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post #1 of 18 Old 06-28-2013, 06:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I'm just starting to try and learn about what I need for my backyard setup.

One thing I have yet to be able to understand is, if I am not looking for ultra high quality / High Def video, and just want a fun Backyard Movie experience, can I get a projector like:

PowerLite X12 XGA 3LCD Projector

It seems it would support 720P playback at 16:9 for movies, has HDMI, 2800 white / color Lumens....

I'm just confused as to if I can use projectors like that, that are being sold as "business projectors" for use in a home backyard theater where I don't need super ultra hi def stuff?

Set me straight please, thanks
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post #2 of 18 Old 06-28-2013, 08:04 PM
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No reason why you couldn't, if you'll be satisfied with the greyish blacks, and a little more noise at, 37.0 dB, if you need to run it in high mode.
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post #3 of 18 Old 06-28-2013, 09:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jnabq View Post

No reason why you couldn't, if you'll be satisfied with the greyish blacks, and a little more noise at, 37.0 dB, if you need to run it in high mode.

I don't mind an imperfect picture as long its watchable and decent. that seems to have plenty of Lumens to be usable outside with 2800 white and color right?
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post #4 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 12:08 AM
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I imagine it'll be tough to get really good blacks outside no matter what projector you use. I've been to many drive in movies, and they were never reference quality video.

so, for outdoor use only I would almost think a business projector would be an advantage. if you can't get deep blacks, you might as well get bright whites wink.gif

I show videos and movies on the data projectors at school all the time. they are absolutely watchable. I mean, would we even have lcd TV's if 'grey blacks' made a picture unwatchable tongue.gif

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post #5 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

I imagine it'll be tough to get really good blacks outside no matter what projector you use. I've been to many drive in movies, and they were never reference quality video.

so, for outdoor use only I would almost think a business projector would be an advantage. if you can't get deep blacks, you might as well get bright whites wink.gif

I show videos and movies on the data projectors at school all the time. they are absolutely watchable. I mean, would we even have lcd TV's if 'grey blacks' made a picture unwatchable tongue.gif

Thanks for replies guys.... That is at Walmart.com for $400, which is still almost 50 less then I can find any "home entertainment" model with 3d... which I would never use in my life.

I may try it and I can always take it back to Walmart if it sucks hard
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post #6 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 11:23 AM
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double check their return policy to make sure they'll take it back and then go for it man. only way to tell what you need is to try one and use it as a baseline. I mean even if you hate it, at least you'll know what you need to improve on(blacks, brighter, resolutions, etc)

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post #7 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Good call on checking the return policy. Walmart seems like you can return everything under the sun. And if I do a "free in store pickup" I don't lose out on any shipping costs if I return it.

Does anyone know if black out shade fabric is available in most fabric stores? Or is that mainly an online only purchase?
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post #8 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 06:21 PM
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Black out drapes are readily available at Walmart and Target.
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post #9 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 08:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, well went to Best Buy and was assured by the Geek member that they have no restock fee, so I purchased a:

EX5210 XGA 3LCD Projector

Which was in their "business projectors" section, for $550 (not on sale, crappy price... Epson.com has it for 50 cheaper, free shipping BTW)

I got it home and plugged it into my PS3, messed with zero settings, just plugged and played.... and the picture was astonishing!

It was in my kitchen with a White sheet draped over my cabinets with a skylight and two windows open and I could still see how great the picture was.





I know this picture doesn't do it justice, it was with my Iphone...

But I also took a video and it amazes me.... even with a crappy sheet out of the laundry and tons of Ambient light I could have watched the whole movie without even noticing.

remember, I just plugged it in and hit play, so Im sure settings could be changed to make it a better color etc, but I just wanted to see if a "business projector" with max resolution of 1024 x 768 could play movies good enough to watch once a week outside....

I'd say yes
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post #10 of 18 Old 06-29-2013, 08:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Wish I knew how to upload a video to here so I could show you how much ambient light there actually was and the video quality...
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post #11 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 04:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandmanusd View Post

Wish I knew how to upload a video to here so I could show you how much ambient light there actually was and the video quality...

No need, your enthusiasm for your projector is quite evident. wink.gif

I remember feeling the exact same way when I purchased my first LCD projector (Panasonic PT-L720U) back in 2003 for $3000. I thought the picture looked great and I was coming from having owned 3 different CRT-based projectors. The contrast ratio on the Panasonic was 400:1 with 2200 lumens.

No reason not to enjoy what you have especially given the price. Someday you will upgrade but you will always remember your first projector.

All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Movies

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post #12 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 06:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Its actually the exact opposite. Now that I know "business model" projectors with 1024 x 768 can play full 720 movies with insane quality, Im going to take this one back and buy a cheaper version, since I know its all just BS hype by the manufacturers over features I don't need for a once a week movie outside on the patio.

I guess I'm just old enough to remember Drive in movies with their one channel crappy sound coming from a tin box in your window and the mini mall in the background that had so much light you could barely see the screen, yet we still had the best time of our lives going there. Its the experience, not the "hi def" of it all. That is what I was looking for with a projector.

It was just really hard to see through all the hype on the boxes and web pages of these types of projectors. The manufacturers never once said "watch stunning HD movies" on their business projectors because they wanted you to fork over another $300 for their "bottom of the line" movie projector... when in fact you can use their business ones for just that and 99% of people couldn't tell the difference.

PS: I rotated this thing and put it on my wall, painted a semi gloss tan paint. which, according to my calculations, would have been roughly 200" picture and it was even more amazing. When I walked up next to the wall, I could see the pixels but it still was clear enough to watch, even at point blank range:



This confirmed one more thing for me, I don't need to fork over tons of money for a fancy projector screen when a brown wall or a 50 thread count cotton sheet worked well enough to watch movies with nobody the wiser.
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post #13 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 01:01 PM
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good work on your decision.

I wouldn't call it 'hype' as much as different expectations and needs. if you had that projector and a great home theatre projector side by side in a light controlled, blacked out room, the difference would be clear.

however at the same time, those two projectors in a dusk-lit backyard on a monster screen would probably be the opposite. the home theatre projector could be so dark you can't even see it!

I would also agree with your screen observation. in fact, in a lot of ways a bedsheet can be better than a cheap screen. I've got way more texture and 'sparklies' on my cheap electric screen than I had with a bedsheet. plus the bedsheet was 'acoustically transparent' haha. but it didn't roll up out of the way at the touch of a button, so... either way, I feel you either need to really up the quality of the projector and room(so that texture or hotspotting is more noticeable than pixel structure), or be trying to hide serious flaws(high gains etc) to justify an expensive screen. for example, my old projector looked mint on my cheap screen. my new projector shows all the flaws of my screen.

I would caution you not to go too cheap. money isn't always spent on performance. the reliability, build quality, install flexibility(lens shift, zoom, etc), and warranty also contribute to the price of a projector.

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post #14 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 01:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Of course I'm not suggesting the one I got was the best in the business I meant hype of one projector being labeled as "home theater 720p" by the company and you look at the specs and it has virtually identical specs to the business one $200 cheaper... They suck you in with terms and make you pay more so they can then charge proportionately more for the next step up in the home theater market...

Never once on the packaging or in the specs for any of the business model projectors do they mention being able to hook up a DVD player and watch a movie... Because they want you to think it can't be done on that model and make you pay $200 for the "home theater" version which is practically identical
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post #15 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandmanusd View Post

Of course I'm not suggesting the one I got was the best in the business I meant hype of one projector being labeled as "home theater 720p" by the company and you look at the specs and it has virtually identical specs to the business one $200 cheaper... They suck you in with terms and make you pay more so they can then charge proportionately more for the next step up in the home theater market...

Never once on the packaging or in the specs for any of the business model projectors do they mention being able to hook up a DVD player and watch a movie... Because they want you to think it can't be done on that model and make you pay $200 for the "home theater" version which is practically identical

I am sure they list all the input connectors.. in this day and age they don't need to tell you you can hook up a DVD player.. if you have the appropriate input connection (composite, component, HDMI) you can hook up ANY video input device and watch it. Unfortunately a 1024x768 native projector is not going to display 720p without scaling as you don't have 1280x720 pixels to display it on.. and a 3000 lumen business projector is not going to have a very good black level as it is not designed for HT, it is for multi media in a conference room.. can you watch it, SURE, is it what you want in a proper Home Theater, NOPE, but if what you have works for you, that is all that matters!
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post #16 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 02:20 PM
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Why didn't you just go for a 720p projector? You can get one for the same price you paid for that Epson, and 1080p for $200 more.
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post #17 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 04:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Well I got that projector at best buy because I wanted to try out the 1024x768 business projector first hand and they were the only store in town with anything actually in stock. The price I paid was garbage and the only 720p projector they had was 799....

I never planned on keeping it but needed a baseline to see if I needed a 720p or not... The Epson x12 xga is only 399 and nearly identical to the one I bought... So that is the one I would end up getting
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post #18 of 18 Old 06-30-2013, 06:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandmanusd View Post

Of course I'm not suggesting the one I got was the best in the business I meant hype of one projector being labeled as "home theater 720p" by the company and you look at the specs and it has virtually identical specs to the business one $200 cheaper... They suck you in with terms and make you pay more so they can then charge proportionately more for the next step up in the home theater market...

Never once on the packaging or in the specs for any of the business model projectors do they mention being able to hook up a DVD player and watch a movie... Because they want you to think it can't be done on that model and make you pay $200 for the "home theater" version which is practically identical

you may be right about some things, but I don't think they are playing that many tricks. they are marketing their products, and 'business' projectors don't advertise watching dvd's because businesses don't care about that as much as brightness, portability, bulb hours, etc. again, while the initial performance is probably very similar, that doesn't mean they didn't make meaningful changes between the business and home theatre models. the HT model might be quieter, have a 16:9 aspect instead of 16:10 aspect(or 4:3 in this case), maybe even stricter quality control.

all you need to do is look at the inputs to know what you can hook up to it. I've never seen that information 'hidden' before. by all means, if the savings are significant and the business projectors suit your needs, grab one and be happy. it's probably better if you just look at them as 'projectors' and base your decision on their specs, not their labels though. I certainly wouldn't assume buying a business projector would be a better bargain just because it's a business projector.

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