Official Panasonic AE2000 thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by repdetect2 View Post

Like playing wii with friends??



Wouldn't you want less light if your going to play with your friends wii?
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post #92 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 06:50 PM
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I agree. Lots of negatives with CRT. Most will not notice the difference between the current crop of 1080Ps and CRT. The rest of us who struggle to gain performance inch by inch will always want more. It's part of the game.
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post #93 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 06:57 PM
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Don't you find it hard to play wii with a projector anyways? Seems like you would always be standing in the light creating shadows on the screen.
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post #94 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:02 PM
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The Wii should work fine with a projector, though you may have to stand slightly off center. Me and my kids don't stand directly in front of our TV in the family room when we play the Wii so it should not be any different with a projector. Especially if it's ceiling mounted.
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post #95 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:04 PM
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Well, I have everything going into an upcomverting amp and then out the source over hdmi..

I suppose if I don't like the unit it can go back
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post #96 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadly25 View Post

Don't you find it hard to play wii with a projector anyways? Seems like you would always be standing in the light creating shadows on the screen.

Yeah, and with a short throw, unless you are pretty tall, there is no problem. I have a wii and a Marantz VP4001, and really do not have any problems getting in the way. That's with the pj mounted at 12 feet back and about 8' off the floor.
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post #97 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:06 PM
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Thanks so much for all the Wii feedback
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post #98 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:36 PM
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post #99 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 07:45 PM
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I couldn't get to the computer today because I was to busy. All day I've been looking forward to hearing a lot of new user feedback, but after reading 4 pages I see next to nothing!?!?!

I can say I'm bothered by the one comment regarding 1/2 to 1 pixel MC across the entire screen. I hope this doesn't turn out to be the norm.

Hopefully tomorrow brings some more in depth conversation from owners.
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post #100 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

What about mixed scenes? DC restoration ( fluctuating black levels )? MTF? Green phosphor lag? CRT issues go on and on. I'm personally glad the day has come that black level is near CRT, without all the other CRT negatives. There's much more to the whole picture than the "how black can you go" limbo stick game. My goal is: "how close to 35mm film cinema can you get." (Within the 1080p resolution of course)

Yes there are issues with all the technologies. I just happen to like black to actually be black. If it is really getting close I'll likely jump in. If I can still put on a puppet show when the screen is 'Black' I'll likely wait a few more years. I have yet to see a bulb projector that I would consider 'acceptable' when it comes to black levels. Hopefully one the new 1080p projectors will change that.

The biggest negative for CRT to me is always having to worry about burning the tubes. I can deal with just about all the other issues. I have a G70 projector that has one hell of a good bright picture and really does do black as black.
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post #101 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 08:55 PM
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checked with PS3 1080/24p, sony 7669 pattern.

I took a few shots from different area, they are more or less like that

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post #102 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 08:58 PM
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My goal is: "how close to 35mm film cinema can you get." (Within the 1080p resolution of course)

Depends on what you are measuring. 35mm is around 16 megapixels so resolution-wise there is some work to be done. Black levels on most home theater projectors already beat the socks off any 35mm theater setup. It's one of the reasons digital cinema is making headway. But it's not all about black levels... dynamic range is much more important. I'll post my impressions after I receive my AE2000 this weekend!

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post #103 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroendless View Post

checked with PS3 1080/24p, sony 7669 pattern.

I took a few shots from different area, they are more or less like that

Is this one-pixel wide lines?

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post #104 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csundbom View Post

35mm is around 16 megapixels so resolution-

Where is that number from? I think it's more like 6 megapixels.
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post #105 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 09:11 PM
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It's Mavs opening game, i just passed the 4 hours trial period... so i guess it's a keeper?

If you can't live with pixel misalignment, wait for more reports.

Other than that... enjoys the screenshot as requested,
ps3, 1080/24p.

tivo s3, scene from Hero. 720p

moto 6416, 1080i


2000u does a wonderful job upscaling and deinterace the beat-up moto box to 1080p. I never like the pixelized and motion artifact watching sport with moto. I'm happy to say that it's all.all.all... good now . Now i can use moto for sport if both of the tuners were used at Tivo.
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post #106 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csundbom View Post

Is this one-pixel wide lines?

I read somewhere it's a 2x2 pixels line. I could be wrong.

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That looks about right for convergence, it looks as if blue is only slightly off, maybe about a half pixel at most? Red and green appear to be fine?

Frankly, it's hard to count with Panny's SS, there's were any pixel to be found. My sony was like blue off 1 pixels, 1/2 on red. The 2000u has mixed of RGB pixels all at different area.
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post #107 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 09:42 PM
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Thanks for the screen shots!
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post #108 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotel96 View Post

Where is that number from? I think it's more like 6 megapixels.

The Imaging Science Foundation. 4000x4000 is what they quote as being equivalent to film. 6k may be close enough. There are a lot of factors here.

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post #109 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroendless View Post

2000u does a wonderful job upscaling and deinterace the beat-up moto box to 1080p. I never like the pixelized and motion artifact watching sport with moto. I'm happy to say that it's all.all.all... good now . Now i can use moto for sport if both of the tuners were used at Tivo.

What's the mode used for these pictures (Normal, Cinema1, Color1 etc)?

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post #110 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:15 PM
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Hmmm, on your unit, how far do you have to be away to see the effects of the what looks like slight misconvergence? 1x? 0.5x? Closer than 0.5x screen widths?

I swear i can tell a very subtle red edge on the white pop-up menu box if i try. Those are fine pixel menu and it's about 14' from 106" screen.

As for movie or hd material, text is white, logo has not apparently color edge. White jersey or high contrast area has not CA or blooming effect. That wasn't the case with my hs51. I'm sensitive to such defect, i own severals fine camera lens and i can't stand looking at one.

Quote:


Btw, what's your impression on black levels? The Panasonic lab never got 100% dark, so I couldn't really judge fade to black. Your comments? From what I saw in the light I was in, it was pretty damn impressive!

Well, I'm in a cave. Black is brilliant for LCD, i'm impressed. What's more impressive is the preset mode for color1 and cinema 1, one only need basic calibration to get this puppy up and running.
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post #111 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csundbom View Post

What's the mode used for these pictures (Normal, Cinema1, Color1 etc)?

All color1. Please take screen shot with chunk of salt. I'm just posting it for fun since i already set up the tripod or pixel misalignment.
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post #112 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroendless View Post

All color1. Please take screen shot with chunk of salt. I'm just posting it for fun since i already set up the tripod or pixel misalignment.

Hard to tell if color is right or not, since there are too many factors here.
1. Projector
2. Screen
3. Camera W/B setting and other characteristics
4. Colorspace in JPG file
5. My monitor (too blue)

Anyway, looks nice and sharp, maybe a touch of EE, but there can be many reasons for that. Do you use the dynamic iris?

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post #113 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by zeroendless View Post

I read somewhere it's a 2x2 pixels line. I could be wrong.

If that's the case, it doesn't look bad at all. Not sure if this is due to panel misalignment or chromatic aberration. If it's CA it will vary at different parts of the image. It's a "nature of the beast" issue with most optics, especially at short throw distances.

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post #114 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csundbom View Post

Hard to tell if color is right or not, since there are too many factors here.
1. Projector
2. Screen
3. Camera W/B setting and other characteristics
4. Colorspace in JPG file
5. My monitor (too blue)

Anyway, looks nice and sharp, maybe a touch of EE, but there can be many reasons for that. Do you use the dynamic iris?

That's correct. Too many factors, not to mention i shoot with raw file, color has been reproduced with photoshop. Yes, Iris was on.
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post #115 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csundbom View Post

If that's the case, it doesn't look bad at all. Not sure if this is due to panel misalignment or chromatic aberration. If it's CA it will be vary at different parts of the image. It's a "nature of the beast" issue with most optics, especially at short throw distances.

Nope, definitely not CA. It would be a disaster for sport. I rather have misaligned pixel than CA cause i don't watch "screen pattern" that often
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post #116 of 3933 Old 10-31-2007, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

When you have all the lights out in your cave, can you notice the iris in action ever making the image brighter and darker like a strobe?

Iris movement is undetected. May be i need better scene for the test but so far so good.

Didn't we have a thread about why pick panny over sanyo somewhere. c4h mentioned sanyo is using 2 gen old iris and with no apparent iris improvement at all. That was my reason over sanyo.
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post #117 of 3933 Old 11-01-2007, 03:11 AM
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Thanks for the report and the pics, zeroendless!
One comment about the convergence issue: there is indeed some misconvergence. I'm afraid that's just part of the problem, as it appears to exist some purple fringing from the lens and the blue channel looks a bit dispersed, as well (that of course, if we rule-out the possibility that your camera's lens may have contributed to the problem).
I did a little trick to check it out: I split your image to RGB channels, fixed the convergence and joined the channels back on. Here's how your AE2000 would look, if it didn't have any misconvergence.
Don't worry though -your AE2000 is (almost) fine! You don’t want to see how my Epson TW1000 looks like…

Fixed convergence


Red channel


Green channel


Blue channel


If you look close enough, you can see some thin white areas near the borders of green and blue channels. They represent the amount of misconvergence they have, compared to the red channel. By the way, is this a pattern from the PJ's menu?
LL
LL
LL
LL

Carpe Diem
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post #118 of 3933 Old 11-01-2007, 05:03 AM
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At these close images you can see how panasonic is compensating for SDE. Seems like the pixels are just barely a bit fuzzy to the point that they blend into the surrounding pixels. I imagine that these pics are so blown up that this is not viewable beyond one screen width. Is this correct?
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post #119 of 3933 Old 11-01-2007, 05:30 AM
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@zeroendless:

I love your pictures!! Will you make some more? I really can't wait to put my eye on that unit!!
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post #120 of 3933 Old 11-01-2007, 06:12 AM
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Zeroendless I am considering the panny as an upgrade to my epson 810. Is it bright enough to watch sports with moderate room light. I have a complete light controlled theater but sometimes like to have the lights on low when friends are over. The epson can get very bright .

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