Choosing LCD over DLP for picture quality (no flame war) - Page 6 - AVS Forum
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post #151 of 166 Old 08-10-2007, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonHoyaFan View Post

How much light output do you require in lumens?

I don't think you should make decisions based on faulty units.

I'd said it's a case of what I prefer as I don't think there is a requirement per say. Both the Pearl and the Panasonic (more so the Pearl) overall images just came across as dull (dim). On top of that the whites didn't have any pop on predominately dark images. Which was still evident in other mixed content images.

The RS1 and HD80 had lots more brightness on both conditions. It felt like you were straining to view the images especially after viewing the others.

Regarding projectors being defective I can only go by what I received. I checked out five different projectors but ended up looking at ten different units trying to find a good one on everyone of them except for one which was good from the get go.

At some point you have to accept they are what they are or do you think after three units you should go for a fourth? I went as far as three with one projector I really wanted to like it.
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post #152 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 04:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I'd said it's a case of what I prefer as I don't think there is a requirement per say. Both the Pearl and the Panasonic (more so the Pearl) overall images just came across as dull (dim). On top of that the whites didn't have any pop on predominately dark images. Which was still evident in other mixed content images.

The RS1 and HD80 had lots more brightness on both conditions. It felt like you were straining to view the images especially after viewing the others.

Regarding projectors being defective I can only go by what I received. I checked out five different projectors but ended up looking at ten different units trying to find a good one on everyone of them except for one which was good from the get go.

At some point you have to accept they are what they are or do you think after three units you should go for a fourth? I went as far as three with one projector I really wanted to like it.

It seems like you prefer a bright projector over one with good contrast. Just beware that brighter projectors often make a more favorable initial impression, but if good contrast and black levels ae not there, this fact may creep up on you and you may grow dissatisfied with it.

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post #153 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Lawguy View Post

It seems like you prefer a bright projector over one with good contrast.

As stated above I preferred the RS1, which I believe, is the current world record holder for contrast at least among digitals and especially projectors without a dynamic iris. Along with the HD80 that had good enough ANSI CR to have some punch.
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post #154 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 10:35 AM
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Having an HD80 for a weekend there are a ton of good reasons anybody may pick that projector over others indeed.

Just because I liked the Panasonic better overall doesn't mean eveyrbody else would come to the same conclusion.

To make the AE1000U bright enough for me, I had to drop a size in screen and get some screen gain going. I had a great movie night with the Panny last night with the inlaws and I am confident I made the right choice for my theater and needs.

Last night I ran Ben Hur off of Lasertdisc rather early in the evening, then Happy Feet and Hot Fuzz off of HD-DVD.
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post #155 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawguy View Post

This is another discussion entirely, but unless you sit close enough to the screen with a 720p projector to see pixel structure, all other things being equal (image processing, etc), most people, even the seasoned videophiles here, cannot tell the difference between 1080p and 720p. In other words, the main benefit of going from 720p to 1080p is to sit closer to the screen.

I'm not trying to convince you to buy anything, by the way. I think I am suggesting that waiting is the best thing to do right now.


I would have to back up pretty far in my theater not to see the pixel structure of a 720p projector. Yes, I guess if I sat that far back I might have trouble seeing the increased pixel count of a 1080p projector.

I have a second projector that is a 720p with smoothscreen, I can still see the pixel structure at 11' where i sit.
If we were talking about a 42" plasma, then yes, 1080p isn't needed, but with front projection, 1080p is a boon...

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post #156 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 01:16 PM
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Robert, suggest you increase your porn viewing. I hear it makes you go blind, and that will surely ease the necessity of constant upgrading....soon 720p will look just like VHS!

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post #157 of 166 Old 08-11-2007, 02:24 PM
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Too late!

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post #158 of 166 Old 08-12-2007, 01:08 AM
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All I want is a JVC RS-1...for $1,000. Hurry up and make em cheaper. These dlp's and lcd's are way behind.
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post #159 of 166 Old 08-21-2007, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdbaba View Post

I have a Panny AE900U and a Sharp XV_Z1200MKII--have had many other DLPs as well, including Sharp XV-Z3000, Optoma H31, BenQ PB6100.

They are all great PJs. However, I do seem to --personally--like the DLP picture better.

One thing to consider is that LCDs do still seem to have a problem with screen retention or burn in. I would always stretch the image on my Panny so as not to let the black bars burn in on the panels. I do not like viewing things this way, however.

You do not need to worry about this with DLP.

Just a thought.

That doesn't make sense, LCDs have never been known to have any burn-in issues. It's the earlier plasmas and old CRT tube TVs and RPTVs that did, never LCDs.

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post #160 of 166 Old 08-21-2007, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawguy View Post

Those Firehawk screens are very expensive so they have to be good, right?

Nope.

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post #161 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post

That doesn't make sense, LCDs have never been known to have any burn-in issues. It's the earlier plasmas and old CRT tube TVs and RPTVs that did, never LCDs.

See post #25 in this thread. Seems pretty conclusive to me.

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post #162 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdbaba View Post

See post #25 in this thread. Seems pretty conclusive to me.

bdbaba

i'm still somewhat skeptical of that. look at some of the reviews from cine4home and the pictures they take of the disassembled projectors. the LCD filters look very much like that one in post #25 and the reviews never mention image retention.

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post #163 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post

That doesn't make sense, LCDs have never been known to have any burn-in issues. It's the earlier plasmas and old CRT tube TVs and RPTVs that did, never LCDs.

Current plasmas still burn in, regardless of who you talk to.....the potential still exists, as you'll find people complaining about image retention still today here on the AVS forums.

LCD's, now that the bulbs are brighter I am guessing, are also prone to some image retention...people who watch alot of 4:3 programming on a PJ have complained about uneven brightness where the pillarboxes were. And of course the other LCD caveats like Panel discoloration and burnt polarizers and whatnot.

People who've used LCD flatpanels on the PC have found image retention in the windows start bar, etc, etc if left on long enough......seems like DLP is the only sure-fire way to avoid that particular problem for now.

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post #164 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 07:06 AM
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yes, that is a concern I have had is the brighter lamps of day discoloring the blue LCD panels. I know I run my PJ for many hours so I never wanted to take a chance with LCD. TI even though it may be biased, had done a extensive test to show that the organic nature of the panels (especially the blue) was susceptible to color breakdown.

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post #165 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 07:18 AM
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On an LCD, it's not called burn-in, it's called Image Persistence.

What is shown in post #25 is polarizer failure due to the permanent discoloration of the organic material between the two glass layers of the polarizer. New inorganic polarizers are better about avoiding that kind of failure.

Here is a link to a note from Apple, Inc. about Image Persistence:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=88343

It can happen, even to Apple displays so LCD projectors are not immune but it is not a showstopper either.
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post #166 of 166 Old 08-22-2007, 07:27 AM
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Agreed, not a showstopper. Having looked and LCD and DLP, IMHO DLP gives me the type of PQ I like. I watch a lot of different LCDs at work all day (given they are presentation LCD), it just seems not as pleasing. I have even looked at some other LCDs like the Epson 400 recently and had the same impression.

I am not going to debate what is a superior technology etc. just what I prefer. YMMV as well as others.

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