Optoma UHD60 & UHD65 4K/UHD HDR DLP Projectors Now Available - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 08:45 AM
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Okay I guess the only issue is BT2020 vs Rec 709. But I heard something very interesting from the sales rep Vivtek new 4K projector which is kinda the same as Optoma 4K PJ. He said they didn't feel it was necessary to have BT2020 because you need at leasing 8000 lumens to display it correctly. That really has me thinking.

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post #62 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by JRock3x8 View Post
the trick is how far down would I have to hang the projector to get the image to land right?
The rule of thumb remains that the horizontal level of the (ceiling mounted) projector lens is above the top edge of your image on your screen surface. How much the projector has to hang above the top edge of your image is determined by the distance between the UHD 65 and the screen, please check the user manual on pages 50 and 51 for details.

At a projection distance of 17' the lens level has to be approx. 0.7 (screen diagonal around 110") - 1 foot (screen diagonal around 170') higher than the top edge of your screen surface, ultimately depending on the size of your screen.


The key in understanding how an Optoma lens works is to remember that usually an Optoma hangs much higher on the opposite side of the room than the top edge of the screen. Optoma has understood that this doesn't work in most home theater environments, the 'lens shift' (remember the Sharp DLP projectors where lens shift did mean "lens shift"?) in their case is mostly to correct this terrible "offset", i.e. to enable the user to bring the projector down and closer to the top of the screen.

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post #63 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 09:05 AM
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At a projection distance of 17' the lens level has to be approx. 0.7 (screen diagonal around 110") - 1 foot (screen diagonal around 170') higher than the top edge of your screen surface, ultimately depending on the size of your screen.
that's very interesting because my Benq 1070 - the lens is more or less at the top of the screen and I have to do a fair amount of keystone adjustment (push the image down) just to make it right.

Sounds like I might actually need the vertical shift to push the image up instead of down.

edit : my screen is 144 x 60 (homemade with spandex) and is about 9" - 12" from the ceiling. PJ is probably 4" - 6" from ceiling? I have the cheapie videosecu mount from amazon

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post #64 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 09:11 AM
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AFAIK import tax in Germany for consumer electronic products is 0%, but a VAT of 19% is imposed on all products which I already considered / subtracted, so my question remains.


Or Optoma USA is anticipating the implementation of the new import taxes the 45th president has announced. So eventually we'll all pay the same price.
You certain, there's 400 euros of cost somewhere in the chain.
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post #65 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 09:27 AM
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If it does the same good job as his predecessor HD 83(00) did with DVDs and BDs now with UHD BDs I'm not worried one bit.

Had a chance to test the FI performance of a JVC DLA-X35 and was rather underwhelmed, none of the Clear Motion Drive settings got close to the performance of the Optoma HD 83 and its siblings up to the HD 50, I think I understood for the first time why there is talk of haloes and artifacts (in contrast the latest JVC DLA-X5500 delivers a good FI performance that's almost indistinguishable from the PureMotion FI performance I've seen with Optomas).
Go to the parachute scene in the movie "kingsman: The Secret Service" and see what happens there with your HD83, see if that scene stays together.
I haven't come across one FI algorithm that can handle that scene.

Also, "The Shawshank Redemption"
Near the end after Morgan Freeman is dropped off in front of a corn field, see how much halo effect there is here.
It's an FI nightmare for any algorithm.
Of all the FI systems I've dealt with, my Sony 300es works best, my old Panny 4000 takes second place _ DmitriRender does OK too and takes 3rd.
None however is perfect, it's a very difficult scene to handle and it makes a good test.
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post #66 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 09:59 AM
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Go to the parachute scene in the movie "kingsman: The Secret Service" and see what happens there with your HD83, see if that scene stays together.
I haven't come across one FI algorithm that can handle that scene.

Also, "The Shawshank Redemption"
Near the end after Morgan Freeman is dropped off in front of a corn field, see how much halo effect there is here.
It's an FI nightmare for any algorithm.

Didn't we talk about that a long time ago? I don't remember seeing that much or severe halo effects there. As it turned out it's rather slow scenes that appear to constitute a problem for FI.


2001 example: The scene where Dr. Floyd has arrived in the outer ring of Space Station V and the elevator doors open, both the outside and inside of the white elevator cabin are covered with sheets of tiny square inlets:


Optoma (HD 83/ HD 50): Only one panel behind the Stewardess sitting there with Dr. Floyd wobbles
JVC DLA-X35: Several Panels wooble
JVC DLA-X5500: There are shortly large and blank triangles on the outer cabin


Other than that both Optoma's PureMotion or JVC's Clear Motion Drive (on the X5500) perform rather nicely and almost halo- and artifact-free. If you see characters in House of Cards moving against each other there are sometimes tiny areas of "digital confusion" next to the characters with PureMotion while C.M.D. has the tendency to feature tiny vertical ghost images trailing the characters.
But those are rather exceptions than general observations.


Another great image test are the rolling screen credits at the end of each House of cards episode, PureMotion rolls these smoothly without any apparent problems, the X5500 sometimes has to catch up (refresh).

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post #67 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by JRock3x8 View Post
that's very interesting because my Benq 1070 - the lens is more or less at the top of the screen and I have to do a fair amount of keystone adjustment (push the image down) just to make it right.

Sounds like I might actually need the vertical shift to push the image up instead of down.

edit : my screen is 144 x 60 (homemade with spandex) and is about 9" - 12" from the ceiling. PJ is probably 4" - 6" from ceiling? I have the cheapie videosecu mount from amazon
You never want to use keystone adjustment. Not good for picture quality. Just FYI.

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post #68 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 11:20 AM
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You never want to use keystone adjustment. Not good for picture quality. Just FYI.
unless I want my back row to wear fire retardant hats I don't really have a choice.
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post #69 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:07 PM
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Okay I guess the only issue is BT2020 vs Rec 709. But I heard something very interesting from the sales rep Vivtek new 4K projector which is kinda the same as Optoma 4K PJ. He said they didn't feel it was necessary to have BT2020 because you need at leasing 8000 lumens to display it correctly. That really has me thinking.

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It sounds like your sales rep is confusing bt2020 WCG with HDR.

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unless I want my back row to wear fire retardant hats I don't really have a choice.

Your choice was to buy and use a projector that worked in your environment without having to use keystone.
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post #70 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:09 PM
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Your choice was to buy and use a projector that worked in your environment without having to use keystone.
my choice was to get started with my theater or wait 5 years to buy a "real" projector. I happen to think I made a great choice.
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post #71 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:21 PM
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my choice was to get started with my theater or wait 5 years to buy a "real" projector. I happen to think I made a great choice.

So there really wasn't one other projector in your budget range that could've done it without having to use keystone? OK, fair enough, but that's a pretty big trade off considering keystone destroys your native resolution. If you bought a 1080p projector it's closer to 720p now with aliasing, moire' and other artifacts being introduced as well.
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post #72 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:24 PM
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So there really wasn't one other projector in your budget range that could've done it without having to use keystone? OK, fair enough, but that's a pretty big trade off considering keystone destroys your native resolution. If you bought a 1080p projector it's closer to 720p now with aliasing, moire' and other artifacts being introduced as well.
I've never owned a projector before so I have no idea what you're talking about - I think my movies look damn good on my 12' wide screen. I look forward (as was always the plan) to upgrading to nicer tech as time and money allows and seeing a better quality product. But it was always going to have to be throw away money. I was never going to spend 5 or 10 grand on a projector. I have 3 kids to put through college.
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post #73 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:27 PM
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unless I want my back row to wear fire retardant hats I don't really have a choice.


I don't understand... the W1070 should be able to easily clear heads and project onto even a fairly low mounted screen without the use of keystone correction. I use a short extension tube with my benq HT2050 but that's only because I wanted my screen as close to the floor as possible.

Do you have pictures of your setup?

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post #74 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:31 PM
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I don't understand... the W1070 should be able to easily clear heads and project onto even a fairly low mounted screen without the use of keystone correction. I use a short extension tube with my benq HT2050 but that's only because I wanted my screen as close to the floor as possible.

Do you have pictures of your setup?
boy we are way off topic here...

Shermer Theater - Construction Wrapping Up

that couch is gone btw.
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post #75 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:35 PM
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boy we are way off topic here...



Shermer Theater - Construction Wrapping Up



that couch is gone btw.


Ok. Someone tell me what I'm missing because that mounting looks fine. Just level off the projector and use the lens shift to move the picture down. I'm shocked you can't square that screen from that mounting point.

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post #76 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:38 PM
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Ok. Someone tell me what I'm missing because that mounting looks fine. Just level off the projector and use the lens shift to move the picture down. I'm shocked you can't square that screen from that mounting point.
maybe I don't know how to use the the lens shift but I turned the little knob and it did almost nothing.
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post #77 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:47 PM
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Hm... On the w1070 you need to use a screw driver to adjust the lens shift. The adjustment is hidden under a plastic cover titled... well, lens shift. Without meaning offense: did you try that?

What to do if you find yourself stuck with no hope of rescue:
Consider yourself lucky that life has been good to you so far. Alternatively, if life hasn't been good to you so far, which given your present circumstances seems to be more likely, consider yourself lucky that it won't be troubling you much longer...

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post #78 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:50 PM
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Didn't we talk about that a long time ago? I don't remember seeing that much or severe halo effects there. As it turned out it's rather slow scenes that appear to constitute a problem for FI.


2001 example: The scene where Dr. Floyd has arrived in the outer ring of Space Station V and the elevator doors open, both the outside and inside of the white elevator cabin are covered with sheets of tiny square inlets:


Optoma (HD 83/ HD 50): Only one panel behind the Stewardess sitting there with Dr. Floyd wobbles
JVC DLA-X35: Several Panels wooble
JVC DLA-X5500: There are shortly large and blank triangles on the outer cabin


Other than that both Optoma's PureMotion or JVC's Clear Motion Drive (on the X5500) perform rather nicely and almost halo- and artifact-free. If you see characters in House of Cards moving against each other there are sometimes tiny areas of "digital confusion" next to the characters with PureMotion while C.M.D. has the tendency to feature tiny vertical ghost images trailing the characters.
But those are rather exceptions than general observations.


Another great image test are the rolling screen credits at the end of each House of cards episode, PureMotion rolls these smoothly without any apparent problems, the X5500 sometimes has to catch up (refresh).
Probably yeah.
There's been so many posts here and on a few other places, I can't remember.
At any rate it will be interesting to see what the new Optoma can do.
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post #79 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 12:51 PM
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Hm... On the w1070 you need to use a screw driver to adjust the lens shift. The adjustment is hidden under a plastic cover titled... well, lens shift. Without meaning offense: did you try that?
no offense taken and yes that's what I was referring to.

Maybe mine is stuck? Although I think I have a different projector than the one I bought (dead pixel, swapped out for new, god bless benq...) - I should probably try it again.
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....... But it was always going to have to be throw away money. I was never going to spend 5 or 10 grand on a projector. I have 3 kids to put through college.

Which is why I made sure to say "in your budget range".
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post #81 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 01:04 PM
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no offense taken and yes that's what I was referring to.



Maybe mine is stuck? Although I think I have a different projector than the one I bought (dead pixel, swapped out for new, god bless benq...) - I should probably try it again.


It's worth a shot. I found his diagram on the web. Obviously you'd need to flip this upside down to a ceiling mount but the concept is the same.



Your screen looks unusually wide. Is that a 2.35? If it is do you over shoot or do you just not use the extra space along the sides?

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post #82 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 01:11 PM
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It's worth a shot. I found his diagram on the web. Obviously you'd need to flip this upside down to a ceiling mount but the concept is the same.



Your screen looks unusually wide. Is that a 2.35? If it is do you over shoot or do you just not use the extra space along the sides?
i will manually zoom out for blu ray movies - most of the time the sides are not used - will address that at some point with some masking of some form.

the beauty of the benq and where I've positioned it is that the zoom is ALL the way one way for 16:9 and ALL the way the other way for 2.35

Thanks for the img - like I said I did that and a) the knob didn't move much and b) it didn't affect the image much at all - maybe mine is broken.
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post #83 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 01:25 PM
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i will manually zoom out for blu ray movies - most of the time the sides are not used - will address that at some point with some masking of some form.



the beauty of the benq and where I've positioned it is that the zoom is ALL the way one way for 16:9 and ALL the way the other way for 2.35



Thanks for the img - like I said I did that and a) the knob didn't move much and b) it didn't affect the image much at all - maybe mine is broken.

You know, if you're over shooting the screen that could be your issue. By over shooting you might have the top edge of the image (the top of the black bar) above the center point of the lens which the projector cannot do. Idk. I feel like you should be able to make that work somehow without keystone. It's not like the w1070 is especially limited and, to be honest, eliminating the need for keystone correction would be like upgrading your projector, IMO. I believe you that it looks fine now but squaring the projector and being able to utilize all your available resolution as well as being able to completely focus your lens should represent a pretty substantial increase in picture quality.

What to do if you find yourself stuck with no hope of rescue:
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post #84 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 01:28 PM
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You know, if you're over shooting the screen that could be your issue. By over shooting you might have the top edge of the image (the top of the black bar) above the center point of the lens which the projector cannot do. Idk. I feel like you should be able to make that work somehow without keystone. It's not like the w1070 is especially limited and, to be honest, eliminating the need for keystone correction would be like upgrading your projector, IMO. I believe you that it looks fine now but squaring the projector and being able to utilize all your available resolution as well as being able to completely focus your lens should represent a pretty substantial increase in picture quality.
well I don't have to adjust keystone between 16:9 and 2.35:1 so whatever like I said it doesn't bother me because I don't know any better but I'll give the vertical shift another shot when I put my screen back up (theater is torn down for pending carpet install at the moment)
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post #85 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 02:02 PM
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am i allowed to start screaming incoherently with joy? cuz I wanna...

is this HDR finally going to be XBox compatible?
yeah, the optoma info page lists xbox one and ps4pro HDR compatibilities!!
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yeah, the optoma info page lists xbox one and ps4pro HDR compatibilities!!
if Destiny 2 supports Scorpio at all, I'm going to have a really hard time not buying this
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post #87 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 02:09 PM
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Just to avoid any misunderstandings: The new 4K Optoma projectors do not feature any "keystone" adjustment controls!

Went to the German HiFi Forum today and a certain George L. - whom I remember to be a reliable person - stated that the Optoma UHD 65 - unlike its 'little' brothers - will not become available in Germany before September (apparently to coincide with IFA 2017 in Berlin). I'll verify this tomorrow with Optoma.

So President # 45 should like Optoma - America First (and the Krauts will pay an extra premium once they can get a UHD 65 in September)!
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no offense taken and yes that's what I was referring to.

Maybe mine is stuck? Although I think I have a different projector than the one I bought (dead pixel, swapped out for new, god bless benq...) - I should probably try it again.
Mine got stuck too until I loosed the lens bolts during a full rebuild, it's not exactly a super awesome sliding mechanism behind the scenes, but it's pretty obvious what went wrong: I didn't follow the instructions in the service manual fully to avoid tightening them too much. I'm sure dust and grime can make the lens shift stop sliding too. Probably just needs a cleanup.
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post #89 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by sage11x View Post
No. Like most DLPs this projector has very limited lens shift. No horizontal and the vertical shift amounts to 18% of the image height. This is a unit designed for ceiling mount and ceiling mount only.
The lens shift is terrible for me since my proj is shelf mounted up high close to the ceiling.
Didnt Sim 2 used to have good vertical lens shift?

I wish we could get great blacks and good lens shift with DLP

Murray Thompson
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Absolutly no connection with RapalloNZ
CinemascopE Home Cinema Build & 2014 rebuild
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post #90 of 1934 Old 06-06-2017, 04:12 PM
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No 3D? On a high end projector?
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