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post #1 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 09:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey ya'll.
Before I start, I must say this forum is very active and informative. Great for newbies like me. Good job smile.gif
Oh yeah, and sorry for my English...

Recently, I've renovated my bedroom. I've decided to finally go big-screen, as I hardly watch any TV, and would like to have the full movie experience.
I tried searching the web for information, and found plenty of it. Thing is, I really don't understand anything in projectors, and am afraid of picking the wrong one. After looking in this forum, writing here is what's right for me.

So, I'm looking for a projector. Let me start you off with some facts.
1) My budget is around 1000$, including shipping. I'd rather get something good for around 600-800$. Also I live in Israel (in case it matters.. taxes, shipping prices etc) though I might have someone in the US get it for me.
2) My ceiling isn't straight, so I might need keystone fixing (did I get it right?)
3) Note that I plan on buying curtain for watching, so the room with be near 100% dark. Reminder: it's a bedroom.
4) The screen is in a narrow space - a wall. 190cm in height and 225 in weight.
5) The watching distance from the screen is - 725cm.
6) I plan on putting the projector on a fixed spot in the ceiling and connect a long HDMI to my PC (of course, from the ceiling to the wall and outside by the bed).
7) 1080P is a must. Also, I don't mind if it's DLP\LCD (mostly because I can't understand what different).
8) I'd like it to be able to play 3D movies, but it's not a must.


Shoot me recommendations smile.gif

If I missed anything of importance, I'll sure be glad to add it.

Honestly, considering paragraphs 4 and 5, should I even buy a projector? Isn't the screen too small for that distance?


I would also like a recommendation for ceiling-mounted pulldown screen. Got any?



Thanks a bunch. appreciate it,
John.
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post #2 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 10:06 AM
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3D movies, Optoma gt750 (easily in your budget), or a refurb Optoma hd33 (out of your budget).

Try this thread for other options:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1413827/need-advice-to-purchase-the-right-pj


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post #3 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 10:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks. I'll have a look.
I'd like other responses as well!

Could you answer:
Honestly, considering paragraphs 4 and 5, should I even buy a projector? Isn't the screen too small for that distance?
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post #4 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 10:25 AM
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If you are watching it from so far back (725cm, really?), that is 24 feet back...

Then NO on a projector setup, your wall is too small to have a large enough screen if you absolutely have to sit that far back. Although if you can get a new seating area closer up, then it is do-able.
Why so far back?


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

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post #5 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Will around 4 meters work?

How about epson 8350? Any good?

Also, refurbish isn't good, right? It means it was already broken!
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post #6 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 11:23 AM
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Yah 4 meters is ok, but the screen will still be a tad small, but it might appear big to you since you'll be new to projectors.
For a 92" screen, about 2 to 3 meters sitting distance would be optimal. You might be able to squeeze a 100" screen in that space, but it would most likely be too tight. Would depend on the frame or border of the screen.

You could definitely make your own DIY screen fit and still get a 100" screen. I would make the screen as big as possible for sure.

Refurb is ok as long as it comes with the original MFR warrranty. The 8350 would work well in your setup, it is good, but some projectors like a Mits hc4000 have a slightly better image, but they are more expensive.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

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post #7 of 41 Old 06-07-2012, 06:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank a lot.
I'd like other recommendations for my set-up.

Thanks!
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post #8 of 41 Old 07-20-2012, 07:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Sorry for bumping but,
is there anything new? Will Panasonic PT-AR100u be good for my setup?
I'm kinda afraid LCD won't be as sharp as DLP...

Also, how far from the screen (considering sizes written above) do I need to place the projector?
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post #9 of 41 Old 07-20-2012, 02:20 PM
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The ar-100u is about as flexible as they come. The ar100u is supposedly really sharp for an LCD projector, you might give it a go.
The Mits hc4000 has the better picture over it though in some ways, but I've never seen the ar100-u in person but I do know it doesn't have the best blacks.

In this buget, it seems like a good choice. The Epson 8350 would have better black for movies over the Panny ar100u, but it won't be nearly as bright.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
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post #10 of 41 Old 07-21-2012, 06:13 AM
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If you do lean toward the AR100U you may be better served by getting the overseas version, the PT-AR100EA, which comes with two plugs. Israel has a unique 230V (50 Hz) electrical plug so whatever your decision you will have to swap out the power cable for whatever U.S. market projector you buy.


All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Movies

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post #11 of 41 Old 07-21-2012, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Do I need a bright projector in a dark room?

Mr. G, that's no problem with adapters\different cables... What projector you think fits best for my bedroom?
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post #12 of 41 Old 07-22-2012, 02:25 AM
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Well, if you can get the Mits hc4000 to work it is the best for movies and gaming in this price range (it has no lens shift meaning you have to mount it centered to the screen and on a ceiling). The Mits doesn't have as much zoom as some projectors and no lens shift, so you may have trouble putting it in the right spot. Try my calculator and find out. Actually the Pro8200 is probably slightly better for gaming, but Mits win in movies so...

I would rank them like this (I've owned 2 of the below -- Pro8200 and Mits hc4000 -- and seen all the others EXCEPT never seen the ar100u, but read calibrator reports and art's review)

Best projectors for movies under $1500

1) Mits hc4000 DLP (I used to own it)
2) Optoma hd33 (better value for features than the Mits though, and has 3D, more expensive though)
3) Benq w1200 DLP (no good for gaming, too much lag, not quite as good of blacks)
4) Viewsonic Pro8200 and Optoma hd20 (these are basically a tie but have different strengths)
5) Epson 8350 (seen many) it could rank # 2 or # 3 and beat a Pro8200 potentially if you got one with good convergence and aren't sitting real close to the screen. The 8350 does have darker blacks than the Viewsonic, but to me it ranks lower because the pixels are a tad noticeable in some scenes on LCD when you sit very close as I do. Also, the 8350 is luck of the draw, and even though the VS doesn't have the sharpest image in this price range, it still does well and it is very consistent and beats most LCD's in sharpness unless you get lucky convergence. If I were ranking them for black levels, then the 8350 ties with the hc4000 for #1 spot, but I'm not ranking purely by black levels.
6) Panasonic ar100u (never seen it but from Art's review I can tell the blacks aren't that good). It could potentially beat the 8350 on all scenes but dark scenes, especially if the ar100u really does have better convergence than the Epson on average (and this is possible).

Note that you cannot really accurately rank projectors, because they have different strengths/weaknesses to each other and it depends what is most important to an individual buyer. The Mits hc4000 is my # 1 pick though if you can mount it in the right spot. In some cases the # 2 through # 6 units could all trade places with each other, but I feel the Mits hc4000 would remain untouched.

The Mits hc4000 has an image more comparable to $1500 projectors IMHO. It is a step ahead of the others, but that step does come with the 3 caveats I mentioned (not as placement flexible, not as bright, more potential RBE).

The reason the Mits wins is because not only does it have the darkest blacks, but I will also say that in the under $3000 category for projectors, nothing I've seen so far can produce as good of an image in bright scenes as the Mits hc4000 on an imperfect source like a cable channel or a movie with some image noise in it (like Netflix streaming). Believe it or not, it can easily beat my $3000 JVC on poorer sources or regular TV, but my JVC beats it in most reference level movies and majorly in dark scenes. Pretty much the Mits hc4000 beats every single freaking projector I've seen at poorer sources, not sure why. I can't really explain it, but the hc4000 leaves just the right amount of noise but maintains a sharper-like look in poorer sources. I am not talking about 480p though, all projectors stink at that, I'm talking Netflix 720p streaming, cable, and movies with too much noise in them, that is where the Mits really shines above the others (and it has slightly better blacks).


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #13 of 41 Old 07-22-2012, 02:45 AM
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Coderguy makes some good points. I do like the pro8200 because it would be 3 year warranty compared to 2 years for hc4000, and 799 for pro8200 vs 1100 for the hc4000. Both are good units. You were saying under 1,000 , seemed like you were concerned about price. And longer warranty is nice, both have longer than 1 year warranty's. I would look into all of coderguys options and then figure out the best for you. Maybe look in threads that have the models he was recommending. I like cheap and good with long warranty, for gaming and movies, so I picked up the pro8200 in dec for 650 which was on sale at newegg. So , who knows, maybe one of these models will go on sale, if it's the one you are interested in, get it then, I guess.

p.s. Coderguy did mention the Rainbow Effect, some people are bothered by it, some not. If you are not sure, that's a hard call for any of us to make. I know Coderguy has shared with us in the past , he is very prone to see the effect, so he decided to sell his hc4000 and he did get the pro8200, which he says doesn't bother him, or he says he rarely ever sees with the pro8200.
Unless you have ability to see for yourself these models in person, I'm thinking , maybe side with caution. Because who knows, maybe you are not bothered by Rainbow Effect but your friend sitting next to you is, or your wife, or Mom or Dad, in which case , they could develop a headache.

I would be interested in what Coderguy advises in this matter, it would be best to figure out if you are effected by Rainbow effect, but even then, who is to say, family member or friend is, I would think RAINBOW Effect should carry some importance if you are in "buy it and you are stuck with it", type deal. I didn't even know about rainbow effect when I was looking at PJ's, thank god I got the pro8200, which Coderguy said was very good for people that are sensitive to that because of extra color wheel segment. Something to think about, I guess.
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post #14 of 41 Old 07-22-2012, 03:12 AM
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If you can find an Optoma hd33 at a good price, that is another one to look at, and it has 3D. For overall value even though the hd33 costs a bit more, I would rank the Optoma hd33 # 1 in value since it has a 6x color wheel and has 3D. The problem with the hd33 is it probably doesn't have enough zoom to accommodate your placement issues.

The Pro8200 and Optoma hd33 have the least amount of RBE of all DLP's under $1500 for sure, but I can't really say I'd recommend skipping all the other choices just because of this potential issue. The chances of someone being bothered on a DLP like the hc4000 are still about 1 in 4 to 1 in 8, whereas on the Pro8200 it should be 1 in 10 or even less.

I can still see rainbows on the Pro8200 if I put in some VERY specific movies, but they are much much milder than they were on any of the other DLP's I've seen. Hence, even when I see them (which is less) they just don't stick out as much. To me the lack of RBE on the Pro8200 took it from # 3 and moved it to # 1, because I still prefer DLP over LCD so far, and other than the $1200+ Optoma hd33, there is nothing else that has such low RBE for a DLP.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #15 of 41 Old 07-27-2012, 08:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Again, thank you very much for the information!

After looking a bit on prices, I've noticed Viewsonic PRO8200 is significantly cheaper!
800$ instead of 1100+$ (for mits hc4000)!

I've even found a deal for that viewsonic that includes a free pull down Elite screen or screen and mount (which I might never really get, it won't fit the suitcase :P)
It's on B&H if someone wants it.


I think I'll go for the Viewsonic. should have a good picture. A few questions:
1) Is it good with sd as well?
2) Is it good for 720p/1080p gaming? any lag?
3) Is it bright enough for my room?
4) Will it mount properly? Does it have lens shift and a good enough zoom?


Thanks!
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post #16 of 41 Old 07-27-2012, 11:00 AM
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Try the calculator in my signature to see if you can mount it, none of the DLP's other than the Benq w6000 have lens shift. It should have enough zoom for most setups.
Fry's has a great deal on a Benq w6000 right now, only $1199!
That is a steal. Also www.consignia.ca has some refurbished Optoma hd8200's for around the same price. Maybe more than you want to spend, but an Optoma hd8200 would beat all these.

For the Viewsonic, there is no lag that I have seen in tests, it is generally under 20 ms which ranks it near the highest of all projectors for low lag.
It's a great gaming projector. It's the brightest of all the projectors in that list except the Panny ar100u is brighter. The VS is the second brightest overall in my lists.

All projectors pretty much stink at SD content, you need a good source for any image being blown up that size.
The Viewsonic does about as good as most do (Which isn't that good on SD).


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
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post #17 of 41 Old 07-27-2012, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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I wouldn't buy a 1200$ projector when I could get pretty much the same result with a 800$ one.
The pro8200 really looks like a great value for the money spent!

Got any a good deal for it (pro8200)?
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post #18 of 41 Old 07-27-2012, 01:00 PM
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Not sure where the good deals are on the Pro8200. I got mine for under $500 (a refurb), it now has 2000 hours on the lamp and its still brighter than some projectors are when they come out new!

Well overall the Benq w6000 is better than the Viewsonic, it is sharper and has an IRIS for darker blacks, it has lens shift for better placement flexibility. The Viewsonic does have slightly less gaming lag, the Benq has darker blacks. The Benq w6000 is one of the sharpest under $3000 projectors ever made.

The only reason I have a Pro8200 and not the Benq is due to my RBE sensitivity. The Benq used to be a $2500+ projector, so for that price it is a deal.

Benq beats the Mits hc4000 even for many people. Don't get me wrong the VS hangs well for the price, but there are better projectors for a little more.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #19 of 41 Old 07-27-2012, 02:23 PM
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Benq w6000 is only 1 year warranty. If it was 3 years I would say go for it, but I didn't know about rainbow effect on it.

How about this as an IDEA. We all went to movie theaters as kids and even as adults. Now in these movie theaters they had PJ's. If we judged those PJ's and screens the exact same way we judge our AT HOME personal PJ, wouldn't they suck, Big TIME. Terrible blacks, and lines on screen in front, terrible sound. But we really didn't notice, once the movie started , we settled in and GOT INTO THE MOVIE. If I'm on a small hdtv or big one or PJ, once I'm immersed in MOVIE, I'm not focused on the blacks or anything else.

Same with computer monitor, we had terrible screens a number of years ago, but if it got the job done, we didn't care, UNTIL people started talking, judging, making us fault find and nit pit, until we get out of the immersion to examine the place we are seeing it in.

Now movie theaters have gone through changes , 3D, IMAX, ect, to help in the IMMERSION process. And to sell higher price tickets. smile.gif

So when you first start watching something, it might take a minute to settle in, but once Immersed, unless the PJ really sucks, there are NO BLACKS and everything looks really burry, or hazy or not sharp at all, or you can't hear what people are saying, you are gonna be fine. Now if you or other people in ROOM are sensitive to Rainbow Effect, they could develop a headache or weird over-whelming feeling. it could be even be subconscious thing, and they could make the PJ watching a "special" event. If you are not bothered, you would watch stuff on it a lot. Again, I think many people could be bothered by this effect and after an hour or 2 , decide they want to watch stuff on regular hdtv or device as change. Something to throw into the equation in deciding what to buy. I think 1080p is a good feature because you are blowing the image up many times and are not sitting 40 feet away from screen but closer, so high def is nice, I have seen low def on home PJ's and it's just not that sharp looking.

So for me, when I bought last dec, 650 for pro8200 seemed like good deal. Also, in 3 years after my 3 year warranty expires I could buy a NEWER PJ or when the bulb pops after 6,000 hours on bulb, replace the bulb.

p.s. The Benq w6000 coderguy recommends does seem like great unit. So I guess weigh the pro's and con's and look at reviews and user reivews and check their forum room. You have to live in area where Fry's is located , sold out online. 1,100 dollars, maybe you could get a square trades extended warranty for 3 or more years just to protect yourself, hate to have 1,100 dollar device go south after 1 year. Also, check how much bulb replacement costs, and how many hours users are reporting on it before it POPS. And if any known problems. I don't know, myself.
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post #20 of 41 Old 03-12-2013, 05:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey guys.
So sadly, I haven't bought a projector yet... Been harsh times.

I'm back, with pretty much the same budget, and would like you to give me some new recommendations as I've seen nice new projectors.
Particularly caught my eye - Acer H6510BD and BenQ W1070

Are they good for my setup? Which is better and why?
Got any new/old recommendations?

Thanks!
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post #21 of 41 Old 03-19-2013, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Anyone?
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post #22 of 41 Old 03-19-2013, 09:20 PM
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Coder's top picks is a good place to get a quick comparison of pj's available in that price range. The Benq 1070 seems to be about the best pj in the $1000 price range atm. http://www.avsforum.com/t/1391476/coderguys-top-projector-picks If it would work in your desired setup, run the numbers on his calculator and see? http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com
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post #23 of 41 Old 03-19-2013, 09:41 PM
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Although my calculator gives good placement info, the lens shift is still a bit buggy, so don't trust the shift numbers. Actually it only bugs out on some projectors for lens shift, but the w1070 is one of them.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

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post #24 of 41 Old 03-30-2013, 05:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for answering guys.

I've bought the 1070w and it does have a great picture.

Few questions:
1) When I connect my PS3 to it, and set my PS3 to 3D, my pj information says "3D Mode: off". Any idea why?
2) I'm having some problems with the calculator. What Ceiling mount do I need for a 110-120 screen? 8 inches long? 14 inches long?
3) How can I give it an amateur calibration?
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post #25 of 41 Old 04-01-2013, 04:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Anyone?
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post #26 of 41 Old 04-01-2013, 05:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by just4u32 View Post

Thanks for answering guys.

I've bought the 1070w and it does have a great picture.

Few questions:
1) When I connect my PS3 to it, and set my PS3 to 3D, my pj information says "3D Mode: off". Any idea why?
2) I'm having some problems with the calculator. What Ceiling mount do I need for a 110-120 screen? 8 inches long? 14 inches long?
3) How can I give it an amateur calibration?
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post #27 of 41 Old 04-03-2013, 12:48 PM - Thread Starter
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post #28 of 41 Old 04-03-2013, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by zapper

When you insert the 3D into your player and the BenQ starts searching for the source get your remote and hit the 3D button on the remote and when you are on the 3D menu go to the second box and set it to frame packing and you should be OK, hope that this helps. Good Luck.


Try the above method and it should help you, good luck

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post #29 of 41 Old 04-04-2013, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zapper View Post

Originally Posted by zapper

When you insert the 3D into your player and the BenQ starts searching for the source get your remote and hit the 3D button on the remote and when you are on the 3D menu go to the second box and set it to frame packing and you should be OK, hope that this helps. Good Luck.


Try the above method and it should help you, good luck

I went and set 1080P @ 24hz on my PS3 and clicked the 3D button on my remote.
The menu did open, and I was able to choose Frame Packing, but right after that everything just came back to normal...
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post #30 of 41 Old 04-04-2013, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by just4u32 View Post

I went and set 1080P @ 24hz on my PS3 and clicked the 3D button on my remote.
The menu did open, and I was able to choose Frame Packing, but right after that everything just came back to normal...


You should had left the PS3 as is, I did not changed any settings on my PS3, question why did you change the setting it should have automatic accepted the 3D if you have been updating the PS3 firmware.

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