Infocus IN72 Specific Thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP > Infocus IN72 Specific Thread
951's Avatar 951 03:01 PM 02-11-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_S View Post

I'm wondering if anyone can help tell me the proper height to ceiling mount my IN72 relative to the screen. If possible, I'd like to avoid keystone corrections. I'm planning on using an oversized screen in length, as I'll probably be viewing in both 16:9 and 4:3. The usable "top of screen" will likely be at a height of 6.5 feet, though I could go lower. My projector can only be 7.5-8.5 feet away, which means I can make use of a 60"-wide screen. All that is fine. Problem is my ceiling is up at 13 feet, so I need to drop the projector down quite a bit. There is also a beam (10' high) that I can attach a custom steel "arm" to that will help me get in the range of both height and distance from the screen.

So my question is, what height should the projector be at? I've read that "slighty above the screen" is the manufacturer's intention. Is that true? How far above the screen can I go with the IN72's built in lens offset (but without keystone correction)? How do I calculate that?

Thanks Alot, Peter S.

The IN72's offset is 128% of projected image height. http://www.infocus.com/service/howto...set_how_to.pdf

michiman's Avatar michiman 03:12 PM 02-11-2007
Kras...

That is what has been in the back of my mind. The 4805 is back in it's original package. I need to mod my mount for the IN72 but that will only take me a few minutes with a scroll saw and drill. Nice to have friends with tools I would only use every couple of years. I hope to be doing some calibration later this week... First I need to enjoy the projector for a few nights. And to rebound from the dread of my bulb failing.
dmcdayton's Avatar dmcdayton 03:44 PM 02-11-2007
Kras,

Any thoughts on my calibration post?

Is it Kosher to just tone down the brightness setting? Or should I be doing it by lowering the color offsets? I seem to recall a suggestion way back to avoid touching color/contrast directly on 4805...but I'm really happy with the picture so I think I already know the answer...

Just curious why the
SA8300/IN72 would be off so much.

BTW, I just clicked on the tiny AVS Science link...holy cow...3 years and I had no idea they had a whole other company website setup. I'm even in their "service/installation" area. They should send quarterly email to the fee members with just that link if nothing else. I'll check out joining the for pay club.
dmcdayton's Avatar dmcdayton 05:30 PM 02-11-2007
Well the 62MM ND2 filter isn't working anymore, it popped out just after I turned it on this evening. The nice snug fit is too snug now, it won't go back in. It fit perfect Friday so I don't know what happened.

I'm wondering if the case was warm enough to give a little bit when I put it in 2 days ago. Now its too tight and won't sit flush with the inner ring of the lens.

I'll stop by camera shop this week and see if I can get slightly smaller filter to see what fits.
krasmuzik's Avatar krasmuzik 06:44 PM 02-11-2007
Using color offsets instead of brightness was necessary on SP7205 and that got carried over onto SP4805 - until Bob revealed the SP4805 had more bits than the SP7205. It was still a good idea to account for video standard levels to use offsets instead of brightness so that you still had the brightness control for tweaking different channels (if you are like me and want to track down the station engineer and make him calibrate).

This is no longer necessary on the IN72 since color space auto should account for it. If it does not then select colorspace RGB PC or RGB Video for your DVI. But you are still reliant on your settop box complying with either standard - and the TV station broadcasting to that standard. If not - then you are back to riding the brightness controls (or offsets if you prefer).

What I do is set the settop box to output 4:3 and do the same on the PJ. Then you can match up what the box thinks black is with the PJ by matching up black bars. Then you know if blacks are still not black - it is the broadcast.
spyder696969's Avatar spyder696969 06:50 PM 02-11-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by krasmuzik View Post

...(if you are like me and want to track down the station engineer and make him calibrate)...

...make him...

That's some funny stuff.
Star Wars Guy's Avatar Star Wars Guy 07:26 PM 02-11-2007
I said that once I had a chance to watch a few movies on my projector, I would report my findings. Well, I've just completed my 16th movie on the IN72, using the Oppo 971 with a DVI connection. I am not running any TV or other source to the projector, it's just used to watch DVDs. Here's my newbie (first time projector owner) observations so far:

Calibration:

With the exception of a little keystone correction and very very minor brightness adjustment, the projector is all factory specs.

The Picture:

A purely digital movie, such as CARS or Revenge of the Sith, looks awesome. The colors are incredibly vibrant and the picture is very sharp and clear. Older movies such Jet Li's The One has noticable flaws and noise, but I think that has to do with the source, and not the projector or DVD player. Movies with epic shots such as both of the Pirates of the Caribbean movies look incredible as well. The bright scenes really shine (pun intended) and the dark scenes are very good too.

The Screen:

I'm using an Elite Screens 100" pull up that sets in front of my entertainment cabinet. A fixed screen would be preferable and will be once I move to a new house where space won't be such an issue. Other than having to put the screen up/down for every movie I watch, the screen looks very good.

The Placement of the projector:

One thing I failed to include in my placement consideration before I purchased was the size of the DVI cable coming out of the back of the projector. I had originally planned to have the projector sitting on my mantle, but with no room to spare and the cable adding another few inches, I had to alter my placement. At first I placed it on a side shelf, but this caused a noticable skewing of the picture on the side that could not be corrected. I've already pointed out elsewhere in this thread that ceiling mounting would have been preferable, but not currently possible. What I have done that has worked out very well is to place the projector behind my seating on a utility cart. I still have some minor keystoning to deal with (40 instead of the default 50 setting), but I can't complain. The only thing I've really noticed that keystone correction has done was shrink the image just a bit to square it up. Other than that, I see no other flaws. At approx 13 feet and no keystone correction, the picture will fill the 100" screen nicely. With the needed KC, the image is about an inch on each side from filling the screen. Definately something I can currently live with.

Conclusion:

I've been extremely pleased with my purchases. I went from a 32" TV, to 100" digital image. I think a first time projector owner such as myself will be extremely pleased as well. My goal was to capture that "in theater experience" in my home. I'm coming close to that. Now if I could just find popcorn that has that same buttered taste as my local theater. For now, I'll have to settle for filling up on the way out of 50 cent bucket night and saving it for my next movie at home.
Peter_S's Avatar Peter_S 11:02 PM 02-11-2007
Thank you all for the links to the setup resources. I will be doing alot of reading while waiting for my projector. Very excited!
Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 12:40 AM 02-12-2007
dmcdayton, did I miss something? You mention INHD, please tell me what that is and how I get it. I'm curious if my cable box setup needs tweaking. I just had a new one put in to replace a defective one a few days ago. Also, I still haven't had a chance to load new firmware since I don't own a pc and I've just been incredibly busy the last few weeks. I think I'm running version 1.2. , so I'm not sure if "auto" gets the DVI settings correct and I can't change it to RGB.
dysfunction26's Avatar dysfunction26 01:51 AM 02-12-2007
Would the IN72 be bright enough for a 92", or 100" screen, when dealing with moderate ambient light? I am going to use this in my living room and I like to leave the kitchen light on (which is the room next to it) while watching television and movies.
dmcdayton's Avatar dmcdayton 03:39 AM 02-12-2007
Marvin

INHD is an HD Network carried by Time Warner Cable.

http://www.inhd.com

If you can't get INHD channel on your cable box, Kras offers a method to adjust brightness (a few posts back) that might work for you, sounds easy.

Unfortunately my cablebox outputs unholy gray/silver bars that completely deystroy the mood, I have to set my box to output stretched 4:3 then I use pj to squeeze it back down. Yes I know, double scaling...but man those silver bars are bright...its like turning a light on the lights.

...and man, I wouldn't want to be the station engineer when Kras walks in the door with an armload of video calibration warfare equipment...Busted!

Thanks for explanation on offsets Kras, as always.
dmcdayton's Avatar dmcdayton 03:52 AM 02-12-2007
dysfunction,

direct light on any projection screen is a killer. My screen will handle 1 - 60watt light 12' back as long as I use a dark, non-light transmitting shade floor lamp at far corner of couch. This is more than enough to read the paper by. However if I take the shade off its toast.

If I understand what I've been reading the past few years, this is purely a function of the screen, not the projector. Whatever ambient light shines on your screen raises "black" to that level....so you lose all your contrast and the picture washes out.

A new IN72 is really, really bright but the screen reflects a kitchen light equally well.

So, think hard about it and decide what you really want (convenience of a TV) or 92" digital perfection for the big game or movies....come back and let us know what you choose..."We'll leave the light on"...
Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 08:09 AM 02-12-2007
Thanks dcmdayton, I have RCN cable instead of Time Warner, so no INHD, but thanks. I'll do the Kras eyball method after I do a few small things like, let's see... get the current IN72 firmware, move my projector a few inches forward and over (redrilling my holes in the ceiling to re-mount the pj), test the pq of my cable box via HDMI and compare to component, install my new DVD player coming next week, switch wires from DVI to HDMI, etc. Wait, using the Kras' quickie black level calibration method might be the easier task. Setting the box to 4 X 3 is easy enough, but where do you get your black bars from Kras? I have Video Essentials and will use it if I have to, but it's a real pain in th @ss. with those wacky navigation formats.
Nick Smith's Avatar Nick Smith 08:13 AM 02-12-2007
Well, I finally got around to doing some more work with the fan swap. I have some Panaflo fans coming in this week to try, but before I did the swap I wanted to find out how hot the exhaust was with the stock Delta fans. I'll try to get some pics taken a little later (I'm at work at the moment). I routed an 8-10" temperature probe through the grates of the exhaust side and monitored the temperature while watching some tv last night. What I found was very interesting.

Low power with everthing intact: 59C

High power with everything intact: 68C

Low power with intake-side end cap removed (side that covers two 80mm fans): 38C (!)

High power with intake-side end cap removed: 42C

Just a note, all temperatures varied slightly due to the furnace kicking on and off, but I think I was able to get accurate averages by watching the temps throughout the night.

I was amazed at the difference pulling the end cap off made. There are about 6 screws holding it on...it's not real difficult to pull. After slipping the end cap back on the temperature immediately began to climb again. There is some slight light spill with the cap off, but nothing bothersome. Also, I'd recommend pulling the cap off only if your pj is ceiling mounted if you have any pets or children because it exposes the fans. I'll have to get some pictures of the setup and the light spill. When I get the new fans in this week I'm going to re-run the test to make sure that I'm getting proper ventilation. My plan is that if I can keep the temp. below 68C at high power (with the cap on or off) I should be fine. If the fans aren't much quieter or they don't cool it down enough I'll definitely swap the old ones back in.

I have had the intake cap off for the last couple of months with no problems. The fan noise is actually decreased a little with it removed...my guess is that the pj sees the cooler temps and slows the fans slightly. Also there is less of a 'whoosh' noise with the cap removed because the air is not being sucked through the small vents in the cap.

For someone wanting to increase the life of their pj and slightly quiet it down I think this would be an easy modification.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Smith View Post

I got bored after work today so I decided to see if a fan swap would be possible. Here's what I found:



It looks like their 80mm x 80mm x 15mm, but I'm thinking I might be able to fit some 25mm fans in there.


Anyone know where to get connectors like these? There's a two-pin on the left and a three-pin on the right. I'm hoping to buy the connectors with pigtails already attached so I can just splice the wiring harness from a Nexus case fan and plug it into the board. I don't want to cut the existing fan harnesses.




And I think this is the little booger that's giving many of us fits.




Any help with the connectors would be greatly appreciated!


Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 08:15 AM 02-12-2007
Damn Nick, that's some serious $hit you're into there, good luck!
Nick Smith's Avatar Nick Smith 10:09 AM 02-12-2007
Thanks Martin....I was very surprised with the results. I'm guessing that the IN74/76 would see the same results considering they share the same case. I'm home for lunch and so I'm able to check my numbers...I was a couple of degrees off here and there when I wrote earlier today so I edited the post to reflect the actual results.

I was never able to find the correct connectors for the fans, but I was able to find some small terminals that will work. They came off of a remote starter I was installing the other night....fortunately the starter had a lot of options that I don't need so I was able to pull those wires/terminals out. They're a snug fit on the male terminals on the pj board, so I'm just going to slap some heat shrink on them and press them onto the terminals (and hope they stay put, which I don't think will be an issue).

If I'm not able to quiet this thing down I might just have to sell it and buy a quieter pj. Everyone who comes over says they can barely hear it, but for some reason I'm able to pick up on it many times throughout a movie.
Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 10:39 AM 02-12-2007
You're probably sensitive to the specific tone frequency the pj is putting out.

Funny story, years ago, I used to occasionally write/produce music for TV. I had to use a phone ring in one spot, so I recorded my own phone, (a unique model from somewhere in South America, if memory serves) Other music production people sampled (copied) my ring tone and in short order, my phone ring was EVERYWHERE, and I'm not kidding. Commercials, movies, sitcoms, you name it. Hell, I was watching a James Bond movie in the theaters and yes, there it was. Every time I heard the ring, I instictively jumped up to answer and only then realized it was from the TV! Well, I finally got rid of the offending phone after hundreds of false alarms. To this day, whenever there's a tone at that particular frequency I jump like Pavlov's dog! Yikes!
dysfunction26's Avatar dysfunction26 11:22 AM 02-12-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmcdayton View Post

dysfunction,

direct light on any projection screen is a killer. My screen will handle 1 - 60watt light 12' back as long as I use a dark, non-light transmitting shade floor lamp at far corner of couch. This is more than enough to read the paper by. However if I take the shade off its toast.

If I understand what I've been reading the past few years, this is purely a function of the screen, not the projector. Whatever ambient light shines on your screen raises "black" to that level....so you lose all your contrast and the picture washes out.

A new IN72 is really, really bright but the screen reflects a kitchen light equally well.

So, think hard about it and decide what you really want (convenience of a TV) or 92" digital perfection for the big game or movies....come back and let us know what you choose..."We'll leave the light on"...

Would a brighter projector make any difference? I have seen on these forums, that the Mitsubishi HD1000U is a bright projector, would that help with the ambient light?
causeofhim's Avatar causeofhim 12:24 PM 02-12-2007
How will it affect my picture if I mount my projector about 10" off of center?
Will it even be noticable?
Thanks
BenJF3's Avatar BenJF3 12:33 PM 02-12-2007
I had to mount mine about 8" off center so I could hit a stud in the ceiling and I only notice a slight squaring issue, but bare in mind I'm kind of a perfectionist. I adjusted the keystone to square it up and the difference is so minuscule that no one notices. If your not sure for your application, try to temporarily put it where you want it and see what it does. I do wish I played around more instead of relying on the Infocus throw calculator. All said and done, this was my first experience with a front projector and I have been overly pleased. The IN72 looks fantastic right out of the box.
Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 12:55 PM 02-12-2007
I'm less than 1/2 inch off and I can't stand it
krasmuzik's Avatar krasmuzik 01:10 PM 02-12-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by dysfunction26 View Post

Would a brighter projector make any difference? I have seen on these forums, that the Mitsubishi HD1000U is a bright projector, would that help with the ambient light?

Mitsu is not brighter calibrated....
rachel1997's Avatar rachel1997 02:57 PM 02-12-2007
Has any body noticed on their IN72 that the power cord connection is a little loose on the unit. The power cord that came with the unit is a little loose. I tried one from my computer and it fit much tighter. Both plugs appear to be the same to my eye. I don't really want to hassle with returing the unit, but I would like to know what is causing this because I need to buy a longer power cord.
BenJF3's Avatar BenJF3 03:05 PM 02-12-2007
I never really noticed. I installed a switched junction box and the hardwired the unit with an old computer plug. I didn't want to splice and cut up the one that came with it. Any standard computer type cable will work, it's not some special cord.

On a side note per my earlier post, I found that I pretty much have to run my SA8300HD at a fixed 1080i resolution for it to be reliable with my IN72. I don't think its the projector, but rather the cable box scaler. Everytime the format changes, the projector will do a set up image and sometimes just stay in a blank screen, when I use a fixed output it doesn't have to keep adjusting and my HD channels look crisp and sharp. I tried to see if there was a very noticeable difference between the 480i and 1080i on SD content and really didn't notice. The IN72 does a good job re-scaling the image back to Native.
Martin Butler's Avatar Martin Butler 03:35 PM 02-12-2007
rachel1997, just use a power cord that fits better, I do.
dragonbud0's Avatar dragonbud0 05:37 PM 02-12-2007
dmcdayton,

So does a 58mm ND2 work? Thanks.
sgibson's Avatar sgibson 06:27 PM 02-12-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmcdayton View Post

Well the 62MM ND2 filter isn't working anymore, it popped out just after I turned it on this evening. The nice snug fit is too snug now, it won't go back in. It fit perfect Friday so I don't know what happened.

I'm wondering if the case was warm enough to give a little bit when I put it in 2 days ago. Now its too tight and won't sit flush with the inner ring of the lens.

I'll stop by camera shop this week and see if I can get slightly smaller filter to see what fits.


Geez...same thing here!
The Hoya 62MM had a snug fit to the IN72 lens housing...till I found it on the carpet this a.m. No damage done, so I just tucked it back and will wait & see if it happens again.
sgibson's Avatar sgibson 06:30 PM 02-12-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Smith View Post

Well, I finally got around to doing some more work with the fan swap. I have some Panaflo fans coming in this week to try, but before I did the swap I wanted to find out how hot the exhaust was with the stock Delta fans. I'll try to get some pics taken a little later (I'm at work at the moment). I routed an 8-10" temperature probe through the grates of the exhaust side and monitored the temperature while watching some tv last night. What I found was very interesting.

Low power with everthing intact: 59C

High power with everything intact: 68C

Low power with intake-side end cap removed (side that covers two 80mm fans): 38C (!)

High power with intake-side end cap removed: 42C

Just a note, all temperatures varied slightly due to the furnace kicking on and off, but I think I was able to get accurate averages by watching the temps throughout the night.

I was amazed at the difference pulling the end cap off made. There are about 6 screws holding it on...it's not real difficult to pull. After slipping the end cap back on the temperature immediately began to climb again. There is some slight light spill with the cap off, but nothing bothersome. Also, I'd recommend pulling the cap off only if your pj is ceiling mounted if you have any pets or children because it exposes the fans. I'll have to get some pictures of the setup and the light spill. When I get the new fans in this week I'm going to re-run the test to make sure that I'm getting proper ventilation. My plan is that if I can keep the temp. below 68C at high power (with the cap on or off) I should be fine. If the fans aren't much quieter or they don't cool it down enough I'll definitely swap the old ones back in.

I have had the intake cap off for the last couple of months with no problems. The fan noise is actually decreased a little with it removed...my guess is that the pj sees the cooler temps and slows the fans slightly. Also there is less of a 'whoosh' noise with the cap removed because the air is not being sucked through the small vents in the cap.

For someone wanting to increase the life of their pj and slightly quiet it down I think this would be an easy modification.

Hey Nick, nice work! Any pics of the side end cap removal? Keep us posted...thanks!
dmcdayton's Avatar dmcdayton 06:40 PM 02-12-2007
dysfunction

I think its a matter of "darkness" not brightness. The 4805/IN72 is really bright as it is. The screen reflects all the light, so black therefore is the screen without the projector on. Check around and see if you can rent a projector or borrow one. Tack a sheet to the wall and see for yourself.

This is how I sold my wife on a projector (demo'd an X1)...she didn't want anything to do with it. I snuck one home and set it up to surprise her. We ended up watching Syrian basket weavers for 3 hours the picture was so awesome....and the IN72 is at least 2x better.
spyder696969's Avatar spyder696969 07:17 PM 02-12-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmcdayton View Post

...We ended up watching Syrian basket weavers for 3 hours the picture was so awesome...

It's funny what we'll watch when something looks so good. About 50% of the time, I'll watch something in HD that I probably never would in SD, or something "less entertaining" in HD over "more entertaining" in SD.
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