Official Epson Problem Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 09:58 AM - Thread Starter
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As in the title what problems are you having with your Epson Projector:

Mine are:

The problem:

OK Have many checked the 2D to 3D converter system??

I find that I keep getting a left eye field that is warped, and bends along the lower 1/3 of the picture to the right.

I have a call into tech support about this.

I have seen it on all the 3020s I have had so far.

The answer from Epson:

"As for the warped 2D to 3D conversion in the left field, this is a normal artifact of the conversion process. We are taking a 2D image and giving it depth, in order to do this we are superimposing 1 image on top of another. the "warp" you are seeing is part of the second image that gives the 1st image depth. It is specification and nothing can be done to correct it. You may also see it on the right side or not at all, the artifact you are seeing may vary based on the content that is being converted to 3D.
As long as you do not see this artifact with Blu-Ray or Broadcast 3D the hardware is OK."

So a right field that is straight and warped left field is normal and OK??

That makes NO sense to me, two pictures left and right, yes, and a shift to make it look like 3D also OK but to distort the lower 1/3 of one field does not compute to me.


I was also concerned with lamp failure as mine failed within 3 weeks.

They replied:

"There are no known issue with the lamp or the life, this is the same lamp used in the PL HC 3010 and they are well over a year old now with a very low failure. Due to the nature of UHE lamp technology some lamps can fail prematurely."

I seem to have seen a few failures posted here, a higher number that just one or two.

I am starting this tread in responce to this post:


"Is there no way to set up a poll as a new thread?
Infact I'd like to see a poll for all the problems people have been experiencing with the 30,50,60, 10 & 20 line of projectors so we can see how many people are in fact having such problems and then link Epson to the poll. It's about time someone from Epson showed their face on here and answered some of the concerns directly."

Rich

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post #2 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 01:20 PM
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I have exactly the same problem with the 2d to 3d conversion on my 5010, so far my problems are as follows:

1. Weird 2d to 3d conversion effect

2. Constantly changing focus, happens when the projector is shut down then used again another time, even after the projector has warmed up I have seen the focus change after about an hours use and need to refocus. REALLY REALLY annoying. I have tried hanging the projector in a cage the right way up and still the same problem.
Also to add to this there seems to be problems with focus uniformity. Parts of the screen will be perfectly in focus and other parts not. Some parts are just not able to be focused pin sharp no matter what. So much for the Fujinon lense? frown.gif

3. Terrible convergence out of the box and as far as I'm concerned wholly unacceptable for any PJ. Took me hours using the alignment controls to get decent convergence only to have it thrown out when I flipped the projector the right way up. How can this be as it means things are moving inside that shouldn't, I.E. the lcd panels or prism?

4. Blanking sometimes when using windows. Depending on whats on the screen it will blank.

5. Colour uniformity problems, I.E. red tinge to the far left of the screen and a slight green tinge in the middle right.


Take note Epson - I have a 10 year old NEC projector that never gave me any of these problems save for a bit of colour uniformity. Sort your QC out please. Sending out so called refurbished projectors is not the answer. rolleyes.gif
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post #3 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 03:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for your input.

I would not mind a refurbished projector IF it was totally serviced, and have been super fine tuned and all repairs and upgrades done.

That would make it better than out of the box brand new.

So far I have had about five units, two 3010s and three 3020. So far all but one have flaws in sharpness, conversions and fuzzy green line, bad gray scale (reddest black and white) and other problems...

Lucky none of the ones you have had.

One odd one is how Epson will not hook up where three other projector makes would, a In Focus, and HP and a BenQ all would take a component to VGA connection, but Epson would not .

All three of the 3020s have had the 2D to 3D problems.

The best one was the number two of the 3020 and its lamp burned out with only three weeks on it and due to they being out of lamps I had to take it back for an exchange. (How does a company with no abnormal lamp failures run out of stock of replacement lamps?)

I am beginning to fear this level of quality is across the board with all projectors...

My 2 cents worth.

Rich

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post #4 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 08:45 PM
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@Racprops, The 2D to 3D conversion "issue" is not a defect. You don't like how it works. Epson has explained how their algorithm works to create simulated 3D content from 2D material, you don't like the algorithm, fine. Since all 3020's seem to do the same thing on 2D to 3D (mine included), I suggest you either live with it or return it. For me, the incredible 3D performance with 3D material is why I love mine, and I could care less about "simulating" 3D from 2D material. (Do you complain about simulated surround sound too? wink.gif )
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post #5 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Sorry but a warped and distorted lower part of the pictures seems wrong.

IF distortion IS a part of ALL OTHER 2D to 3D conversions then I would agree with you.

Then it would be considered the nature of the beast, just as I understand it not will work on every show or movie and sometimes better than others..(in fact that seems to be a part of the real 3D effects..as well....)

BUT if it is a flaw only the Epson's have then it is wrong.

I will bet it will be corrected in the next model offered after this one.

IF they are unwilling to fix it then I feel a rebate is due.

And yes I will complain anytime I am sold product that does not work correctly, and yes I am considering returning it and buying a different make and model.

Rich

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post #6 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 10:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

Sorry but a warped and distorted lower part of the pictures seems wrong.

IF distortion IS a part of ALL OTHER 2D to 3D conversions then I would agree with you.

Then it would be considered the nature of the beast, just as I understand it not will work on every show or movie and sometimes better than others..(in fact that seems to be a part of the real 3D effects..as well....)

BUT if it is a flaw only the Epson's have then it is wrong.

I will bet it will be corrected in the next model offered after this one.

IF they are unwilling to fix it then I feel a rebate is due.

And yes I will complain anytime I am sold product that does not work correctly, and yes I am considering returning it and buying a different make and model.

Rich

It seems like it is not your unit but common to all so if you can return it you should if you are not happy. Complaining might help for future models but it won't help you. If you don't mind DLP, and you want superior 2D-3D conversion, you would probably be much happier with a Mitsubishi HC8000.
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post #7 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 11:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leckian View Post

It seems like it is not your unit but common to all so if you can return it you should if you are not happy. Complaining might help for future models but it won't help you. If you don't mind DLP, and you want superior 2D-3D conversion, you would probably be much happier with a Mitsubishi HC8000.

2/3 the brightness, 1300 ANSI Lumens VS 2400 Lumens and $1000.00 more. $2,699.00 on eBay VS $1599.00.

Not best deal.

The BenQ W1070 might be the better deal, and forget the 2D to 3D converter or buy a aftermarket convertor, it there is any good ones.

Sad as I have seen a few TVs that do the 2D to 3D very well.

I kind of counted on Epson's projectors to equal those.

It cost nearly as much.

Rich

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post #8 of 63 Old 03-03-2013, 11:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Oh by the way companies DO make running changes during a product run, other wise we would not be talking about which version of a model is offered.

IT is possible they will make the correction and fix this flaw. IF this will be a model to be sold for longer than one year and one model production run.

I just want to be given a newer model IF: NO, WHEN they do make the repair/correction.

After all it IS what I paid for!!

Rich

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post #9 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 01:15 AM
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Just becauase every model has the same problem it doesn't mean its not a fault. Manufacturers very rarely admit to hardware faults. If manufacturers don't build hardware with faults then why would there be revisions in firmware? Because the original software was faulty. If that is the case then so it can be the same with hardware BUT that costs a lot more money to correct.
Its obvious Epson qc is severely lacking and that is the main problem here.
Threads like this can get things changed so rather than having a bash at the poster encourage the thread.
I'm sure if you were experiencing some of the problems here your view would be different.
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post #10 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 02:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashyt16 View Post

Just becauase every model has the same problem it doesn't mean its not a fault. Manufacturers very rarely admit to hardware faults. If manufacturers don't build hardware with faults then why would there be revisions in firmware? Because the original software was faulty. If that is the case then so it can be the same with hardware BUT that costs a lot more money to correct.
Its obvious Epson qc is severely lacking and that is the main problem here.
Threads like this can get things changed so rather than having a bash at the poster encourage the thread.
I'm sure if you were experiencing some of the problems here your view would be different.

Thanks.

That is what I am after, and my main point.

IF no one complains, then nothing will ever get fixed.

In this case we need a lot of complaints to move Epson to act.

I am not trying to tare Epson down, but to build them up.

I like almost every feature of the 3020, but at the same time it has a number of problems and this one really sticks out.

The 2D to 3D was one of the main selling points to move me up from a 3010 that was costing just under $1000.00 to the 3020 that costs $1600.00 ($600.00 MORE),

The improvements of the 3020 over the 3010 was the RF glasses and the more controllable main 3D,(A couple of more settings and refinement) AND THE 2D to 3D convertor.

In fact the RF glasses have a major flaw: as once the batteries fail, you have to buy new glasses, the IF glasses used replaceable batteries, and thus are the better long life deal.

I do not give a tick for 100 more Lumens. Both projectors are almost too bright already.

These few improvements are NOT worth $600.00 MORE with the 2D to 3D conversion NOT working.

Remove the 2D to 3D conversion and in my book you do not have a $1600.00 projector you have a $1000.00 projector. At best a $1200.00 projector for the RF glasses and perhaps a better real 3D system...but someday you will now be stuck buying new glasses when the batteries fail, so that is not as good as it should be, sooner or later rechargeable batteries fail.

Now add in the so called great replacement service: IF what they send out is worst that what you having problems with... if the replacement are just repaired and not refined, not specially tuned up and made as good as they can be, not even tested and working correctly, then letting them send you a replacement is a crap shoot.

I GOT a 3010 replacement send out and it was WORST that the one I already had. It had not been completely serviced and was not working right.

I plugged it in and took one look at a reddest gray scale and soft focus and packed it right up and sent it back.

Epson has to be told about these failings.

They are off to a good beginning, but there are major flaws in how things are being done both in production and with repairs/replacements.

They do seem better than the other companies in customer service...a great step in the right direction, now if only...they would go a little farther..

Make sure replacement units are as good or better that NIB, and correct a production flaw and take care of those that complain about it.

And tighten quality control.

There is too much different between each model sold, and again its a crap shoot if your getting a good one.

Rich

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post #11 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

2/3 the brightness, 1300 ANSI Lumens VS 2400 Lumens and $1000.00 more. $2,699.00 on eBay VS $1599.00.

Not best deal.

The BenQ W1070 might be the better deal, and forget the 2D to 3D converter or buy a aftermarket convertor, it there is any good ones.

Sad as I have seen a few TVs that do the 2D to 3D very well.

I kind of counted on Epson's projectors to equal those.

It cost nearly as much.

Rich
You are comparing apples and oranges. The W1070 is a cheap, throw-away, basically business style platform 5.8lb projector with horrible contrast ratio of 10,000 to 1. Plus it is a BenQ which has terrible reliability issues. The Mitsubishi is a quality brand, a true 12.6lb home theater projector with an impressive contrast ratio of 330,000 to 1. There would be absolutely no comparison in image quality. Mits have the confidence to offer a 3 year warranty while BenQ offers the minimum 1 year deal,
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post #12 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 07:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leckian View Post

You are comparing apples and oranges. The W1070 is a cheap, throw-away, basically business style platform 5.8lb projector with horrible contrast ratio of 10,000 to 1. Plus it is a BenQ which has terrible reliability issues. The Mitsubishi is a quality brand, a true 12.6lb home theater projector with an impressive contrast ratio of 330,000 to 1. There would be absolutely no comparison in image quality. Mits have the confidence to offer a 3 year warranty while BenQ offers the minimum 1 year deal,

Now if only I could afford it, but at $2700.00 I can't.

How well does their 2D to 3D conversion work?

Thanks for confirming what I felt with the lesser model of BenQ I have a for a couple of weeks. I felt it was a cheaper model.

It was one of the reasons I went with the Epson.

I have a Mitsubishi 53 inch DLP rear projector TV that is now 7 years old and has had a lamp replaced once.

And YES I agree they make great sets.

I pushed my limit buying the Epson...I cannot got another $1000.00 unless I win the Lotto.

So I am fighting to get what would make me very happy: a fully working Epson 3020 fixed.

Although I do wonder about Epson's reliability issues as well.

Perhaps you can answer that question as well?

And thanks for your feedback.

Rich

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post #13 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

Now if only I could afford it, but at $2700.00 I can't.

How well does their 2D to 3D conversion work?

Thanks for confirming what I felt with the lesser model of BenQ I have a for a couple of weeks. I felt it was a cheaper model.

It was one of the reasons I went with the Epson.

I have a Mitsubishi 53 inch DLP rear projector TV that is now 7 years old and has had a lamp replaced once.

And YES I agree they make great sets.

I pushed my limit buying the Epson...I cannot got another $1000.00 unless I win the Lotto.

So I am fighting to get what would make me very happy: a fully working Epson 3020 fixed.

Although I do wonder about Epson's reliability issues as well.

Perhaps you can answer that question as well?

And thanks for your feedback.

Rich

According to PC:
"...2D to 3D Conversion. The HC8000D-BL has a 2D to 3D conversion system that produces superb results. Usually, 2D to 3D conversion is something of an afterthought, and the resultant 3D picture is only marginally three-dimensional. On many projectors the trade-off of brightness and discomfort that you get from wearing 3D glasses makes 2D to 3D conversion not worth the hassle. However, on the HC8000D-BL, the results of 2D to 3D conversion are more dramatic and engaging than on competitive models. What you end up with is an actual 3D picture that is worthy of the name, and fans of 3D will definitely want to experiment with it using their favorite 2D movies...."

You can get the HC7900 which is very similar to the HC8000 for around 2K. The polarizers on the Epson can be a problem if you use the projector alot.
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post #14 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 08:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leckian View Post

According to PC:
"...2D to 3D Conversion. The HC8000D-BL has a 2D to 3D conversion system that produces superb results. Usually, 2D to 3D conversion is something of an afterthought, and the resultant 3D picture is only marginally three-dimensional. On many projectors the trade-off of brightness and discomfort that you get from wearing 3D glasses makes 2D to 3D conversion not worth the hassle. However, on the HC8000D-BL, the results of 2D to 3D conversion are more dramatic and engaging than on competitive models. What you end up with is an actual 3D picture that is worthy of the name, and fans of 3D will definitely want to experiment with it using their favorite 2D movies...."

You can get the HC7900 which is very similar to the HC8000 for around 2K. The polarizers on the Epson can be a problem if you use the projector alot.

No saving as you have to buy the glasses and emitter, project cost $500.00 MORE.

Shame Epson did not get the same chip.

What are the Polarizers?? And what is considered alot? Are you talking about the glasses?

Thanks.

Rich

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post #15 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

No saving as you have to buy the glasses and emitter, project cost $500.00 MORE.

What are the Polarizers?? And what is considered alot?

Thanks.

Rich
The 3D emitter is $99.99 and it will work with generic xPand 3D glasses which cost $40. The 3010 is a great deal...but you are not happy...so it is not a good deal for you. If you use your projector as a primary TV I think in about 2-3 years there could be problems with polarizers. Polarizer is like a filter. There are three, one each for each LCD panel. Each filter out all but the appropriate color for each LCD panel. For example blue polarizer filters out all but blue for the blue lcd, the same for the green and red lcd.
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post #16 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leckian View Post

The 3D emitter is $99.99 and it will work with generic xPand 3D glasses which cost $40. The 3010 is a great deal...but you are not happy...so it is not a good deal for you. If you use your projector as a primary TV I think in about 2-3 years there could be problems with polarizers. Polarizer is like a filter. There are three, one each for each LCD panel. Each filter out all but the appropriate color for each LCD panel. For example blue polarizer filters out all but blue for the blue lcd, the same for the green and red lcd.

I was not happy with the 3D images...and felt that they made so many changes and improvements that for 3D to have its best shot I will need the latest and best. I would need the 3020.
Add in the seemly real possibility the 2D to 3D (I have watch a few demos in the showroom of Fries and on a couple of sets with that feature...) would work fairly well I felt it was the only way to go.

And I still do.

That filter problem should also be true for LCD TVs as well.

Interesting.

Not very good life spans...I got 7 years and 5428 hours out of a HP DLP Projector and am hoping for something like that with this model.

In fact if not for a dim and color shifting lamp the HP is still running...

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post #17 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 11:04 AM - Thread Starter
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OK Epson is still stonewalling on this problem.

I am on record of complaining about this issue.

As they do admit they seemly plan on making the 3020 for a number of years there is a real possibility they will do a correction to fix this problem..

I have requested that IF that should happen I get an exchange unit with this correction.

That seems to be all I can do other that show them many are aware of this flaw.

Thanks for your help.

Rich

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post #18 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

OK Epson is still stonewalling on this problem.

I am on record of complaining about this issue.

As they do admit they seemly plan on making the 3020 for a number of years there is a real possibility they will do a correction to fix this problem..

I have requested that IF that should happen I get an exchange unit with this correction.

That seems to be all I can do other that show them many are aware of this flaw.

Thanks for your help.

Rich
Epson introduces new home theater projectors once a year...so around thanksgiving, 2013 the successor to the 3020 will be available.
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post #19 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 12:45 PM - Thread Starter
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OK I take then it will be called something else and not a 3020 model B?

Then I may not be in line for a upgrade.

Rich

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post #20 of 63 Old 03-04-2013, 10:16 PM
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OK I take then it will be called something else and not a 3020 model B?

Then I may not be in line for a upgrade.

Rich
Last year 3010
this year 3020
next model this November could be 3030?
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post #21 of 63 Old 03-05-2013, 01:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by leckian View Post

Last year 3010
this year 3020
next model this November could be 3030?

Sounds about right...

Rich

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post #22 of 63 Old 03-05-2013, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Well the problem is once a person gets things figured out, either by replacing the offending product or getting another brand, then they lose interest in posting about the problems.

So: so far we only have heard from a couple of people having problems.

Or there has been less problem that I have seen on other threads, like color blotches,.

Rich

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post #23 of 63 Old 03-05-2013, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by racprops View Post

The BenQ W1070 might be the better deal, and forget the 2D to 3D converter or buy a aftermarket convertor, if there is any good ones
what about using a current Oppo player? The Oppo BDP-103 or BDP-105? These unit's have built-in 2D to 3D conversion, not sure how they compare to other designs?

I'm using, both, the BDP-103 and BDP-105 models in two different systems, have'nt actually experiemented with the 2D to 3D yet though. I plan to order a 3020e very soon, this way I'll be able to experiment using either.
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post #24 of 63 Old 03-05-2013, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
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I already have a 3D blu-ray player...

Rich

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post #25 of 63 Old 03-06-2013, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
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I already have a 3D blu-ray player...
what I was getting at was that a number of current BD players, like the Oppo BDP-103 for example, contain on-board 2D-to-3D convertor's which would allow one to bypass the Epson 3020 2D-to-3D convertor, or compare performance.
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Thanks I did understand that..I have just bought a 3D Sony DVD and was asking for stand alone 2d to 3d.

BUT how well do the work??

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post #27 of 63 Old 03-06-2013, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racprops View Post

Thanks I did understand that..I have just bought a 3D Sony DVD and was asking for stand alone 2d to 3d.

BUT how well do the work??
I'm still waiting to find out, have'nt tested it yet, but I will soon. On the Oppo BDP-103 thread a few commented that the 2D-to-3D conversion was pretty good
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post #28 of 63 Old 03-06-2013, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Let me know how well it works.

Rich

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post #29 of 63 Old 03-07-2013, 06:22 PM
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I turn on my 6010 last week and got a error message called Cinema Filter Error. Please Contact Epson Support. I had to unplug the unit to get it working again. I just reached 400 hrs and I dread sending my projector to Epson being everything else works perfect and convergence is very good .

Well I received my replacement 6010 and there is several dust blobs and the convergence is horrible. I ended up with a second level tech and he was rude. Anyways they are sending out a third unit and I pray it is better than the last replacement.

Joe V.
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post #30 of 63 Old 03-07-2013, 07:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jwv651 View Post

I turn on my 6010 last week and got a error message called Cinema Filter Error. Please Contact Epson Support. I had to unplug the unit to get it working again. I just reached 400 hrs and I dread sending my projector to Epson being everything else works perfect and convergence is very good .

Well I received my replacement 6010 and there is several dust blobs and the convergence is horrible. I ended up with a second level tech and he was rude. Anyways they are sending out a third unit and I pray it is better than the last replacement.

Oh oh....I questioned the use of refurbished units..

Keep us informed.

Rich

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Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

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