New Optoma HD33 HD3300 1080p 3D Projector Review - Page 81 - AVS Forum
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post #2401 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 09:24 PM
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Matt in Houston, I have been doing this 3d thing on my DLP TV for some time now. I have followed the folks trying all order of glasses on this unit in the DLP TV forums for some time too. Bottom line was that you could pretty much get good 3d with DLP link glasses and the rest were a crap shoot. Sure some IR units worked for some and the same ones did not work for others. The bottom line was always that DLP link units always worked unless they were faulty. Yes there was the brightness complaints and the tinting issues, but DLP always worked. I cannot ever remember anyone complaining about ghosting though, maybe DLP TVs are superior to front PJs but probably has to do with image size making it more noticeable. The first time I heard of DLP ghosting was in the front PJ forums and I was dumbfounded because I see no hint of it on my TV.
Edit: this is another reason I am hesitant to try the 3010. I already have DLP link glasses and I am a DLP fanboy. I also have a 8350 and I do like that unit too. Something has to give for my big screen 3d viewing.
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post #2402 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Matt in Houston, I have been doing this 3d thing on my DLP TV for some time now. I have followed the folks trying all order of glasses on this unit in the DLP TV forums for some time too. Bottom line was that you could pretty much get good 3d with DLP link glasses and the rest were a crap shoot. Sure some IR units worked for some and the same ones did not work for others. The bottom line was always that DLP link unts always worked unless they were faulty. Yes there was the brightness complaints and the tinting issues, but DLP always worked. I cannot ever remember anyone complaining about ghosting though, maybe DLP TVs are superior to front PJs but probably has to do with image size making it more noticeable. The first time I heard of DLP ghosting was in the front PJ forums and I was dumbfounded because I see no hint of it on my TV.

The reason might be that I think most DLP TVs are using DLP link glasses and they seem to work better at least from what I can see here. The projector guys have mostly IR and RF and also of course DLP link, but youre going to read more diverse comments because of the different choices that come with some of these projectors.

From what I can tell, its not the projector in my testing...its the glasses for sure. Something about the viewing angle or edge of the Optoma RF glasses does NOT want to play well with certain 3D images. In the center they look fine..but tilt your head up and it all falls apart. Not so with the DLP-Link. Im a convert at this point.
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post #2403 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt in Houston View Post

The reason might be that I think most DLP TVs are using DLP link glasses and they seem to work better at least from what I can see here. The projector guys have mostly IR and RF and also of course DLP link, but youre going to read more diverse comments because of the different choices that come with some of these projectors.

From what I can tell, its not the projector in my testing...its the glasses for sure. Something about the viewing angle or edge of the Optoma RF glasses does NOT want to play well with certain 3D images. In the center they look fine..but tilt your head up and it all falls apart. Not so with the DLP-Link. Im a convert at this point.

I think it is a timing issue. The DLP link takes it's cue directly from the screen which is what you are seeing. We do not know what is going on with IR and RF signals because they are processed and sent. DLP link is just that, linked to what you are seeing. I am going to watch Pirates 3d here shortly and try real hard to get my Ultimate 3d Heaven UCs to ghost by looking through every angle I can on my DLP TV and report back. I can say I have never seen any and do not expect to. If this happens with the 33/3300 I will not be a happy camper because my TV is 3 YEARS OLD for crying out loud. Perhaps the checkerboard format was/is indeed a better format for 3d. As a matter of fact I am sure it is though not adopted by the HDMI 1.4a format and that is what really pisses off gamers, though I do not care about gaming on my setup.

Anyway, glad you found some good 3d glasses. I was looking at those too for some extra pairs for my TV. Let us know how they continue to perform as you evaluate them.
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post #2404 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

I think it is a timing issue. The DLP link takes it's cue directly from the screen which is what you are seeing. We do not know what is going on with IR and RF signals because they are processed and sent. DLP link is just that, linked to what you are seeing. I am going to watch Pirates 3d here shortly and try real hard to get my Ultimate 3d Heaven UCs to ghost by looking through every angle I can on my DLP TV and report back. I can say I have never seen any and do not expect to. If this happens with the 33/3300 I will not be a happy camper because my TV is 3 YEARS OLD for crying out loud. Perhaps the checkerboard format was/is indeed a better format for 3d. As a matter of fact I am sure it is though not adopted by the HDMI 1.4a format and that is what really pisses off gamers, though I do not care about gaming on my setup.

Anyway, glad you found some good 3d glasses. I was looking at those too for some extra pairs for my TV. Let us know how they continue to perform as you
evaluate them.

Thanks, Ill be sure to keep everyone posted. If you can try a 3D gaming console to do your ghost test. Watching movies will rarely show the artifact quite as well from my limited testing...but who knows, Im far from an expert here.

If you stick with dlp link when you get the hd3300 you should be golden from what I can see.

Good luck!
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post #2405 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt in Houston View Post

Thanks, Ill be sure to keep everyone posted. If you can try a 3D gaming console to do your ghost test. Watching movies will rarely show the artifact quite as well from my limited testing...but who knows, Im far from an expert here.

If you stick with dlp link when you get the hd3300 you should be golden from what I can see.

Good luck!

Absolutely zero ghosting so far no matter how I look through the glasses. I am still amazed at this 3 year old TV. I probably cannot test your gaming request because I do not game and my TV does checkerboard only through the Panny BD player. I could test a PC game or two but I refuse to send one more dime to Nvidia for that ability since I paid good money for a 3d card (GTX 460) yet they want more. My son is the gamer and he has all Xbox 360 titles which will not work with my TV in 3d. If I had anything to say here it would be that checkerboard format 3d is awesome and I thank Panasonic for it's continued support of the format because it made flawless 3d a reality in my home on my DLP TV. It is so good I doubt I will see a 3d PJ I will be happy with any time soon. But I will try. Again, I have flawless 3d on a 61" screen. If you are not familiar with checkerboard 3d do a search. It is a gamer dream but better yet it yields a great movie picture too. Now I am going to enjoy the rest of the ghost free movie. Cheers.
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post #2406 of 5315 Old 11-01-2011, 11:30 PM
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Following tuning of rf I no longer see any ghosting at all anywhere on the lens, found instructions for rf emitter seems to work slightly different to monster for instance I'm sure monster says hold left to cycle through options, optomas you press and hold joystick down, could be wrong

Anyway here's the instructions

http://www.optoma.co.uk/uploads/manu...n-GB.pdf#page6
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post #2407 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul77 View Post

Following tuning of rf I no longer see any ghosting at all anywhere on the lens, found instructions for rf emitter seems to work slightly different to monster for instance I'm sure monster says hold left to cycle through options, optomas you press and hold joystick down, could be wrong

Anyway here's the instructions

http://www.optoma.co.uk/uploads/manu...n-GB.pdf#page6


Thanks so much for this link, I found the DVD manual to be seriously lacking in info on this! I have some ghosting whilst in game using my GT570, movies are ok. I do wonder whether I have to return the value again whilst using my PS3. - doesn´t look like there aren´t any settings to memorize.
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post #2408 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 02:56 AM
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post #2409 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 04:42 AM
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Also, easy fix for the drapes--get blackout drape cloth and set up a double rod for the blackout behind the drapes or sew the blackout to the drapes. Material is readily available at local drapery or material shops.

The blackout drapes are GREAT. I use them and bought them fairly cheap a few weeks ago at my local BJ's Warehouse (like Sam's Club).
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post #2410 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by paul77 View Post

Following tuning of rf I no longer see any ghosting at all anywhere on the lens, found instructions for rf emitter...

I have four pair and they all exhibit the same thing. I have known how to tune the RF for weeks now and tried every possible setting. The bottom of the lenses ghost if you look up at the top of the screen and something is 3d at the bottom of the screen. It also tends to ghost if you are reclining back in the chair and looking at an angle through the lens. Others have seen this too further back in the thread. Again its not as noticeable in movies but its super distracting in GT5.



The DLP link do not have the same sensitivity to the angle or lens position as the RFs.
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post #2411 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 05:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Matt in Houston View Post

I have four pair and they all exhibit the same thing. I have known how to tune the RF for weeks now and tried every possible setting. The bottom of the lenses ghost if you look up at the top of the screen and something is 3d at the bottom of the screen. It also tends to ghost if you are reclining back in the chair and looking at an angle through the lens. Others have seen this too further back in the thread. Again its not as noticeable in movies but its super distracting in GT5.

The DLP link do not have the same sensitivity to the angle or lens position as the RFs.

I'll try it tonight. No problems on my PS3 though (have you tried adjusting 3D screen size? - don't know if that helps), for me it's only when I play games on my PC, and only really noticable in 720p, 1080p seem to have a lot less ghosting, but it's more of a strain due to lower refresh.
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post #2412 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 05:48 AM
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I will look again tonight but I don't have gt5, however I have sky 3d and If there was ever any ghosting it's on there!!

I've tilted my head all over to the point where I'm in serious danger of damaging my myself

I will look again tonight and report back

Also re emitter settings being saved you make the adjustments and then leave it for a period of time and settings are saved, can't do multiple settings though. That's my understanding

The only remaining issue I have is reflections but I am going to do a DIY fix with adhesive av velvet some how
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post #2413 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 06:55 AM
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Thanks guys for looking into it. I really wanted these to work, after all I spent the money and bought 4 pair. So far I just cant get them to not ghost in those situations no matter what I try. Its almost as if the lenses are too big and just cant handle a reclined angle like that before they start to distort.

Again, if I keep the image in the sweet spot or near center of the glasses it looks perfect. Its getting toward the edges that really makes it show for me.

It is strange though that the DLP-Link seem seem so much better to me in this regard. I am really loving the 3D image the HD3300 throws even more now with these glasses. Such a great projector everyone that I have shown it too is blown away.

For you guys that dont have issues with the RF, PM me if you might be interested in buying my 4 pair for cheap.
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post #2414 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 08:30 AM
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Matt I just succesfully eliminated the ghosts out of my image. The info in the pfd worked like a charm, though I did have some trouble getting into the manual tuning mode (the transmitter is honestly a piece of trash!):

I pressed inwards and in all directions until I got it showing two lights. Then released and used up/down and left/right to adjust the image. Within a few clicks the ghosting was gone.

Now having said that, if I tilt my head to a (very) high angle the ghosting is back (I never noticed this until you posted it), but from your normal sitting position you should be able to adjust it to your comfort.

Now I have a headache though, that stuff is a real killer for the eyes...
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post #2415 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 08:36 AM
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Any opinions on using this filter to drop the black levels a bit? Will 77mm fit?

http://www.amazon.com/Zykkor-Neutral...248000&sr=8-14
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post #2416 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 08:44 AM
 
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Any opinions on using this filter to drop the black levels a bit? Will 77mm fit?

http://www.amazon.com/Zykkor-Neutral...248000&sr=8-14

Have you tried turning brightness all the way down and then turn down contrast until you get the blacks you want. Not sure you need a filter.
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post #2417 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 08:44 AM
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Matt I just succesfully eliminated the ghosts out of my image. The info in the pfd worked like a charm, though I did have some trouble getting into the manual tuning mode (the transmitter is honestly a piece of trash!):

I pressed inwards and in all directions until I got it showing two lights. Then released and used up/down and left/right to adjust the image. Within a few clicks the ghosting was gone.

Now having said that, if I tilt my head to a (very) high angle the ghosting is back (I never noticed this until you posted it), but from your normal sitting position you should be able to adjust it to your comfort.

Now I have a headache though, that stuff is a real killer for the eyes...

Yeah Ive tuned them several times and you can get a great image, but the edges still ghost like you said...its just very pronounced in GT5 and also in a little black ops since the gun stays at the bottom of the screen. I dont care to play COD in 3D so that doesnt really matter much IMO.

If you recline back, or with certain games where you have a static 3D image on the bottom edge of the screen, like the steering wheel and instrument cluster in GT5, you are going to have ghosting down there if you are looking up screen and ahead down the road at the next corner. Its just very annoying!

If you tilt your head up with the True Depth 3D DLP Links you wont see anything like what you see in the RF's, at least in my testing.

Good luck and have fun!
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post #2418 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by threed123 View Post

Have you tried turning brightness all the way down and then turn down contrast until you get the blacks you want. Not sure you need a filter.

I've played with the settings, but black doesn't really get any deeper beyond a point. I find the brightness is still plenty, so I wanted to try what some others have nad noticeable results with. My room is very dark so I know I could squeeze some more out of it and for the price it seems like a good shot.

I had read someone said 77mm will fit the lens on the HD33?
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post #2419 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 09:24 AM
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I have a question regarding the 3D - what type of 3D does the Optoma do on Blu Rays? I ask this because one of my 3D channels uses side by side and Gears of War 3 uses side by side, but I find it's nowhere near as nice (clean?) as with Blu Ray movies. It hard to describe why it looks better, but with side by side I notice what looks to be "invisible jaggies" (tearing?). Maybe I'm not describing it well, but...

At any rate, I know it's not the glasses (not ghosting) - I'm using DLP Link and they are fantastic. From the sounds of it, many people have been able to dial in RF really well, but I turned these things on and they worked flawlessly out of the box. If you're a tweaker, RF may be a good choice, but if you're like me and just want it to work, DLP link is a winner.

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post #2420 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 09:30 AM
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so after going back and forth on the 3010 and hd33 ....ive started to lean towards the hd3300. its for a living room with no light control during the day...nighttime is fine.... im just curious as to how it will fair during the day...i do have blinds.....in the afternoon is when the light is pretty bright in my place... realistically how will the hd3300 fair?...if i reaaaally have to buy a blackdiamond ill do it...but i was thinking diy as well... i would have gone with the 3010 automatically due to its high light output.. but with the input lag at 60 ill have to pass...what do you guys think?...i know there are so many variables that its hard to say..but im wondering how others are fairing with similar situations as me. thanks again!
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post #2421 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 09:59 AM
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so after going back and forth on the 3010 and hd33 ....ive started to lean towards the hd3300. its for a living room with no light control during the day...nighttime is fine.... im just curious as to how it will fair during the day...i do have blinds.....in the afternoon is when the light is pretty bright in my place... realistically how will the hd3300 fair?...if i reaaaally have to buy a blackdiamond ill do it...but i was thinking diy as well... i would have gone with the 3010 automatically due to its high light output.. but with the input lag at 60 ill have to pass...what do you guys think?...i know there are so many variables that its hard to say..but im wondering how others are fairing with similar situations as me. thanks again!


I can see my 120" 1.1g matte white screen just fine with several lights on in my theater, but it does make a negative impact. If there is a way to install some blackout curtains over your blinds it would make a big difference.

Either way, the HD3300 is quite bright and as long as you dont have direct sunlight hitting the screen you SHOULD be fine messing around with it during the day. I would hold off on any serious movies until night though.

Good luck!
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post #2422 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blastermaster View Post

I have a question regarding the 3D - what type of 3D does the Optoma do on Blu Rays? I ask this because one of my 3D channels uses side by side and Gears of War 3 uses side by side, but I find it's nowhere near as nice (clean?) as with Blu Ray movies. It hard to describe why it looks better, but with side by side I notice what looks to be "invisible jaggies" (tearing?). Maybe I'm not describing it well, but...

At any rate, I know it's not the glasses (not ghosting) - I'm using DLP Link and they are fantastic. From the sounds of it, many people have been able to dial in RF really well, but I turned these things on and they worked flawlessly out of the box. If you're a tweaker, RF may be a good choice, but if you're like me and just want it to work, DLP link is a winner.

Your cable/satellite channels and the xbox games all are Side-by-side (SBS) 50%. Meaning both left and right views have half the standard horizontal resolution to fit both views in one standard frame. The BD are "frame packed" which means that a full left frame is followed by a full right frame. Simply put, there's at least twice as much horizontal resolution in the BD frames than the Xbox or TV frames.

Secondly, at the same resolution, video games will always have "jaggies" when compared to real footage.

Thirdly, Gears is probably not rendering at 1080p in the first place. It's probably 720p scaled to 1080p and then the horizontal resolution is halved. That's definitely going to affect it as well.

And finally- you're fine with movies playing back at 1080p@24hz framepacked, but you wouldn't want your games (or sports) to be handled this way. 24 FPS (hz) is too slow for games or sports. With the current HDMI 1.4a architecture, the alternative is 720p@60hz framepacked... but there are a lot of people that think 1080p@60z SBS-50% is superior to 720p@60hz frame packed... so that might not be the best bet either.
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post #2423 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 11:28 AM
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Don't use monster instructions use the ones I posted, to cycle through modes is different you press the joystick down not in a direction, this is not the only difference in the instructions, also setting polarisation is different

If you use optoma rf instructions the emitter works like a charm
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post #2424 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 12:01 PM
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Don't use monster instructions use the ones I posted, to cycle through modes is different you press the joystick down not in a direction, this is not the only difference in the instructions, also setting polarisation is different

If you use optoma rf instructions the emitter works like a charm

Paul, quick question...In any of the 3D you have seen, is there ANY ghosting at all near the bottom edges of the lenses, or if you are reclining looking up at the screen, does anything near the bottom of the lenses ghost?

Have you played any 3D games or just movies?

I know how to tune the glasses, so I know for sure that is not the problem here. Maybe I got a bad batch...who knows. Guess Im going to have to break out the Nikon D700 and show you guys whats going on here...
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post #2425 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt in Houston View Post

Paul, quick question...In any of the 3D you have seen, is there ANY ghosting at all near the bottom edges of the lenses, or if you are reclining looking up at the screen, does anything near the bottom of the lenses ghost?

Have you played any 3D games or just movies?

I know how to tune the glasses, so I know for sure that is not the problem here. Maybe I got a bad batch...who knows. Guess Im going to have to break out the Nikon D700 and show you guys whats going on here...

I lean back in a recliner and watch movies most of the time. When I lean back, I guess my eyes are looking through the bottom of the lenses. I can sometimes see some ghosting while sitting this way, but it is in really, really extreme cases. I just adjust my glasses on my head a little bit and it goes away. It's really not a bother, but I haven't tried many of the PS3 games yet. I don't have the GT game, either. I have two pairs BTW, and they both show very minimal ghosting in an extreme angle I guess? Like I said, doesn't bother me enough to try a new pair of glasses.
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post #2426 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 03:22 PM
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Yes done this tonight and in extreme kind of unnatural position I can see a little ghosting, but I have to tilt my head quite significantly. I recline while watching films but not to that extent.
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post #2427 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 04:17 PM
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Finally put up the new HD3300 tonight and instantly turned it on.. all I can say is WOW!?! I can't believe how much better the picture is from my HD72. I realize the bulb is brand new at this point but the colors and brightness are amazing even in Cinema mode! I have not tweaked any settings at this point but I am extremely happy!

I always want the colors to "pop-out" of the screen and the HD3300 does that without question! I'm sure the HD33 is extremely similar but I am not sure why anyone would not choose the HD3300 when it can be ordered from the AVS store for a great price!

The only thing I wish it had at this point is horizontal lens shift (I realize DLP's do not typically have these features). The HD72 lens is on the opposite side of the HD3300 (and HD33) so my screen it slightly off right now. I'll figure out how to fix it - will not be a big deal.

There's no chance that a projector mount for the HD72 would work with the HD33 is there? Are the mounting points completely different? I'm guessing they are, but thought I'd check.
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post #2428 of 5315 Old 11-02-2011, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul77 View Post

I have managed to eliminate ghosting with the rf emitter, also reversed polarisation so no more sync invert!

I am no expert and did what I could with monster rf manual

I cannot believe optoma has not given guidance on how to use this thing!!!!!!

It might be an idea for some knowledgable member who owns this a hd33 with rf to give a decent how to, unfortunately I am not knowledgable

It is a major function that needs to be mastered to maximise the 3d potential in my view

Yes I agree, I still need to tweak mine as I used Monsters guide and I have accidentally switched polarity
I think the glasses are a bit thinner at the bottom and let a little crosstalk through - if you use a media player that has white letters when you pause at the bottom of the screen it can come through the other lens in dark blue. I haven't noticed any problems in movies though.
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post #2429 of 5315 Old 11-03-2011, 01:38 AM
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How do you guys experience eye-strain. I watched the Avatar blu-Ray last night with a friend and we turned it off halfway because it was so intense. We watched The Green Lantern which has far less decent 3D effects, but it was much easier on the eyes. My screensize is about 90" diagonal but I can't really sit further back then 5 meters, though I guess the nice thing about shutterglass is position doesn't really effect the 3D.

If there was another projector on the market with passive vs. shutterglass I would have bought it without second guessing over the Optoma, because passive is so much easier on the eyes (plus you don't need to buy 100$ glasses). However I understand passive cuts your resolution in half which is the reason it's a no go on projectors (at this price).

Any tips for less eye strain?
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post #2430 of 5315 Old 11-03-2011, 04:17 AM
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Originally Posted by oleus View Post

this exact phenomenon was driving me crazy with MY BLOODY VALENTINE last night. a lot of foreground blurriness, and i did see a fair amount of ghosting. unless i had the optoma rf glasses in the exact right position and my head tilted right, i saw some ghosting/crosstalk. i lean back in theater seats pretty close to the screen so maybe i should move back.

i know VALENTINE was shot on 3d cameras but the fake (and much maligned) post-processed THOR looked just as good on my setup as MBV did. MBV is cited as one of the better live-action 3d movies but it didn't knock my socks off.

I too have this issue,

Its almost like the "pop" part of the 3d Image is out of focus.

I have improved this by using the Monster software to adjust the RF transmitter and reduce Ghosting, I am wondering if what we are seeing is an effect of ghosting??? any comments?

The settings i have changed have improved the "pop" but it is still not right.

To add more confusion, if i watch Despicable Me and go to the ticket scene in space, the "pop out" is stunning.

Alice in Wonderland has great depth but a lot of foreground blur.

Don`t know if it will help you but the setting on MY RF are 970 and 120 respectively.
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Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

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