If you are considering buying a low end projector, Consider Benq 2050 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 81 Unread 01-28-2017, 05:35 PM - Thread Starter
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If you are considering buying a low end projector, Consider Benq 2050

I am writing this post, just as a public service, for newbies, seeking to start into home theatre.
If you are an experienced home theatre owner, please read no further. I know, no more than you and you might not like my suggestion/comment.


Recently, I saw a Sony 4k- 360 at a friend's house. Wrote a comment about that and my evaluation of a Sony 4k, a jvc 4k and an epson 4k.. I found a lot of video noise for viewing 2k satellite. They were fine for 4k but there is not that much 4k content - not yet, anyway.

The video scaling and processing of 2k to 4k has not yet caught up to my satisfaction. There was too much video noise, little posterization and over all unsatisfactory picture.

In that group, I found that the Epson 5040, at $3000, to be the best value.
I decided to not buy a 4k, right now.

Today, I happened to try a Benq 2050, on my 150" wide 1.3 micro perf screen. I was pleasantly surprised. It has 15000:1 contrast, 2200 lumens. Actually, for the price, it is amazing! The lamp in my current projector costs $900!

Of course, the Epson 5040 would be, as I wrote, the best value.. but this little projector for $750 is an amazing value, as a starter! To be clear, it is not perfect, but if you did not see this side by side with a $5k projector, you would not even know the difference. If you don't know or miss it, why pay for it?
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post #2 of 81 Unread 01-28-2017, 08:59 PM
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That's why the BenQ HT2050 is often recommended as the best overall projector for less than $1,000. It's not that far off when compared with some projectors that cost more than $1,000, either.
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post #3 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 06:05 AM
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I'm also not sure if the OP has taken a look at the Sony HW45ES, the Epson 5025, the Epson 3000 series, or the Epson 2040 which are all under $2,000 and are considered some of the top picks on the market for the entry/mid level crowd.

I remember the day I got my Panasonic PT-L300U (July 2003) and one of the first things I did was take this 960x540 projector into one of the stores I had access to and fire it up in a head-to-head with a $10,000 Runco.

Did it match up? Nope! Not quite as bright, the higher resolution (1280x720) Runco was a bit cleaner, black levels were better, and motion was cleaner. But, it was nowhere near $8,000 better and the little Panasonic had almost no fan noise compared to the Runco.

Now I can't even imagine spending more than $3,000 on a projector with the way pricing falls and technology moves along. We've basically seen brightness double while contrast has remained strong, or better, on the entry level units that still seem to manage to drop in price a bit more every year.

Certainly, the HT2050 is a favorite among many people and deservedly so. Yet, there's a ton out there under $2,000 which have the quality which only $10,000+ models gave us six or seven years ago. On a standard home theater screen, it's hard for me to understand the added cost, no matter how great the JVCs I see continue to look.
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post #4 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 06:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_Integrated View Post
I'm also not sure if the OP has taken a look at the Sony HW45ES, the Epson 5025, the Epson 3000 series, or the Epson 2040

Now I can't even imagine spending more than $3,000 on a projector with the way pricing falls
I have not seen those but I agree with you and would expect them to be as good as or better. The main reason I started this thread, is the $750 price tag. I was shocked, pleasantly so.

As shocked was I, when I saw a $10,000 Sony 360 4k. This BenQ might well be better, with dish 2k source. That Sony had a lot of video noise, scaling issues etc. Of course, it was very good with 4k source, for obvious reasons.
The way prices are falling, and as you wrote, it's difficult to justify spending more than $3k, even for 4k. Epson 5040 at $3000 was as good as as the $10,000 Sony 360.



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post #5 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audvid View Post
It has 15000:1 contrast,
Shakes head

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post #6 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verge2 View Post
Shakes head

If I misquoted the numbers, please feel free to correct me. I did not measure the contrast. The following is from Amazon, for this projector.


  • HIGH RESOLUTION: 3D 1080p projector with ANSI Brightness of 2,200 Lumens, 15,000:1 contrast, premium RGBRGB Color Wheel and ISFccc Certified Calibration for Day/Night viewing


I bought this projector because it said "All glass lens". I was going to give it a try, expecting to be awful and if so, either use it in my exercise room or return it. I never thought it could actually display a decent picture in my main theatre, on 150" wide screen. This goes to show, how much the technology has gone up!

I can see the value of the all glass lens. The picture is quite sharp/clear (not sure of the correct term to be used).
The weakness is of course in the coarseness of the picture but for that price, it is amazing! I am probably going to use this projector, on a temporary basis, until next Cedia.. until Sony comes out with a Sony 1200 (meaning, laser, 4k, 3000 to 5000 lumens). The current Sony 5000, is simply beyond my budget..
Or until Benq or someone else comes up with a laser with 4k and an amazing lens.

Last edited by audvid; 01-29-2017 at 10:44 AM.
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post #7 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 10:41 AM
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If you are considering buying a low end projector, Consider Benq 2050

Verge is trying to say ( ) that the claimed contrast figure is nonsense.

Real-world measuring puts the HT2050 at about a tenth of that figure for native contrast - 1500:1. Still higher than anything else at the price-point, but far from the manufacturer claim.
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post #8 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 10:50 AM
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But put it up to a Barco Thor you definitely should and would see a marked difference 6000:1 from a Big 6P 3DMD DLP RGB laser projector. Of course off the scale price difference, sub 1K vs super 100K. So there are people with bigger wallets that do see reason to spend more.

I am easiliy charmed by cute little devices like the BenQ's.
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post #9 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 11:02 AM
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Not LASER, but 2000 (peak white rec. 709/sRGB half that) lumens plus spec sheet says 2400, the X12000 by BenQ has been announced. 4K is XPR with the 0.67" DMD. But at ISE BenQ* will also show the LK970, 4K Laser-phosphor rated at 5000 lumens, so meeting your target after calibration.

Optoma is also launching such a laser unit, as is Vivitek, so who will be the source for this BenQ laser projector, Coretronic or Delta?

*Search/browse there for articles on the other projectors
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post #10 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 04:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
But put it up to a Barco Thor you definitely should and would see a marked difference 6000:1 from a Big 6P 3DMD DLP RGB laser projector. Of course off the scale price difference, sub 1K vs super 100K. So there are people with bigger wallets that do see reason to spend more.

I am easiliy charmed by cute little devices like the BenQ's.
Of course, my Sony Qualia 004 has an amazing Karl Zeiss lens (which was about $8000) and the quality of the lens shows. The picture from my Qualia is much more natural and smooth. The only negative is that the Qualia lamp is $900!
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post #11 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 04:50 PM
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I would like to throw in my XGIMI H1 LED projector as a worthy candidate for projectors under $1000. It may sound like low end in price, but it is certainly not low end in features.
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post #12 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:06 PM
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If you are considering buying a low end projector, Consider Benq 2050

Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklee View Post
I would like to throw in my XGIMI H1 LED projector as a worthy candidate for projectors under $1000. It may sound like low end in price, but it is certainly not low end in features.


It's only rated at 900 lumens. It also seems unavailable in the US via any big retailers.

It's also not really targeted at home theater.

The PF1500 was rated at 1400 lumens but only measured around 900 (or about 700 lumens calibrated) in real-world testing.
Has anyone measured the H1 for its actual brightness? Or actual contrast? Color performance? Any detailed reviews (with measurements) that you could link to?

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post #13 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:10 PM
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post #14 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:36 PM
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Wow lamps that get less expensive after the projector has been discontinued for years, very rare. They used to be $3000,- When new the projetcor came with a second lamp(voucher), but the $3000 killed the second hand market. The lamp becoming more expensive than the used price of the projector.

Philips told me they measured the UST LG the 1000 at ~600 lumens so the 1258 in sRGB/Rec. 709 of its HLD prototype platform is uit good. The European version of the PF1500 was performing less than the US pre-production unit tested by Cine4Home, so Philips HLD was the new solid state king of the hill. Of course also more costly a report from India says the BenQ X12000 lists there for just under 7K$/€ equivalent, half a million rupia, 350K or 5K for the lamp based XPR 4K W11000.

The laser-phosphor units are all solid state mechanical projectors, not solid state, so still high velocity wheels that can fail, and now two instead of one increasing the odds of failure.

Last edited by donaldk; 01-29-2017 at 05:45 PM.
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post #15 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
Wow lamps that get less expensive after the projector has been discontinued for years, very rare. They used to be $3000,- When new the projetcor came with a second lamp(voucher), but the $3000 killed the second hand market. The lamp becoming more expensive than the used price of the projector.
I was considering buying a Meridian 810. List was $165,000 when new. They were asking $20k. I was going to offer $10k.. until I found out that the lamp was $8000 for 1500 hours!
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post #16 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:49 PM
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The advantage of Barco staging or dci projectors they use standard Xenon lamps, so aftermarket can be as low as your Qualia Xenon.

Actually initially the Meridian listed at $180K. super high mark up, the high end audio world is known for at least three times ex factory;-). The DP1500 at 16K suggested to you therefore sounds like the best option if you still want the best 2K around.
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post #17 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
The advantage of Barco staging or dci projectors they use standard Xenon lamps, so aftermarket can be as low as your Qualia Xenon.

Actually initially the Meridian listed at $180K. super high mark up, the high end audio world is known for at least three times ex factory;-). The DP1500 at 16K suggested to you therefore sounds like the best option if you still want the best 2K around.
You are correct about the $180k. The D1500 is just too big for my theatre. And I don't have a way to Vent it. I liked your other suggestion of the DPI. It had a less expensive UHP bulb. I am on the look out for it.
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post #18 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 06:29 PM
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It's only rated at 900 lumens. It also seems unavailable in the US via any big retailers.

It's also not really targeted at home theater.

The PF1500 was rated at 1400 lumens but only measured around 900 (or about 700 lumens calibrated) in real-world testing.
Has anyone measured the H1 for its actual brightness? Or actual contrast? Color performance? Any detailed reviews (with measurements) that you could link to?
It may not be targeted at a professional level for home theater, but for 90% of everyone's home I think it is more than sufficient. Lighting tests have been conducted for the H1, and compared to the PF1500 it compares very well. The drop between advertised to real world figures are not as drastic as the LG. All of the other measurements are very subjective IMO because some people like bright "contrasty" images, while others are adamant towards matching the original settings of the source. Based on the eye test it meets my requirements, but then I was happy with it out of the box while everyone had said that the calibrations were really off. Maybe mine was already calibrated? I do not know.

I have posted quite a few pictures and video samples on the XGIMI H1 thread, it was all I could work with before I got my H1. I will continue to post more including my own very non-technical review of my H1 when I get around to it.
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post #19 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 06:47 PM
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I didn't like the way it was announced as being an 4K projector. Traditional Chinese marketing selling VGA as HD.
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post #20 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 09:09 PM
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Respect is earned over time.
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post #21 of 81 Unread 01-29-2017, 09:20 PM
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I didn't like the way it was announced as being an 4K projector. Traditional Chinese marketing selling VGA as HD.
Could you show me where it is advertised as a 4K projector here or here? It quite clearly states "true 1080p" in both references.

Also, would you consider the Epson ProCinema 6040UB a 4k projector? Even though it uses native 1080p HD chips but is advertised as 4k.
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I also LOLed at quoting the contrast spec with a straight face.
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post #23 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklee View Post
Could you show me where it is advertised as a 4K projector here or here? It quite clearly states "true 1080p" in both references.

Also, would you consider the Epson ProCinema 6040UB a 4k projector? Even though it uses native 1080p HD chips but is advertised as 4k.
It's advertised as 4k... where?


In made-up land?
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post #24 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 10:14 AM
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The original H1 press release from XGIMI, which can be found on BusinessWire (which posts unedited company press releases) is not entirely clear in the way it addresses the H1's resolution. For example, the only mention of resolution in the entire press release is this:

Quote:
See every detail with H1’s 4K compatible image quality, while movies, games and presentations boast crystal clear HD images with 1080p resolution.
It's unclear if XGIMI wrote the following headline accompanying the press release or if BusinessWire wrote the headline based on XGIMI's statement that the H1 has "4K compatible image quality":

Quote:
Say Goodbye to LCD as XGIMI Unveils 4K 300” Screenless Home Cinema
Unlike those of us who are seriously into AV, the general public and general media don't always understand the difference between "4K compatible image quality" and native resolution, which on the H1 is 1080p and not 4K. There's really no way to know for sure whether XGIMI accidentally or deliberately tried to create the impression that the H1 is a true 4K projector.

Link to BusinessWire
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post #25 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
The original H1 press release from XGIMI, which can be found on BusinessWire (which posts unedited company press releases) is not entirely clear in the way it addresses the H1's resolution. For example, the only mention of resolution in the entire press release is this:

It's unclear if XGIMI wrote the following headline accompanying the press release or if BusinessWire wrote the headline based on XGIMI's statement that the H1 has "4K compatible image quality":

Unlike those of us who are seriously into AV, the general public and general media don't always understand the difference between "4K compatible image quality" and native resolution, which on the H1 is 1080p and not 4K. There's really no way to know for sure whether XGIMI accidentally or deliberately tried to create the impression that the H1 is a true 4K projector.

Link to BusinessWire
This isn't the first time we have seen similar marketing efforts from certain lower end brands.
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post #26 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
The original H1 press release from XGIMI, which can be found on BusinessWire (which posts unedited company press releases) is not entirely clear in the way it addresses the H1's resolution. For example, the only mention of resolution in the entire press release is this:

It's unclear if XGIMI wrote the following headline accompanying the press release or if BusinessWire wrote the headline based on XGIMI's statement that the H1 has "4K compatible image quality":

Unlike those of us who are seriously into AV, the general public and general media don't always understand the difference between "4K compatible image quality" and native resolution, which on the H1 is 1080p and not 4K. There's really no way to know for sure whether XGIMI accidentally or deliberately tried to create the impression that the H1 is a true 4K projector.

Link to BusinessWire
LOL, this is not XGIMI's own press release, it's businesswire's poor form of reporting probably for clickbait purposes. The two links that I provided are the main source of where they were supposed to get the proper details. They're even listed on that page in which they still managed to get wrong.

So it seems that THEY and THEIR subsequent readers have interpreted information incorrectly.
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post #27 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 07:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklee View Post
LOL, this is not XGIMI's own press release, it's businesswire's poor form of reporting probably for clickbait purposes. The two links that I provided are the main source of where they were supposed to get the proper details. They're even listed on that page in which they still managed to get wrong.

So it seems that THEY and THEIR subsequent readers have interpreted information incorrectly.
You need to do your homework before jumping to conclusions. BusinessWire is not a news service and has no news writers. They only distribute company-approved press releases. There's a big blue button on their main page labeled Submit A Press Release. Wikipedia has the CliffsNotes version of BusinessWire's business model:

Quote:
Business Wire

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Business Wire is a company that disseminates full-text press releases from thousands of companies and organizations worldwide to news media, financial markets, disclosure systems, investors, information web sites, databases, bloggers, social networks and other audiences.
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post #28 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 07:13 PM - Thread Starter
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guys.. this is turning into a P**ing contest. Who cares? How does this argument help the reader? Please get back onto the subject matter.
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post #29 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 07:18 PM
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I finally took my HT2050 out of the box today. Was impressed with the brightness, but the chromatic abberation was too much. Going back to Amazon.
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post #30 of 81 Unread 01-31-2017, 07:32 PM
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guys.. this is turning into a P**ing contest. Who cares? How does this argument help the reader? Please get back onto the subject matter.
O, there's factual information from helpful posters, who help others for no charge.


Then there's paid guerrilla marketers.
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