LG PF80G First world mini-projector full led 1080p - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 668 Old 11-11-2013, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by HTCrazy View Post

Depends on your definition. Around here a medium priced projector is considered to be $3K - $5K

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WTF $3K- $5K projectors are considered medium priced projectors... don't know if you've seen sesame street ... differences between much or little...$5000 is medium priced...
According to your opinion, around here PF80G is a very cheap projector... Wow in that case i am going to order a couple of them, It is a bargain cool.gif
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post #362 of 668 Old 11-11-2013, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HTCrazy View Post

Depends on your definition. Around here a medium priced projector is considered to be $3K - $5K. I'm guessing the PF85U plus OPPO 103D will get 90% of the way to the $3K projectors with their native processing. Subtract the $300 - $600 in bulb savings and you're down to $1200-$1500.

Add the fact that the OPPO will also make a big improvement in the audio and be usable on ANY display - and you'll have a very improved looking and sounding HT setup for (well) under $2K.

A ~$2-3k B-stock JVC is going to smoke a PG80G with any sort of video processing you want to shackle onto it.

I've never been that impressed with video processing, and you can do a whole lot of it on an HTPC.
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post #363 of 668 Old 11-11-2013, 09:41 PM
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It seems the price of the PF80G is starting to get higher, Amazon.de had it for 1349€ (1821,82$), but now it's up to 1500€ (2025,75$).

Considering it was announced to 1200$/€ to begin with it's quite shocking to find it climbing by 25% before it's fully released to the stores.

 

 

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post #364 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 02:51 AM
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 The price for the PF80G is still 1349 Euro in most german shops. Amazon isn't a good base to assess the price trend in the first few month after new releases.

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post #365 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 02:57 AM
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Originally Posted by t-n-o View Post

 The price for the PF80G is still 1349 Euro in most german shops. Amazon isn't a good base to assess the price trend in the first few month after new releases.

+++

http://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/4050026_-pf80g-lg-electronics.html
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post #366 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 04:11 AM
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Don't grumble in Germany than in Spain is worse ... is only available in a store and to 1729€ ($2315) ... Oh wait it´s a low priced proyector...is under $3K biggrin.gif


http://www.idealo.es/precios/4050026/lg-pf80g.html
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post #367 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 04:25 AM
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At least it's sold in your country, all the dealers who had it in Denmark has dropped it and LG has stated that it won't be sold in the nordic countries.

 

 

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post #368 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 04:36 AM
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Lol,

I still don't understand why they decide "NOT" to release it in certain countries?

LG PA70G was never officially released to Belgium.
On the PA80G i expect the same.

The issue is, for warranty it needs to ship back accross europe, and LG doesn't repair those things really, they just ignore problems (like with my PA70G i used to own).

I'm looking forward to see more reviews, if i see 90+% satisfaction on this product i'll buy it, else not, the PA70G has given me a headache.
I had a PJ for 2 months and i couldn't read website text. Now i'm still without a PJ frown.gif
I still hope this will be the one though, i don't mind if it's LG or not, but the service they provided was FAR below my epxectations.
LG sales reps even communicated to the store that they are not aware of any focus issues on the PJ...

/Lex
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post #369 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPS13 View Post

A ~$2-3k B-stock JVC is going to smoke a PG80G with any sort of video processing you want to shackle onto it.

I've never been that impressed with video processing, and you can do a whole lot of it on an HTPC.

A $2k JVC would smoke it for black levels - which is huge. But sharpness, color richness and pop would likely be in favor of the PG85U. All projectors have video processing and usually the more expensive the better. Often that's the big difference maker in picture quality as you go up the manufacturers line. To imply that video processing doesn't matter is a head scratcher but there's no doubt HTPCs can also do a great job of it. The OPPO is just one way to go.
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post #370 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lex View Post

Lol,

I'm looking forward to see more reviews, if i see 90+% satisfaction on this product i'll buy it, else not, the PA70G has given me a headache.
I had a PJ for 2 months and i couldn't read website text.
/Lex

The PA70G was NEVER a good.PJ for doing computer work because of its diamond pixels - tho quite fine for watching movies esp for the price. Getting an inexpensive PJ that does sharp enough text for computer work and also looks great for movies is a tall order. But I think the PA85u has gone away from the diamond pixels - so who knows?
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post #371 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 06:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPS13 View Post

A ~$2-3k B-stock JVC is going to smoke a PG80G with any sort of video processing you want to shackle onto it.

I've never been that impressed with video processing, and you can do a whole lot of it on an HTPC.
I don't think it would smoke it. I read on here when I was purchasing my pa70g projector that a guy did a side by side at a fry's store with projectors in the 2-4k range and the pa70g was just as nice as the others in a light controlled room. I purchased this based on that and the fact it has leds that last 30,000 and no bulb to purchase every couple of years. I have my pa70g hooked up to my directv and ps3 and it's a sharp and nice as any of my other TV's if you feed this projector a good/great source it will give you an excellent picture in a light controlled room. I have no focus issues on mine, I did have to have mine repaired as some video board or something went bad. anyway for $450 dollars I can't complain and if/when the 1080p version comes out and drops in price I will probably pick that up. here are a couple of pic's of mine.
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post #372 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HTCrazy View Post

A $2k JVC would smoke it for black levels - which is huge. But sharpness, color richness and pop would likely be in favor of the PG85U. All projectors have video processing and usually the more expensive the better. Often that's the big difference maker in picture quality as you go up the manufacturers line. To imply that video processing doesn't matter is a head scratcher but there's no doubt HTPCs can also do a great job of it. The OPPO is just one way to go.

You'd have to have a really bad JVC with major uniformity issues to have it get beaten by the PG85U/PF80G. The JVC's lens is MAGNITUDES better than the cheap tiny lens on the LG. There is no CA on the JVC, while the LG has shown it still has a decent amount of CA as a result of its small lens. "Pop" has to go to the JVC, which will do way more calibrated lumens than the LG (not to mention higher contrast ratio, which is usually what gives a lot of "pop" to an image). I might give you color saturation to the LG, but I think it'd be minor and overshadowed by the superior JVC.

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Originally Posted by thebigdaddye View Post

I don't think it would smoke it. I read on here when I was purchasing my pa70g projector that a guy did a side by side at a fry's store with projectors in the 2-4k range and the pa70g was just as nice as the others in a light controlled room. I purchased this based on that and the fact it has leds that last 30,000 and no bulb to purchase every couple of years. I have my pa70g hooked up to my directv and ps3 and it's a sharp and nice as any of my other TV's if you feed this projector a good/great source it will give you an excellent picture in a light controlled room. I have no focus issues on mine, I did have to have mine repaired as some video board or something went bad. anyway for $450 dollars I can't complain and if/when the 1080p version comes out and drops in price I will probably pick that up. here are a couple of pic's of mine.

You're kidding yourself if you think a PA70G is anywhere near a $2-4k projector. I've A and B'd my PA70G vs. a JVC HD-1. The JVC pretty much blows it away in every conceivable category, as you'd expect given it cost over 10x more.

I think the PA70G throws a pretty nice image for $400-450, but let's not delude ourselves into thinking it's besting projectors that cost 10x more than it.
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post #373 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 06:57 AM
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In a dark room, the pa70g can produce about as good an image as my 1080p bulb PJ. In a non dark room the 1080p bulb will crush the pa70g. What I mostly watch is tv shows /internet movies/ amazon/netflex stuff, not blu ray material, so, I don't notice the differences. Also everybodies perceptions are different. I used to go to movie theaters and didn't really "judge" the projectors or screens, mostly I got into the movie and whether the movie sucked or not, and if people around me were talking during the movie or not, or bubble gum was on floor and I was stepping on it or on the seat. smile.gif

So, in these rooms, some of us become "specialists" and examine the PJ, the screen, etc. But really, when I go to to other people's homes and watch a movie on their PJ, and the picture looked decent, I would "watch the movie" and not spend a lot of time judging the screen, etc. smile.gif

For PC use, my pa70g rocks. I set the fonts in foxfire to size that "makes" it look good. I always have the mindset of "how can I get this to look good", and then set about adjusting PJ position, screen, lighting in room, seating distance, graphic's in PC, font size, etc, until it looks "good". Then I focus on "news story", or "watching the movie/tv show". Then forget about it.

I thought 1080p mattered, but it doesn't for me at all, maybe in a few years when amazon/netflix/ you tube has true 1080p content it will matter. But by then 4k will be normal, and hardly any 4k content on internet. smile.gif
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post #374 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 07:07 AM
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as far as comparison I am only going off what the person who posted the info on this site in the pa70g forum. I myself have not done a side by side comparison with another projector (I do have a 51 plasma's and a 57inch crt tv to compare and my projector holds it's own vs those ). I also don't know what the other projectors were, but he did state that the LG was as nice as the other's . there are a lot of people that say 4k TV's blow away 1080p maybe if you stand 2-3 feet away. the jvc probably does blow away the lg, but it should if it is 10X the cost if not then if I was an owner I would be po'ed. all I know is I am very happy with my projector and every person I have had over is blown away at the picture. the key to a great picture is calibration and sending it excellent video feed which I am sure you know
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post #375 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigdaddye View Post

as far as comparison I am only going off what the person who posted the info on this site in the pa70g forum. I myself have not done a side by side comparison with another projector (I do have a 51 plasma's and a 57inch crt tv to compare and my projector holds it's own vs those ). I also don't know what the other projectors were, but he did state that the LG was as nice as the other's . there are a lot of people that say 4k TV's blow away 1080p maybe if you stand 2-3 feet away. the jvc probably does blow away the lg, but it should if it is 10X the cost if not then if I was an owner I would be po'ed. all I know is I am very happy with my projector and every person I have had over is blown away at the picture. the key to a great picture is calibration and sending it excellent video feed which I am sure you know

Yeah, I would hope a PJ that cost 10x as much would look better, right? smile.gif

For testing, I placed my hdtv 42 inch next to the pa70g, and adjusted the pa70g settings until it looked better than my hdtv. smile.gif
I played same scene from tv show or movie, second for second, and keep making adjustments, until the PJ POPed, and the hdtv didn't . wink.gif
Many of us did pick up the pa70g for 399 dollars a year ago, some of us were amazed that we could pick up 720p LED PJ for that price, even cheaper than 50-70 inch hdtv's. smile.gif
Hopefully the new pf80/85 will be at price point that justifies spending more on it. I want to see more side by side tests, and figure out if it's worth 3x the amount of the pa70g.
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post #376 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 07:43 AM
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The diamond pixels and CA don't bug you guys? I've gotten over it for the most part, but where I sit I just start to notice these things on some scenes.

I like my PA70G for what it is, but you guys are making it sound like it's punching WAY over its weight. Some of the comments are a bit out there with regards to what the projector can do IMO.


I'm potentially interested in the PF80/85 - depending on price and how the CA looks on production samples. A little bit more brightness would be nice for 2D, but I would really like to watch some 3D, and I'm afraid that's going to push me towards a bulb projector.
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post #377 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 08:16 AM
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Originally Posted by RPS13 View Post

The diamond pixels and CA don't bug you guys? I've gotten over it for the most part, but where I sit I just start to notice these things on some scenes.

I like my PA70G for what it is, but you guys are making it sound like it's punching WAY over its weight. Some of the comments are a bit out there with regards to what the projector can do IMO.


I'm potentially interested in the PF80/85 - depending on price and how the CA looks on production samples. A little bit more brightness would be nice for 2D, but I would really like to watch some 3D, and I'm afraid that's going to push me towards a bulb projector.

It comes down to "really explaining your setup".

Because you might have setup where your pj is ceiling mounted and you never told us that. Or you have 60 inch image on white wall. Or there is light in your room. Or your PC graphics card sucks. Or you are sitting 3 feet from screen. Etc.

Understand, I adjust everything until it looks good. If I have to sit 5 feet back, I sit 5 feet back, if I have to make the font size 20, I set it to 20. If I have to get the PJ 5 foot high, I put it on tripod and set up screen so it's set up perfectly flat, not one side closer then other side. I set graphics on PC and try different settings.

I don't know, did you try setting a hdtv next to PJ, and keep adjusting the settings on expert mode on PJ until the image was better than hdtv? Yes or NO. I did, and before I did that, all the calibrations I did sucked. After I did that, the pa70g was awesome.


I have read on this site, who someone had old PJ, and it was ceiling mounted, and got a new PJ, and thought the new PJ sucked. We advised him to change the ceiling mount location, and he said NO! He wanted something that could be placed in exact same location (ceiling mount) that will look good in that one spot. So he returned that PJ and got same brand PJ as his other model and spend more for not as good PJ. But it worked for him because it was in exact same ceiling mount.

So, understand, if you are fixated in doing it only ONE WAY, you either find something that works the "way you want", or you adjust your set up for the PJ that you bought.

Now, maybe the new LG pf80g will work for you, maybe not.
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post #378 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 08:37 AM
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I'm not really sure what you're ranting about - but my PA70G is installed correctly on a ceiling mount. The projector is level and square to the screen to within 0.1 degree, the projector is centered to within 1/16" etc. 110" 1.2 gain white screen.

I've run calibration disks on it, but usually deal with some color inaccuracy to boost up the lumens a bit.

That doesn't change the fact that the image interpolation for the diamond pixel DMD blurs images frequently, and the lens is pretty low budget with quite a bit of CA. The black levels are meh as well (as in average for the .45" 1280x800 DMD).

Don't get me wrong, it still looks "decent" given the price I paid, but my 720P 58" Panasonic plasma (top of the line 2006 model) blows it away for sharpness and contrast (as you'd expect). I don't really judge it against the plasma in those areas, but it's extremely noticeable. But I do judge it against what I feel a quality 1080P projector would provide and what I feel the PA70G is letting me down. I also realize there's a price difference with that performance difference (rightfully so), but that's the benchmark.


So in short, I know what I'm talking about, and I'm a little shocked that you guys are talking about your budget $400-450 projector slaying stuff extremely expensive and capable projectors, or saying you adjusted it until it "looks better" than your HDTV. I never said you can't calibrate a PA70G, but I don't care how much you calibrate it, you won't change the shortcomings of the projector inherent in the design.


Let's try to be objective here guys...
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post #379 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 08:49 AM
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Gee, we are all trying to be helpful here. Ok? Also, we are not all on the same page. ok? So unless people spell out where they are coming from , how are we to know.

I asked you to spell it out to us, is that unrealistic? I don't think so. So you are ceiling mounted. Well, I'm not saying this PJ will look as good as super high priced equipment. But it will look very good for the price point.

Now, if you for test purposes take it down from ceiling mount, and placed it on tripod and did what I suggested, then , you could see if it does look better that way. Either it does or it doesn't.

I'm not ranting at you. My rants usually have a lot of curse words in it, with angry mad.gif faces in it. Bro, you are trying to convey that for the price the pa70g is , it is a decent 720p LED PJ but has obvious shortcomings for you. And you are concerned that some of the guys here are making the pa70g out to be something that it isn't. Fair enough.

Also, you are in this thread to find out if the pf80g would be better PJ since it has square pixels and is 1080p. I'm interested in that too.
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post #380 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 08:56 AM
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Just to answer your question, I have a few hundred hours with the projector mounted upright, and a couple thousand with it ceiling mounted. No change in the displayed image (not sure why it would?).


I'm not mad or anything, and I'm a big LED projector fan like you guys, but I feel like some of the "hype" and "loyalty to the purchase" that's shown by some people on this forum really leads newer guys astray. I don't see anything wrong with talking about the projectors in an honest way, so that's all I'm getting after.
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post #381 of 668 Old 11-12-2013, 09:07 AM
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Just to answer your question, I have a few hundred hours with the projector mounted upright, and a couple thousand with it ceiling mounted. No change in the displayed image (not sure why it would?).


I'm not mad or anything, and I'm a big LED projector fan like you guys, but I feel like some of the "hype" and "loyalty to the purchase" that's shown by some people on this forum really leads newer guys astray. I don't see anything wrong with talking about the projectors in an honest way, so that's all I'm getting after.

We are cool. smile.gif
I think many of us might not have same experience with PJ's to do comparisions like some others.
I was able to compare my 1080p PJ and my hdtv's to the pa70g and thought it was pretty good and was a keeper. smile.gif
Some people on AVS are videophiles and some are just regular folk and just want to know the movie/game looks good or not.
I was not expecting much for 399 dollars last year, so obviously I was super happy with the pa70g. I don't think a 2,000-3,000 PJ would be in same class, but at the time I bought it, there was no other 720p LED PJ that was as cheap or as good as this pa70g. So I was doing apples to apples. Make sense.
In any case, maybe cut some of us some slack, and allow us to share our experience, and I really do want to read your experience and your comparisions, both are needed.
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post #382 of 668 Old 11-13-2013, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by worf at the french forum

Il est en route pour le WORF Laboratory / It is en route to the 'WORF Laboratory'

Seems that we get another test soon:D 

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post #383 of 668 Old 11-14-2013, 07:51 AM
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when will this projector be available in US?
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post #384 of 668 Old 11-14-2013, 08:08 PM
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A guy at LG told me they'll announce the availability on Black Friday. To check their website Nov 29th. We'll see.
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post #385 of 668 Old 11-18-2013, 01:02 AM
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Let me summarize a few things.

LG PF80G vs LG PA70G

Scale: full HD square pixels vs quasi HD diamond pixels ---> BIG PLUS! Definetly THE best advantage to the PA70G

Brightness: 700 vs 500 Lumens ---> not big but decent advantage to the PA70G (not worth the change for me)

Focus: according to a review of the first buyer on german amazon and some others here it has the same low quality lens and focus issue as the PA70G ---> No advantage here / again dafuq???!!!

Noise: Still very loud high pitched, small fans cause of the small formfactor so its only working on medium energy setting max ---> No advantage here

Connectivity: Widi and 1 more HDMI is a nice feature a lot of people like or need ---> decent advantage and logical step forward

Flexibility: Still no Zoom / Lens shift but ok since its for fixed home cinema / TV replacement anyway ---> No advantage here

LED dimming for max black / contrast: same attempt as on the SP F10M with the same mistake of bad implementation because of too slow pulsing so artifacts and colour problems occur and make it obsolete. So the blacks / contrast are the same as on the PA70G ---> no advantage here

3D : I don't care at all but some do and its not on board (I only care cause of the possibility to tweak such a device to run at 120hz in 2D) ---> disadvantage to the PA70G


The good thing is its a full hd LED (no laser) beamer and the only one that is on the market. The bad thing is it still has the same child diseases as the PA70G which im running at 120 hz for 2D and im not sure if it would work for the PF80G the same.

Because of the bad experience with LG and the reviews...and of course the ridiculous price for a still partially faulty product I stay away from this and wait for next year as I don't see the need to pay 2x the money I paid for the PA70G (650 Euro vs 1349 Euro) which I fixed the focus issue hardly. Its just not worth it. I see this thing as a mid step product waiting now for either a more quality brand like Epson / Panasonic / etc. or for LG to get his crap together in the future for a fully functioning and "worth the ridiculous pricetag" they demand.

Till then I let the enthusiasts here pay the development costs by pumping money for this product into LG for the later model I will maybe buy. The biggest No No for me is that the lens is still having focus issues that cant be fixed cause of the too small lens for the lightpath and I wont do a fix for that myself on such a heavy pricetag - that's laughable.
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post #386 of 668 Old 11-18-2013, 09:22 AM
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..and here is quick summary from someone who own multiple projectors.

LG PF80G vs Optoma ML500 + some Sony HW10 comments:

Scale: full HD square pixels vs quasi HD diamond pixels ---> the best advantage probably.

Brightness: 700 vs 400 Lumens ---> not big but decent advantage to the Optoma (not worth the change for me either)

Focus: Optoma ML500 has bit focus issue that it stabilizes after on sometime LG PF80G no focus issue. Still maybe its unfair vs optoma ie square vs non square but sharpness and focus is in another level.

Noise: Still very loud high pitched, small fans cause of the small form factor so its only working on medium or low energy setting max. Optoma was still bit louder even on eco than LG. Sony HW10 beats them both easily smile.gif

Connectivity: Widi and 1 more HDMI. I do not really see much advantage for my use.

Flexibility: Still no Zoom / Lens shift but "ok" since its for fixed home cinema / TV replacement anyway ---> No advantage here.

LED dimming for max black / contrast: Not usable
Contrast / max black: Probably panel contrast is better in LG. I do not have my old HW10 hooked up but i say LG is comparable.

3D : I don't care at all smile.gif

Sumamary: LG PF80G is 1st usable (can replace bulb projector easily) led projector for me. . Add Darbee processing and its great.
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post #387 of 668 Old 11-18-2013, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thomask1979 View Post


Focus: according to a review of the first buyer on german amazon and some others here it has the same low quality lens and focus issue as the PA70G ---> No advantage here / again dafuq???!!!

 

 

Actually it seems the problem can be fixed:

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJPAUL View Post

Guys i handled the focus issue wink.gif

My Focus wheel was only a little bit loose/slack (sry i dont know the english word for [german ("locker")]

I pushed the focus wheel a little bit against the PJ and than set the focus and BOOM everything is brilliant wink.gif

 

 

Razerian

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post #388 of 668 Old 11-18-2013, 07:43 PM
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Ok we're a couple weeks away from LG announcing US availability. Can anyone that already owns this give us an update on your impressions? Much appreciated!
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post #389 of 668 Old 11-19-2013, 04:45 AM
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If it's suppose to be released and made avalible on the 29th then we got 11 more days to go until black friday.
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post #390 of 668 Old 11-19-2013, 05:11 AM
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It wasn't absolutely clear that it would be available AND announced by the LG rep I spoke with - but it seemed that way. He said to check the LG website on the 29th for the 85U and click on some link that shows the dealers that ARE carrying it. He also didn't say for certain that it WOULD be available, just that he strongly expected it.

I'd love to hear back from some of the owners about their continuing experiences - good OR bad. Anyone?
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Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

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Lg Electronics Pa70g Micro Portable Led Projector , Lg Pa75u Dlp Home Theater Projector , Optoma Hd91 Full Led 1080p Projector
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