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Epson 5040UB ($2999) - e-Shift 4K, HDR10, WCG, Powered lens position memory

261K views 4K replies 332 participants last post by  Azekecse 
#1 ·
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...l-input-and-hdr-for-under-3000-300287574.html

NEW YORK, June 21, 2016 /PRNewswire/ -- (CE Week, Booth [URL=http://www.avsforum.com/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=116]#116 )[/URL] – Epson, the number-one projector manufacturer in the world, today announced two new Home Cinema projectors, including the world's first WirelessHD projector with 4K content support. The Home Cinema 5040UB and wireless Home Cinema 5040UBe feature 4K Enhancement Technology1 and are the first 3LCD projectors with 4K UHD signal input and high dynamic range (HDR) support. These newly designed Home Cinema projectors deliver 2,500 lumens of color brightness and 2,500 lumens of white brightness2 and an expansive color gamut to display the entire sRGB and DCI color spaces3. The projectors are engineered with up to 1,000,000:1 dynamic contrast ratio and display high dynamic range content, with eye-popping bright colors and deep, dramatic Ultra Blacks for a fully immersive large-screen experience.

"These new projectors are a breakthrough in projection technology, engineered to handle 4K UHD content for under $3,000," said Rodrigo Catalan, senior product manager, Projectors, Epson America. "With HDR support, it's easier than ever for consumers to enjoy the latest content with high dynamic range to create an amazing cinematic experience."

The Epson Home Cinema 5040UBe is the world's first WirelessHD projector and features 4K Enhancement Technology.


The Epson Home Cinema 5040UBe is the world's first WirelessHD projector and features 4K Enhancement Technology.
More About the Home Cinema 5040UBe and 5040UB
The Home Cinema 5040UBe and 5040UB with 4K Enhancement1 are compatible with HDMI® 2.0a and HDCP 2.2 standards for displaying 4K UHD content. The projectors automatically detect an encoded HDR signal and adjust the brightness levels to display highlights and detailed blacks. The projectors deliver an immersive, natural picture quality displaying the full sRGB color space, even in the brightest mode, as well as the entire DCI color gamut – the digital cinema standard – in Digital Cinema Mode. Both projectors include an enhanced optical engine and a new all-glass cinema lens engineered to deliver excellent sharpness and color uniformity with remarkable clarity across the entire screen.

The Home Cinema 5040UBe enables users to connect a range of entertainment devices using the included transmitter and wirelessly stream 4K, HDR and Full HD 1080p content with WirelessHD. The transmitter connects up to four HDMI devices simultaneously and supports 4K HDCP2.2 standards. It also includes one HDMI out connection and one optical port, with one HDMI port supporting MHL®4. Connect a receiver, Blu-Ray player, gaming console, or streaming devices Chromecast™, Roku®, Amazon Fire™ TV, and Apple TV® and switch between four HDMI devices simultaneously with Preview Mode. For a more immersive experience with sound, external speakers can be connected via the optical port (speakers not included).

Additional Home Cinema 5040UBe and 5040UB features include:

Powered Lens Position Memory – Preset up to 10 positions for zoom, focus and lens shift for both standard and wide cinema ratios
Installation Flexibility – Equipped with a wide range of lens shift capabilities, including a super-wide range of up to ± 96.3 percent on the vertical axis and ±47.1 percent on the horizontal axis
Image Enhancement Features – Super-resolution delivers defined edges and rich image quality, making content come alive; Detail Enhancement refines surface detail for true-to-life images; users can adjust levels of sharpness and detail enhancement
New Optical Engine – Non-inverting optical engine design utilizes an additional high-quality relay lens for Epson's best color field uniformity to date
Frame Interpolation5 – Generates multiple new frames between the originals, reducing motion blur and providing a smoother, theater-like experience
Auto Iris Technology – Adjusts the aperture to provide the optimum contrast and brightness for each scene
Centered Lens Design – Makes installation easy to plan and carry out with simpler lens-to-screen alignment
Color Brightness Specification – Brilliant image quality requires high color brightness; Epson projectors utilize 3LCD, 3-chip technology and offer up to 3x higher color brightness than leading competitive projectors6
Availability and Support
The Home Cinema 5040UBe (MSRP $3,299) and 5040UB (MSRP $2,999) will be available in August through authorized resellers. Each projector comes with Epson's industry leading service and support, including toll-free access to Epson's PrivateLine® priority technical support, and free two-business day exchange with Extra CareSM Home Service. The projectors include a two-year limited warranty (90 days on lamps). For more information, please visit www.epson.com/homeentertainment.

The new line of Epson home theater projectors will be on display and demoed at Epson's booth #116 at CE Week June 21-23.
 
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#415 ·
I don't think the price difference, at least in the US, is $1k. Dealers have to stick to Epson MSRP, but I don't think that is true for JVC?? I suspect the real delta is more like $700ish. The JVC does have a pretty big contrast advantage. OTOH, the Epson has several advantages too,

1) Cheaper bulbs
2) Much better warranty (Epson will just swap you units, you don't have to be without yours at all)
3) Lower price
4) Maybe closer to P3 color?? This is one place I've read where the RS400 falls down somewhat. I'm not 100% sure on this one.
5) Possibly lower input lag with the right settings at least. The 5030 has lower lag in some modes.

I think unless you have a good dedicated theater room (dark colors), the 5040 is probably the better deal. OTOH if you have a fully darkened room, the RS400 would be more tempting.
 
#419 ·
#445 ·
#471 ·
I will take that bet. :)
 
#458 ·
What are the benefits in DCI P3 colors compared to rec709 in my current avengers, bourne, star trek material? Is it something you can see clearly without side by side comparison unlike most of the features in projectors these days?


I have to say, I was hoping more from this projector especially contrast wise because most of these features for me are completely useless when I'm strictly viewing 2D material.

- The lumen output nice upgrade, but completely useless when I already get eye torching brightness with new lamp. I't already annoying when scenes switch from dark to bright, so this +50% more brightness is completely useless personally. I have vpl-hw50es.
- Lens memory is useless when having only 1 16:9 screen
- Motorized zoom, same as above + I'm not some fat dude who can't get up from the couch
- Iris still seems to be some budget hack and not proper one like competition


The only really upgrade to my current situation would be the e-shift and I'm genuinely interested in it especially if it's as good as in JVC. Sony has native 4k but when JVC faux 4k is sharper than sony true 4k, I don't see why would you need to have real 4k when you can have better image but cheaper?


Don't get me wrong, not trying to downplay this projector, I'm sure it will be the best bang for buck in it's class, but just trying to figure out should I switch or not. The best scenario for me would be that JVC would lower the price 1000€ and then I would probably buy that. One can only hope. :rolleyes:
 
#460 ·
What are the benefits in DCI P3 colors compared to rec709 in my current avengers, bourne, star trek material? Is it something you can see clearly without side by side comparison unlike most of the features in projectors these days?
Not much unless you can get something to convert 1080 REC709 to UHD with P3. It does add some extra saturation but as you say, you may not realise the differences unless you do a side by side, and then you may want to upgrade. But if you're more than happy with what you have, you don't need to upgrade yet - the longer you leave it, the better the projectors will get and the cheaper they will become, so your current thinking is probably for the best :)

- The lumen output nice upgrade, but completely useless when I already get eye torching brightness with new lamp.

I't already annoying when scenes switch from dark to bright, so this +50% more brightness is completely useless personally. I have vpl-hw50es
I agree. Better blacks and contrast are nice, but too bright an image is a negative IMHO. If you have that, I would always suggest using a filter, like a simple ND (2 or 4, depending on your set up), or a colour correction filter with calibration for better contrast and black levels while reducing the white level down to a more acceptable level. You can always remove the filter when the lamp dims and gets to a point where you need some image brightness back. An ND2 isn't expensive and can make a big difference on some screen sizes. With the Sony 40, a 106" diag 16:9 screen benefited nicely IMHO. Yours might too by the sounds of things.

- Lens memory is useless when having only 1 16:9 screen
- Motorized zoom, same as above + I'm not some fat dude who can't get up from the couch
Some people run a 2.35 screen CIH configuration so that feature is extremely useful.

- Iris still seems to be some budget hack and not proper one like competition
Yeah, could be better but seemed to work reasonably well with the content I saw. Sony's is better.

The only really upgrade to my current situation would be the e-shift and I'm genuinely interested in it especially if it's as good as in JVC. Sony has native 4k but when JVC faux 4k is sharper than sony true 4k, I don't see why would you need to have real 4k when you can have better image but cheaper?
I wouldn't say it was better than the Sony for UHD (even with the Epsn glass lens vs Sony's with a plastic element) but it's close enough for a lot of people, making the cost for a 4K Sony seem extravagant.

Don't get me wrong, not trying to downplay this projector, I'm sure it will be the best bang for buck in it's class, but just trying to figure out should I switch or not. The best scenario for me would be that JVC would lower the price 1000€ and then I would probably buy that. One can only hope. :rolleyes:
I wish they would do that too :D

But for some, the UHD support is worth the cost if you want to watch UHD BD stuff now, rather than wait. I think with these models, Sony 1080 models have some real competition.
 
#464 ·
The previous person who had the 9300 we saw tried that from the menu without physically inverting the projector, and didn't notice any change in fan noise. Maybe that's because the new chassis design has an air flow that works well inverted or not, so doesn't require a change in fan speed. Just a guess of course.
 
#466 · (Edited)
The JVCs eshift was marginally better, but you really need to look hard to see it. When up close and doing that you see bigger differences in panel alignment.

One paused image we used was from TDK and looking at the tyre wall markings from the upturned truck because although we were running split screen, the tyre was on both screens and we could compare directly the exact same part of the image.
 
#477 ·
I am also looking at this Unit, looking to enter 4k. I have a JVC x30 now and love it! awesome unit, even with the bulb issues I still love it, But for video games it sucks, and the bulb issues are annoying.
Epson was never a option with no motorized shift, I do a zoomed 2:35 setup. So I have a tv for gaming now and the jvc for movies. Had to Updrade my reciever first, just ordered the yahmaha a3050 to replave the elite sc35 since no 4k.
I have a batcave, cieling and front black, side walls dark tan so the X550r is is soooo calling my name, but holy crap 550-600 per bulb??? The bulbs for my x30 were a little high at 300-350. I go though at least a bulb a year so it adds up.
If the epson has good input lag and motion blur, I can game on a projector again. Now a motorized lens shift, and bulbs that from the looks on the design may be $100 to $150 the cost over the life of the unit could be a very large amount. If anyone sees them side by side I am super intersted if I would be super bummed for going with the epson from my jvx x30. the unit will probably be 700 to 1000 more then if you go through 4 bulbs over a few years (because we are all waiting for true 4k laser or led based units to become affordable) your talking like $2500 difference. Not sure It would be worth it with the shift to true 4k laser hopefully close. Would anyone here keep either unit past 3 years once the true 4k non flame flower bulb versions start showing up in the 3-4k range?
 
#763 ·
The bulbs for my x30 were a little high at 300-350. I go though at least a bulb a year so it adds up.
You may want to look at the Philips lamps which are selling for $62. People who tried it all seem to like it. There are a posts here that discuss this.
 
#482 ·
Who do you think its competition is? A lot of talk about JVC RS400 vs. Epson 5040 but it's pretty well known the street price difference between these will be many hundreds of dollars plus historically the JVC lamps cost A LOT more than the Epsons plus the JVC doesn't include a 3D transmitter (additional cost).
 
#487 · (Edited)
I hope Projectordream.com gets a hold of a 5040 and runs contrast tests on it. Their method seems to me the most illuminating.
Compare the current JVC and Epson below. The difference in low light performance is obvious. In scenes with >10% white field the two projectors have identical contrast. Below 10% white the JVC kills it.
If you plan on watching primarily sports or the evening news the difference won't matter, but for those sci-fi/horror fanatics the current choice is clear. I doubt this graph will change much for the 5040.
For comparison and a chuckle the last graph is everyone's favorite low cost dlp, the BenQ W1070. (Which has been hanging out in my throw distance challenged theater for 3 years now.)






 

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#490 ·
Then that calls into question the testing method, because a higher native contrast projector will always have higher contrast, when compared to a lower native contrast projector. Yes it will get closer, as the room gets more ambient light, but the lower native contrast projector will never surpass the higher native contrast projector in actual use. Now you could set up a test so that the lower native does win, but it will not give you what you will get in real use. For example, if you only used a 0 ire test pattern and gave the projector several seconds for the dynamic iris to close fully down. Then if the projector with lower native contrast uses a large multiplier on the iris, so that it's dynamic contrast was higher, then in a test like this, the lower native contrast projector would show better test results. That is much like how manufacturer's get such ridiculous contrast numbers to begin with.
 
#493 · (Edited)
http://projectiondream.com/en/movie-brightness-adl-contrast-measurements/

Remember our results from the ADL analysis (with a gamma of 2.2) of 53 famous movies:

90% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 20% (ADL=% of white)
80% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 13%
50% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 5%
The average brightness/ADL of all analyzed movies is 8%

The curves confirm the impression we had when we tested the Benq W2000: It has an incredible ANSI contrast! In our optimized room we measured a 50% contrast value of 529:1! This compensates for the On-off contrast of around 1600, which is typical for a DLP projector.

According to this, the higher end projectors will of course rule in perfect rooms or with low ADL content like movies, but the advantage switches with high ADL content like sports in white living rooms.

Even if the test is flawed, it still probably shows that if your primary usage is watching sports in a white living room, it's a waste of money to buy higher end because the difference is minimal. In a blacked out theater watching movies, the JVC has over twice the contrast, so that will definitely be preferred in that scenario. It's all about the needs.
 

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#494 ·
http://projectiondream.com/en/movie-brightness-adl-contrast-measurements/

Remember our results from the ADL analysis (with a gamma of 2.2) of 53 famous movies:

90% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 20% (ADL=% of white)
80% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 13%
50% of all movie pictures have a brightness below 5%
The average brightness/ADL of all analyzed movies is 8%

The curves confirm the impression we had when we tested the Benq W2000: It has an incredible ANSI contrast! In our optimized room we measured a 50% contrast value of 529:1! This compensates for the On-off contrast of around 1600, which is typical for a DLP projector.

According to this, the higher end projectors will of course rule in perfect rooms or with low ADL content like movies, but the advantage switches with high ADL content in white living rooms.
I am just telling you, those are not ANSI contrast numbers on the left side of those charts. The contrast numbers are too high.
 
#496 ·
There are so many factors that can affect the results.
Projector brightness?
How close to the side walls is the screen?
How close is the image to the ceiling?

You are going to get a lot more washout with an image 6" away from a white ceiling than you are going to get if the image is 9.5' away from the ceiling. I have a JVC RS45 in a room with nearly white walls and white ceiling. I currently have a high ANSI DLP in place of the JVC. I can tell you that the JVC provides better contrast in my white room. The ceiling is 17' high. The closest side wall to the image is about 6'.
 
#501 ·
Up grading from plasma the 5040 has given me pause.....

I've been using a 65" LG plasma in my family room for the past 5 years. I've recently decided to make the plunge to front projection.

The projector will be placed in our family room which is open to our kitchen and dining room and also has a arched opening which opens to the front of the house. The room has light colored walls, ceilings and flooring with 6 windows and a french door.

I critically analyzed my viewing habits and realize my viewing consists of 80% sports, 15 hdtv viewing and 5% movies. Heck I don't even own a blue ray player, we either stream or use the kids Xbox.

I had originally decided to grab a Epson 2045 but quickly changed to either a Epson 1985wu or a Epson 1440 due to the +4000 lumens. I've seen both and feel either will work in my situation. I realize the black levels are not as good as the Sony or Benq but I rarely watch in a properly darken room so that is not a big issue for me.

However the 5040 has caused me to rethink. My only concern is will it be bright enough to enjoy NFL and college football games during the day.

I've recently upgraded my audio system and recently watched Tron and Interstellar. That is two more movies than I've watched in probably two years.

So I think with the addition of better audio and a bigger screen,I may watch more movies. The football part of the equation will never change.

Would adding a Darby to the 1440 get me partially to the 5040?

I'm very intrigued by the faux4k. If you have to resort to careful measurements and close examination to tell the difference I'm in.
 
#510 ·
I've been using a 65" LG plasma in my family room for the past 5 years. I've recently decided to make the plunge to front projection.

The projector will be placed in our family room which is open to our kitchen and dining room and also has a arched opening which opens to the front of the house. The room has light colored walls, ceilings and flooring with 6 windows and a french door.

I critically analyzed my viewing habits and realize my viewing consists of 80% sports, 15 hdtv viewing and 5% movies. Heck I don't even own a blue ray player, we either stream or use the kids Xbox.

I had originally decided to grab a Epson 2045 but quickly changed to either a Epson 1985wu or a Epson 1440 due to the +4000 lumens. I've seen both and feel either will work in my situation. I realize the black levels are not as good as the Sony or Benq but I rarely watch in a properly darken room so that is not a big issue for me.

However the 5040 has caused me to rethink. My only concern is will it be bright enough to enjoy NFL and college football games during the day.

I've recently upgraded my audio system and recently watched Tron and Interstellar. That is two more movies than I've watched in probably two years.

So I think with the addition of better audio and a bigger screen,I may watch more movies. The football part of the equation will never change.

Would adding a Darby to the 1440 get me partially to the 5040?

I'm very intrigued by the faux4k. If you have to resort to careful measurements and close examination to tell the difference I'm in.
How far back do you sit and can you at least block some of the light? My opinion is that I am not sure the additional contrast ratio and faux 4K will make a huge difference based on how much sports you watch vs movies. I have a Darby, and it does work pretty well, but I would not expect wonders, especially with bad source material. It usually looks best for me with high quality Blu-Ray.

If it was me, I would get the brightest projector you can buy and not break the bank. And I would not rule out another HDTV (new Vizio P series or even M series).
 
#506 ·
@Gary Lightfoot

Would love to hear what the picture quality was like in game mode. On the 5025/5030, the image looked blurry or lower res.

Also, you keep mentioning man/bat cave. Where do you draw the line? Would a room with no windows, dark walls, but light flooring and ceiling be considered a bat cave?
No.
 
#505 ·
So the test may very much resemble the standard ANSI test where any scatter or reflection greatly affects the results, especially if the color lumens match the white lumens on the DLP at your set output.
 
#520 ·
It's August. Just wondering if there has been any tightening on the actual release date of the Home Cinema 5040UBe and Home Cinema 5040UB.

Thanks!!
August 31st. :D
 
#529 ·
I'm trying to decide between this and the JVC RS400. But I have a question: What will happen to these projectors once dynamic metadata for HDR rolls out? Will these become obsolete with HDR 12 and HDMI 2.1?

I'm upgrading from an Optoma HD66 (720p 3D DLP) and I'm guessing the improvement in contrast and colors would be quite substantial?
 
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