The Three 1280x800 LED Clones - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 429 Old 08-26-2011, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post


I'll have to look around, I can't recall what thread it was in, but the guys reviewing seemed like knowledgeable and were able to point out obvious differences between the Acer and Optoma, to the point where I wanted to hold off for the Acer.

I got that too from the review, but I'm sure I will get the first one that comes out first. I just want countless hours of use on my big screen for football season. All the games except for the eagles game will be on the led projector
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post #182 of 429 Old 08-26-2011, 04:06 PM
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I still have a Infocus X2 in the box in plastic cover that only has around 200 to 300 hours on the bulb and still looks new.
I have this feeling that if I buy the Acer or Optoma 500 lumen projectors that in about a year from now maybe a 1080 P Led 500 to 700 lumen would be out.
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post #183 of 429 Old 08-26-2011, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCaugusto View Post
afineman >>> Nice to hear from you again and please don't be so coy ! Like you i was wowed by the HS201 the minute i set it up to the moment i sold it to get the HX300G.
I don't expect to be wowed the same way (we've been spoiled, i'm afraid) going from the HX300G to the ACER K330 but i do expect to be able to sit even closer to my screen than i presently do without seeing any pixels, and since the largest screen size i can fit in my HT room is "only" about 96" diagonal i figure any increase in perceived size would be a welcome addition.
BTW, i don't know if you guys noticed it but there is a link on the LG HW300T for the owner's manual and indeed it has similar CMS and grey-scale tracking as used on the HX300G, PLUS what appear to be some extra calibration "goodies".
PS : afineman, please tell us more about your experience with the Qumi; Appart from the start-up focus issue (did it happen only during start-up and then did it stabilize completely?), was it about as bright as the HS-201, were you able to sit much closer to screen without noticing pixels, did you notice those darned "diamond-shaped" pixels, how noisy was it, etc,etc ?
Macgo ? the thing is with the new 500 lumen projectors is that you can expand the screen to up to 120 " and if you are running it at 100 " no worries of the picture being out of focus.
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post #184 of 429 Old 08-26-2011, 04:14 PM
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Macgo ? I never really had a problem with the LG HX-300 with seeing the pixals for most of the time I am sitting at least 11 to 12 feet away from the screen.
The thing I don't like about it is the dull look of it, yes, I can turn up the brightness but that does not always work in all the seen in a movie.
Don't even bother to use it for games if you think your going to get a clear image like on a computer monitor or CRT HD TV.
The LG HX-300 is adequate for movie watching.
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post #185 of 429 Old 08-26-2011, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeonZA View Post
1024x768 should be able to fit inside 1280x800. Black bars will be at the top,bottom,left and right sides. Or am I wrong?

To test if the Qumi is doing 1:1 mapping we should maybe create a test pattern where we alternate black and white pixels for all 1280x800 pixels and check if every one of the displays correctly.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sure you could fit 1024x768 inside 1280x800 but why would you want black bars all around the image ?
Personally i'd rather not get any black bars on top/bottom of image when displaying native 4:3 content from a 16:10 image ratio chip that has 1280x800 pixels, OR if the image doesn't appear too distorted horizontally or vertically and i am not doing any "critical" viewing (blu-ray, dvd, etc) i'll probably let the built-in scaler do its job by using the full 1280x800 pixel grid and damn that image distortion !
I guess it's a matter of choice : by using 1024x768 it would mean thin black bars on top/bottom of image each consisting of 16 horizontal pixels AND wider side black bars each consisting of 128 pixels; By using 960x800 it would mean NO top/bottom black bars BUT each side bar would consist of 160 pixels.
Choices, choices, choices, but, believe me, when i get one of these pjs i'll definitely be playing around with both of these resolutions, notwithstanding my protestations to the contrary.
Insofar as this new HD Pico chip being capable of doing 1:1 mapping, did you see the diagrams posted on the Qumi thread by member anomaly123 and others ? Very illustrative and eye-opening...
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post #186 of 429 Old 08-27-2011, 02:11 AM
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Does anyone know if the ML500 (and the clones, I suppose) will accept 240V/50 Hz if I order it from the US?
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post #187 of 429 Old 08-27-2011, 05:57 AM
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Looks like I may order one of these from the states (I live in Canada) Was looking at the Qumi but the focus issue turns me off. If I don't end up getting this maybe an XGA LG LED Projector!
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post #188 of 429 Old 08-27-2011, 06:03 AM
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US distributor claims ML500 will be in stock at the end of this week.

Former Top 1000 Amazon reviewer bemoaning the loss of objective user reviews. Amazon, stop your complacency!
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post #189 of 429 Old 08-27-2011, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HenryDudley View Post

Does anyone know if the ML500 (and the clones, I suppose) will accept 240V/50 Hz if I order it from the US?

These tiny PJs are a boon for business travelers, so yes, I am sure the power supply is dual voltage. Heck, this is even true for most full-size PJs.
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post #190 of 429 Old 08-28-2011, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Well guys, i managed to download the manuals for the Optoma ML500, ACER K330 and LG HW300T and, as i expected, the manuals for the Optoma and ACER (two of the three clones) are almost identical without any options for CMS and grey-scale tracking adjustments.
The Optoma appear to have three more adjustments under "advanced menu" than the ACER pj has, for "BrilliantColor", "color space" and "inputs" and i think that "BrilliantColor" might be even disabled as it applies only to DLP pjs with standard color wheels; I can only surmise that the Viewsonic PLED-W500 clone will have the same set of adjustments, which is a disappointment to me.
The LG HW300T, being a totally different "beast" on the other hand, offer even more adjustments than my current HX300G, including almost full CMS controls for primary/secondary colors (saturation and tint included, no brightness) and that amazing grey-scale tracking adjustment from 0-IRE (black) to 100-IRE (white) divided in 10 individual controls from 0-IRE to 100-IRE for each primary R/G/B color ! On top of that you have adjustment for lowering/raising black level, just like my HX300G, AND similar control for the white level, as well as dynamic contrast, etc, etc, etc.
I am beginning to wonder if the HW300T is better geared toward home environment users and "cheapstakes videophiles" such as ourselves than business users and that its description of being a "presentation pj" more a virtue of its size, portability, features and pricing.
As far as we've been all able to investigate/search/knitpick, all these pjs appear to be still using the PT-54 LED chipset from Luminus Devices (not the Qumi, which appear to use the PT-39 chipset) and differences in lumen output could be related to the ability of the LED chipset of being driven "harder/hotter" depending on the design wishes of each manufacturer.
However, having pointed out the differences in menu controls for these pjs, i must also point out that the HX300G did not test nearly as well as the Optoma ML500 and Viewsonic W500 on the ZOL.com site for FO/FO contrast and ANSI contrast, so before i make my final decision, which now includes the LG HW300T, i would really/really like to see its test report on the same site for comparison's sake.
I realize i've been hedging this purchase back and forth, left and right, up and down, etc, etc, etc, but it's just that i like to make my purchases of electronic equipment without any equivocations and if after all of that i still have to return the item due to poor performance at least i tried my best to avoid returning it, to the best of my abilities...
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post #191 of 429 Old 08-28-2011, 07:17 PM
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is the LG only 250 lumens, or did the specs change from earlier in the year when it was released?

after calibration it could be well under 200. The Acer has my interest for now based on the zol.com info.


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post #192 of 429 Old 08-28-2011, 07:23 PM
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Like I said before, I'm sure the LG is a great pj. But my question, and a few others, is... if I'm going for a screen size of 100 to 120 inch, does that make it a no brainer or pushes my decision heavily in favour of the 500 lumens models?

Dare I say it might...
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post #193 of 429 Old 08-29-2011, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

I got that too from the review, but I'm sure I will get the first one that comes out first. I just want countless hours of use on my big screen for football season. All the games except for the eagles game will be on the led projector

The translated review was for Acer vs Viewsonic I thought? Is there a review somewhere stating that the Acer > Optoma as well?

I might pull the trigger on an Optoma tonight if not.
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post #194 of 429 Old 08-29-2011, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parawizard View Post

The translated review was for Acer vs Viewsonic I thought? Is there a review somewhere stating that the Acer > Optoma as well?

I might pull the trigger on an Optoma tonight if not.

There was a comparison that would lead you think that the Acer was better off as a HT projector when comparing color, contrast. Someone will hopefully post the link again.

I am holding off until the Acer arrives since the comparison was relatively convincing (they had them side by side) with a preference leaning towards the Acer for HT duty.


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post #195 of 429 Old 08-29-2011, 07:26 PM
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That was I was thinking when reading through some posts saying that the Acer and Optoma models went head to head somewhere. I must of somehow missed that completely.

The only comparison I've seen was the Viewsonic against the Acer. I haven't heard anything about the Optoma yet.

zombie10k, are u getting the Acer as soon as it arrives? Or are you waiting for some more reviews on it first? Just to be sure.
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post #196 of 429 Old 08-29-2011, 07:41 PM
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Even if it wasn't the acer vs Optoma, its safe to say that the acer looked ok as a HT projector. Think I might just order the Optoma tomorrow, but its too bad because I'm out of time until next week. At least it will be there when I get back
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post #197 of 429 Old 08-29-2011, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine0 View Post

That was I was thinking when reading through some posts saying that the Acer and Optoma models went head to head somewhere. I must of somehow missed that completely.

The only comparison I've seen was the Viewsonic against the Acer. I haven't heard anything about the Optoma yet.

zombie10k, are u getting the Acer as soon as it arrives? Or are you waiting for some more reviews on it first? Just to be sure.

Nah, no waiting.. just jump right in. I have the QUMI and it's a great little portable projector just to carry around for quick videos on the 32GB internal card, but I need something with more lumens to use as a TV projector for my 142" 2.8 high power screen. The QUMI works, but I need most of the lights out. I think the lumen measurement of the new Acer LED will be perfect for this task. Right now I use my Acer 5360 and will let that thing burn for hours on end since the lamp is inexpensive. About 1/4 the cost of my JVC lamps.

Is there any rumors to the Acer's US release or are we weeks away?


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post #198 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 04:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Nah, the testing done by ZOL.com was for the Viewsonic W500 and the ACER K330 but i imagine the results already gave us a pretty good idea of what to expect from the Optoma ML500, ANSI contrast between 1.500:1 ~ 2.300:1 and ANSI brightness between 295~370 lumens.
I posted the results for the tests including the Vivitek Qumi on page 4 of this thread.
No US release date for the ACER K330 yet but i imagine it should happen within the month of September.
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post #199 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 05:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCaugusto View Post

Nah, the testing done by ZOL.com was for the Viewsonic W500 and the ACER K330 but i imagine the results already gave us a pretty good idea of what to expect from the Optoma ML500, ANSI contrast between 1.500:1 ~ 2.300:1 and ANSI brightness between 295~370 lumens.
I posted the results for the tests including the Vivitek Qumi on page 4 of this thread.
No US release date for the ACER K330 yet but i imagine it should happen within the month of September.

thanks for the info. So there was no comparison of the Optoma and Acer? I wonder how close they will be based on factory settings. There seemed to be a fair margin of difference in the zol.com report so each manufacturer must be cooking the firmware differently with default color settings.

Without CMS controls, it would be good to pick the model that is the closest for HT purpose. If it's the same comparison I am thinking of, it seems the Acer stood out over the Viewsonic.


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post #200 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 06:18 AM
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Based on the ZOL.com review and comaprison, we have an idea on the Acer and Viewsonic models. But right now the Optoma is still a bit of an unknown quantity.

Sure the Acer, right now, seems the best/safest bet. But still, I would like to know a bit more about the Optoma before I part cash. Since I've waited for this long, I might as well get the best of the 3.
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post #201 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

thanks for the info. So there was no comparison of the Optoma and Acer? I wonder how close they will be based on factory settings. There seemed to be a fair margin of difference in the zol.com report so each manufacturer must be cooking the firmware differently with default color settings.

Without CMS controls, it would be good to pick the model that is the closest for HT purpose. If it's the same comparison I am thinking of, it seems the Acer stood out over the Viewsonic.

Anomaly123 explained some differences in one of his earlier posts:

Quote:
Originally Posted by anomaly123 View Post

The brightness difference comes from the mixing of a white field in addition to the red/green/blue fields. If you look at the color saturation spec, Qumi shows 128%, Acer shows about 100%, Viewsonic shows about 60%. RGB LEDs usually form a 120%~130% NTSC gamut due to the green at 520nm wavelength. What white mixing does is turn on R/G/B at the same time when the panel is showing a white field. The drawback is one trades color gamut area with brightness because the RGB primaries on the CIE1931 chart shift towards the center.

It is likely the Qumi is not doing white mixing, the Acer is doing slight white mixing, and the Viewsonic is doing heavy white mixing. This is a pure electronics tuning issue and depends on the target specs of the projector.

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post #202 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine0 View Post

Based on the ZOL.com review and comaprison, we have an idea on the Acer and Viewsonic models. But right now the Optoma is still a bit of an unknown quantity.

Sure the Acer, right now, seems the best/safest bet. But still, I would like to know a bit more about the Optoma before I part cash. Since I've waited for this long, I might as well get the best of the 3.

Someone should have a unit to review any time now as they seem to be shipping. It is always a pain sourcing stuff in Canada but I have managed to find a decent deal from a US Store on the Optoma. Darn suspense. Who knows when I can get an Acer though it may be a couple months depending on who is carrying them intially
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post #203 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 01:11 PM
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In case you guys missed it, here's the K330 brochure from a UK seller. Gives a lot of great facts in a nutshell. I really dig the wireless feature.
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post #204 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parawizard View Post

Someone should have a unit to review any time now as they seem to be shipping. It is always a pain sourcing stuff in Canada but I have managed to find a decent deal from a US Store on the Optoma. Darn suspense. Who knows when I can get an Acer though it may be a couple months depending on who is carrying them intially

ProjectorPoint in the UK says they're supposed to receive it around the end of next week, but who knows. Seems like they have a lot of preorders.

I think I'm going with the K330. I want the one that is brightest, but at the same time I want audio out so I can use external speakers with the built-in media player (if it's usable, I guess) and HDMI (I'm assuming that will work). The Acer seems to be the only one that has that, although it sacrifices S-video input for it. I just don't understand why Optoma/ViewSonic would leave this out. It seems like such a basic feature.

I can't wait for some comparisons with the Optoma. I hope it doesn't outperform the Acer.
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post #205 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 02:51 PM
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because it has a built in speaker,most using it for ht use will out put bluray to a/v receiver.I would rather have the s vid for a cheap tuner.

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post #206 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 06:59 PM
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Help me understand this. It appears that these three clones do not offer any CMS capability. The LG 300G(?) appears to offer CMS . Why would I even think of one of these clones instead of the LG if I plan to use it for home theater?

Jack
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post #207 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 07:03 PM
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I see that amazon.com has the Optoma in stock. It has 2 people giving it favorable reviews there already, so people do seem to have it in their hands now! (unless they are fake reviews )

Anyone here put in orders anywhere for the Optoma?
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post #208 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine0 View Post

I see that amazon.com has the Optoma in stock. It has 2 people giving it favorable reviews there already, so people do seem to have it in their hands now! (unless they are fake reviews )

Anyone here put in orders anywhere for the Optoma?

I did today
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post #209 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 07:23 PM
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Congrats blee0120! Looking forward to see what you think of it!
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post #210 of 429 Old 08-30-2011, 08:08 PM
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http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-...stRecentReview
http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-...stRecentReview

Quote:


"Mr Gizmo" is clearly an Optoma employee - all four of his reviews are 5-star reviews for Optoma products, and the review sounds fake. Please delete this, Amazon.

Quote:


Grad students do not live in dorms. This is a fake sounding review because of that. The rest is too positive with no reference to the details such as color and resolution IN DETAIL.

so blatant.... lol

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