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post #91 of 922 Old 02-16-2005, 05:18 AM
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ROne,

Got a question for you...I started my Z3 with the settings that you provided earlier and with very slight tweaking, I get what I think is an absolutley dynamite picture. Then, I borrow a copy of Digital Video Essentials and, for fun, try to correct color decoder inaccuracies using the provided 3 color window/test patterns via DVE. Making some great changes to the many RGB values listed above, I got very close to perfection according to the test patterns and provided color window. Then I switch to some program material and it looks like crap! Color is now way off. I happily went back to my saved configuration and all is well again. Why would getting closer to what the color test patterns indicate, make program material worse? Just curious. Thanks.

Dan
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post #92 of 922 Old 02-16-2005, 07:49 AM
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When you say colour do you mean saturation or colour balance across the greys?

If saturation then I wouldn't expect you have colour decoder problems as colour saturation is not adjustable on the projector in HDMI is it?

I suppose you may be talking about saturation at the source - on TT I stick to about -50.

Another thing - DVE uses a colour chart encoded in PAL or NTSC, I would imagine that the saturation information is not appropriate for a digital colour-space and would not be accurate.

I do my colour by eye and then test it across many discs, as lots of disc have bad colour information.

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post #93 of 922 Old 02-16-2005, 08:47 AM
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First off, I'm using component and NTSC. I didn't actually check my greys but I'm sure that is what would have shown my problem. The picture was overly green as far I remember.

I'm sure it doesn't help that I was just "blindly" raising and lowering the red and green values until I got as close to what the color test patterns were supposed to look like through the gels. My blue was right on when I started so I didn't need to change it.

My assumption was that getting the test patterns to appear as was explained using the gels, could only make things better. Not that simple apparently....

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post #94 of 922 Old 02-16-2005, 02:22 PM
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Dan - it sounds like to me you like your colour balance/white reference point is too green. Yet you are trying to calibrate the saturation rather than the colour balance (the balance of white/grey with no saturation.)

Gels will not point you in the right direction here.

If there is too much green in the picture - yes you can try and tune it out with the RGB but not using the gels as your reference. The only way you can tune the "colour" of grey/white is with a device that measures colour such as colorfacts (as expensive to buy as your Z3!).

You can try and eyeball it to a reference described by colour temperature (how warm or cold it is) for 6500 standard, the reference films are usually telecined at. But getting hold of a 6500 kelvin reference system is easier said than done.

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post #95 of 922 Old 02-18-2005, 08:38 PM
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Has anyone done any testing with settings on the component video inputs??


I have an HD Cable receiver which I am connecting via component video..

What is the best way to calibrate the projector for this type of device?


Would it be a bad idea to just temporarily hook up a DVD Player and run the basic AVIA calibrations and use them with my HD receiver, or would that only be useful for that DVD player only?
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post #96 of 922 Old 02-21-2005, 06:59 PM
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hello,
This is my first post but I've been lurking for awhile. I've owned a Z2 and now a Z3. I'm very happy with the upgrade except.....

First off...
I'm using a Panny S97S w/ HDMI
projecting a 92" diag onto a Dalite High Contrast Screen
I've used the settings posted in this thread and I've calibrated contrast and brightness with Avia.
Contrast is at +10
Brightness at 0
Gamma at 0
all of the Panny settings are at zero
Firmware version 1.00

Anyway, in very black scenes or very bright scenes my image is very grainy. Very black scenes will actually show gray specs that flash in and out of the scene. On the other hand, very bright scenes seem to pulse brighter at times. In general, poor transfers look very bad (very grainy). LOTR fellowship of the ring first issue disk looks completely washed out in parts.

Could this be a problem with my contrast adjustment?
Noise?
or, I hate to say it, version 1.00?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Ian

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post #97 of 922 Old 02-22-2005, 12:39 AM
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Ian you have PM
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post #98 of 922 Old 02-23-2005, 04:39 AM
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I have had a Z3 for a couple of days now (after my panny 100 blew up)
I get a good image from my tosh550 DVDplayer with component inputs. I also use a HTPC. The picture is OK with the VGA/RGB input. The graphics / desktop seem OK with the DVI output from my radeon 7500, but when watching DVD with power DVD, the picture is a bit jerky. Why would it be jerky with DVI but not RGB. I am a bit of a newbie to DVI /HDMI!!! Thanks
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post #99 of 922 Old 02-26-2005, 11:55 PM
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Re: color/tint uniformity...problem solved

Quote:
Originally posted by Big Kahuna Daddy
A fellow a.v.s forum member "pm'ed" me a solution to the tint uniformity problem. He said simply go into the menu, go to advanced settings, go to iris. The idea is to "open" the iris, and this will TOTALLY solve the tint shift.
In cinema color the iris is factory set to -38. Adjusting the level to -21 will fix the tint. Even a level of -30 made a huge difference. You can then adjust the brightness and contrast to make up for the open iris black level decrease.


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post #100 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 08:56 AM
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That's very interesting - and worth having a mess with ...

However you will not be able to lower your black level to the same degree with your iris open more.

Why? Because the iris determines the floor of light output, and brightness adjusts only to the floor of the iris.

This doesn't mean you will necessarily sacrifice contrast, just black level.

An interesting tweak though.

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post #101 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 11:04 AM
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FWIW, I have the iris open to -21, but have the Z3 paired with a Carada High Contrast Gray screen (fairly dark gray). This combo provides very good black levels,contrast, "punch", and GREATLY reduced tint uniformity issues.
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post #102 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 11:37 AM
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Are there any optics geniuses out there who could explain to us why the iris is affecting color uniformity?

Tom
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post #103 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 11:43 AM
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My guess ....

Because if you limit the light output to a certain extent - the bulb can't illuminate the panel with enough intensity to hide imperfections?

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post #104 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 02:16 PM
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Hi,

I have a 2HD (Z2) and I'd like to ask if much of the info in this thread can be applied to the Z2 as well?

Thank you,

bedo
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post #105 of 922 Old 02-27-2005, 04:30 PM
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Hey All -

I originally had this in the Z3 owners thread, but now that I saw this thread I figured it'd be more appropriate here. Let me know if you have any thoughts on this...

I've had my Z3 about a week now, and I'm starting to get frustrated with the focus. It looks great in many shots, but whenever the focus is on something not in a close-up, it looks out of focus to me. I've played with the focus extensively, and cannot seem to fix this.

A couple things to consider - #1, I am currrently projecting onto my wall (painted misty evening grey). #2, I don't think this was as noticable before I finished mounting it on the ceiling this weekend (could just be cause I've watched a lot more since then and didn't notice before). #3 before I had it ceiling mounted, the cables were running along the floor, now they are in the ceiling and closer (still over a foot away) to some electric wiring.

One other note - this is all based on watching DVDs using component video cables.

Obviously you can see my suspisions. Any thoughts on what it might be? Is it just that I need to hurry up and order a screen? By the way, I've played with the sharpness settings on the pj.

Thanks,
Jeff
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post #106 of 922 Old 02-28-2005, 12:14 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by affeking
Hey All -

I originally had this in the Z3 owners thread, but now that I saw this thread I figured it'd be more appropriate here. Let me know if you have any thoughts on this...

I've had my Z3 about a week now, and I'm starting to get frustrated with the focus. It looks great in many shots, but whenever the focus is on something not in a close-up, it looks out of focus to me. I've played with the focus extensively, and cannot seem to fix this.

One other note - this is all based on watching DVDs using component video cables.

Jeff

Jeff,
I don't have an answer for you, but I too just got a Z3 in the past week, which replaced a Z2 that I had for a year. The Z3 does look slightly fuzzy in comparison to the Z2. No amount of focus or sharpness adjustment makes it any better. However, I just finished watching the Oscars in HD and the picture was sharp as a tack. But other HD broadcasts as well as DVDs and SDTV broadcasts have all looked softer and slightly out of focus on my new Z3 compared to my year old Z2.

I have a Da-Lite Hi Power 92 X 52 pull down screen.

Tom
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post #107 of 922 Old 02-28-2005, 01:03 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jefe noche
FWIW, I have the iris open to -21, but have the Z3 paired with a Carada High Contrast Gray screen (fairly dark gray). This combo provides very good black levels,contrast, "punch", and GREATLY reduced tint uniformity issues.

thank you" jefe"for this great tweek, it fixed the tint uniformity totally for me. I have had the Z3 for 5 days now and we just luv it. Iam a major critic and i really cant find anything to bitch about with this brilliant pj. just marvelous.

"Aloha"
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post #108 of 922 Old 02-28-2005, 08:55 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by TCroly
Jeff,
I don't have an answer for you, but I too just got a Z3 in the past week, which replaced a Z2 that I had for a year. The Z3 does look slightly fuzzy in comparison to the Z2. No amount of focus or sharpness adjustment makes it any better. However, I just finished watching the Oscars in HD and the picture was sharp as a tack. But other HD broadcasts as well as DVDs and SDTV broadcasts have all looked softer and slightly out of focus on my new Z3 compared to my year old Z2.

I have a Da-Lite Hi Power 92 X 52 pull down screen.

Tom

Tom -

Just curious, what cables are you using for your different sources? I'm using component for DVDs (its a long 35' too...) and S-Video for my Directv (non-high def). The problem seems to appear on both of them, so I'm inclinded to assume that's not the issue, but I wonder if using HDMI (or shorter cables) would solve it...

I was thinking it might just be the fact that I'm blowing up the relatively low def DVD image so large, but even when I shrink it down to a little over 70" the fuziness looks bad. I wish I could sit mine next to someone else's Z3 and figure out if I have a legitimate problem I need to have it serviced for... By the way, I don't have HDTV to test with.

Thanks,
jeff
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post #109 of 922 Old 02-28-2005, 12:01 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by affeking
Tom -

Just curious, what cables are you using for your different sources? I'm using component for DVDs (its a long 35' too...) and S-Video for my Directv (non-high def). The problem seems to appear on both of them, so I'm inclined to assume that's not the issue, but I wonder if using HDMI (or shorter cables) would solve it...

I was thinking it might just be the fact that I'm blowing up the relatively low def DVD image so large, but even when I shrink it down to a little over 70" the fuzziness looks bad. I wish I could sit mine next to someone else's Z3 and figure out if I have a legitimate problem I need to have it serviced for... By the way, I don't have HDTV to test with.

Thanks,
jeff

Jeff,
I feel exactly as you. I would like to test my projector side by side with another to see if this problem is "just the way it is" or if there is something wrong with my particular projector. The fact that you describe the exact same thing, makes me less inclined to think it is something wrong with the projector. I notice this softness most on superimposed graphics, like the score of a ball game posted at the bottom of the picture. I was watching a basketball game in HD and it looked pretty good, but the score graphic looked soft and out of focus.

The cables might be the issue and I am going to get some new cables to do some testing. I am using inexpensive, 3 foot long, component cables to connect my HD cable box and my DVD player to the projector. The Tivo goes via S-video cable. But the Tivo PQ has always been soft compared to the cable box or DVD.

I was using a VGA breakout cable with a VGA to DVI adapter to connect the DVD player to the Z2. This was resulting in a pretty sharp picture, but for some reason the VGA input on the Z3 does not recognize the output from my DVD player the way the DVI input of the Z2 would.

I plan to get an up-converting DVD player that I will connect to the projector with HDMI, but I am waiting for the Panasonic S77 to be released in April.

Tom
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post #110 of 922 Old 03-01-2005, 02:25 PM
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Hi there,

My Z3 and Panasonic S97 arrived yesterday and I'm shocked at how amazing the picture quality is! When it comes to tweaking it I'm not even sure where to begin so I look forward to reading this thread in depth, I'm curious if I should be watching my DVD's in 720p or 1080i??

Also when I hook up my VCR (with the RCA cable) I'm getting a line through the image which starts at the bottom of the screen and slowly travels upwards, is there any way to fix this?

Thanks,
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post #111 of 922 Old 03-01-2005, 03:51 PM
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Crab, it is really a matter of preferrence and source material. Some may argue that the LCD panels are native 720p and therefore you should use 720p to avoid artifacts, vb, etc.. Others will argue that the 1080i is higher resolution and should be used instead. When it comes down to it......what looks good to you?

Your question prompted a question of my own. How does the upscaling feature of the Z3 work? The manual makes it sound like it only upscales from 480i to 480p. Does it also upscale 480p to 720p or will you need an upscaling player like th S97 to do this. When my player is set to output 480p the Z3 always displays 480p output. Is this right? If it's upscaling shouldn it not display 720p?

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post #112 of 922 Old 03-01-2005, 04:13 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by leitweight
I have a custom setting on the Z3 for brighter output which works pretty well.

It's great to hear that about the High Power Da-lite, as I just purchased one.

What is your custom setting?

thanks,
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post #113 of 922 Old 03-01-2005, 04:21 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by ianjenkins


Your question prompted a question of my own. How does the upscaling feature of the Z3 work? The manual makes it sound like it only upscales from 480i to 480p. Does it also upscale 480p to 720p or will you need an upscaling player like th S97 to do this. When my player is set to output 480p the Z3 always displays 480p output. Is this right? If it's upscaling shouldn it not display 720p?

It's weird the way that it's shown in the maneual as only having 480p. In actuality when you get to that point in your set up you just push the right arrow on the remote and you get the other two choices (720p & 1080i)
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post #114 of 922 Old 03-02-2005, 06:57 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by crab1664
Hi there,

My Z3 and Panasonic S97 arrived yesterday and I'm shocked at how amazing the picture quality is! When it comes to tweaking it I'm not even sure where to begin so I look forward to reading this thread in depth, I'm curious if I should be watching my DVD's in 720p or 1080i??

Also when I hook up my VCR (with the RCA cable) I'm getting a line through the image which starts at the bottom of the screen and slowly travels upwards, is there any way to fix this?

Thanks,

I use 720p so that there's no reformatting of the image. But actually, I do not see any difference between 720p or 1080i.

When I hook up my vcr (480i), I have similar problem/s unless I choose 480i or Auto. Now I'm not sure how the upscaling should work. On another subject, the vcr caused a hum to go thru my audio system which prompted me to disconnect it.
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post #115 of 922 Old 03-05-2005, 08:06 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by crab1664
It's great to hear that about the High Power Da-lite, as I just purchased one.

What is your custom setting?

thanks,

Crab,

It's just increased Iris and a brighter bulb mode, then a recalibration of Contrast, etc at these settings. I am way too busy right now to even check what my settings are, but when I have a chance I can post them.
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post #116 of 922 Old 03-16-2005, 03:40 PM
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bump

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post #117 of 922 Old 03-16-2005, 06:32 PM
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Got the PJ, so whats the first thing I need to do ? Buy a calibration DVD ?

Picture looks great , but I have no frame of reference to judge it against..

Sometimes ignorance is bliss

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post #118 of 922 Old 03-17-2005, 05:31 AM
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Go to the first page for settings by other owners. Then adjust to taste... and like you have said... "Sometimes ignorance is bliss". Most of all enjoy...
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post #119 of 922 Old 03-17-2005, 06:58 PM
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question..

I am watching on a screen painted behr silverscreen..

I think it is a bit "dim"

the contrast is incredible, but overall i like brighter pictures




maybe the screen is a little too dark gray ???


what do you guys think ? am I better off with white, or a few shades lighter gray ?

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post #120 of 922 Old 03-19-2005, 02:53 PM
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I'm trying to get my Z3 looking good with a 720p input over HDMI from a samsung 841 upconverting player. I'm been trying everything and searching this forum and still can't find anything to help. The picture just doesn't look good. To me it doesn't look as good as a 480p picture. So I must be doing something wrong.

Could someone tell me what user setting (color, iris, etc...) they have made on thier Z3 for this kind of input? I'm at my witts end with this.

Thanks for any help
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