Epson 5040UB or JVC rs420 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 83 Old 03-02-2017, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Epson 5040UB or JVC rs420

My head hurts. I have read until I am now essentially paralyzed. Best I can gather on the differences:

Epson:
Better (much lower) latency for gaming
Better for action / sports viewing
A bit brighter (does not matter as room is light controlled)
Perceptibly sharper image
Cheaper replacement bulb
Longer warranty and better CS

JVC:
Better blacks - better movie watching experience

The difference in purchase price is almost non-existent for me. If this were the case for you, and you have seen both, which would you pick? I have seen the 5040ub. I have not seen the jvc.
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post #2 of 83 Old 03-02-2017, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwanck11 View Post
My head hurts. I have read until I am now essentially paralyzed. Best I can gather on the differences:

Epson:
Better (much lower) latency for gaming
Better for action / sports viewing
A bit brighter (does not matter as room is light controlled)
Perceptibly sharper image
Cheaper replacement bulb
Longer warranty and better CS

JVC:
Better blacks - better movie watching experience

The difference in purchase price is almost non-existent for me. If this were the case for you, and you have seen both, which would you pick? I have seen the 5040ub. I have not seen the jvc.
I know this wasn't one of your options, but have you considered one of the new 4K DLP models like the Optoma UHD60 and the like? I know resolution isn't the end all for quality but you'd be looking at much higher resolution from the start and the aforementioned Optoma model is the same price as the Epson. Food for thought.

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post #3 of 83 Old 03-02-2017, 02:40 PM
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If they are priced the same for you definitely buy the 420. And remove lower lag from your Epson pro list. The 420 is one of the first JVCs with a low latency mode.
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post #4 of 83 Old 03-02-2017, 05:41 PM
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In a light controlled room this is an easy pick. JVC RS420 is the superior projector for dark room viewing.
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post #5 of 83 Old 03-02-2017, 05:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies.

The other thing I have seen is that the Epson has more issues with configuration and inputs...
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post #6 of 83 Old 03-03-2017, 08:48 PM
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Input switching times are annoying on the JVC. It really drives you mad when you game on a PC. Input lag has improved but havent seen any figures confirming 4k gaming is low lag too, also its still not as quick as the 29ms of the Epson (splitting hairs). The motion also wasnt the best on last years JVC. Until I get my hands on a new JVC I cant confirm or deny any of these issues are still present. Good too see your doing your research, some dont.

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post #7 of 83 Old 03-04-2017, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by hatlesschimp View Post
Input switching times are annoying on the JVC. It really drives you mad when you game on a PC. Input lag has improved but havent seen any figures confirming 4k gaming is low lag too, also its still not as quick as the 29ms of the Epson (splitting hairs). The motion also wasnt the best on last years JVC. Until I get my hands on a new JVC I cant confirm or deny any of these issues are still present. Good too see your doing your research, some dont.

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I just went through the same process and chose the 420. Couldn't be happier.
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post #8 of 83 Old 03-07-2017, 05:12 AM
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I haven't seen either, but have studied both myself. With the recent $500 drop for the Epson, I'm shocked you can get a 420 for a similar price. At the same price, the 420 would seem the no-brainer decision to me.

Two full speed 18 gbps inputs is the big thing on the 420 versus Epson's outdated 10.2gbps hdmi pipe. Input switching is the biggest complaint on any of the JVCs but most people aren't driven crazy by that. If you need a projector immediately, I'd go 420, but I suspect Epson will be releasing a new model in the next couple months (okay, maybe four to six? the 5040 was announced in June 2016) to address the 5040's most glaring weakness (their chipset).

Personally, I'm still holding out, but I doubt the JVC would result in as much near-term buyer's remorse since it already has the better chipset, arguably better HDR support, definitively better blacks, and the JVC comes in beautiful black instead of that hideous, obnoxious white (lol, I can't hammer that one enough!).

Good luck!
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post #9 of 83 Old 03-09-2017, 11:03 PM
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I too, am trying to make the same decision right now.

Haven't called for pricing on a 420, but if it's close, I am already leaning towards the JVC. Coming from a ZT60 -- I can appreciate contrast and black levels.
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post #10 of 83 Old 03-10-2017, 09:19 AM
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I recently seen both on a theater crawl here in KC last month also got to see a JVC 400, JVC 520, JVC 600, Sony 40S, Panasonic PT-AE8000U and a Epson 8350 set up in rear projection format.

Out of all all of them I would go with the JVC 600 first, Epson 5040, JVC 520, JVC 400, Sony 40ES, Epson 8350 and then Panasonic PT-AE900U. The 600 is way out of my range so I am taking it out. I like the 5040 over the 520 because it seemed brighter and had more color then the 520 I seen that was calibrated to proper specs. Not sure on the 5040. Now the Sony 40 ES was surprisingly impressive and has made me question whether it is worth it to go with a faux 4K right now. Heck I am even thinking of just upgrading from a Optoma HD65 to an Epson 2040 for the next few years.

Now the rear projection was cool in that you could be in the room with all the lights on and the picture didn't really suffer much for it. They were replaying the Super Bowl Game and it looked like a giant TV.

If I was to decide on a faux 4K it would be either the 5040 or the 6040 that also comes with an mount, extra lamp and an extra year of warranty to take it to 3 years. It also comes in black and I have seen it as low as $3399 right now.

I have read that both the Espson and JVC are doing better on lag time and should be fine for the PS4 or Xbox One S, but the Espon 2040 at $649 is starting to sound like a better option for me right now and leaves me money to up grade to Dolby Atmos.

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post #11 of 83 Old 03-18-2017, 01:31 PM
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I got the Epson 5040UBE last night and fired it up. I think it looks phenomenal, however, I am still curious as to whether or not make the jump to the RS-420. I can't imagine that it will be a noticeable increase in performance for the price. But I would like to see better black levels -- which I know I will get with the JVC, but how noticeable will the increase be?

Can anyone comment on the RS-420 colors and cinematic presentation (i.e. motion and sharpness?) who may have had or seen the Epson as well?

Thanks!
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post #12 of 83 Old 03-18-2017, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiophile@Birth View Post
I got the Epson 5040UBE last night and fired it up. I think it looks phenomenal, however, I am still curious as to whether or not make the jump to the RS-420. I can't imagine that it will be a noticeable increase in performance for the price. But I would like to see better black levels -- which I know I will get with the JVC, but how noticeable will the increase be?

Can anyone comment on the RS-420 colors and cinematic presentation (i.e. motion and sharpness?) who may have had or seen the Epson as well?

Thanks!
I have seen the JVC 520 calibrated, the 500, the 600, the Epson 5040 and 6040. I liked the color brightness of the Epson's over the JVC's except for the 600. The 600 was very impressive, but cost $6K. I couldn't tell that much more in black levels to me, but others thought the JVC were better, but the you can't beat the price of the 5040. Now​ I have heard the older JVC's lamp may last a little longer, but not sure. I have also read that to get the full effect of 4K you need to sit closer then you would for 1080p. I have seen the Sony 40es and thought it was really nice as well. I am kind of leaning towards the Sony 45 ES now maybe. This is my opinion and I would need to see them in the same room back to back to campare better.

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post #13 of 83 Old 03-18-2017, 07:48 PM
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biggest thing the 420 has over the 5040 is the 420 isn't handicapped by hdmi limitation. it can pretty much do anything with 4k hdr from any source, where as the 5040 can't because of the limited hdmi chip. ex: consoles and the 5040 can't work 100% like they can with 4k tvs or the 420.
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post #14 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 01:16 AM
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biggest thing the 420 has over the 5040 is the 420 isn't handicapped by hdmi limitation. it can pretty much do anything with 4k hdr from any source, where as the 5040 can't because of the limited hdmi chip. ex: consoles and the 5040 can't work 100% like they can with 4k tvs or the 420.
This is also one of the things that is grinding my gears on going forward with the 5040UBE. No doubt that the JVC is more 'future proof'.
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post #15 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 07:11 AM
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I have seen the JVC 520 calibrated, the 500, the 600, the Epson 5040 and 6040. I liked the color brightness of the Epson's over the JVC's except for the 600. The 600 was very impressive, but cost $6K. I couldn't tell that much more in black levels to me, but others thought the JVC were better, but the you can't beat the price of the 5040. Now​ I have heard the older JVC's lamp may last a little longer, but not sure. I have also read that to get the full effect of 4K you need to sit closer then you would for 1080p. I have seen the Sony 40es and thought it was really nice as well. I am kind of leaning towards the Sony 45 ES now maybe. This is my opinion and I would need to see them in the same room back to back to campare better.
Some say that the better blacks of the JVC 400/420 come at the expense of shadow detail. Did you notice more black crush of details in shadows on either the JVC or the Epson?
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post #16 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Viche View Post
Some say that the better blacks of the JVC 400/420 come at the expense of shadow detail. Did you notice more black crush of details in shadows on either the JVC or the Epson?
Not sure, the thing I noticed was that the color on the 5040 and 6040 seemed brighter on the 400/420. I am not sure what to look for on black crush in the shadow details. I seen most of these on a theater crawl and didn't get to spend a lot of time watching them all. Like I said the main thing that stood was the color brightness.

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post #17 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Viche View Post
Some say that the better blacks of the JVC 400/420 come at the expense of shadow detail. Did you notice more black crush of details in shadows on either the JVC or the Epson?
i'd take some black crush for perceived improvement with blacks than have to stare at shades of grey all the time.

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post #18 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 03:51 PM
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i'd take some black crush for perceived improvement with blacks than have to stare at shades of grey all the time.
Guess it's personal taste. I favor shadow details when I calibrate my TV. I'll put a dark scene up and then tweek until the blacks are as black as possible and details in the darkest areas start to get lost. Then I'll back out a step to where shadow details are mostly visible. It's a balance. Not sure what I'd prefer on a projector as no one around me has these models in a dark room under the same roof.
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post #19 of 83 Old 03-19-2017, 10:25 PM
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Went back to Magnolia today to look at the JVC 420 one last time. Definitely more cinematic and less SDE. Noticeably better black levels as well. However, Viche is right, there is quite a bit of black crush in certain movies in the JVC compared to the Epson. With a good screen, you may actually miss that detail -- I know I would.

Funny enough (or not so because I have to ship this baby back), the Epson 5040 I got and had been trialing in home developed a vertical band of stuck/dead Cyan pixels (20-30 pixels wide) about 1/4 over from the right side of the image.

Back to the drawing board for me. Is it a sign to get the JVC? Or do I take my chances with a second Epson copy, save some money now and wait for Laser and 4K to become more affordable in the $3000 to $5000 range?

Hmmm.
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post #20 of 83 Old 03-20-2017, 03:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Audiophile@Birth View Post
Went back to Magnolia today to look at the JVC 420 one last time. Definitely more cinematic and less SDE. Noticeably better black levels as well. However, Viche is right, there is quite a bit of black crush in certain movies in the JVC compared to the Epson. With a good screen, you may actually miss that detail -- I know I would.

Funny enough (or not so because I have to ship this baby back), the Epson 5040 I got and had been trialing in home developed a vertical band of stuck/dead Cyan pixels (20-30 pixels wide) about 1/4 over from the right side of the image.

Back to the drawing board for me. Is it a sign to get the JVC? Or do I take my chances with a second Epson copy, save some money now and wait for Laser and 4K to become more affordable in the $3000 to $5000 range?

Hmmm.
You sure they had FauxK turned on on the Epson. That should've helped with SDE. Maybe they had frame interpolation turned on too high?

Have you found anywhere that has the sony HS 45 on display anywhere? It was on sale for 1700 recently, I'm tempted to just get that till 4K is worked out.

Edit: I was leaning toward the Epson, but my biggest concern is how much tinkering I'd have to do for various sources due to the 10 GB HDMI limitation, the lack of lumens to do HDR appropriately, and fauxK's effect on games vs movies vs tv. Like a poster in the Epson thread recently said, I don't know if I could enjoy the projector with that many variables going on combined with my mild OCD.
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post #21 of 83 Old 03-20-2017, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viche View Post
You sure they had FauxK turned on on the Epson. That should've helped with SDE. Maybe they had frame interpolation turned on too high?

Have you found anywhere that has the sony HS 45 on display anywhere? It was on sale for 1700 recently, I'm tempted to just get that till 4K is worked out.

Edit: I was leaning toward the Epson, but my biggest concern is how much tinkering I'd have to do for various sources due to the 10 GB HDMI limitation, the lack of lumens to do HDR appropriately, and fauxK's effect on games vs movies vs tv. Like a poster in the Epson thread recently said, I don't know if I could enjoy the projector with that many variables going on combined with my mild OCD.
I too am thinking of just getting the Sony 45ES instead of a faux 4K projector. I have seen the 40ES and it looks great so I would think the 45 would be awesome and cheaper. Also I wouldn't have to buy a 4K DVD player then.

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post #22 of 83 Old 03-20-2017, 07:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viche View Post
You sure they had FauxK turned on on the Epson. That should've helped with SDE. Maybe they had frame interpolation turned on too high?

Have you found anywhere that has the sony HS 45 on display anywhere? It was on sale for 1700 recently, I'm tempted to just get that till 4K is worked out.

Edit: I was leaning toward the Epson, but my biggest concern is how much tinkering I'd have to do for various sources due to the 10 GB HDMI limitation, the lack of lumens to do HDR appropriately, and fauxK's effect on games vs movies vs tv. Like a poster in the Epson thread recently said, I don't know if I could enjoy the projector with that many variables going on combined with my mild OCD.
Both had FauxK turned on to their medium setting. It's just the nature of LCD -- if you pick it out and pay attention, you can still see the SDE from about 4 feet away compared to the JVC at a much closer distance. At normal viewing, you wouldn't notice it and the Epson lends itself to a more perceived, sharper image at that point.
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post #23 of 83 Old 03-20-2017, 07:44 AM
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Both had FauxK turned on to their medium setting. It's just the nature of LCD -- if you pick it out and pay attention, you can still see the SDE from about 4 feet away compared to the JVC at a much closer distance. At normal viewing, you wouldn't notice it and the Epson lends itself to a more perceived, sharper image at that point.
Got it. Still, you should check out the Sony if you have the opportunity. Then let me know what you think!
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post #24 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viche View Post
You sure they had FauxK turned on on the Epson. That should've helped with SDE. Maybe they had frame interpolation turned on too high?

Have you found anywhere that has the sony HS 45 on display anywhere? It was on sale for 1700 recently, I'm tempted to just get that till 4K is worked out.

Edit: I was leaning toward the Epson, but my biggest concern is how much tinkering I'd have to do for various sources due to the 10 GB HDMI limitation, the lack of lumens to do HDR appropriately, and fauxK's effect on games vs movies vs tv. Like a poster in the Epson thread recently said, I don't know if I could enjoy the projector with that many variables going on combined with my mild OCD.
The HDR/4k bandwidth limit is the one thing holding me back from the 5040. The JVC is more than I want to spend, if it dropped to $3k or below I might consider it.
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post #25 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Ladeback View Post
I have seen the JVC 520 calibrated, the 500, the 600, the Epson 5040 and 6040. I liked the color brightness of the Epson's over the JVC's except for the 600. The 600 was very impressive, but cost $6K. I couldn't tell that much more in black levels to me, but others thought the JVC were better, but the you can't beat the price of the 5040. Now​ I have heard the older JVC's lamp may last a little longer, but not sure. I have also read that to get the full effect of 4K you need to sit closer then you would for 1080p. I have seen the Sony 40es and thought it was really nice as well. I am kind of leaning towards the Sony 45 ES now maybe. This is my opinion and I would need to see them in the same room back to back to campare better.
If you liked the RS600, you can find a B-stock for a lot less than 6K. As for beating the on sale price of a 5040, look for an RS400 B-stock.
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post #26 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 08:46 AM
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If you liked the RS600, you can find a B-stock for a lot less than 6K. As for beating the on sale price of a 5040, look for an RS400 B-stock.
I am not finding any great deals on B-stock for the RS600, RS400, RS500 or RS550. For the 600 everything is still close to 6K and the for the other they range from 3K and up. desertdome might have some good deals, but I am on hold anyway till I see how things go at work for me. I may have to travel again and my room is far from being ready for a new projector. I am a holding pattern till live gets figured out for me.

I will keep checking on prices of b-stock if things change.

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post #27 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 08:51 AM
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Have you looked on the Av science store? The 420 is on sale for 2899 I think.
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post #28 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 08:52 AM
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Sorry, that's the 400. Still a great deal.
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post #29 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladeback View Post
I am not finding any great deals on B-stock for the RS600, RS400, RS500 or RS550. For the 600 everything is still close to 6K and the for the other they range from 3K and up. desertdome might have some good deals, but I am on hold anyway till I see how things go at work for me. I may have to travel again and my room is far from being ready for a new projector. I am a holding pattern till live gets figured out for me.

I will keep checking on prices of b-stock if things change.

Thanks,

Doug
You usually need to call for deals like b stock - just FYI.

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post #30 of 83 Old 03-22-2017, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladeback View Post
I am not finding any great deals on B-stock for the RS600, RS400, RS500 or RS550. For the 600 everything is still close to 6K and the for the other they range from 3K and up. desertdome might have some good deals, but I am on hold anyway till I see how things go at work for me. I may have to travel again and my room is far from being ready for a new projector. I am a holding pattern till live gets figured out for me.

I will keep checking on prices of b-stock if things change.

Thanks,

Doug
B-stock deals usually do not last long, but they are available.

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