Optoma brings 4K UHD to the masses with 3 new affordable models! - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 214 Old 05-28-2017, 10:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Optoma brings 4K UHD to the masses with 3 new affordable models!

As the price goes up, the contrast gets better and top UHD65 model is best to avoid RBE. Not sure how much contrast is gained due to typical PR-inflated contrast numbers!

NOW AVAILABLE!

Optoma UHD65 - $2499 (black) <<< This is the one for home theater
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
2200 lumens (lamp)
1200000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBRGB color wheel for reduced RBE
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped to rec709 colorspace
HDR10

Optoma UHD60 - $1999 (white)
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
3000 lumens (lamp)
1000000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBCYW color wheel for high brightness
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10

Releasing later this year:

Optoma UHD550X - projected $1299-$1699 range
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
2800 lumens (lamp)
500000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBCYW color wheel for high brightness
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10

Double the detail without triple the price

Last edited by Ruined; 06-07-2017 at 11:59 AM.
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post #2 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
As the price goes up, the contrast gets better and top UHD65 model is best to avoid RBE. Not sure how much contrast is gained due to typical PR-inflated contrast numbers!

All three releasing in June 2017:

Optoma UHD550X - $1999
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
2800 lumens (lamp)
500000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBCYW color wheel for high brightness
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10


Optoma UHD60 - $2499
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
3000 lumens (lamp)
1000000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBCYW color wheel for high brightness
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10


Optoma UHD65 - $3299
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
2200 lumens (lamp)
1200000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBRGB color wheel for reduced RBE
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10

Double the detail without triple the price
Are these prices and timelines confirmed? Has anyone seen these are there reviews or previews ?

/// Carl-Fredrik
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post #3 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 06:45 AM
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Why no 3D??!!!!!

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post #4 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 07:01 AM
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None of those models costs less than $1000 and there are no models with laser or LED light source. I'm not interested yet.
Do you know what kind of DMDs they will use. The 0.67" TRP DMD has produced low native contrast specs on the BenQ W11000 according to PJHC.

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...t-benq-w11000/
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post #5 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 07:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post
Why no 3D??!!!!!
3D requires significant extra cost and Optoma was looking at hitting the lowest price points possible for 4k UHD with this round of projectors.
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post #6 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 07:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by danny92 View Post
Do you know what kind of DMDs they will use.
0.67" XPR. While the BenQ W11000 measured low, the newer Acer 7850 measured over 2000:1 native contrast which should be sufficient when combined with dynamic iris.

It all depends upon the implementation, so we will see when reviews hit.

I think the only one here really designed for dedicated home theater use is the UHD65, because of its RGBRGB color wheel. The cheaper ones will work for moderate ambient light or business use though.

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post #7 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 07:54 AM
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Call me when the UHD65 has 1500 color/white brightness matched lumens via LED illumination, with a RAPCUR level driver so no RBE, and costs less than 1.5K. I'll get one for sports and gaming unless it doesn't have quality DLP motion like reported on some of these Faux-K DLPs.

I'm keeping the Delta HT-8000 until then.

I honestly think Sony is going to drop true 4K into the 45ES line within three years. Epson may with the 3xxx and 5xxx series as well. If they do, these DLPs will only sell in the $600-$1000 range.

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post #8 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
3D requires significant extra cost and Optoma was looking at hitting the lowest price points possible for 4k UHD with this round of projectors.
Significant? the $799 BenQ 2050 has 3D. How much could it have possibly added?

These are a swing and a miss to me. large projector screens are the best place to enjoy 3D. If I am trying to upgrade to the newest tech, I don't want to leave that behind. I am sure there is plenty of people interested in 4k but not 3D but I bet there is a lot more people that want 4k but also still enjoy 3D. I think that will push many potential customers up over to the Epson.

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post #9 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 08:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post
Significant? the $799 BenQ 2050 has 3D. How much could it have possibly added?

These are a swing and a miss to me. large projector screens are the best place to enjoy 3D. If I am trying to upgrade to the newest tech, I don't want to leave that behind. I am sure there is plenty of people interested in 4k but not 3D but I bet there is a lot more people that want 4k but also still enjoy 3D. I think that will push many potential customers up over to the Epson.
It's due to the processing power required to do both 4K UHD and 3D. The Epson is native 1080p, Optoma is higher resolution and thus requires higher resolution scaling and processing. Epson requires no scaling since 3d is 1080p like the Epson.

Really depends if you want 3D and UHD displayed at 3k (Epson) or no 3D and UHD displayed at 4k (optoma)

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post #10 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 08:53 AM
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That makes sense. I want full 4k res and 3D so ill keep waiting 😁

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post #11 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 08:55 AM - Thread Starter
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That makes sense. I want full 4k res and 3D so ill keep waiting 😁

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You can get it now in the Barco Loki, only $60k laser 0.9" XPR 4K UHD DLP with 3d ☺️
http://www.cepro.com/article/barco_l...i_4k_projector

I always found non-DLP 3d to be mediocre (crosstalk and/or flicker). Can always use a cheap DLP for 3D, as you said they are like $600 and would be way less eyestrain than Epson 3d.

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post #12 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 10:50 AM
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I wonder what the fan noise and placement options will be like in these Optomas.

Personally I don't care at all about 3D.

Quote:
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
Interesting. Last year I was asking why this wasn't a thing in TVs and projectors. Well, now it is. I would love to have this feature in a non-eshift 1080p projector actually. If companies are going to continue releasing 1080p projectors, they should be able to take 4K HDR sources (just like 720p TVs take 1080p sources). Either they display HDR10 or else they should tone map down to 709. I'm guessing that would work better than having the player do HDR to SDR conversion, but correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm thinking a 1080p projector that does HDR10 from a 4K source would be very popular as it would reasonably priced.

In the meantime I'll just deal with my Blu-ray's HDR -> SDR conversion on my 1080p Sony VPL-HW45ES. IMO, the biggest downside of my Sony is not that it is 1080p. The biggest downside is that it doesn't accept 4K sources, doesn't accept HDR, and doesn't support HDCP 2.2. I wasn't convinced it was going to be a big deal, until I saw the results of in-player HDR to SDR conversion.

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I honestly think Sony is going to drop true 4K into the 45ES line within three years. Epson may with the 3xxx and 5xxx series as well. If they do, these DLPs will only sell in the $600-$1000 range.
I hope so.

I'd strongly consider buying a US$2499 Sony 4K HDR projector in 2020.

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post #13 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 11:19 AM
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no 3D, no short throw, no thank you ill stick with my 2150

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post #14 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Call me when the UHD65 has 1500 color/white brightness matched lumens via LED illumination, with a RAPCUR level driver so no RBE, and costs less than 1.5K. I'll get one for sports and gaming unless it doesn't have quality DLP motion like reported on some of these Faux-K DLPs.

I'm keeping the Delta HT-8000 until then.

I honestly think Sony is going to drop true 4K into the 45ES line within three years. Epson may with the 3xxx and 5xxx series as well. If they do, these DLPs will only sell in the $600-$1000 range.
For people who both don't want to wait three years nor spend $10k the UHD65 allows one to experience 4k right now with great value.
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post #15 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 01:21 PM
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... Not sure how much contrast is gained due to typical PR-inflated contrast numbers! ...

500000:1 dynamic contrast
1000000:1 dynamic contrast
1200000:1 dynamic contrast ...
I can't count high enough to measure the magnitude of exaggeration.
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post #16 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 01:35 PM - Thread Starter
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I can't count high enough to measure the magnitude of exaggeration.
I think what we can probably tell is that the Uhd60 has twice the dynamic contrast of the uhd550x, and the UHD65 has 20% more dynamic contrast than the uhd60. Will have to wait and see what the real base number is though.

I would wager the 550x has so much lower dynamic contrast due to using lamp dimming instead of a dynamic iris, but I don't see confirmation of this yet.

UHD65/60 probably use dynamic iris. Likely higher contrast of UHD65 a function of RGBRGB color wheel.

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post #17 of 214 Old 05-29-2017, 08:20 PM
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The only one that looks remotely interesting is the UHD65 (RGBRGB color wheel) and, of course, it's the one that costs more than three grand.

I'm just not that hopeful that these will produce competitive dark room picture quality to products like the Epson 5040ub or even the 1080p only Sony 65ES- two projectors available for LESS than the cost of this Optoma.

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post #18 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 01:40 AM
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Yup, only good for sports and gaming when they get under 1K, assuming you're RBE insensitive.
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post #19 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 07:16 AM
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They really need to get rid of RGBCYW color wheels.

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post #20 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 08:04 AM
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They really need to get rid of RGBCYW color wheels.


Unfortunately, they serve a purpose for people who need a bright room / mixed room solution or a business solution. But I agree for a 'serious' home theater model you really want an RGBRGB model as the performance is so much better.

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post #21 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 02:51 PM
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Well at least it's progress and not an eshift model. Hopefully I'll have another few years on my AE4000. I think by then there will be a nice selection of models under $3k.
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post #22 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 05:01 PM
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Well at least it's progress and not an eshift model.
Exactly. Can't wait for the reviews. I'm very happy with my 5040, so, no biggy if they are not that great. I will wait longer. If they are great, I will be selling my 5040, lol.


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post #23 of 214 Old 05-30-2017, 05:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jasonsong View Post
They really need to get rid of RGBCYW color wheels.
As another poster noted RGBCYW are very useful for high brightness/ambient light needs. The UHD60/UHD65 are near identical other than the color wheel and chassis color. The RGBCYW wheel gains 800 lumens at the expense of 20% lower contrast and increased RBE. But if you are just watching TV in a daylight filled family room or showing PowerPoint presentations in an office it is likely worth making the tradeoff for the extra lumens.

For dark home theater use, though, RGBRGB/UHD65 is the one to get for enhanced contrast and less RBE.

Looking at these models I see three targeted markets based on specs:
Uhd550x: business
Uhd60: family room
Uhd65: home theater

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post #24 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 05:27 AM
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More outdated DLP tech

Exaggerated contrast and useless low color brightness wheels.
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post #25 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
As another poster noted RGBCYW are very useful for high brightness/ambient light needs. The UHD60/UHD65 are near identical other than the color wheel and chassis color. The RGBCYW wheel gains 800 lumens at the expense of 20% lower contrast and increased RBE. But if you are just watching TV in a daylight filled family room or showing PowerPoint presentations in an office it is likely worth making the tradeoff for the extra lumens.

For dark home theater use, though, RGBRGB/UHD65 is the one to get for enhanced contrast and less RBE.

Looking at these models I see three targeted markets based on specs:
Uhd550x: business
Uhd60: family room
Uhd65: home theater

What's the PowerPoint use case for 4K?
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post #26 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 05:56 AM
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What's the PowerPoint use case for 4K?
Project Managers/ CEO who like flashy buzz words for board room upgrades.
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post #27 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 06:19 AM - Thread Starter
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What's the PowerPoint use case for 4K?
No SDE/pixel grid during presentations for those sitting close to the screen in a meeting room (in smaller rooms not uncommon for people to sit 3ft from the screen to maximize office space), able to include smaller text more easily legible (ie excel) .

Also, projectors like the 4k 550x will eventually fully replace the 1080p models like 1080p replaced 720p due to economics of scale. Since these use a 0.67 DMD and similar size lens as a 1080p pj, once the SOC required for 4k drops in price and R&D is recouped these will be around same price as current 1080p pjs. This model helps begin that process.

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post #28 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 08:41 AM
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Exactly. Can't wait for the reviews. I'm very happy with my 5040, so, no biggy if they are not that great. I will wait longer. If they are great, I will be selling my 5040, lol.


p.s. Very nice HT you have.
Thanks, yes the 5040 seems to be the best deal if you want to get into 4k in some fashion, the eshift units seem to do a good job at faux 4k. If you have to switch back and forth from a real 4k unit and a faux 4k to notice any difference then the faux is good enough for me.

My concern with the Optoma would be RBE. Friend of mine has a budget Optoma, I need to ask the model next time I'm over his house and I can see the rainbow on any quick flash or transition of white to black.
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post #29 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 08:44 AM
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I went back to the OP and read it again, so it costs $800 more just for the RGBRGB color wheel and a black housing? Am I missing something?
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post #30 of 214 Old 05-31-2017, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
No SDE/pixel grid during presentations for those sitting close to the screen in a meeting room (in smaller rooms not uncommon for people to sit 3ft from the screen to maximize office space), able to include smaller text more easily legible (ie excel) .

Also, projectors like the 4k 550x will eventually fully replace the 1080p models like 1080p replaced 720p due to economics of scale. Since these use a 0.67 DMD and similar size lens as a 1080p pj, once the SOC required for 4k drops in price and R&D is recouped these will be around same price as current 1080p pjs. This model helps begin that process.
Not really relevant now.

No idea why they even bothered.
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