Official Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 5010 / 6010 thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 2Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #541 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 05:13 AM
Member
 
wickedg8gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: louisville ky
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
THANK YOU everyone for the help. I really understand alot more now. I'll leave the 5010 on auto (which is what the manual says) and my source the PS3 doesnt have any other options so all signals should be detected properly to give the best 3d picture possible.
wickedg8gt is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #542 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 05:57 AM
Senior Member
 
KevinG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: S. Jersey
Posts: 459
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Is there a quick way to switch between auto and SBS that I haven't found? Currently, I have to bring up the menu, and go to 3d settings...

It's annoying when I watch a SBS movie, and forget to switch back to auto. Next time I turn on the system it is very confused since it thinks it should be getting a SBS image, and it isn't.
KevinG is offline  
post #543 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 06:22 AM
Member
 
8000HD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 60
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
You can use the remote User button (can be configured in the settings) to switch 3d modes.
8000HD is offline  
post #544 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 07:11 AM
Member
 
wickedg8gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: louisville ky
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinG View Post

Is there a quick way to switch between auto and SBS that I haven't found? Currently, I have to bring up the menu, and go to 3d settings...

It's annoying when I watch a SBS movie, and forget to switch back to auto. Next time I turn on the system it is very confused since it thinks it should be getting a SBS image, and it isn't.

If 3d blu-ray movies are frame packed then what are SBS movies.
wickedg8gt is offline  
post #545 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 08:01 AM
Senior Member
 
KevinG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: S. Jersey
Posts: 459
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8000HD View Post

You can use the remote User button (can be configured in the settings) to switch 3d modes.

Excellent, thanks. I wasn't aware of that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wickedg8gt View Post

If 3d blu-ray movies are frame packed then what are SBS movies.

SBS means "Side-by-side". Watch one in non-3d sbs mode and it will be very obvious what it means. In one frame, both the left and right eye are present, next to each other. Typically, these are seen as "half SBS", meaning that half of the resolution is given to each eye. (So, instead of a single frame getting all 1920 horizontal pixels, each eye is given 960 pixels).

As you can imagine, the same is true of "Top and Bottom" 3d.
KevinG is offline  
post #546 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 08:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Gmichael2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Earth, today.
Posts: 1,760
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
My 120" screen came in yesterday. Put it up last night. Can't wait to get home tonight to test my 5010 on the larger screen. I haven't tried Tron Legacy in 3D yet. The story sucked, but I hear that the 3D FX are good.

(I think I'm picking up some kind of cold. cough cough.....)
Gmichael2 is offline  
post #547 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 09:05 AM
Member
 
wickedg8gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: louisville ky
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well if anyone has played with the settings on a 5010 and a ps3 it would be greatly appreciated if you could post them that gave you the best image.
wickedg8gt is offline  
post #548 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 09:44 AM
Advanced Member
 
Rigby Reardon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 970
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by wickedg8gt View Post

Well if anyone has played with the settings on a 5010 and a ps3 it would be greatly appreciated if you could post them that gave you the best image.

For 2D I use the "Natural" mode with default settings in Eco mode. For 3D the "3D Dynamic" mode with slightly reduced color saturation. The presets are so good that I don't feel a need for further calibration. You can also try turning on the dynamic iris. It makes an audible noise (mine sounds a bit like the seek noises of a harddisk drive) but can improve on/off contrast and blacks in dark scenes. Depending on the movie the effect may or may not be very noticeable.

I don't have a Playstation so I can't say anything about that.
Rigby Reardon is offline  
post #549 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 09:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
drhankz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,423
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gmichael2 View Post

My 120" screen came in yesterday. Put it up last night. Can't wait to get home tonight to test my 5010 on the larger screen. I haven't tried Tron Legacy in 3D yet. The story sucked, but I hear that the 3D FX are good.

(I think I'm picking up some kind of cold. cough cough.....)

I don't want t dampen your fire - but I was disappointed
in Tron 3D in the Theater. I hope Blu-Ray is better.
drhankz is offline  
post #550 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 12:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
wnielsenbb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Phoenix AZ
Posts: 2,051
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Tron 3D had a deliberate lack of seperation. Something about too much seperation being bad for little kids. It is a fun movie, but not a 3D showcase at all.
Open Season, although not a great movie is an excellent showcase.
wnielsenbb is offline  
post #551 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 12:29 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drhankz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,423
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

tron 3d had a deliberate lack of seperation.

+1
drhankz is offline  
post #552 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 12:35 PM
Member
 
ubob800's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 29
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I watched the movie Raging Bull the other night, which is predominately shot in Black and White. As I watched the movie I realized there were subtle red and blue hues on various regions of the screen. I wasn't sure if this was coming from the source or if it might be the fault of the PJ...but on a whim I decided to disable the dynamic iris. After doing so, I didn't notice this effect again for the remainder of the film.

Has anybody else noticed this effect on B&W content? Is it possible that the Dynamic Iris could be to blame? I can't think of a scientific reason why, but then again I have a very limited knowledge of optics.
ubob800 is offline  
post #553 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 12:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
drhankz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,423
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ubob800 View Post

Has anybody else noticed this effect on B&W content? Is it possible that the Dynamic Iris could be to blame? I can't think of a scientific reason why, but then again I have a very limited knowledge of optics.

A Member here in NH also noticed it on B&W with a 6010.
drhankz is offline  
post #554 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 01:54 PM
Member
 
wickedg8gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: louisville ky
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon View Post

For 2D I use the "Natural" mode with default settings in Eco mode. For 3D the "3D Dynamic" mode with slightly reduced color saturation. The presets are so good that I don't feel a need for further calibration. You can also try turning on the dynamic iris. It makes an audible noise (mine sounds a bit like the seek noises of a harddisk drive) but can improve on/off contrast and blacks in dark scenes. Depending on the movie the effect may or may not be very noticeable.

I don't have a Playstation so I can't say anything about that.

I appreciate it. I did assume though that for 2d blu-rays or anything 2d it would be normal plug in play (as in turn it on and set the livingroom or dynamic setting) and watch; like it was with my 8350. My hangup is the 3d stuff. Im trying to read all about it and read the 5010 owners manual because thats where I dont understand the different formats and stuff. I know the owners manual says keep the projector 3d format on auto unless bad picture. So I was just wondering for all who use the ps3 with there 5010/6010 what they kept the projector and ps3 settings on for very best 3d blu-ray picture.
wickedg8gt is offline  
post #555 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 06:56 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ricwhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Layton, Utah
Posts: 2,963
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
I'm looking at getting an Epson 5010 or 6010. Has anyone had any experience using either of those Epson models with a Onkyo TX-NR709 or 809 receiver and an Oppo BDP-93 BR player? I'm just wondering how that combination of components works together and whether there are any issues or problems - especially on the 3D end. Thanks in advance for any information you can provide.
ricwhite is offline  
post #556 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 08:51 PM
Advanced Member
 
coolplazma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: N. Idaho / Spokane
Posts: 518
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Hiya,

I can't seem to locate a service manual for these projectors. Would anyone care to do some sleuthing and figure out the pinouts on the RJ45 emitter port?

If this is the same pinout as the Sony HW30, then I'd prefer to eliminate the IR completely and only use the Bit Cauldron RF glasses (branded as MonsterVision, Optima, etc).

For reference, here are the posts about about the HW30 pinouts and cabling created by our Euro friends:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post21254110
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post21183251


Mark Haflich's suggestion is a little less scarey to build as it would use a simple external 5v dc power supply:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=1528

Coolplazma's HT Den project. Early project info. Needs update with final results.
coolplazma is offline  
post #557 of 3391 Old 01-12-2012, 11:13 PM
Member
 
ubob800's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 29
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Has anybody noticed that their Epson 5010 box has white tape over two of the bullet-point features on the outside? For example, my box has about eight bullet-points listed in four different languages (two languages on opposing sides) and in all cases the same two items have been covered with white tape. Looks to me like they made some last minute changes to the PJ but didn't get the new packaging to go with it.

My wife tried to peel the tape off of the English points and was able to reveal that one point begins with "Entertainment" and the other with "ISF Certified". At that point the box started ripping off so that's as far as she got.

I was able to find one photo of a person who didn't have the tape, but the photo was from an angle where you can't read the text. Does anybody else have a box without the tape? I'm just curious to know what might have been!

Attachment 233967
LL
ubob800 is offline  
post #558 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 06:03 AM
Advanced Member
 
toofast68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NorthEast Ohio, USA
Posts: 938
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by ubob800 View Post

Has anybody noticed that their Epson 5010 box has white tape over two of the bullet-point features on the outside? For example, my box has about eight bullet-points listed in four different languages (two languages on opposing sides) and in all cases the same two items have been covered with white tape. Looks to me like they made some last minute changes to the PJ but didn't get the new packaging to go with it.

My wife tried to peel the tape off of the English points and was able to reveal that one point begins with "Entertainment" and the other with "ISF Certified". At that point the box started ripping off so that's as far as she got.

I was able to find one photo of a person who didn't have the tape, but the photo was from an angle where you can't read the text. Does anybody else have a box without the tape? I'm just curious to know what might have been!

Attachment 233967

Mmmm, ISF sounds like the PRO Model 6010
toofast68 is online now  
post #559 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 06:32 AM
Member
 
nab9524's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I am trying to make a decision between the Sony 30ES and the Epson 5010. I have seen the Sony in person, but I have not been able find an Epson to view.

Is there anyone in the Rochester NY area that has a 5010/6010 that would be willing to let me view it?
Thanks
Nate

nab9524 is offline  
post #560 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 06:57 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
42Plasmaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,035
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by ubob800 View Post

Has anybody noticed that their Epson 5010 box has white tape over two of the bullet-point features on the outside? For example, my box has about eight bullet-points listed in four different languages (two languages on opposing sides) and in all cases the same two items have been covered with white tape. Looks to me like they made some last minute changes to the PJ but didn't get the new packaging to go with it.

My wife tried to peel the tape off of the English points and was able to reveal that one point begins with "Entertainment" and the other with "ISF Certified". At that point the box started ripping off so that's as far as she got.

I was able to find one photo of a person who didn't have the tape, but the photo was from an angle where you can't read the text. Does anybody else have a box without the tape? I'm just curious to know what might have been!

Attachment 233967

Take a look at the box on this thread.
I believe the ISF & THX is for the 6010 only.
They may have initially had ISF & THX for the 5010 series but then decided to removed it to keep those features exclusive to the 6010 only.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1374303

2014
42Plasmaman is offline  
post #561 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 07:49 AM
Member
 
GardenVariety's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 193
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobkbusch View Post

When I spoke with Epson customer support yesterday, they said they would send a "new" projector since mine is less than 30 days old. He said if it was older than 30 days, I would probably get a refurbished projector.

Is that what you mean by new "retail" vs. new "warranty" model?

It means I got a model that was meant to be sent to retailers for sale. It was hinted to me that I wasn't supposed to get one of these models. No matter now though... this one has the same focus issue as the 5 before it. I think it may be inherent to these models. I did an experiment yesterday and figured out exactly what was happening. Previously, I would turn on the projector and it would be out of focus. After this I would focus the projector and it would stay solid for about 1 hour then slowly defocus. This was the same across 4 8700UB's and now 2 5010's. I really refuse to believe that I'm the most unlucky person in the world. So now, I let the projector warm up for an hour and focus it. The next time I fire up the projector it starts to focus until it becomes focused at around 1 hour and stays that way. I figured out that I have two choices with these projectors: 1) Focus at the beginning and refocus during the middle of a movie or 2) Warm up the projector for 45 minutes to an hour before starting a movie. Awesome, right? Has anyone else actually focused this projector upon start up and then tested the next time on start up?
GardenVariety is offline  
post #562 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 08:04 AM
AVS Special Member
 
BrettStah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 3,311
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
That is strange... where do you live, and how is the temperature and humidity (in the house)?

Brett

I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.
BrettStah is offline  
post #563 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 08:28 AM
Member
 
GardenVariety's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 193
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettStah View Post

That is strange... where do you live, and how is the temperature and humidity (in the house)?

I live in Huntington Beach CA. Humidity is probably around 40-50% and temperature is around 70F
GardenVariety is offline  
post #564 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
42Plasmaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,035
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by GardenVariety View Post

It means I got a model that was meant to be sent to retailers for sale. It was hinted to me that I wasn't supposed to get one of these models. No matter now though... this one has the same focus issue as the 5 before it. I think it may be inherent to these models. I did an experiment yesterday and figured out exactly what was happening. Previously, I would turn on the projector and it would be out of focus. After this I would focus the projector and it would stay solid for about 1 hour then slowly defocus. This was the same across 4 8700UB's and now 2 5010's. I really refuse to believe that I'm the most unlucky person in the world. So now, I let the projector warm up for an hour and focus it. The next time I fire up the projector it starts to focus until it becomes focused at around 1 hour and stays that way. I figured out that I have two choices with these projectors: 1) Focus at the beginning and refocus during the middle of a movie or 2) Warm up the projector for 45 minutes to an hour before starting a movie. Awesome, right? Has anyone else actually focused this projector upon start up and then tested the next time on start up?

Are you using the same area on the screen to focus and content(text) each time you check it?

Is your projector ceiling mounted?


I've found that if I focus on text about a foot to the left or right of center that I get better focus uniformity across the screen then focusing on text on dead center.

2014
42Plasmaman is offline  
post #565 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 08:48 AM
Member
 
GardenVariety's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 193
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post

Are you using the same area on the screen to focus and content(text) each time you check it?

Is your projector ceiling mounted?


I've found that if I focus on text about a foot to the left or right of center that I get better focus uniformity across the screen then focusing on text on dead center.

It's on a 100lb component rack behind the seating. I focus on the center of the screen and it's visibly blurry when focusing on the menu screen of the Epson. I use the same pattern each time. I'm not talking about focus uniformity. My issue is the projector needing to warm up to focus.
GardenVariety is offline  
post #566 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 08:59 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
42Plasmaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,035
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by GardenVariety View Post

It's on a 100lb component rack behind the seating. I focus on the center of the screen and it's visibly blurry when focusing on the menu screen of the Epson. I use the same pattern each time. I'm not talking about focus uniformity. My issue is the projector needing to warm up to focus.

When you test the focus & wait an hour, are you watching a movie or just letting it sit?

Example: Power on, wait a few minutes, focus, let projector sit idle with may be a loop of pictures, check focus in an hour and it's out of focus.

Just wondering if the shelf (any vibrations(loud/powerful LFE)) is causing the focus ring to move.

2014
42Plasmaman is offline  
post #567 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 09:12 AM
Member
 
GardenVariety's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 193
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post

When you test the focus & wait an hour, are you watching a movie or just letting it sit?

Example: Power on, wait a few minutes, focus, let projector sit idle with may be a loop of pictures, check focus in an hour and it's out of focus.

Just wondering if the shelf (any vibrations(loud/powerful LFE)) is causing the focus ring to move.

No, I turn off all audio and let the projector sit with a movie on. I've ruled out any other outside influences (vibrations, hdmi cable, etc..) Again, this happens with every Epson I've had in the past two months.
GardenVariety is offline  
post #568 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 09:31 AM
dna
AVS Special Member
 
dna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Fremont, CA U.S.A.
Posts: 1,031
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
With the possible exception of LED projectors, most projectors change focus to some extent as the lamp heats up the unit. If you don't believe me google projector focus warm-up and start reading the 1,260,000 results.

The second google hit brings up an article on the Epson 8700 UB:

"After 30 minutes or so of power-up time, the focus improved visibly. This is not the only projector out there that changes focus slightly on warm-up, but this Epson shows the anomaly more than previous units I've worked with. Bottom line - let the projector warm up for at least half an hour before adjusting focus. And don't be tempted to adjust it right after a cold start."

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/proje...r.html?start=2

Even CRT projectors change focus as they warm up:

http://www.curtpalme.com/Focus_and_Mechanical_Aim6.shtm

- David
dna is offline  
post #569 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 11:39 AM
Member
 
wickedg8gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: louisville ky
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I recieved my 5010 today and now waiting on my 134in Carada b/w screen.
wickedg8gt is offline  
post #570 of 3391 Old 01-13-2012, 03:54 PM
Member
 
pkirangi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 51
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Okay I received my 5010 yesterday. The thing I noted as soon as I removed the PJ from the box was that there was dust on the front air duct, and the lens cover was half open. The lens cover also had some stains on it. As soon as I fired the PJ, I noted that image was out of focus, really small and pointing way down. I had to use the vertical shift/zoom/focus to get the out of box message on the screen. I have yet to play with the PJ, but you would think that EPSON would have kept standard alignment when shipping the projectors. All this lends me to believe that the PJ shipped was a used one...what do you guys think. Did someone experience this? Is there something quickly I can verify to make sure that everything is alright with the projector. I am half way into returning the product. I had got this from B&H photo.

Thanks
pkirangi is offline  
Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

Tags
Epson 5010 Powerlite Home Cinema 3d Front Projector , Epson Powerlite Pro Cinema 6010 Projector , Projectors , Epson Powerlite Home Cinema 8350 , Cpu Fan

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off