Optoma HD70. The new budget king. - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP > Optoma HD70. The new budget king.
MTyson's Avatar MTyson 09:12 AM 09-13-2006
I never thought I'd see the day where high quality HD DLP out did the best HD LCDs in price, especially dramatically lower. Not that long ago even the XGA units like the H1100 were going for $3,500-$4,000 and were far more expensive and they weren't even true HD. DLP used to command at least $1,000 to $2,000 more minimum over HD home theater LCDs.

LCD's only option it seems would be to release $699-$799 high quality 720p model, but for some reason I don't see that happening. Exciting times in digital front projection.

price3's Avatar price3 09:13 AM 09-13-2006
I just wish these low cost DLP's didn't alienate so many users with offset issues.
nightfly13's Avatar nightfly13 09:17 AM 09-13-2006
(after reading projector central review)

SOLD! This saves me another 200 hours reading comparison reviews of last years crop of 720Ps The offset will work for me just fine.
akdude47's Avatar akdude47 09:36 AM 09-13-2006
I just wish it had more zoom range When you guys get yours, and like them, I'll order. I need to replace my X1 in the worst way possible!
mjolson's Avatar mjolson 10:24 AM 09-13-2006
Kudos to Optoma for breaking the $1k barrier!
jeff442's Avatar jeff442 10:31 AM 09-13-2006
Not to poo poo the H70, as I love Optoma and what they've accomplished, but I'm glad I paid the extra $300 and bought an HD72. Fan noise is very important to me and I don't mind having a DVI/HDMI plus a little extra contrast and color fidelity. I will definitely be recommending the HD70 to friends though, as sub $1000 is ridiculous!
HeadRusch's Avatar HeadRusch 10:34 AM 09-13-2006
When I got my H31 last August I told my wife "This will last us the next couple years until the HD projectors really come down in price".

........

Oh well


My "new bulb" fund now covers nearly 1/2 the cost of a 720p DLP projector. Woot!

Actually unlike most folks, I wont be rushing out to buy a HD or BluRay player, nor will I run my cable to the PJ for HD signals (more than likely, in the short term). The primary reason I'm buying is so I can sit a little closer to my 106" screen than the 480p H31 would allow me......
MTyson's Avatar MTyson 10:43 AM 09-13-2006
Ok, everyone including PJCentral is going on about it being $1k. So that is the MSRP? Visual Apex has the MSRP at about $1495. Which is it? If the MSRP is $999 that means it'll be streeting for less than $999 sooner which is really great.

$999 means by next year it could be had for as low as $500-$700. How insane is that? At that price someone could mod it with an iris and even partially block the white segment for improved contrast and saturation. It would be like getting a highend HD DLP super cheap.

I'm just really curiouis if LCD manufacturers like Panasonic and Sanyo will fire back with a cheaper LCD or if they are flat out beaten in price for good by DLP. If not, this projector should destroy the sales of non C2Fine, non 1080p LCD projectors.
HeadRusch's Avatar HeadRusch 11:21 AM 09-13-2006
Thats a very interesting consideration, and one I brought up in a thread not too long ago.....if we have a 720p DLP in the $1k retail range, seriously, LCD's would lose their one primary saving grace...price.

Now, really, the only thing LCD's would offer would be.....lens shift. Hmmmm....it'll be interesting to see how many other manufacturers place their 720p DLP's in the 1K to 1.5K range now.

I just wish I could get a read on how the unit performs with keystone turned on..I'll definately need to keystone my image in my setup if I go with a HD70. I keystone my H31 now but there is no visual degredation...I'm not sure if that will carry over to a higher-rez image tho. So its in the cart, I just haven't clicked "preorder" yet....
lynesjc's Avatar lynesjc 12:26 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by nightfly13 View Post

(after reading projector central review)

720p DLP for $1k from a reputable vendor? Wow! Just wow!
lynesjc's Avatar lynesjc 12:31 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

I'm just really curiouis if LCD manufacturers like Panasonic and Sanyo will fire back with a cheaper LCD or if they are flat out beaten in price for good by DLP. If not, this projector should destroy the sales of non C2Fine, non 1080p LCD projectors.

This does become the question doesn't it? They'll have to discount 1080p much faster than they planned to remain competitive.
TexasHeat's Avatar TexasHeat 12:34 PM 09-13-2006
WOOT! is right.... Oh.. and from what I've read the price isn't LCD's only saving grace =)
FiveMillionWays's Avatar FiveMillionWays 12:41 PM 09-13-2006
LMAO @ the comments. I got my first 720 p projector a year ago for less then that. I believe LCD will go lower then this because they are moving toward 1080 P models. It's fantastic the prices have come down so low so fast. This will put pressure on Infocus and Benq as far as price slashing goes and just may put Infocus out of business in the home theater market to say the least. Keep um coming I say!
FiveMillionWays's Avatar FiveMillionWays 12:45 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by lynesjc View Post

This does become the question doesn't it? They'll have to discount 1080p much faster than they planned to remain competitive.

Being a fan of LCD I hope you are right my friend. I was going to purchase a flat screen t.v for all the time viewing and using my projector for movies and big game viewing. Now I'm thinking of purchasing a new projector instead. Perhaps they are going to use a simular tactic the printer manufactures use by selling the equipment cheap and charging an arm and a leg for replacement lamps. I hope this is not the case.
MTyson's Avatar MTyson 12:50 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHeat View Post

WOOT! is right.... Oh.. and from what I've read the price isn't LCD's only saving grace =)

Price and projector placement options are their biggest advantages. DLP has the black level, contrast (despite those riduclous specs the LCDs claim now) & shadow detail advantage. DLP also has less screendoor than the Z4 while being sharper than the AE900 which uses SmoothScreen to get rid of SDE (softening the picture). DLPs also lack vertical banding which is something I cannot stomach.

720p DLPs used to cost $1000-$2000+ more than the LCDs and they got away with it. Now that one is way cheaper DLP has become the price/performance king of HD digitals.

If one were to mod the HD70 with an Iris it would become and eve better deal. The mod is simple too and the unit apparently has brightness to spare. Image AI combined with an iris = Very high contrast for a $999 DLP.
lynesjc's Avatar lynesjc 01:19 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

I'm just really curious if RPTV manufacturers like Panasonic, Mits, Sony, Samsung, and Hitachi will fire back with cheaper RPTV's or if they are flat out beaten in price/performance for good by front projection DLP. If not, this projector should destroy RPTV sales.

Fixed your post.
Lawguy's Avatar Lawguy 02:02 PM 09-13-2006
This is a very dramatic move on Optoma's part and also a very good one for all of us.

I think that this has to mean that the street price of 720p LCDs is going to have to fall below $1000. LCDs still have more features and there are those that will never figure out how to mount one and just buy an LCD. Let's hope that this really puts pressure on 1080p LCD pricing.

Also (and this is not to be taken lightly) Optoma has had a lot of quality control problems on expensive projectors. I suspect that we will see more of them on this model.


Bottom line is that we all win as the PQ per dollar ratio just jumped and will continue to jump in the coming months.
Jones_Rush's Avatar Jones_Rush 02:10 PM 09-13-2006
2 questions about the Projector Central review:

1. How come they say the color wheel is 4X when official specs say 5X. Where is the mistake ?.

2. Did the reviewer based his good opinion when watching dark films, assuming you are using ImageAI ?.

Overal amazing review.
Matt Tucker's Avatar Matt Tucker 03:20 PM 09-13-2006
Hey guys -

The HD70 officially has a 4x, 7 segment color wheel.
TomJones's Avatar TomJones 03:20 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawguy View Post

Also (and this is not to be taken lightly) Optoma has had a lot of quality control problems on expensive projectors. I suspect that we will see more of them on this model.

I've been studying lcd pjs, but now have become interested in the HD70. Could someone mention the type of quality control problems Optoma has had?
Jones_Rush's Avatar Jones_Rush 03:34 PM 09-13-2006
Probably lamps exploding prematurely.

And if we're talking about lamps, how much will a replacement lamp cost for the HD70 ?.
dragonbud0's Avatar dragonbud0 04:28 PM 09-13-2006
PC had wrong specs on the old benq 6200; it was 2x but PC said 4X, so thye could be wrong again on the HD70 - sounds more like a 4X, not 5X.
DanLW's Avatar DanLW 04:42 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProjectorCentral View Post

There are four buttons corresponding to the HD70's aspect ratios (4:3, 16:9, Letterbox, and Native), ...

So for those of us who may consider doing a constant height setup later on, this projector won't require a video scaler? Hey, perhaps a company will reveal a much cheaper anamorphic lens at CEDIA in the next few days...

This will probably be my projector, but that could change in the next several days. I'm sure Optoma isn't the only company that wanted to wow people with an amazing price. While I do prefer DLP, if a comparable LCD comes out a couple hundred dollars cheaper, I may re-consider.

By next year's CEDIA, we should be seeing projectors with mainstream pricing. These big box stores can easily show these in properly set up rooms if they just got rid of all those RPTVs.
Cyrano's Avatar Cyrano 05:13 PM 09-13-2006
This PJ sounds good. After 3 years with our X1 (2600+ hrs) it's time for the upgrade.

But - the offset kills the deal I guess. I don't remember exactly what the X1 is but at 12' from the screen (80" diag 4:3) the X1 is 4" from the ceiling (7') and the screen is about a foot down. I use no keystoning and the focus is good and equal on the screen. I think the X1 is about 1/2 the offset (or less) of the HD70. Since I would use a 16:9 screen with the HD70 it could be a little lower but not by much.
Jones_Rush's Avatar Jones_Rush 07:45 PM 09-13-2006
Quote:


This will probably be my projector, but that could change in the next several days. I'm sure Optoma isn't the only company that wanted to wow people with an amazing price. While I do prefer DLP, if a comparable LCD comes out a couple hundred dollars cheaper, I may re-consider.

Comparable LCD at several hundreds less than the HD70 ???, I wish...

The cheapest 720p LCD this year, and probably the best deal, will remain the AE900 with the rebate, for as long as it lasts.

We knew about the HD70 long before CEDIA, and we probably already know everything interesting that CEDIA is going to present, for a long time now, and there is no new budget king for LCD pjs on this CEDIA, nothing even remotely close.

If you're looking for amazing deals on LCD units, you'll have to wait for the drastic cuts which will happen in 2007, when all the competitors will have new C2Fine pjs and will die to get rid of all the old D5 pjs.
Mupi's Avatar Mupi 08:18 PM 09-13-2006
Dont forget that this unit has a white segment. no wonder it is
cheap. Who has measured the contrast. With a white segment
claims like 4000:1 CR are bogus. Just plain marketting gimmick.

If a lamp alone is $300 and if they can sell an unit for 999, I wonder why the
heck they were selling 720P for $5000. Still Infocus 7210 is ridiculously priced
at some 5k. So what does HD70 lack that Infocus 7210 or 7205 doesnt.

Are those who still pay 3k or 5k for 720p idiots?

There has to be a good reason for 720P DLP FP's to be still selling for
3k or 5k. The parts could be substandard like cheap crappy lens etc.
in the sub 1k units.
PJ central already said HD70 is louder than 72. Who knows what else
is substandard
Jones_Rush's Avatar Jones_Rush 08:26 PM 09-13-2006
The HD72 also has a white segment, yet it is more expensive. There are many reasons why the HD70 is cheap in comparison to the HD72, this is not one of them.

Also, if you read Projectorcentral's review carefully, you could have seen that their bottom line is that if you don't put the HD72 and HD70 side by side, it is VERY hard to tell the difference. There are small nuances, but that's it.

Regarding cheap materials, maybe so, but unlike many other respected pj manufactureres (panasonic etc), Optoma offers a 2 year warranty on this pj, and not 1.

If I'm buying this pj I'm going to throw it in the dumpster the minute the warranty ends, and buy myself a new 1080p $999 pj. I just hope I'll have the patience to wait that long.
TomGivan's Avatar TomGivan 08:36 PM 09-13-2006
Do you guys think this pj would be an upgrade from the Sony HS51?
Mupi's Avatar Mupi 08:38 PM 09-13-2006
wait till we hear from any owners. sooner or later there will be
RMA's, firmware updates etc etc. and in the next CEDIA they will
announce another cheapo crap this time a sub 1k 1080p.

BTW: I feel it is ridiculous to have a white segment in a HT projector
just so that they can bump up the brightness. That enables them to
use a lower power lamp and so the fan is quieter. Where as In72 or 76
has no white segment but they have a powerful lamp and their
dumb engineers couldnt make the fan quieter.

These are the things they have to work on to make a quality
product. Just dumping cheap crap in the market shouldnt be their
primary goal. As long as there are more and more consumers who
just want something cheap, this trend will continue.
mjolson's Avatar mjolson 09:00 PM 09-13-2006
I don't think anybody has any illusion of the HD70 being a giant killer, but isn't it a bit premature to label this as "cheap crap"?
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