The Official EPSON EH-TW550/750HD 3LCD 3D HOME CINEMA PROJECTOR Owners Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 44 Old 03-24-2013, 06:16 AM - Thread Starter
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The Epson EH-TW550 is a new(ish) entry level 720p projector that seems to be a successor of the EH-TW450. Main upgrade is that it supports 3D.

Not to be confused with the older EH-TW5500, which despite the similar model number, is quite a different model.

In North America, the equivalent model name appears to be the 750HD.

I've just ordered one. Should have it delivered in a couple of days.

The only detailed review I could find is this one:

http://www.techjailbreak.com/epson-eh-tw550-a-good-cheap-3d-projector-review-performance/

There's also this youtube review:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt1Gp0No6G8

and this promo (in German, but easy enough to understand):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQkwl3FXOEY

And this is an early "pre-review" of 750hd (by "pre-review" I mean the reviewer hasn't actually tested the machine, he's really just reporting the info released in the manufacturer's announcement):

http://www.projectorreviews.com/blog/2013/01/07/epson-introduces-the-home-cinema-750hd-at-ces/

SPECIFICATIONS

PRODUCT NAME Epson EH-TW550

PRODUCT CODE V11H499053

WHAT'S IN THE BOX
EH-TW550 Projector, Power Cable, Remote Control + Batteries, Soft Carry Case, User's Manual

TECHNOLOGY
Projection System RGB liquid crystal shutter projection system
LCD Panel 0.59-inch with MLA (D8)

OPTICAL
Zoom 1-1.2 (Optical Zoom)
Screen Size 33" to 318" [0.9 to 9.0 m] (Zoom: Wide)
33" to 317" [1.08 to 10.8 m] (Zoom: Tele)
Keystone Correction Vertical: -30 to +30 degrees
Horizontal: -30 to +30 degrees (slide bar)
Projection Distance 60" screen 1.68 - 2.02 m
Throw Ratio 1.30 (Zoom: Wide), 1.56 (Zoom: Tele)
Projection Lens F Number 1.58-1.72
Projection Lens Focal Length 16.9 mm-20.28 mm
Focus Method Manual

IMAGE
Colour Light Output 3,000 Lumens
White Light Output 3,000 Lumens
Resolution WXGA
Native Aspect Ratio 16:10
Contrast Ratio 5,000:1
Lamp Type 200 W UHE (E-TORL)
Colour Video Processing Full-colour (16.77 million colours)

CONNECTIVITY
Input: Video 1 x RCA (Yellow), 1 x S-Video
Input: Computer 1 x D-sub 15-pin (RGB)
Input: Digital 1 x HDMI
Input: USB 1 x USB A, 1 x USB B
Input: Audio 1 x RCA (Red and White)

ADVANCED FEATURES
USB Plug ’n Play Yes
PC Free Photo, Movie (Motion JPEG)
3D Formats Top-and-Bottom, Side-by-Side, Frame Packaging
Internal Speakers 2W
Direct Power On Yes
Security Yes
Colour Modes 2D: Dynamic, Living room, Cinema, Game
3D: 3D Dynamic, 3D Cinema

GENERAL
Dimensions D x W x H 243 x 325 x 77 mm
Weight 2.7 kg
Lamp Warranty 1yr or 750 Hrs - whichever comes first*
Projector Warranty 2 Years
Power Consumption: Lamp on 289W
Power Consumption: Standby 0.40W
Noise Level 36 dB

Anyway, this seems to be an interesting entry-level 3D model that hasn't been discussed much, so I thought I'd start the "official owners" thread for it, since I'll be a proud owner in a few days time.
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post #2 of 44 Old 03-25-2013, 06:03 AM - Thread Starter
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The only difference between the 750HD and the EH-TW550 is the color, AFAICT. The 750HD is white and the EH-TW550 is black.

750HD:

http://www.pcmag.com/image_popup/0,1871,s=1889&iid=362502,00.asp



EH-TW550:

http://www.techjailbreak.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Epson-EH-TW550-3D-projector.jpg

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post #3 of 44 Old 03-26-2013, 07:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Epson USA is actually now selling the 750HD direct for $799 (compared to the $899 price originally announced at CES in January):

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/jsp/Product.do?sku=V11H499020

Specs mentions that power consumption is 289W on normal mode (max 3000 lumens output), compared to 237W in ECO mode, but they don't reveal the max lumens output when in ECO mode. I don't know how to estimate lumen output from a lamp as a function of its power consumption -- I would assume it's quite non-linear, with light output efficiency dropping off as the wattage increases, so a conservative guess the value would still be >2500 lumens.

I'm curious because the ECO mode is almost certainly the mode I will running it in for almost all the time, but it seems this number is rarely if ever mentioned in the spec sheets. Probably makes for bad marketing (got to keep those lumens up there... rolleyes.gif)

As well as being kinder to the bulb (5000hrs vs 4000hrs nominal), and your power bill, of course, the ECO mode runs more quietly -- 29dB cf 36dB in normal mode. I notice that is a number they _do_ bother to mention!

Oh well, I'll be able to give a subjective impression of the light output in normal vs ECO mode once the unit is delivered
(scheduled for today).
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post #4 of 44 Old 03-27-2013, 07:08 AM
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Hi,

Thank you for starting this thread.

I was planning to get the Benq W1080st (and have read the thread as well here on this website.), but shipping would take a month or two as per amazon.com.

Benq w1080st is not yet available here locally in Singapore.

Then I came across the Epson tw550 - it's on promotion here at 1,499SGD (1,150USD) comes with free 3d glasses.

I was really sold with Benq W1080st based on the reviews but have yet to see a comprehensive review of the Epson TW550, except for the european videos from youtube and this thread.

Would really like to see some hands-on review of the TW550 on this thread. Thank you in advance!

Btw, based on my hours of researching on projectors, the only things I was able to comprehend were that the Benq W1080ST has DLP tech and 1080p vs Epson's TW550 has 3LCD and 720p. Not even sure if these two models are comparable.
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post #5 of 44 Old 03-27-2013, 04:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cbc8000 View Post

Btw, based on my hours of researching on projectors, the only things I was able to comprehend were that the Benq W1080ST has DLP tech and 1080p vs Epson's TW550 has 3LCD and 720p. Not even sure if these two models are comparable.

I had a quick look at a Benq w1080st review, and except for price, the two projectors really have quite different strengths and weaknesses.

At an entry level price point like this, you are going to get compromises somewhere, so it's just a matter of deciding what's important to you and what's not.

The main differentiating advantage of the Benq w1080st over much of its competition at this price is its extreme short throw projection capability (the "st" in the model name). This makes it very useful for people who might otherwise have trouble find a suitable spot to locate a projector in a smaller room, for example.

Placement of whatever projector you are going to get is a hugely important practical detail for many situations, so I'd look into this closely for whatever projectors you are considering. I went to some lengths to satisfy myself that the Epson EH-TW550 would work where I was intending to put it (on a coffee table about 8-9' from the screen, to project an a full size image onto an 80" wide screen). I was relieved to find that was all fine, and calculations lined up with reality. Phew! That would have made the purchase an instant return if that hadn't worked out.

After that, I was looking at 3LCD vs DLP. Personally, I decided to rule out any DLP projectors, particularly at the lower price points, because of the RBE (rainbow effect) and potentially greater noise. So that pretty much narrowed the field down to either an Epson or Panasonic for me.

Before deciding to go with the Epson EH-TW550/750HD, I was intending to go with the more expensive EH-TW3600/8350 model, but finally decided in favor of the cheaper EH-TW550/750HD instead, primarily for the lower total cost of ownership. Replacement bulbs are much cheaper, for whatever reason, and the initial outlay is lower too, of course.

The advantages the EH-TW3600/8350 has over the lower priced EH-TW550/750HD I decided weren't important to me. The difference between half HD and full HD resolution is not a big deal at all for me sitting at the the distance of 10-13' from 80" screen, for example. Color fidelity is much more important to me in a projector than a higher resolution past 720p. The higher contrast ratio offered by the more expensive unit was also unimportant, as my living room would always have a degree of ambient light even when all the lights are turned off in the evening. Anything more than the 5000:1 spec of the EH-TW550 would be pointless in my situation, at least from what I've read.

Finally, the EH-TW550 had 3D, which although probably I wouldn't use much for movies, I thought might be fun for gaming. The EH-TW550 also had a low lag gaming mode, so it was clearly aimed at the gaming market as well as the traditional home cinema market. So on balance, I decided the EH-TW550 would get the nod.

I've only had one afternoon to play with it so far, so I can't give anything like a comprehensive review. But so far, my impressions are positive. For movies on ordinary DVD, the picture looks great using HDMI input. I tried the analog inputs just to see what the difference in quality was like, and it was very noticeable. Frankly, I wouldn't consider using the SVGA or component inputs for movie watching.

Color/contrast was good, I particular liked the "dynamic" mode setting for movies. Very good and natural skin tones, realistic colors, vibrant but not unnatural or oversaturated at all. There's some further fiddling about with various settings available to further fine tune and calibrate, but I've just had a quick look at the "out of the box" settings. I may not bother fiddling with them further, as it already looks pretty good to me.

Noise level on ECO mode was acceptable. The brightness in ECO mode makes me think I'm unlikely ever to want to to put the projector into the increased brightness of normal mode. Given how bright this thing is, even a Super-ECO reduction mode might have been a good idea. I'm actually a bit concerned it may be too bright for comfortable for living room movie watching in the evening with the lights out -- we shall see.

Haven't tried out the 3D glasses yet.

Set-up was fine, but a little more fiddly than our last projector, which although older, had vertical and horizontal lens shifting, which made set-up a snap. With the EH-TW550, you've got to angle the projector using the height adjustable front leg, which is clunky by comparison. Oh well. Price points and compromises. Once set-up, it's all fine, so I guess I'll get used to it. The EH-TW550/750HD does have auto vertical keystone adjustment though, which works perfectly AFAICT, so can't complain there.

Anyway, so far so good, overall. The built-in 2W monaural speaker sounds dreadful, as you would expect, so bad in fact that I really don't know why they bothered including it. It would have been more flexible if they had provided audio output connectors on the back panel of the projector as well. As it is, only audio inputs, unfortunately. And given the only audio output is going to be the built-in speaker, not much point for those, IMHO.
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post #6 of 44 Old 03-28-2013, 05:27 AM
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I am a bugger for doing an eon of research before buying any gadgety widgety thing and this one after some deliberation against the QUMI Q5 (portability, low lumen, not inbuilt 3D), BENQ W703D (weak 3d image apparently), BENQ W1070 (full HD, £100 more). However the EH-TW550 is brighter so when its comes to 3D this is a bonus. Now its hard for me act too knowledgable as this is only my second projector BUT it is amazing, more amazing at the price. Put it this way I was watching 720P imax footage of the Grand Canyon at 9am this morning on the wall drinking me coffee before work..... in 3D!! thats how bright it is. I havent tested the gaming out yet but again this is one of the main reasons bought it as apparently this is super set up for gaming (which I would translate to near zero lag)

Tips > Click on, set up extra brightness for 3D.

Tips > You don't get 3D glasses with the unit. Ouch. These can be quite expensive £60+ and bulky. However after some deliberations and search I found these...
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B004QO3KGM/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
£17!!! great design so you don't look like a goon, lightweight, rechargeable via usb rather than battery like the other cheaper ones. And they work with this projector just one touch of the button. Work perfect. The have an auto on/off sensor as well.

Tip > If you have 3D MKVs you want to watch on your ps3 you will find many problems. Firstly the ps3 only picks up on fat32 file systems, that means thats what your external usb plugin drives for ps3 would have to be. The problem with fat32 is there is a limit on file transfer size (4 GB) and 3d 720/1080P files are BIG, bigger than that. After alot of fiddling I eventually got it to work. Alot of people suggest streaming from your pc/mac using playstation media server (http://www.ps3mediaserver.org/), this is fine most of the time but 3D files are very big and bandwidth hungry and end up stuttering. Instead of using the PMS to stream from your computer just use PMS to copy the file to the ps3 and play from PS3's own hard drive. (ie in the ps3 media bar click 'copy' instead of 'play')

I would thoroughly recommend this excellent projector (with them excellent 3d glasses ... bargain)
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post #7 of 44 Old 03-28-2013, 05:32 AM
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the other things for me was great keystone capabilities so that even in the corner of the room at an angle I can adjust the picture to look great on any wall....
Like a person above I was worried about throw distance. I have a small room. I thought maybe I needed a short throw. Not so, this puppy fills the whole damn wall nearly at prob about 4 meters. A short throw prob would have been too much for me but I get it all depends on where you want the projector in your room etc...

anyways, I'll stop gushing about this projector (and no I dont work for epson I am a graphic designer based in Nottingham, UK)
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post #8 of 44 Old 03-28-2013, 07:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

However after some deliberations and search I found these...

Great find! I didn't realise these glasses were non-proprietary. Lots of choices all of a sudden -- buying the Epson branded ones from Epson or resellers at the recommended retail price is prohibitively expensive, of course. Cheers for that!

And I'm glad you are liking your tw550. What 3d blu-ray player are you using, out of interest? Your ps3, or another player?
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post #9 of 44 Old 03-28-2013, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

I am a bugger for doing an eon of research before buying any gadgety widgety thing and this one after some deliberation against the QUMI Q5 (portability, low lumen, not inbuilt 3D), BENQ W703D (weak 3d image apparently), BENQ W1070 (full HD, £100 more). However the EH-TW550 is brighter so when its comes to 3D this is a bonus. Now its hard for me act too knowledgable as this is only my second projector BUT it is amazing, more amazing at the price. Put it this way I was watching 720P imax footage of the Grand Canyon at 9am this morning on the wall drinking me coffee before work..... in 3D!! thats how bright it is. I havent tested the gaming out yet but again this is one of the main reasons bought it as apparently this is super set up for gaming (which I would translate to near zero lag)

I too thought it would have very good input lag since it has a game mode. This proved not to be the case. I measured it (using the tool from tft.vanity.dk) to be 30-80ms, on average I`d say ~45ms. This was tested in game mode, with the projectors native resolution on my laptop to avoid scaling, and with functions like auto iris off, no keystone etc so that it wouldn`t have to use any processing power and thus increase the lag. The laptop was connected directly to the projector, and not through my receiver. My laptop which I used as a reference has some unknown input lag which must be added to the measured value as well. So did I miss something, or is there something wrong with my unit? I don`t know. We`ll know for sure when others start measuring input lags as well. I will be getting a new unit anyway since my has a convergence issue, and i will measure again when I receive it in a week or so. What I can tell you is that for me the input lag is absolutely noticeable. I`m no hard core gamer, I just play some casual FPS now and then. So I`m not going to claim the lag is going to affect my score as I think i will be able to compensate for it when I get used to it. That being said, the lag is in the upper limit of what I`m comfortable with before it starts feeling too "sluggish". I also have a mac mini for media center, and the mouse cursor movement is a bit delayed there as well. But nothing I can`t live with. It`s much better than the TW9000W, but not nearly as fast as my TW700.
Quote:
Tips > You don't get 3D glasses with the unit. Ouch. These can be quite expensive £60+ and bulky. However after some deliberations and search I found these...
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B004QO3KGM/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
£17!!! great design so you don't look like a goon, lightweight, rechargeable via usb rather than battery like the other cheaper ones. And they work with this projector just one touch of the button. Work perfect. The have an auto on/off sensor as well.

The 3d glasses you are linking to are 120Hz from what I can tell. The TW550 uses 240Hz glasses.
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post #10 of 44 Old 03-28-2013, 09:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

The 3d glasses you are linking to are 120Hz from what I can tell. The TW550 uses 240Hz glasses.

Not sure about the SSG-3300GR glasses, but the similarly priced SSG-4100 series

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-SSG-P41002-XC-Battery-Operated/dp/B007ITXYM2/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1364532689&sr=1-3

must be compatible with 240Hz 3D displays, as they are described by Samsung as compatible with their latest 240Hz 3D LCD and Plasma TVs.

Where did you get the info that the Epson is 240Hz? There are a few reports of the SSG-330GR glasses working well with other Epson 3D projectors.

A quick search and I can't find any reference to the 240Hz displays making older RF 3D standard glasses obsolete. Do you have any pointers?
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post #11 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by plugger2 View Post

Not sure about the SSG-3300GR glasses, but the similarly priced SSG-4100 series

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-SSG-P41002-XC-Battery-Operated/dp/B007ITXYM2/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1364532689&sr=1-3

must be compatible with 240Hz 3D displays, as they are described by Samsung as compatible with their latest 240Hz 3D LCD and Plasma TVs.

Where did you get the info that the Epson is 240Hz? There are a few reports of the SSG-330GR glasses working well with other Epson 3D projectors.

A quick search and I can't find any reference to the 240Hz displays making older RF 3D standard glasses obsolete. Do you have any pointers?

Its on the Epson TW-550 information web page: https://www.epson.co.uk/gb/en/viewcon/corporatesite/products/mainunits/specs/12166.
Also, if you check the specs of the Epson 3d glasses you will see they are 240/480 Hz.

I don`t know if the SSG-P4100 will work, but Epson follows the "Full HD 3D initiative" which should make it possible to use other 3D-glasses with their projectors.
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post #12 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 04:16 AM
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hahah well I have the SSG-3300GR glasses and they are working well sooo? smile.gif The SSG-4100 look a bit flimsy and use little round batteries, the 3300's got the ol usb charging. Anyways be good to hear how the other ones fare. The 3300 seem to a premium product which are now going for cheap wheres the 4100's just look they were always purposed for cheap mass production. Heck I dunno, both will prob work but I think the build quality of the 3300 is prob better? I have even popped back on and bought two more.

One problem after a days use though with the projector.... (and I am sure I will prob find a solution)... audio out? there isnt any?? there must be a solution? say for example on the PS3? is there anyway to out the audio direct from the ps3 by another output whilst it also pumping out down the HDMI cable? I thought there might be a headphone jack but couldnt spot one on the ps3. There is no way I bare to watch a film using that feeble speaker on the projector unit. Otherwise this could be a real problem. Whats the point in having a brilliant projector light output to produce a dramatic visual with such a un dramatic sound output, completely ruins the experience
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post #13 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 04:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

Its on the Epson TW-550 information web page: https://www.epson.co.uk/gb/en/viewcon/corporatesite/products/mainunits/specs/12166.

Fair enough, that what it says. I must admit I'm surprised that an entry level model like the tw550 can do 240Hz though!
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Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

Also, if you check the specs of the Epson 3d glasses you will see they are 240/480 Hz.

This surprises me less; the max shutter speed of the glasses just reflects the lcd being used, and they might well be using the same lcd used in glasses designed for the high end lcd and plasma TVs, just because that's what all the manufacturer's that use the "full hd 3d initiative" standards are using.
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Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

I don`t know if the SSG-P4100 will work, but Epson follows the "Full HD 3D initiative" which should make it possible to use other 3D-glasses with their projectors.

That's the thing: I had a look to see if anyone was describing a 1.0 standard at 120Hz and a 2.0 standard at 240Hz, or something like that. But nothing! There is just the "Full HD 3D/RF" logo, which is supposed to indicate that these glasses are suitable for these devices. No indication that 120Hz shutter frequency glasses would work less well or be in any way incompatible with 240Hz or higher displays. But clearly not all glasses have the same max. shutter frequency (some are definitely rated at 96-120Hz, while others are 96-240Hz). Hmmmm.... the mystery deepens.
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post #14 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 04:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

hahah well I have the SSG-3300GR glasses and they are working well sooo? smile.gif

It would be interesting to do an A B comparison with glasses with both the 120Hz and 240Hz shutter frequencies to see if there is any discernable PQ difference, but from what I've read there is no question that anything marked with the "Full HD 3D/RF" logo _should_ be compatible. It's an intriguing open question at this stage whether there really would/should be a difference in PQ. Quite a bit of googling after neeemo's original post and I found no discussion anywhere of this issue.
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Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

One problem after a days use though with the projector.... (and I am sure I will prob find a solution)... audio out? there isnt any?? there must be a solution? say for example on the PS3? is there anyway to out the audio direct from the ps3 by another output whilst it also pumping out down the HDMI cable? I thought there might be a headphone jack but couldnt spot one on the ps3. There is no way I bare to watch a film using that feeble speaker on the projector unit. Otherwise this could be a real problem. Whats the point in having a brilliant projector light output to produce a dramatic visual with such a un dramatic sound output, completely ruins the experience

Yes, I've encountered just this issue today. When I first set-up, I was using a DVD player that has old-school RCA analog audio outputs that I could connect to my amplifier, while connecting the TW550 via HDMI, but today a friend brought around a PS3 to try out with the projector, and no sound! (well, except from aforementioned feeble speaker.) frown.gif

The only solutions I can think of to this would be to

a) get an amp with a SPDIF audio interface, and connect the SPDIF output from the PS3 to the amp (unfortunately, my amp predates SPDIF!) Just need one of those "toslink" cables, I think, if your amp has a SPDIF input...

b) get a HDMI audio breakout box something like this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-HDMI-to-HDMI-Audio-RL-SPDIF-Support-5-1-7-1-HDMI-Conveters-Adapter-/271103332167?pt=US_Video_Cables_Adapters&hash=item3f1f048f47

I don't know how that will work, but I think I'll have to order one to try it.

Serious design limitation/oversight, IMHO! mad.gif

If anyone can think of a better or simpler solution, please chime in.

Edit: I've just gone and ordered one of these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Multi-AV-Video-RCA-Cable-Component-For-Sony-Playstation-PS3-High-Def-TV-LCD-HDTV-/350751532601?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51aa6ba639

It plugs into the "av multi" port on the back of the PS3, and provide analog output for component video and audio. I'll just use the analog audio to connect to my amp once I've got the cable. Saves buying a more expensive DA converter box of some description...
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post #15 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 04:44 AM
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I didn`t say it wouldn`t work. The projectors 3D frequency is a multiple of the glasses (twice as fast), so I`m guessing that while it works, you have only half the light throughput that you would using 240Hz glasses.

As for the SSG-4100(gb) I`ve been reading a bit now, and others are using it with Epsons x020-series with success. I assume they will work fine with the TW550 as well. I`ll be getting a few in a week or so, and will post the results here. Since i have the original Epson glasses I`ll do a comparison.
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post #16 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 05:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

I didn`t say it wouldn`t work. The projectors 3D frequency is a multiple of the glasses (twice as fast), so I`m guessing that while it works, you have only half the light throughput that you would using 240Hz glasses.

Actually, from what I was reading, the difference between 120Hz 3D and 240Hz 3D is not about getting twice the frame updates, you are still getting exactly 60fps for each eye in both cases.

The difference is that with 240Hz 3D glasses, you get an additional blank frame for each eye interleaved between the actual video frames, which is supposed to make for clearer 3D imaging. At least that's the theory I was reading. But what you are *not* getting is 120fps for each eye when the display is 240Hz.

Now, I'm not sure what a set of 3D glasses with a shutter frequency of 120Hz is going to be doing when faced with a 240Hz signal. Just drops the interleaved blank frames? Don't know. Or maybe glasses with a 120Mhz shutter frequency can actually keep up with 240Hz 3D refresh rates, since the rate for each eye is only 120Hz, even with the blank frame interleaving. Just couldn't nail this question down... maybe the 240Hz spec for shutter frequency only matters when going up to the 480Hz displays? (of which there are very few at the moment, but perhaps manufacturers are expecting them to be come more common.)

Anyway, I'll be taking the pragmatic approach: if it _looks_ good, it _is_ good.
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post #17 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by plugger2 View Post

Actually, from what I was reading, the difference between 120Hz 3D and 240Hz 3D is not about getting twice the frame updates, you are still getting exactly 60fps for each eye in both cases.

The difference is that with 240Hz 3D glasses, you get an additional blank frame for each eye interleaved between the actual video frames, which is supposed to make for clearer 3D imaging. At least that's the theory I was reading. But what you are *not* getting is 120fps for each eye when the display is 240Hz.

Now, I'm not sure what a set of 3D glasses with a shutter frequency of 120Hz is going to be doing when faced with a 240Hz signal. Just drops the interleaved blank frames? Don't know. Or maybe glasses with a 120Mhz shutter frequency can actually keep up with 240Hz 3D refresh rates, since the rate for each eye is only 120Hz, even with the blank frame interleaving. Just couldn't nail this question down... maybe the 240Hz spec for shutter frequency only matters when going up to the 480Hz displays? (of which there are very few at the moment, but perhaps manufacturers are expecting them to be come more common.)

Anyway, I'll be taking the pragmatic approach: if it _looks_ good, it _is_ good.

Here is a picture from epson explaining why higher frequency of the shutters provide more light throughput: http://www.epson.com.sg/resource/singapore/product/product_page/projector/3d_02.jpg. Allthough this example is for 480Hz vs 240Hz, the principle is valid for 240Hz vs 120Hz as well.
As you can see, with higher frequency the duty cycle increases, and thus increases the luminance.

For the low cost of the SSG-4100 (assuming they work with the TW550), i see no reason going for a set of 120Hz glasses, hoping that it will show what the projector is intended to show using 240Hz glasses.
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post #18 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 07:00 AM
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While searching for compatible 3d glasses, has anyone found any that makes it possible to use Dual Play on this projector? I`ve only found IR-glasses supporting this (as well as passive ones).
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post #19 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 04:30 PM
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thanks plugger2 re: the ps3 audio issue, i actually already have one of those cables but for reason assumed that if it was outputting hdmi it wouldnt also output through that, if it does your a goddamn genius and I will buy you a virtual beer. It's ridiculous as surely to include such a cheap adapter is a no brainer for people to output audio. Its a flaw on an otherwise amazing projector.. although from what I hear its problem alot of projectors have.

Regarding the 3D glasses, just as a thought process I could not fathom how they would let more light in, just because something is refreshing quicker surely it would have the same time being open and closed regardless but that diagram makes sense as the packet size ie quicker so they just reduced the black out time. Bit annoyed I have just purchased those extra two pairs from amazon. Think I will send them back and get the 240hz's just to compare smile.gif Be good to see a real scientific break down side by side factual comparision not from a company though.

Thanks for all the advise and input...

(are there any cheap 240hz glasses?)
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post #20 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 05:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

thanks plugger2 re: the ps3 audio issue, i actually already have one of those cables but for reason assumed that if it was outputting hdmi it wouldnt also output through that,

You won't know until you try it, but I would expect it to work fine. Certainly works fine for devices like the DVD player I've been using. Analog and digital outputs are available in parallel without any issues.
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Originally Posted by SeismikSi View Post

Regarding the 3D glasses, just as a thought process I could not fathom how they would let more light in, just because something is refreshing quicker surely it would have the same time being open and closed regardless but that diagram makes sense as the packet size ie quicker so they just reduced the black out time. Bit annoyed I have just purchased those extra two pairs from amazon. Think I will send them back and get the 240hz's just to compare smile.gif Be good to see a real scientific break down side by side factual comparision not from a company though.

Thanks for all the advise and input...

(are there any cheap 240hz glasses?)

The ssg-4100 are cheap, and they are 240Hz. If you do get both kinds, it will interesting to see if there is any noticeable difference in light transmission. The diagram neeemo linked to on the Epson site suggests there might be, but even that is a simplification of what's really going on -- e.g., it assumes instantaneous LCD transitions from full dark to full clear, which won't be the case in reality.

My guess is that the difference between 240Hz glasses and 120Hz in practice either will only be very slightly noticeable if doing a side by side A/B comparison, or not noticeable at all. Why do I say that? For the simple reason that of there was a noticeable difference, you'd be seeing "240Hz!" in large letters on the 240Hz glasses, and you'd see threads all over the place with people bemoaning the fact that they have to go and trade up their old 120Hz glasses for the new super duper 240Hz ones.

But in reality there is absolutely no discussion or comment whatsoever. The silence is deafening, in fact. But if you do go ahead and get some 240Hz glasses to directly compare with the 120Hz ones you've already got, I'll certainly be interested to hear your first hand impressions.
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post #21 of 44 Old 03-29-2013, 06:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neeemo View Post

While searching for compatible 3d glasses, has anyone found any that makes it possible to use Dual Play on this projector? I`ve only found IR-glasses supporting this (as well as passive ones).

These ones might do what you are looking for:

http://www.xpand.me/products/xpand-3d-glasses-lite-ir-rf/

By dual play, you mean two players look at the same screen, but instead of 3D, each sees the game in 2D, but from their perspective?

I think these glasses have a mode for that... you might have to download the .pdf user manual and have a read.

This is from the user manual:
Quote:
Set Glasses to Operate in Dual View Mode
With the selection of Dual View Mode, the XPAND 3D Glasses Lite can be used for
dual gaming. Dual View Mode can be used during normal 3D viewing as well to
disable 3D viewing for people that face an uncomfortable feeling when watching 3D.
When the 3D host is emitting the dual view signal, double click on button (1) to
change Dual View Mode between player 1 and player 2.
Not all 3D host devices support a dual view signal. When the 3D host is emitting a
normal 3D signal, double click on the button (1) to change between player 1, player
2 and normal 3D viewing mode.
When a double click is detected, the LED (2) will indicate the eyewear mode:
Player 1: One Quick Blink
Player 2: Two Quick Blinks
Normal 3D*: One Long Blink
*Accessible only if the 3D device is not emitting dual view signal

These glasses are a bit dearer than the others we've been discussing in this thread, at $60 when buying directly from Xpand.

Intriguingly, you can buy the X105BT model Xpand glasses that are OEM Mitsubishi, but may (or may not) have the same functionality. (They may may even be the exact same glasses!)

http://www.paulstv.com/3D-Accessories/Mitsubishi-X105BT.asp

$30 instead of $60 (also available on Amazon). I'm quite tempted myself to give these a go, but I can't find the detailed specs as are available on the Xpand site for their own branded glasses, so it's a bit of a pig in a poke.
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post #22 of 44 Old 04-02-2013, 11:22 PM
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I have just bought the Epson EH-TX550 and love it with one exception, I am not able to get a 3D image out of it!

Its hooked up to my PC with a HDMI cable and I am running a NVidia GTX 660 graphics card

I tried "Side by Side" , "above below" and Interlaced MKVs but when I hit the 3D button it Says...

"The Current input image/settings do not display in 3D"

I am running it in Landscape (Flipped) because I cant find a setting on the projector to invert image, but have turned it off for testing


Has anyone had any luck with 3D on a PC?
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post #23 of 44 Old 04-03-2013, 01:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by balro View Post

"The Current input image/settings do not display in 3D"

I was getting this message initially when trying to play a 3D blu-ray through a PS3 connected to the TW500 via HDMI.

In the end, I got it to work, using the the "auto" setting for the 3D format settings. The trick was to first sync the glasses to put the TW550 into 3D mode before trying to connect the PS3. Very counterintuitive, but that was required. I'd tried all the manual 3D settings without any luck. The 3D format it showed up as when it was finally working was "sequential frame packing", or somesuch (you can look at the "info" tab from the menu) which wasn't one of the manual setting options.

Very frustrating initially, but got there in the end. Sadly, the 3D movie ("Prometheus") wasn't worth watching after all that, but that's another story.
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post #24 of 44 Old 04-04-2013, 01:30 AM
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Thanks for the suggestion but both manual and auto don't seem to work

Starting to think this projector is a dud, just like Prometheus.....
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post #25 of 44 Old 04-04-2013, 03:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by balro View Post

Thanks for the suggestion but both manual and auto don't seem to work.

Did you see the "glasses are synced" message displayed on the screen?
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post #26 of 44 Old 04-04-2013, 04:36 PM
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Yes, it pops up on the screen, not sure how I do it, I seem to hold the Paring button and sometimes its quick and other times it takes a while, but a message does appear (75% Battery Life Nice feature)

I am playing side by side and above below with Windows media player and 3D Blu Rays with TotalMedia Theatre 6
Total Media has various output options and I change every setting I have in every combo I can but nothing frown.gif
I also try Stereoscopic Player with various formats and outputs but still nothing

Every article and review I read seems to have people plugging this projector into a PS3, am I the only guy who is plugging it into a PC ?

Not much info out there for this projector yet
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post #27 of 44 Old 04-04-2013, 08:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by balro View Post

Not much info out there for this projector yet

Yes, that's why I started this thread. It's really only been available for a few weeks now.

However, there are several other Epson PJs that have been around longer that appear to use the same or similar 3D tech, so it might be useful to look up a list of those, and start searching for threads or other tidbits of info regarding using those with a PC.

FWIW, I'd probably stick to auto mode for the time being on the Epson side, and start fiddling with settings on the PC side (refresh rates, resolutions, color depth, whatever else is configurable) and see if something gets recognised by the Epson.

One thing I found is that even once the glasses are synced (which seems necessary for the Epson to recognise a 3D signal on the HDMI input and do the apropriate handshaking), the glasses might go unsynced if the HDMI signal isn't recognised, and you have to go through pairing them again. I found I could tell when the glasses were actively synced by looking over at a fluorescent light... if the glasses were actively synced, the light would appear to be flashing quickly, otherwise it looked as it did normally.

Good luck. If you find an answer, perhaps post back here with your solution.
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post #28 of 44 Old 05-02-2013, 04:56 PM
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Please keep me informed w/info/tests of this projector as I'm interested in buying one. Thanks!
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post #29 of 44 Old 05-03-2013, 09:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rhythmnblue View Post

Please keep me informed w/info/tests of this projector as I'm interested in buying one. Thanks!

Not too much extra to say that hasn't been said in this thread already, i.e., apart from minor niggles with audio set-up etc. this unit works quite nicely once the set-up is sorted out. Nice and bright, clear and vibrant picture, fan not too loud (I keep it in eco mode almost all the time) and so on.

One of the things that did tip the scales for me when deciding which unit to purchase was the cost of replacement bulbs -- much cheaper on this model compared to, for example, the EH-TW3600/8350 model, as I mention post #5 in this thread. That can reduce the total cost of ownership significantly over the lifetime of the unit.
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post #30 of 44 Old 05-05-2013, 03:48 AM
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Hi everybody.

I'm having some hard time choosing between two projectors, Epson EH-TW550 or full HD EH-TW5900 that would cost me 300€ more.

When I watched this germanian review video of EH-TW550, guy went to the "Information" page in the menu and it said "Resolution: 1920x1080"? How is this possible when the projector is supposed to be only HD Ready 720p?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPmBT1bxjXo

I dont quite understand these things. If the native resolution is 1280x720, it can still play 1920x1080 somehow, non-native?

Another thing is that the TW5900 has 2000 lumens of color and white output, and this cheaper one got 3000 lumens of both. Does it make TW550 better?

Someone please educate me! smile.gif


Thanks.
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