Optoma HD33 might not have the issue, and AVS has some good deals on them if you call them. I really like the HD33 now too because it produces a somewhat similar image for movies but you do lose a little contrast and sharpness (not a huge amount), and in exchange you do get 3D and a brighter image for larger screens and a faster color wheel for less RBE for just a little more.

There is also the Benq w6000, w1100, and w1200.

Relatively speaking, the Mits has the best contrast and picture at this price range other than maybe the Benq w6000 for a few hundred more if you don't mind the IRIS and noise, and with each of these projectors having advantages and disadvantages. The next step up is subjectively the Epson 8700ub, but it can have its own issues as well and isn't nearly as sharp. Maybe this year the QC will be better, but that is yet to be known.


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post #1360 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curttard View Post

The only downside with Projector People is that you can only return it for full refund if there are 4 hours or less on the lamp.

Quote:
Originally Posted by squeeks View Post

Amazon also has 30 day money back guarantee, and they will even pay for return shipping on defective items. And if you choose to have it replaced they will ships you a new one before you return your old one.

Interesting about amazon. What is their policy on bulb use? Also, i noticed it goes back and forth as to whether it's amazon or another vendor that is fulfilling the order. Read one of the reviews. One person was not allowed to return his unit to the vendor. I was aware of projectorpeople's less than 4 hour policy. I should be able to see right away if it has the light uniformity issue. Please let it not be so....

Oh..and Coderguy, thanks a bunch for your frank insights. Your obvious experience is very helpful.
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post #1361 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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One final warning to people (sorry just to have to say it), if you choose something else like the 8350 or similar, you will be stuck with other issues when comparing it to the Mits (like a loss in sharpness), again they all have advantages / disadvantages.

So it doesn't matter what projector you get, you will find a problem, and if you don't, invite me over and I'll show you one


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post #1362 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

One final warning to people (sorry just to have to say it), if you choose something else like the 8350 or similar, you will be stuck with other issues when comparing it to the Mits (like a loss in sharpness), again they all have advantages / disadvantages.

So it doesn't matter what projector you get, you will find a problem, and if you don't, invite me over and I'll show you one

My breaking point it whether or not it is visible on normal video. It was definately visible during normal movie watching with both units and Mitsubishi said point blank that it was just that way. I realize that bulb break in plays a part and i put 200+ hours on it in two weeks just to give it a chance. it only worsened. I really wanted to keep it but i cant accept that Mitsubishi put out a flawed product and expected it to fly on its other aspects. If my experience helps others with my expectations avoid a similar hassle then thats why i posted here . I was not looking for perfection just a decent image. I will probably get the w1100 next. I can deal with firmware issues better than bad brightness uniformity.
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post #1363 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:49 PM
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i could even deal with the hc3800 color uniformity issue better that having lopsided brightness
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post #1364 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:50 PM
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My issue mirrored Smonska's earlier in this thread.
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post #1365 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 03:51 PM - Thread Starter
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I hear you, but some of us have been around this and the hc3800 thread for many many years, and like I said it's probably not the same across units, there is a variation, they just don't want you to return so many units (understandable to a degree). These posts are probably only the 10th to 20th time we've seen people really consider it a deal breaker across the hundreds of posts in both threads. Which if you think about it, isn't that much.

I have seen the issue on other DLP's as well (and on LCOS and LCD), perhaps not as commonly, but still have seen it.


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post #1366 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 05:31 PM
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Amazon doesnt care, you can just return it as defective if it has the issue and they will send you a new one. No questions asked..Well they do ask that you write a short description of what is wrong...Anyway here is a screen shot of my blue screen. I do notice that it is slightly dimmer of the left side, but i only see it on the blue screen, not on any program material.
LL
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post #1367 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squeeks View Post

Amazon doesnt care, you can just return it as defective if it has the issue and they will send you a new one. No questions asked..Well they do ask that you write a short description of what is wrong...Anyway here is a screen shot of my blue screen. I do notice that it is slightly dimmer of the left side, but i only see it on the blue screen, not on any program material.

Well I guess that review actually said he was waiting for Amazon to bail him out. The actual vendor would not help him. You are saying if another vendor is going through amazon, Amazon is just happy as could be to let you return to your hearts delight? Interesting. Hard to believe but interesting.
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post #1368 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 06:12 PM
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Amazon will give you one replacement and then a refund.
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post #1369 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rojofi View Post

Amazon will give you one replacement and then a refund.

Correct, but then you can just purchase another one again. I did that about 1.5 months later and it was actually about $40 less than my first purchase, so their own policy actually cost them $40.

I would have been happy with just another exchange.

I was an early adopter that got stuck with the shutdown/checkerboard of death units. Until the 2nd amazon purchase (not unit) worked out fine.
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post #1370 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey Fleaman,

If you tried my calc. or have any ideas about it, please let me know in the other thread if you want.

As high-priced as the used units are still selling for these days, I almost feel like buying the Optoma hd33 right now, getting the Mits hc7800 later, and then whatever reviewer units I get in the meantime, doing a triple to quadruple shoot-out between 3-4 projectors. That way I don't have to wait any longer for reviewer units.


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post #1371 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 07:00 PM
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I run a small negative gain screen, so I'm kind of an anomaly around here. Plus I don't intend on any upgrades anytime soon as I'm not into 3D and that seems to be the only 'improvement/advancement' lately. So sorry, not much to comment on your calculator or the new batch of (3D) projectors....
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post #1372 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 07:06 PM - Thread Starter
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True and no problem, not much reason to upgrade from an hc3800 for your usage.

There are more choices available now though like the hc7800 having an IRIS, a potentially better hc4000. I most likely don't care about 3D either (not too much), but I like the lumens boost these newer projectors give for sure so I can do larger screens. The new Epson has a mode that is supposedly close to D65 at 1600 lumens, and most all of the BEST modes of these projectors have increased at least a decent portion.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

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post #1373 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 07:38 PM
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I've just 'downgraded' to a Mitsubishi HC4000 from a Sony VPL-HW20. I've previously owned the HC3800 and missed the pop and vibrancy that was inherent in the image.

I had the oportunity to set the machines up side by side, running blu-ray (The Dark Knight) in a light controlled environment, and was surprised to note the Mitsubishi produced a more dynamic image in most scenes that I viewed. I also preferred the colour and sharpness of the Mitsubishi's image over the Sony. Also my colour uniformity seems to be close to perfect; much better than my old HC3800.

Overall I'm really impressed and rather surprised at the quality of image from the HC4000.
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post #1374 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 07:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Nice feedback, I have had a similar experience with OLDER Sony's vs the Mits DLP, but to Sony's credit they are now much improved so I hear.

You do lose some black levels in the real dark scenes, but the black levels are decent on the Mits compared to many other DLP choices. I preferred the color of a Sony vw70 in most scenes (of course it was an $8000 MSRP PJ), but otherwise, the DLP I preferred overall because of the way it held its own, and the sharpness would be greatly missed.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
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post #1375 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rojofi View Post

My breaking point it whether or not it is visible on normal video. It was definately visible during normal movie watching with both units and Mitsubishi said point blank that it was just that way. I realize that bulb break in plays a part and i put 200+ hours on it in two weeks just to give it a chance. it only worsened. I really wanted to keep it but i cant accept that Mitsubishi put out a flawed product and expected it to fly on its other aspects. If my experience helps others with my expectations avoid a similar hassle then thats why i posted here . I was not looking for perfection just a decent image. I will probably get the w1100 next. I can deal with firmware issues better than bad brightness uniformity.

man first one in this thread to have this issue, at least with the hc4000, I don't remember seeing anyone else, I'm very picky and went through 2 of these and I never had those issues..what kind of screen are you using is it posible that the screen could be causing an issue?

Looks like he mentioned one other user, thats a bummer I still think it throws up one of the better images but that would bother me also...i'd probably return and purchase again later, wonder how long it takes them to shuffle the stock....

War Eagle!!!
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post #1376 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimoy View Post

I've just 'downgraded' to a Mitsubishi HC4000 from a Sony VPL-HW20. I've previously owned the HC3800 and missed the pop and vibrancy that was inherent in the image.

I had the oportunity to set the machines up side by side, running blu-ray (The Dark Knight) in a light controlled environment, and was surprised to note the Mitsubishi produced a more dynamic image in most scenes that I viewed. I also preferred the colour and sharpness of the Mitsubishi's image over the Sony. Also my colour uniformity seems to be close to perfect; much better than my old HC3800.

Overall I'm really impressed and rather surprised at the quality of image from the HC4000.

Welcome to the mits thread

I think its amazing what you can get at this price point...i'm just not an lcd fan and DLP just looks better...

War Eagle!!!
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post #1377 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I've seen the brightness uniformity issue before on them with test patterns, but it was so slight it wasn't worth mentioning and I wasn't sure if it was the setup.

Also if the projector isn't perfectly perpendicular or the screen is hot-spotting, that can cause it. Room reflections or different levels of light absorption across the room can easily cause it as well. Since this projector has a slight light leakage issue, make sure extra light isn't being thrown on there either.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #1378 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bishopt View Post

man first one in this thread to have this issue, at least with the hc4000, I don't remember seeing anyone else, I'm very picky and went through 2 of these and I never had those issues..what kind of screen are you using is it posible that the screen could be causing an issue?

Looks like he mentioned one other user, thats a bummer I still think it throws up one of the better images but that would bother me also...i'd probably return and purchase again later, wonder how long it takes them to shuffle the stock....

kinda what i had in mind until Mitsubishi said they were all like that.
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post #1379 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:21 PM
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i am using a matte white 1.0 screen with the projector 11 feet back on a ceiling mount
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post #1380 of 2857 Old 09-19-2011, 08:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Try a wall temporarily, how big is your screen?


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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