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post #1 of 13 Old 05-11-2002, 07:52 PM - Thread Starter
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So we have been demote to the sub-$5000 category, now it is us against them :D why $5000? a few months from now, the bar has to be lower again.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/searc...der=descending

Cheers,
Jaz
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post #2 of 13 Old 05-11-2002, 08:01 PM
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Demoted....Nope...Just classified in to an area that fits better. If a person an only afford to spend $2,500 on a projector...then they sould not be reading posts on a $10,000 unit or tweeking one.

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DISCLAIMER: All spelling and grammatical errors done on purpose for the proofreadingly challenged...:)

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post #3 of 13 Old 05-11-2002, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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I know, I was just joking. But I will continue to read both forums, always good to know what is the latest greatest, etc. AVS is DA source for such information. Thanks!

Cheers,
Jaz
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post #4 of 13 Old 05-12-2002, 12:26 AM
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David,

I respect your reasons for the split; but, I am surprised that you would make such a pretentious statement “they should not be reading posts on a $10,000 unitâ€. David, part of the intent of this hobby is to further one’s knowledge. When I became interested in this hobby, I devoured all of the information that I could find on various projectors at all price ranges. This data enabled me to make an educated and informed decision on the eventual purchase of my projector.

Peter
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post #5 of 13 Old 05-12-2002, 01:00 AM
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Hi,

It's all business, no more, no less. As a educated end-user, we do what we want under the given rules. No need to worry. Things always work out itself...

regards,

Li On
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post #6 of 13 Old 05-14-2002, 08:43 AM
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i think many of us here in the "less than" forum could "afford" almost any projector we wanted. we just seem to be able to keep in touch with reality a little better.

steve
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post #7 of 13 Old 05-14-2002, 09:54 AM
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Wow, what a sad day. I came into work today, logged on and went straight to my favorite forum only to find out I am now considered a second class citizen. This was such an obvious kick to the stomach of AE-100 owners it's sickening. I love this forum and have been coming here for about two years(lost my old user name and password, duh)and I will still continue to come here. I respect and appreciate very much what David and Alan have done, I really do BUT as I read Alan's post's on the split I feel as though I have been "kicked out of their club" and insulted. You can say whatever you like but the fact is that is how most AE-100 owners "FEEL". Notice I used the word feel, because that is what this has boiled down to, feelings. The over $5000 guys got tired of hearing how all the new guys(not all newbies)were so excited about this new projector, complained and got what they wanted, PERIOD. Us AE-100 guys annoyed the "Big Boys" and they had us kicked out of their club house. Plain and simple. Want some examples? Here are a few that show their true feelings:

Posted by QQQ:
In BOLD letters; Praise God for the new budget projector forum.
Thank you!! Thank you! Thank you!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by JPinto:
Ummm...you didn't get rid of the AE100. It's a HT projector. It may be low on price but it's High End in performance!

Response to JPinto by David Bott:
Not on our Planet it's not. Thats why we have the $$$ values on the new forums.(Big Fat Grin)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by QQQ to JPinto:
I am not kidding you when I tell you that the only thought I had when I saw the new forum is I hope JPinto still visits.

Just dont bring your AE-100 with you when you come. (Big Fat Grin)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by JPinto:
Your ambiguous forum titles still lets the AE-100 in. List price is $4999.95 CDN....with taxes it's $5170.00, were still in with the Big Boys!

Response by QQQ:
David, Please up the price range to >$5170.00

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am honestly sad, I have been on the forum for about 2-3 hours now, just reading all the posts. Angry ones(usually AE owners or budget minded people)and all the happy posts(usually bigger budget people aka, the "Big Boys")and this is the first time I have posted a darn thing today. I just feel insulted. I have $8000 worth of pre/pro and amp's but because I chose to buy a certain type of projector I have been segregated.

If this was "truly" because of all the dealer spam then why weren't their posts just deleted? If some of the AE-100 posts were repetitive then why weren't they just deleted? I know I did put up a few posts such as"Well, DHL got me for the customs fee" etc and for that I apologize but damn.......this is just sad.

Well, I don't know if I made any sense what so ever, just my feelings on what has happened. If anything I think to separate the projectors by resolution would be much more wise and less insulting.

To David and Alan, I love your site. I will not leave(unless you throw me out kicking and bitching the whole way!!) but I think an injustice has been served. I'm sure this thread will soon be locked, as many others have but I just wanted to be able to speak my peace. I mean to offend no one, though I feel offended myself. Just my two pennies worth.........................

Regards,
John P.
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post #8 of 13 Old 05-14-2002, 10:34 AM
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"If a person an only afford to spend $2,500 on a projector...then they sould not be reading posts on a $10,000 unit or tweeking one."

The same av enthusiast who bought an el cheapo PJ may upgrade into the "high end" some day. Statements such as one above will unnecessarily be hurtful and thus may jeopardize future sales. I for one am reading all I can know about LCOS and they are generally above $5000. Just because I have an AE100, I should not be reading the above $5000 post is preposterous. For the record I do support the changes.I hope the admin here exercise a little bit of diplomacy and better choice of words. My 2 cents.
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post #9 of 13 Old 05-14-2002, 11:14 AM
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I have Sharp 9000 before, I sell it to my friend and I buy AE-100. I think this projector is the most cheapest HT projector and the most excellent result.

I will not spend US 5000 for Sharp 9000 when I can see movie for US 1500.

and IMO

It's not about balls, but It's about brain. :D :p
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post #10 of 13 Old 05-14-2002, 08:17 PM
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Hi Abit-id,

A $5000 Sharp 9000? Big deal! I'd a NEC XG85 CRT projector costs $20k brand new before I switched to the little wonder AE100.

You see, in business term, who's been hurt most? Just remember the history, in time, there will be only us remain!

regards,

Li On
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post #11 of 13 Old 05-15-2002, 03:27 AM
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I am slightly surpised at the response of some people here.

I can understand that it may be a bit annoying having to read through many posts that are not (in your opinion) related to your area of interest.

To split (and specialise) a forum as it becomes more and more popular is surely natural and nobody is banned from reading the other one anyway.

I guess peoples feelings got hurt (I don't know the history) and now there is a bit of bad blood.

If people think they are better/above the AE100 then that is their problem - be happy you are not so blinkered.

Justin
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post #12 of 13 Old 05-15-2002, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WXdude
Wow, what a sad day. I came into work today, logged on and went straight to my favorite forum only to find out I am now considered a second class citizen. This was such an obvious kick to the stomach of AE-100 owners it's sickening. I love this forum and have been coming here for about two years(lost my old user name and password, duh)and I will still continue to come here. I respect and appreciate very much what David and Alan have done, I really do BUT as I read Alan's post's on the split I feel as though I have been "kicked out of their club" and insulted. You can say whatever you like but the fact is that is how most AE-100 owners "FEEL". Notice I used the word feel, because that is what this has boiled down to, feelings. The over $5000 guys got tired of hearing how all the new guys(not all newbies)were so excited about this new projector, complained and got what they wanted, PERIOD. Us AE-100 guys annoyed the "Big Boys" and they had us kicked out of their club house. Plain and simple. Want some examples? Here are a few that show their true feelings:

Wxdude---

Not to rehash the old and start more arguments, but so you understand the interaction that you referred to above. In retrospect, I feel somewhat to blame for stoking the flames about the split particularly with reference to the AE100, where it was not my intention to cause dissention. Here is a bit of a perspective of the temporal nature of the discussions which is difficult to determine from the varied threads.

When the split happened, I was online and watched it unfold. The forum titles were different at that time and the split APPEARED to be (to me) based on:

HT forum vs. Business projector forum

(I'm using the term "business projector" as a opposed to "presentation projector" as milori clearly showed that all projectors make presentations, so they are all presentation projectors... but I digress)

I thought it was a misunderstanding based on the premise that the AE100 was not a "HT projector", when it clearly was for HT purposes and not business purposes. In my mind (the mind is a terrible thing :D) the AE100 should be included on the "HT forum" not on the "business forum". The exchange you quoted was real time and happened when the split occurred, at a time when the forums had different titles from what they possess now.

Altaman picked up on the disagreement of what the AE100's focus was and posted this thread "AE100 a HT or presentation projector" ( http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7&pagenumber=1)

Which was misinterpreted by some as an attempt to try to get the AE100 "back" into the other forum. But by then, the forum titles had changed to further clarify that the split was purely an MSRP thing, not a HT vs business thing.

However, I still wanted to understand the logic behind David & Alan's assertion that the AE100 not being a "real" HT in "their world".... not out of argumentation, but just to understand & learn how the pro's categorize projectors. "Why is the AE100 not real HT"? was my question, not "Why can't the AE100 be in the >$5k forum"?

Alan later posted: "I just spent sometime and did a search on the net to numerous sites and yes indeed the AE100 is a HT projector. If anyone else have their doubts I did a search to numerous sites and all of them market this unit as a HT projector. Also I found that even Panasonic does not support this unit in the presentation section. So yes indeed I stand corrected! This looks like a very nice projector."

So, it was a bit of turmoil, but the AVS guys are working hard to please the majority, but they cannot please everyone. I support the forum split and feel it's good for the value guys to not worry about the expensive Marantz& Runco, etc units. And the high end guys don't want to hear about the value solutions. It's a bit of a pain for those who own value PJ's now but are looking to upgrade in the future, but we'll live.

Moderators: A "Rant" board would be a great place to transfer threads like these! ;) Hint, hint!

- JP

- JP in TOronto
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post #13 of 13 Old 05-15-2002, 05:46 AM
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Hi JPinto,
I understand what your saying and maybe a split was necessary, but the way it was handled was insulting to AE owners. It is painfully obvious that the "high end guys" complained enough to finally get us thrown out of their "clubhouse". Plain and simple. I am not trying to rub salt in old wounds here, just calling a spade a spade is all. Lets be honest and face the facts. QQQ's post's show clearly how they felt and also reveals who one of the major complainers was. I think some of his and others posts are arrogant and triumphant. You can come to my house, just don't bring that little piece of cr@p projector.:rolleyes: It's funny, just prior to this split I had PM'ed QQQ because Alan had deleted one of his threads without even reading it because some member complained. I thought it was unjust and so did he. QQQ was upset, justifiably so, that his thread had been deleted just because a member complained about it. But we were split because "some members complained" and it's ok. Kind of double standards don't ya think??

I don't believe that you were fanning the flames any, there was just quite a few upset people on both sides. I didn't find out about the split until later than most so I still have a few ummm.......feelings you might say. If you notice their forum is cruising along smoothly while there are still "troubled waters" in ours but it is improving as we accept our fate.

Maybe a split will be good for us, who knows, all I'm saying is that I believe it could have been handled much more professionally. I did see a few members leave though, and that sucks!LOL. Maybe they will come back after cooling off, hopefully. I GREATLY appreciate what David and Alan have done here, I have gained so much from this forum(and it is their forum to do with as they please). Saved tons of $$ and made a few friends, so all is well. I'm sure we will all be just fine from the slap in the face and I hope lessons have been learned from it. I know I learned a few. OK, I will stop whining about it, it's over and done with. Thanks for your reply JP, talk to ya soon.

Regards,
John P.
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