Epson 5020UB Owners Thread... - Page 40 - AVS Forum
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post #1171 of 1305 Old 01-19-2014, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by BizMarkie View Post

What's the different between 5020 and 5030 ??

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post #1172 of 1305 Old 01-19-2014, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post

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Thank you for the stupid answer
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post #1173 of 1305 Old 01-19-2014, 07:18 PM
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Well I just pulled the trigger on 5020ubr. So we will see how it goes.
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post #1174 of 1305 Old 01-19-2014, 08:40 PM
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The 5020 and 5030 are arguably similar. The 5030 has a higher contrast ratio and has a black and white mode. There are a few tweaks available in 3D mode on the 5030 that are not allowed on the 5020. Check out the review on Projector Central and get all the latest specs and differences between the two. I was thinking of replacing my 5020 with the 5030, but the advantages didn't justify the cost and the trouble of changing what I have.
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post #1175 of 1305 Old 01-19-2014, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by depalmat View Post

The 5020 and 5030 are arguably similar. The 5030 has a higher contrast ratio and has a black and white mode. There are a few tweaks available in 3D mode on the 5030 that are not allowed on the 5020. Check out the review on Projector Central and get all the latest specs and differences between the two. I was thinking of replacing my 5020 with the 5030, but the advantages didn't justify the cost and the trouble of changing what I have.

Thanks so much for your time.
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post #1176 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 05:37 AM
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Originally Posted by usace View Post

... Is there enough vertical shift on the projector to accommodate this?

I'm 95% sure the answer is yes, as I've not yet mounted it, but have it on a table about 10 inches below the very bottom of the screen, and I can shift it all the way up to fit.

Given you are on ceiling but flipped, that appears to be the same shift. At least I hope it is since I'm waiting on my mount and will be similarly placed.
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post #1177 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMoreE View Post

I'm 95% sure the answer is yes, as I've not yet mounted it, but have it on a table about 10 inches below the very bottom of the screen, and I can shift it all the way up to fit.

Given you are on ceiling but flipped, that appears to be the same shift. At least I hope it is since I'm waiting on my mount and will be similarly placed.

Thanks for the reply. That sounds like a similar amount of shift, just in the opposite direction. Well actually, it's in the same direction, if my projector is mounted upside down. Thanks again!
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post #1178 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 07:44 AM
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I've not found a suitable solution, and I find this to be a serious flaw in these Epson projectors. There are several in my family that use the theater and they cannot seem to consistently hold the remote toward the screen for 40 or so seconds until the green light on it goes out. I have an IR remote of course - one solution would be to get an RF remote that can translate to IR - that way the remote can be thrown in a seat yet its eventual command to change the input will still be received by the projector.
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Originally Posted by Steven in Balto View Post

I have a new 5030 and spent a good bit of the weekend setting up marcos on my older MX 500 remote and am experiencing the same problem. I set the remote to first power on the projector, then the receiver and its inputs, then the cable box or Blu Ray player, then a several second delay and back to the projector to change the source to either HDMI 1 or 2 depending upon which input I am using ( I can NOT switch HDMI through my older, but still serviceable Yamaha receiver). But, no matter how long a delay I program into the remote macro, the projector is always set at the last source input. I can't believe that Epson set the unit up so you have to wait for it to warm up before you can change the input. Has anyone figured out a solution to this issue?

Originally Posted by sroberts

Power on delay - how soon after I power up can I change the input? Harmony remote software says 30 seconds and it may be correct as setting it lower seems to cause the signal to be missed. But it does not make sense to me that the projector remains dumb to any input until the lamp warms up. Folks are getting confused because upon powerup to watch TV, they hear the TV but see the DVR menu until the waiting period is over.

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post #1179 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BizMarkie View Post

Thank you for the stupid answer

Now that we are name calling answers, let's talk about questions. Read any professional review on the 5030 and you will find a paragraph or two detailing the answer to your question. Besides a tweak to the iris which results in a better contrast spec, the biggest change was the addition of CFI to the 3D mode.
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post #1180 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sroberts View Post

I've not found a suitable solution, and I find this to be a serious flaw in these Epson projectors. There are several in my family that use the theater and they cannot seem to consistently hold the remote toward the screen for 40 or so seconds until the green light on it goes out. I have an IR remote of course - one solution would be to get an RF remote that can translate to IR - that way the remote can be thrown in a seat yet its eventual command to change the input will still be received by the projector.

On the back end, it also seems to also lock out for a few moments when you turn off any source feeding it so one would have to turn the PJ off first before turning off any remaining devices in the stream with a macro.

I haven't gotten around to programming a macro for my Harmony ONE so it is good to know I may have to figure some way 'round this this power up/power down delay.

It does take a while to sync-up or handshake so I am suspecting this is why the delay occurs.
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post #1181 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post

Now that we are name calling answers, let's talk about questions. Read any professional review on the 5030 and you will find a paragraph or two detailing the answer to your question. Besides a tweak to the iris which results in a better contrast spec, the biggest change was the addition of CFI to the 3D mode.

Thank you for answering
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post #1182 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 11:59 AM
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Just remembered that the 5030UB also has independent HDMI sources, so you can now have a split screen of (2) HDMI sources like blu-ray and cable/sat, whichis way cool!
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post #1183 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by depalmat View Post

Just remembered that the 5030UB also has independent HDMI sources, so you can now have a split screen of (2) HDMI sources like blu-ray and cable/sat, whichis way cool!

 

This one was a big bummer for me when I realized the 5020, despite having two HDMI inputs didn't have independent inputs so I couldn't do split-screen viewing with 2 HDMI sources.  I, just today, purchased an HDMI to VGA converter for that reason, but have yet to test it.  I'll report back when I do.  The original plan was to be able to have my PC on one screen and BluRay/TV/Netflix on the other side simultaneously.  I already have two HDMI cables run through the ceiling to the projector.  I just need to put the converter and VGA cable in place.

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post #1184 of 1305 Old 01-20-2014, 09:09 PM
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The HDMI to VGA converter works perfectly.  I can now split screen on my 5020 using 2 HDMI sources, sent to HDMI1 and VGA inputs on the projector:

 

1. From the AVR main HDMI out to HDMI 1 on the projector --  HDMI to HDMI

2. From my PC's video card HDMI out to the HDMI-VGA converter then from converter to the projector -- HDMI to VGA

 

It's one extra step vs the 5030, but still works just fine.

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post #1185 of 1305 Old 01-21-2014, 06:54 PM
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Hey all!
I have been loving my 5020 but have noticed a good accumulation of dust that seems to be on the inside of the lens. I can't seem to find anything in the owners manual about cleaning the inside of the lens.
Any suggestions on how to clean this up?

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post #1186 of 1305 Old 01-28-2014, 05:20 PM
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has anybody gotten the xbox one Kinect to turn their 5020 off? the 5020 is not in the list of Epson TVs in the xbox device menu. I tried the 3010 and a couple of others. the xbox will turn the projector on, along with my dtv receiver and AV receiver, when I say "xbox on," but will not turn the projector off. I saw this thread

http://forums.xbox.com/themes/groups/generic/forums/thread.aspx?ForumID=4269&ForumThreadID=1664048

which indicates the EMP745 (listed in the xbox menu) uses the same "codes" ("NEC-Format (Custom Code = 8355h)" as the 8530 (not listed in the xbox menu). unfortunately choosing the emp745 in the xbox menu doesn't work for me either. where might I find a list of projectors that use the same remote codes as my 5020, so I can choose one that's in the Xbox's list?
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post #1187 of 1305 Old 01-28-2014, 10:07 PM
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Has anyone tried the ValueView Sharp branded 3D glasses with the Epson? I know all of the ValueView brands should work, but I was just asking because on amazon the only seller that had a pair available through their "prime shipping" was Sharp branded. I want to pull the trigger on these but Im just a little gun shy
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post #1188 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 05:51 AM
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Is there anyone here who can sent me the firmware 1.03 software for the TW8100 / 5020UB projector? I'm still on 1.00 and i'm having hdmi issues with my ps4 and wii u, i believe the firmware fixes it. Epson europe won't sent me the firmware, they are very difficult people.
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post #1189 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 07:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theheadsn View Post

Has anyone tried the ValueView Sharp branded 3D glasses with the Epson? I know all of the ValueView brands should work, but I was just asking because on amazon the only seller that had a pair available through their "prime shipping" was Sharp branded. I want to pull the trigger on these but Im just a little gun shy

I did a review of these glasses. Check my posts for it.

I spoke with the owner of this company and he sent me free samples to test with my Epson 6020.
He mentioned that all their RF glasses have the same circuitry. They just market them to specific brands.
This being the case, if the Sharp glasses are listed as RF, then they should work.

Jeffrey

"Engineers aren't boring people, we just get excited over boring things".
--Anon.

 

 

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post #1190 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by BizMarkie View Post

What's the different between 5020 and 5030 ??

 

Totally aware of the impending release of the 5030/TW9200 I instead bought a new 5020UBE/TW9100W at the end of November 2013.

 

I did this after reading everything I could, over and over, regarding the potential differences.

 

The claimed improvements in the 5030/9200 were as follows but it semed that each came with an undermining qwerk, that for me couldn't justify the price difference between a brand new discounted (wireless) 5020/9100 @ £2219 and the new wireless 5030/9200 @ £2998.

 

That's a massive £779 difference in new unit price for the following improvements:

 

* Frame Interpolation in 3D

The qwerk here being that it only works for full-HD 3D.

So it doesn't work for side-by-side, over-and-under broadcast 3D formats.

 

Since getting the 5020/9100 I've discovered I don't particularly care for FI anyway (in 2D) and I don't notice any issues with action scenes in 3D.

(Although 5030/9200 owners have claimed this feature alone was worth upgrading a 5020/9100 for, I find that hard to chew!)

 

* Better contrast (600,000 :1 vs 320,000:1)

The qwerk here being that difference is achieved by making the auto-iris more aggressive in the 5030/9200 than it is in the 5020/9100.

The native ANSI contrast of the two units is supposedly the same and is good enough not to bother with the auto-iris on either model.

 

* Better optics

I read this somewhere but users who have had both units didn't seem to notice a difference and I never read any hard evidence that the optics had been upgraded in any way.

(I read the same claim when comparing the 5010/9000 with the 5020/9100)

 

* Black & White colour modes

I don't watch enough B&W to care.

(I'm not even sure this applies to the European 9200 version. We don't get THX colour modes on the European versions either!)

 

* Split-screen with 2 HDMI inputs

I don't care about this feature and the wireless version lets me preview 5 HDMI inputs at once anyway.

 

There were other deciding factors such as the wireless 5030/9200 not being in stock anywhere at the time.

And if I could've easily afforded 3k, I would've chosen the newer 5030/9200 just because it was the latest model but to be honest, even 2.2k was hard enough to justify with my wife and I think at that price I got an amazing bit of kit and I don't regret my choice between the two.

 

Especially now I realise I also want to buy a darbee and I could do with a better screen to go with it!

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post #1191 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by BMoreE View Post

That said, definitely avoid doing anything other than setting all 4 corners to the same setting for a panel - I had clearly visible distortion on uniform-color screens as the algorithm adjusts across the deltas. I thought it was my screen until I remembered that I had tweaked individual values along the same line that I was now seeing shadowed on my screen!

 

Yes, don't make the mistake I made by adjusting each corner for what was best for that corner, which is what the Epson instructions imply you should be doing.

 

I've spent two months being both impressed (particularly by the 3D) with my 5020/9100 but disappointed by a general lack of sharpness and clarity from it.

I was quite sure it was to do with bad panel alignment, as I could see text had an embossed kind of look and up close, the bad alignment was obvious (see before pic).

 

So much so that I was thinking of getting a replacement unit even after spending a couple of hours on LCD alignment.

Although text was improved and I got those yellow boxes on the alignment process looking pixel perfect in each corner, in doing so, I'd ended up with massive changes to both blue and red panels which ended up at different levels in each plane and every corner. Worse, following this process, the alignment in the middle of the screen was still off a bit.

These were the adjustments I ended up with following the on-screen instructions literally:

  RED                   BLUE

-3     4                 -2     0   

10    -1                20    10

 

0      8                0      10

14    4                15     10

 

Today after reading some of the crucial info in the 5010/9000 thread, I thought I'd give the 'all four corners the same' trick a go.

This is my before picture (without any alignment applied):

 

Ignore the focusing issues (as that is caused by my phone camera), I could see that red was around a whole pixel too high on the vertical. It seemed OK on the horizontal.

Blue was also the same, but also looked a touch higher than the red.

(Frustratingly this actually means the red and blue panels are aligned with each other and it is actually the green one which is out but you can't adjust that panel.)

 

So I went into the alignment process aiming to shift all four corners of red and blue one pixel down (using a value of 8 due to what I'd read on AVS posts).

It feels counter intuitive because as you do each corner, alignment issues remain on the test pattern, particularly around the corner you are actually setting.

 

It wasn't until I did all four corners that things 'magically' cleared up.

 

So I went from the wild set of adjustment figures above to a simple +8 vertical change in all four corners on both red and blue

This is my after picture:

 

Now it isn't perfect as blue is still approaching half a pixel too high but it is a massive improvement in sharpness and clarity over doing the adjustments the way you would expect to do them.

 

Thank you AVS posters! 

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post #1192 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 04:02 PM
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Bigly I'm glad that worked for you. Your alignment looks tremendous I think.
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post #1193 of 1305 Old 01-29-2014, 08:28 PM
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bigly...for a $2500 PJ, that is very very good alignment. Thanks for sharing your success!
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I must be guilty because people say I am guilty because they chose to call me guilty because they refuse to see the truth. Much easier to be part of the mob..
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post #1194 of 1305 Old 01-30-2014, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffreyJonesBSME View Post

I did a review of these glasses. Check my posts for it.

I spoke with the owner of this company and he sent me free samples to test with my Epson 6020.
He mentioned that all their RF glasses have the same circuitry. They just market them to specific brands.
This being the case, if the Sharp glasses are listed as RF, then they should work.

Jeffrey

Actually was lucky enough to read your review, probably the main reason why I decided on getting the valueview glasses. I think Im just paranoid about them not working, but I figured they would
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post #1195 of 1305 Old 01-30-2014, 08:13 PM
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I have read the magic trick you are talking about, but I will. I thought, though, that the corner adjust would just affect the corners. You are saying it adjusts the entire panel? How is that? You do the four corners and then it talks about adjusting the rest of the grid. Mine was never as far off as your picture, but I'm tempted to try this trick anyway...
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post #1196 of 1305 Old 01-31-2014, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theheadsn View Post

Actually was lucky enough to read your review, probably the main reason why I decided on getting the valueview glasses. I think Im just paranoid about them not working, but I figured they would

Let us know when your glasses arrive and if you like them.

"Engineers aren't boring people, we just get excited over boring things".
--Anon.

 

 

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post #1197 of 1305 Old 01-31-2014, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by domitron View Post

I have read the magic trick you are talking about, but I will. I thought, though, that the corner adjust would just affect the corners. You are saying it adjusts the entire panel? How is that? You do the four corners and then it talks about adjusting the rest of the grid. Mine was never as far off as your picture, but I'm tempted to try this trick anyway...

 

Adjusting the corners in LCD agnment adjusts every area of the panel to some degree.

You can see this because when you set values for all four corners, every intersection gets its own values automatically set.

 

That is why I think doing intersection adjustments is a bad idea (as is setting the corners by varying amounts in the same plane).

By doing so you are either adjusting another area of the screen (that you may have thought or adjusted to be correctt) or at best you are introducing areas where the scaling algorithm has to squeeze or expand the pixel structure more than in other areas of the screen.

 

That has got to create artifacts, similar to how using keystone correction does, but affecting red and/or blue colour resolution specifically.

This is a digital software based alignment and the panels themselves are not being moved.

Adjusting corners equally, particularly by an entire pixel, seems to simply shift the image by that amount.

Without complex potentially sub-pixel scaling work for the alignment algorithm to perform.

 

I nearly sent my unit back based on the bad physical alignment as I was quite sure it was worse than most people experience out-of-box (which you have confirmed).

 

But now I feel sort of lucky in the sense that mine seems to be out by an entire pixel in one plane, almost uniformly across the whole image, which is a condition the algorithm seems to handle best without introducing artefacts.

 

Suspecting how the algorithm works, I'd be more unhappy if I replaced it for a unit which was off by a sub-pixel amount, out on both horizontal and vertical planes or worse, if the missalignment was wildly uneven from one side of the plane to the other (i.e. if a panel was slightly angled).

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post #1198 of 1305 Old 02-01-2014, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigly View Post

Adjusting the corners in LCD agnment adjusts every area of the panel to some degree.
You can see this because when you set values for all four corners, every intersection gets its own values automatically set.

That is why I think doing intersection adjustments is a bad idea (as is setting the corners by varying amounts in the same plane).
By doing so you are either adjusting another area of the screen (that you may have thought or adjusted to be correctt) or at best you are introducing areas where the scaling algorithm has to squeeze or expand the pixel structure more than in other areas of the screen.

That has got to create artifacts, similar to how using keystone correction does, but affecting red and/or blue colour resolution specifically.
This is a digital software based alignment and the panels themselves are not being moved.
Adjusting corners equally, particularly by an entire pixel, seems to simply shift the image by that amount.
Without complex potentially sub-pixel scaling work for the alignment algorithm to perform.

I nearly sent my unit back based on the bad physical alignment as I was quite sure it was worse than most people experience out-of-box (which you have confirmed).

But now I feel sort of lucky in the sense that mine seems to be out by an entire pixel in one plane, almost uniformly across the whole image, which is a condition the algorithm seems to handle best without introducing artefacts.

Suspecting how the algorithm works, I'd be more unhappy if I replaced it for a unit which was off by a sub-pixel amount, out on both horizontal and vertical planes or worse, if the missalignment was wildly uneven from one side of the plane to the other (i.e. if a panel was slightly angled).

Bigly, thanks for this valuable information.

My 6010 currently has vertical fringing (very like your 'before' image), with blue and red (combining as purple) peeking over the top of text on the left side of the image, but on the far right side of the image, red is separating out horizontally to the left by at least one, possibly two, pixels. This leaves an annoying thin green line on the furthermost right border of the image. Based on your system of correction, can you suggest my best course of action to correct my particular situation, given that I apparently have misalignment in two planes?
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post #1199 of 1305 Old 02-02-2014, 03:43 AM
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Regarding alignment of the colors - I think I follow the theory of moving in increments of 8 (8 = 1 full pixel). However, with this method wouldn't you have to set each of the 4 corners the same? In other words the top left is adjusted 8 spots the the left, so you would apply the same 8 spots to the left in the other 3 corners, correct? What if the bottom right is fine as far as horizontal adjustment goes, but needs vertical adjustment only. I guess you just have to hope the same adjustment is needed universally and compromise some misalignment in some areas for better alignment in other areas.
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post #1200 of 1305 Old 02-02-2014, 03:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by musicalfox View Post


Bigly, thanks for this valuable information.

My 6010 currently has vertical fringing (very like your 'before' image), with blue and red (combining as purple) peeking over the top of text on the left side of the image, but on the far right side of the image, red is separating out horizontally to the left by at least one, possibly two, pixels. This leaves an annoying thin green line on the furthermost right border of the image. Based on your system of correction, can you suggest my best course of action to correct my particular situation, given that I apparently have misalignment in two planes?

 

As the alignment feature is software based and does not change the fact that the panels are physically out of line, that green line wont budge (as the red and blue panels don't have any pixels physically there to combine with the green).

It should only show in content with a strong green element in that row (e.g. white clouds).
I have one at the bottom of my image but it's rarely noticeable.
You can project it onto your black borders if it bothers too much.

For the symptoms you describe I'd first try moving the red panel to the right one pixel with a +8 on the horizontal in all four corners.
I suspect you will also benefit from moving the blue one the same (otherwise your unwanted green line would be more cyan).

Depending on how bad the vertical is, you may benefit from +8 vertical on one or both panels too.

But if it is only fringing and not approaching an entire pixel out, moving it down a whole pixel may just make it fringe the other side of the line, potentially more than it does without +8.

I think it was BMoreE who suggested good results with using a factor of 4 instead of 8 which will give you more scope to sort fringing closer to half a pixel misaligned but it has more chance of causing sub-pixel scaling artifacts.

With physical misalignment you are never going to get it aligned across the entire image with this shift without scaling method.
Even with alignment mine goes slightly out as you move away from the center.

In my opinion it is better to choose an alignment which betters as much of the middle of the image as possible.

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