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post #181 of 273 Old 06-16-2010, 12:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Dell says Ubuntu is safer than Windows

http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/62535

http://digg.com/linux_unix/Dell_says...r_than_Windows

Quote:
Bicep 5 hr 48 min ago

Dell's Statement is EXACTLY TRUE as written

Dell.com/ubuntu says:

"6) Ubuntu is safer than Microsoft Windows
The vast majority of viruses and spyware written by hackers are not designed to target and attack Linux."


That statement is EXACTLY TRUE as written - At least until such time that the statistics of Linux machines being infected, outnumbers that which is the number for Windows infections. Let me put it this way: Windows has already proven to be less safe than Linux. The number of infected windows systems both current and previously VASTLY, VASTLY outnumbers the total number of GNU+Linux systems infected by malware in the entire history of humankind.

Could Linux become less safe than Windows ever in the future, say, after it has a greater marketshare? Perhaps, and an asteroid could fall out of the sky and kill us all too! But, until then, the simple fact remains that a very large number of infected Linux machines would have to appear to change the current statistics, and the current fact - that is: GNU+Linux IS safer than Windows. Period.

Here are some interesting additional points:
-There are currently 671,013 virus signatures that can be downloaded and used for the FOSS Clam Antivirus program, and more are released everyday. Of those virus signature definitions, how many do you think only work on the Windows platform? In this scenario, starting with GNU+Linux is like starting with a fresh slate. How many decades would "Crackers" have to start writing GNU+Linux specific malware to catch up to the arsenal that they already have available for Windows?

-Most modern GNU+Linux distros use a packaging system that keeps the vast majority of installed software on the machine up-to-date with security patches and fixes. This is not true for windows.. In windows, programs like Adobe Reader, have to rely on the user to initiate an entirely separate update-mechanism to retrieve the critical update for that particular program, regardless of whether the windows operating system itself is up to date or not. For example, my Ubuntu systems(I'm typing on one of them now), already downloaded the latest flash-player (10.1). Has your windows system already updated the flash player? Note: if you have anything less than Flash Player 10.1, you are vulnerable to a serious security flaw that was identified by Adobe. You should update the Flash Player right now! The GNU+Linux package management system is superior to other systems in terms of keeping things up to date.

-Most modern GNU+Linux distros get security updates AS SOON AS THEY ARE RELEASED... There's no waiting for "Patch Tuesday"... In GNU+Linux, when there's an update/patch/fix/improved feature in the pipe, you get it as soon as it's available. There's no "business case" reason to wait to have the best with GNU+Linux. What's nice is that most of the time you don't even have to reboot after installing updates.

-UnrealIRCD is not even available in the Ubuntu GNU+Linux repositories (although there are several other IRCDs available in there). This means I would have to go and manually download and install (as root), that program in the first place. Ubuntu is considered a Desktop operating system (although server version is available), and it's also the "majority Desktop " in recent surveys of GNU+Linux distros on the Desktop. So this "infected" package wasn't even available in the software packaging system for the "majority" GNU+Linux desktop in the first place.

-GNU+Linux was created as a multi-user+networked system from the start. This means that GNU+Linux was built with security as paramount from day one.. and GNU+Linux continues to exemplify that end, magnificently.
Any self-respecting technologist or scientist cannot truthfully tell someone they are not safer for using GNU+Linux.. It's just not a logical argument.

Linux IS safer than windows - it's true!

 

dell-ubuntu-safer-than-windows.pdf 213.1181640625k . file
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File Type: pdf dell-ubuntu-safer-than-windows.pdf (213.1 KB, 2 views)


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post #182 of 273 Old 06-17-2010, 08:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Why Open Source Makes Sense: Scientifically Proven

http://linuxologist.com/1-general/wh...ically-proven/


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post #183 of 273 Old 06-17-2010, 08:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Ubuntu: meritocracy not democracy
Ubuntu community manager Jono Bacon explains


http://www.techradar.com/news/softwa...mocracy-695040


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post #184 of 273 Old 06-20-2010, 11:08 AM
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One point I have to raise with you RGB. Linux isn't totally free. There are a lot of government and public institutions that have contributed to Linux over the years. Case in point is the ZFS port.

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post #185 of 273 Old 06-20-2010, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

One point I have to raise with you RGB. Linux isn't totally free. There are a lot of government and public institutions that have contributed to Linux over the years. Case in point is the ZFS port.

But haven't those same organizations not also benefited far more from Linux then the cost of the employee time they have donated to it?
Therefore Linux not only is free, but it has saved taxpayers money too.

To answer the question in your sig: Mandriva, you won't regret it

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post #186 of 273 Old 06-20-2010, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tux99 View Post

But haven't those same organizations not also benefited far more from Linux then the cost of the employee time they have donated to it?
Therefore Linux not only is free, but it has saved taxpayers money too.

To answer the question in your sig: Mandriva, you won't regret it

I guess that is one way of looking at it, but the taxpayers are still funding the organization as a whole. Maybe if they used Microsoft they wouldn't be financially viable and would have to be shut down.

In response to Mandriva, I need to give it a whirl. I have been using Ubuntu for to long. I just installed it on my laptop and don't really like how it integrates. I guess I need to play with it more. I downloaded PC-BSD to give KDE 4 another shot. I guess I should see if KDE is good enough to use now everyday.

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post #187 of 273 Old 06-21-2010, 12:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

One point I have to raise with you RGB. Linux isn't totally free. There are a lot of government and public institutions that have contributed to Linux over the years. Case in point is the ZFS port.

...which is why Linux belongs to all of us (taxpayers, at least ).

Of course the development of Linux takes time and effort, which are not "free" (beer), but are at minimum and more importantly, free speech.


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post #188 of 273 Old 06-21-2010, 12:10 PM - Thread Starter
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http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...69&postcount=1

Quote:


They convinced me to use Ubuntu over Windows 7. I liked it so much I changed my main home machine to Ubuntu as well from Win7. It has come a long way since V5, which was the last version I had used. I can't remember why I went back to Windows.



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post #189 of 273 Old 07-19-2010, 08:03 PM
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Rgb, you will love the following article:

50 Places Linux is Running That You Might Not Expect
http://www.focus.com/fyi/information...ht-not-expect/

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post #190 of 273 Old 07-20-2010, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tux99 View Post

Rgb, you will love the following article:

50 Places Linux is Running That You Might Not Expect
http://www.focus.com/fyi/information...ht-not-expect/

Been there, done that

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...s#post18563210

...great link anyways, and this is a better thread for it.


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post #191 of 273 Old 07-20-2010, 08:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Dell Windows or Ubuntu?

http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/to...hs1&l=en&s=dhs

Of course, Dell updated their site to appease MS re: their former "Ubuntu is safer than Windows" stance, posted earlier in this thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=181

Good followup discussion-

http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl.../07/19/1727250

good response that reflects my experience the past 3 years with Ubuntu/Linux-

Quote:
by INT_QRK (1043164) writes: on Monday July 19, @04:01PM (#32955360)
I disagree too with the assertion that one should use windows if "You are new to using computers." Gnome on Linux as applied by the Ubuntu distribution is so user-friendly and functional that my very computer-challenged wife picked it up with no problem. If you're new starting out, Ubuntu may in fact be the easiest to learn and effectively employ, since it comes with such a rich application environment. Also, I put 3 daughters through the college with new PC's, and after the 3rd or 4th time I had to reload Windows in their Freshman year, because their machines got corrupted/owned/trashed from the college network environment, Windows would give me crap trying to reload from the OEM disk (probably a run-counter to thwart piracy, but not applicable in my case). So rather than repurchase Windows, I just loaded Ubuntu. All finished college just fine on Ubuntu with no further crashes. The interesting side-effect is that when they graduated, none of my daughters bought a Windows PC, instead going for Macs, the slicker *nix option, but *nix nonetheless. Also, "You are interested in open source programming" should be modified to say "You are interested in open source applications or programming."

Quote:
by mcgrew (92797) * writes: on Monday July 19, @03:30PM (#32954782) Journal

Which would be everybody not using a Mac, and I say poppycock. KDE is very similar to Windows and has a tiny learning curve; it's trivial to switch. As to new users, I've had friends who never had computers before, and wound up infecting them over and over (despite Norton). After getting tired of reinstalling Windows for them I'd install Linux dual-boot and disable networking in Windows and not install Norton. Every single one liked Mandriva better, and they never got another virus.


Quote:
by Lumpy (12016) writes: on Monday July 19, @03:40PM (#32954968) Homepage
but it's not truthful... A new pc user should use ubuntu as it's EASIER than all version of windows.

Install software is as easy as a single click. A proper Laptop or PC requires Zero configuration. Windows pc's come all pre-configured, so to be fair the ubuntu pc should be 100% configured as well.

They can't get infected with 99.97% of all viruses and trojans out there which affect even seasoned professional PC users with multiple PHD's in PC use. Newbie Pc users click on everything and many trojans are designed to fool them. Those trojans are completely neutered under ubuntu.

Plus there is a ton of free software that is a single click away in the application store. Something that Windows lacks. They can find almost everything they need there.

BUT, it all lies on the back of having the ubuntu pc preconfigured like all windows boxes get.

Doing a half assed default ubuntu install is only designed to screw the newbie. Unfortunately dell will give them a half assed install.



I'll pick apart the points here:

Quote:

Choose WINDOWS if:

You are already using WINDOWS programs (e.g. Microsoft Office, iTunes etc) and want to continue using them

False and misleading.

For most people most of the time, the current OpenOffice v3.2.1 is *More familiar* to most home users since it uses the Office 95-2006-like UI. And it reads/writes legacy Office file formats *better* than Office.

Quote:
by StuartHankins (1020819) writes: on Monday July 19, @04:31PM (#32955810)
Agreed. I have a license for MS Office XP and there are only a few things I use it for:
Some of the meeting requests from newer versions of Exchange don't send an ICS file (so they can't be accepted in Thunderbird / Lightning). I use Exchange webmail for these.
Sometimes I need to open a file which uses macros / crosstabs and links.
Calc has poor trendline capabilities for charting.
That's about it. OO Write has been far superior to Word on long technical documentation (doesn't crash, isn't slow, TOC entries are simple, styles are sane). OO Calc is quicker and easier at inserting large amounts of data from text / delimited files. OO Calc and Write can open MS Office 2007 files but MS Office XP and 2003 can't. We have the MS Office "converter" installed on everyone's machine for those 2007 / 2010 documents, and it gives poor results and is the source of a lot of headaches for my department to support.

And then there's the usability issue (at least for me) -- I've been using office apps since GEOS, so Quattro Pro, AmiPro, Lotus 1-2-3, etc menus are familiar to me. I dislike personalized menus and especially dislike the ribbon. I dislike the slow load times of Office in general and the frequent patches / crashes.

My wife's workplace switched to OpenOffice over a year ago without issue. No home user needs anything more than OpenOffice in my experience. Businesses tend to lock themselves into MS Office due to complicated Excel macros, overly complicated Powerpoints, Visual Basic dependencies, IE dependencies, or other artificial MS constraints on user freedom.

No one I know who is serious about music or values thier rights/privacy uses iTunes- Amazon's MP3 store is better/cheaper, plus the HUGE number of music managers/players available for Linux/Ubuntu- Banshee, Rythmbox, Exaile, gtkPod, Aqualung, Decibel, etc

Quote:
You are familiar with WINDOWS and do not want to learn new programs for email, word processing etc

Utterly ridiculous assertion. If someone is "familiar with Windows" then they are most likely using XP. Win7 totally changes the UI/Desktop. If you are going to change your Desktop and UI, then *any* alternative OS with a UI/Desktop different from XP is fair game- OSX, KDE/Gnome/etc.

Furthermore, as mentioned ad nauseum in the slashdot discussion above, core PC needs like "email, word processing, etc" are met FAR better with a top Linux distro like Ubuntu, PCLinuxOS, Fedora, Mandriva, etc, with the MASSIVE improvement in basic security and malware prevention/protection on the wild internet.

Quote:
You are new to using computers

Another preposterous reason to use Win7 in lieu of Ubuntu or other major Linux. In fact, this bullet point is the STRONGEST reason to use the latest Ubuntu, Mandriva, or PCLInuxOS- noobs are more prone to malware infestations, and these OS's will provide the best protection available to consumers! Plus, the install and daily use with these latest desktops is far SIMPLER than installing Win7 from scratch or daily email/office/social networking needs.

As for the Ubuntu side:

Quote:
You are interested in open source programming

They *mean* to say "You are interested in open source *software*" NOT "programming".


Funny how threats from MS can change a vendor's tune...

Quote:
Typical Microsoft price lobbying (Score:5, Insightful)
by guruevi (827432) writes: on Monday July 19, @02:41PM (#32954004) Homepage

If you don't change your mind we'll stop providing you with cheap licenses and Gold Partner status and cut off your MSDN subscription. I worked for a couple of Gold Partners and it's the same everywhere, Microsoft uses it's monopoly status and high prices to force people into compliance.

Ubuntu is good enough for most people especially when pre-installed on a computer. Unless you're just plain stupid you will be able to work with it and do whatever you need to do. Sadly Windows is so ingrained in users that are resistant to change that it's hard to change platforms for a lot of people



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post #192 of 273 Old 07-20-2010, 10:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Why Linux is Better

http://www.whylinuxisbetter.net/


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post #193 of 273 Old 07-26-2010, 10:14 PM
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Actually Linux is not any safer than Windows. In Linux an antivirus scanner can not be loaded as a daemon or service to check for data going into the kernel. Sure it can run as a daemon, but it scans files that are newly written or have been modified. There is AIDE to detect for as new files and make sure there are nothing suspicious going on with those files. What shines brightest in Linux for protection compared to Windows is its port and packet firewall. Home users rarely need a firewall on their computer. The router or hardware firewall is all they need.

Yes, Linux has a fast response times for fixing security issues although it can cause problems if the fixes changes how the program works or any program depending on that program works, chaos can happen and it did with OpenSSL. In Linux, home users should only upgrade programs that related to the web because these gets attack more than others. This means you update all web browsers to the latest stable release, update the flash player, update adobe reader, update media player plugins, and update JAVA VM. Other programs are not necessary to update because they are attacked differently.

Linux users does have to worry about rootkits. These are worst than viruses. In some cases third-party package maintainers could include rootkits. Even though Linux is free and open for anybody to use, so Linux still can be attacked.

Linux is probably the best operating system to use for a HTPC. Linux has an easier method to decode MPEG-1, MPEG-2, WMV3/9, H.264, VC using VA-API and VDPAU. This the video card will do most of the work. It works in all four media players. In Windows, there are more layers to handle each of these codecs.

OpenOffice is not the best office suite. It is pathetic for what it is trying to achieve. I prefer SoftMaker Office because it is a better alternative compared to OpenOffice. OpenOffice does not speak professional in the business world, but SoftMaker Office can. Businesses uses Microsoft Office because that it is the standard in the business world. Like it or not businesses uses Microsoft Office to make them look professional. I do not use OpenOffice to write my resume because formatting screws up and everything looks very amateurish.

I have been using Linux for 7 years and on a daily basis, so I know what program to use and what program not to use. It is OK to use commercial programs in order to get the job done. In other cases open source programs will be better. Using both open source programs and commercial programs gives Linux the ability to be more powerful to the user compared to Windows.

The Linux distribution that I used is Gentoo. It is a rolling release, so I can update programs with out doing a whole clean installation. Mainly I update any programs that deal with the web compared to other parts.

Linux does not do great when handling Flash, so this can be an issue to some people. If a high speed processor is picked and there is enough RAM, the issue is minimized. You can blame Adobe for this because it seems they do not care for software efficiency. It is true that Flash does crash programs, so Steve Jobs is right. The amount of times I have issue with Flash is about several times per week. To minimize this problem, I recommend to use flashblock.

The power management in Linux is more a luck of the draw. Either it works or it does not work. The daemon at Granola can help manage ondemand settings, so the drop of performance becomes less noticeable. Using stand-by or hibernation modes in Linux is a problem on most setups. Sometimes suspend to disk works while on other systems suspend to RAM works better. From experience do not use either suspend to RAM and suspend to disk.

Linux is not always free. Yes you are not paying any money out of your own pocket, but still have to pay for your time to understand and use it. Also you have to understand that you the user are the primary technician to fix problems and upgrade programs when using Linux. If you do not have time for this, go back to commercial operating system land.

Any time I hear or read anybody using Linux for protection. They are bull crapping themselves without understanding what Linux is all about.
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post #194 of 273 Old 07-28-2010, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Why NASA uses Open Source
By Sean Michael Kerner on July 20, 2010 12:26 PM



http://blog.internetnews.com/skerner...ource-and.html

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In order to save the data from distant spacecraft, satellites and other scientific endeavors, NASA is leveraging open source tech (including Ubuntu Linux) and regular enterprise networking components to meet their mission.



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post #195 of 273 Old 07-29-2010, 04:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electroju View Post

Actually Linux is not any safer than Windows. In Linux an antivirus scanner can not be loaded as a daemon or service to check for data going into the kernel. Sure it can run as a daemon, but it scans files that are newly written or have been modified. There is AIDE to detect for as new files and make sure there are nothing suspicious going on with those files. What shines brightest in Linux for protection compared to Windows is its port and packet firewall. Home users rarely need a firewall on their computer. The router or hardware firewall is all they need.

Any time I hear or read anybody using Linux for protection. They are bull crapping themselves without understanding what Linux is all about.

False- see

Can Ubuntu save online banking?

Quote:


Jay McLaughlin has me worried. I do my online banking from the same home computer the rest of the family uses for Web surfing and online games. I have the McAfee security suite loaded and do regular scans so accessing online banking should be protected. Right?

Not really, says McLaughlin, a Certified Information Systems Security Professional and CIO of CNL Bank. Accessing online banking from your everyday PC is just asking for trouble, he says.

In fact, the CIO of the Orlando, Florida-based regional bank would like to see all of his customers - both consumers and businesses - access online banking either from a dedicated machine or from a self-booting CD-ROM running Ubuntu Linux and Firefox.

Why would you EVER need a daemon/service anti-virus running to "check for data going into the kernel"? This concept entirely misses the point of the *nix security/privilege model.

If malware were written for Linux that prompted a user to enter the root password, then yes, damage could be done to the kernel. Or a third party repo could be set up with bad intent.

These examples are simple social engineering and no amount of good OS design will EVER prevent this- no different than a random stranger walking up to you on a busy street, showing you a document and telling you to sign it, without you knowing what the document is or does- could be you are signing over the title to your car or home. You get the idea- you must trust the source and know the ramifications of the root/admin password, like knowing the legal ramifications of signing random documents or giving private information to random phone callers.

99.9% of malware TODAY is written for Windows- regardless of the reason. A person switching to Linux TODAY *Will* be FAR safer- ALL independant, honest security experts recognize this.

Yes, if desktop/mobile Linux use increases significantly, then in the FUTURE, malware asking for the user's root password will probably increase. Users will need to know the power of the root password, and/or have userland-only accounts like most smartphones/tablets/netbooks running Linux kernels today (Android, Meego, etc).

By the time Linux kernel based OS (Android, Chrome, Meego, Ubuntu, Mandriva, etc) marketshare gets substantial across desktops, tablets, netbooks, notebooks, etc, they will all have been revved umpteen times to continually patch security issues and become even more malware resistant, and any current Linux malware (the few that exist) probably won't work any more.

Also, an exploit for one rev of one Linux based OS (Android 2.1 or Meego 1.0 for example), may not affect other distros, or even another version of the same distro (Meego 1.5 or 2.0 vs 1.0 for example). Linux based OS's are updated and revised FAR more frequently and faster than Windows.

When a bank security expert recommends a Linux LiveCD for banking, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with Windows and Right with Linux.

Seriously, this issue is the LEAST debatable in the Win vs Linux discussion.


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post #196 of 273 Old 07-29-2010, 04:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Dell adds several new Ubuntu 10.04 machines to lineup!

http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/64241

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/s...=us&l=en&cs=19

According to Dell:
Quote:


6) Ubuntu is secure
According to industry reports, Ubuntu is unaffected by the vast majority of viruses and spyware.

http://www.itworld.com/open-source/1...untu-linux-out

Dell Expands Ubuntu Offerings:
http://digg.com/linux_unix/Dell_expa...ktop_offerings


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post #197 of 273 Old 07-29-2010, 04:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Another bellweather-

I was at Borders Books two days ago, and for the first time (for me), I counted MORE Linux computer magazines on the magazine rack vs those with Windows, by almost 2:1! This is counting ANY computer magazine with Windows in the title or a major focus on the cover! The number of Linux magazines prominently displayed was shocking, including Linux Mint only mags, Ubuntu and PCLinuxOS titled mags, and a slew of "Linux-this and that" mags.

Ballmer's ouster imminent, Linux mags predominant at Border's, down is up- *Something* is happening, guys


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post #198 of 273 Old 07-29-2010, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

False- see

Can Ubuntu save online banking?



Why would you EVER need a daemon/service anti-virus running to "check for data going into the kernel"? This concept entirely misses the point of the *nix security/privilege model.

If malware were written for Linux that prompted a user to enter the root password, then yes, damage could be done to the kernel. Or a third arty repo could be set up with bad intent.

These examples are simple social engineering and no amount of good OS design will EVER prevent this- no different than a random stranger walking up to you on a busy street, showing you a document and telling you to sign it, without you knowing what the document is or does- could be you are signing over the title to your car or home. You get the idea- you must trust the source and know the ramifications of the root/admin password, like knowing the legal ramifications of signing random documents or giving private information to random phone callers.

99.9% of malware TODAY is written for Windows- regardless of the reason. A person switching to Linux TODAY *Will* be FAR safer- all security experts recognize this.

Yes, if desktop/mobile Linux use increases significantly, then in the FUTURE, malware asking for the user's root password will probably increase. Users will need to know the power of the root password, and/or have userland-only accounts like most smartphones/tablets/netbooks running Linux kernels today (Android, Meego, etc).

By the time Linux kernel based OS (Android, Chrome, Meego, Ubuntu, Mandriva, etc) marketshare gets substantial across desktops, tablets, netbooks, notebooks, etc, they will all have been revved umpteen times to continually patch security issues and become even more malware resistant, and any current Linux malware (the few that exist) probably won't work any more.

Also, an exploit for one rev of one Linux based OS (Android 2.1 or Meego 1.0 for example), may not affect affect other distros, or even another version of the same distro (Meego 1.5 or 2.0 vs 1.0 for example).

When a bank security expert recommends a Linux LiveCD for banking, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with Windows and Right with Linux.

Seriously, this issue is the LEAST debatable in the Win vs Linux discussion.

Security experts forgot about WINE, Crossover Office, and Cedega that Windows users to run Windows programs that are not yet have comparable native program in Linux. The use of these programs exposes your whole entire root. Again you forgot to think about rootkits and these are the worst than just thinking about viruses.

I do not use Linux for the thought of better protection. I use Linux because it is cheaper to use. You are debating this what you do just do not understand.

LIVE Linux discs will only be secure if the web programs are up to date. If they are not, you are back were you first started.

There are a lot of copy cat sites that could hijack your web browser into thinking it is a legit site. Any operating system will then be vulnerable. A lot of people are naive, so they do not care what operating system they are using. They just want their computer to just work. They could be using Linux and they have not update any of their web applications for over a year.

BTW, this thread is getting off topic.
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post #199 of 273 Old 07-29-2010, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electroju View Post

You are debating this what you do just do not understand.

LIVE Linux discs will only be secure if the web programs are up to date. If they are not, you are back were you first started.

There are a lot of copy cat sites that could hijack your web browser into thinking it is a legit site. Any operating system will then be vulnerable. A lot of people are naive, so they do not care what operating system they are using. They just want their computer to just work. They could be using Linux and they have not update any of their web applications for over a year.

BTW, this thread is getting off topic.

I'm afraid you are debating what you don't understand. Even an out-of-date Live CD or a 2 year old version of Firefox running on Linux will be far safer than an up-to-date Windows with a current Firefox, simply because most web-exploits specifically target Windows flaws and many Firefox flaws are only exploitable in Windows.

Also when using a Live CD specifically for online banking any sensible user would go straight to the banking web site and then close the browser afterwards, not browse across random sites, then do the banking and then again browse around random sites.

My Linux news / reviews / tips+tricks / downloads web site:
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post #200 of 273 Old 07-30-2010, 07:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Agreed re: no more debate on the malware issue- it is nicely summarized here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_malware

Quote:
"The growth in Linux malware is simply due to its increasing popularity, particularly as a desktop operating system ... The use of an operating system is directly correlated to the interest by the malware writers to develop malware for that OS."[3]

However, this view is not universal. Rick Moen, an experienced Linux system administrator, says "[That argument] ignores Unix's dominance in a number of non-desktop specialties, including Web servers and scientific workstations. A virus/trojan/worm author who successfully targeted specifically Apache httpd Linux/x86 Web servers would both have an extremely target-rich environment and instantly earn lasting fame, and yet it doesn't happen."[4]

One may still wish to run a Linux-based anti-virus software to scan insecure documents and email which comes over from the Windows world. SecurityFocus's Scott Granneman stated,

...some Linux machines definitely need anti-virus software. Samba or NFS servers, for instance, may store documents in undocumented, vulnerable Microsoft formats, such as Word and Excel, that contain and propagate viruses. Linux mail servers should run AV software in order to neutralize viruses before they show up in the mailboxes of Outlook and Outlook Express users."[1]
The total number of viruses have passed the one million boundary [5]. If the 4 % Linux adoption would be proportional to the amount of malware for this system, we would expect to see at least several thousands of viruses and worms. This may be near an order of magnitude more than observed. Hence minority may not be the only reason contributing to Linux security.

Quote:
The following is a partial list of known Linux malware; however, few if any are in the wild, and most have been made obsolete by updates.



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post #201 of 273 Old 07-30-2010, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Linux market share grows vs. Windows and Mac OS X shrinkage

http://blogs.computerworld.com/15462...os_x_shrinkage

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We're told Linux is the only OS with a growing market share: Windows and Mac OS X actually shrank. The Net Applications report also shows Windows 7 already dwarfing all versions of Mac OS combined. In IT Blogwatch, bloggers review the data.


Quote:


Emil Protalinski has been studying studies:


In December 2009, Linux was the only operating system to show positive percentage growth in market share. ... Windows market share dropped 0.31 percentage points ... Mac OS dipped 0.01 percentage points ... and Linux edged forward 0.02 percentage points. ... Strong sales from Windows 7 and Snow Leopard were not enough to stop both Windows overall and Mac OS overall from dropping.

Quote:


Meanwhile, Angus Kidman reports on kiwi Linux developments:


A New Zealand high school running entirely on open source software has slashed its server requirements by a factor of almost 50, despite a government deal mandating the use of Microsoft software in all schools. ... A long-standing contract with the national government means the software giant is paid for technology for the school even though none has been used.
...
The implementation uses Ubuntu on the desktop and Mandriva for four key servers (one firewall, one storage and two KVM hypervisors). ... Applications used within the school include OpenOffice, Google Docs, Moodle for managing education content, and Mahara for student portfolios.
...
[The] dedicated server room ... [was] designed ... based on standard New Zealand school requirements, including four racks each capable of holding 48 servers for its main systems. The main infrastructure only requires four servers, suggesting an almost 50-fold saving on hardware requirements.

Quote:


But wizardforce criticizes the Microsoft license:


The contract stipulates that Microsoft gets paid regardless of whether schools actually use their software. So while the schools may not be forced through contract to use MS software, it doesn't matter to Microsoft as they still get paid for non-existent software.
...
Well isn't that lovely. Demonstrably corrupt



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post #202 of 273 Old 07-30-2010, 10:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Usage share of operating systems
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems

Servers
Netcraft reports Linux at >41% of servers and growing as of Jan 2009 (yes, old data)

Quote:


Desktop
Steve Ballmer of Microsoft estimates Linux's share of desktop users to be higher than the web stats suggest. In a speech to investors in February 2009, Ballmer presented a slide based on Microsoft's research: it shows Linux's share of business and home PCs about the same as Apple's

Quote:


Mainframes
Gartner reported on December 23, 2008; 18 months ago (2008-12-23) that Linux on System z was used on approximately 28% of the "customer z base" and that they expected this to increase to over 50% in the following five years.[24]

Quote:


Supercomputers
The June 2010 figures show Linux in the lead at 91.0%, followed by IBM AIX at 3.8%, Microsoft Windows HPC Server 2008 at 1.0% and OpenSolaris at 0.4%.

Trend is clear for web clients (monthly/yearly growth)-
http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp


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post #203 of 273 Old 07-30-2010, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tux99 View Post

I'm afraid you are debating what you don't understand. Even an out-of-date Live CD or a 2 year old version of Firefox running on Linux will be far safer than an up-to-date Windows with a current Firefox, simply because most web-exploits specifically target Windows flaws and many Firefox flaws are only exploitable in Windows.

Also when using a Live CD specifically for online banking any sensible user would go straight to the banking web site and then close the browser afterwards, not browse across random sites, then do the banking and then again browse around random sites.

I know this already, so I understand. This debate can go on forever until people understand they can not run from the problem because the problem will still be lurking around the corner. For example, Windows users switching to Mac thought they will get protection, but later the problem they had in Windows is now in the Mac world.

Linux can be attack just as easily as Windows if the programs are not updated. You can say it your way, but I know this from experience.

Closing web browsers does not clear the data. It may close the socket or connection to certain server that it is connected to, but the data is still stored until the user manually clears the data. For some systems, it takes 15 minutes to many hours to release the socket.
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post #204 of 273 Old 07-30-2010, 08:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electroju View Post

Security experts forgot about WINE, Crossover Office, and Cedega that Windows users to run Windows programs that are not yet have comparable native program in Linux. The use of these programs exposes your whole entire root.

Please explain.
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post #205 of 273 Old 07-31-2010, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Please no more Linux malware debate here- if you want to continue that discussion, please start a new thread "Linux malware issues" or similar.

This thread is for posting reasons *for* using Linux on a media PC or supporting media computers (Servers, mobile, etc)

If someone wants to start a thread in the Windows or Mac forums for posting reasons to use those OS's, you're free to do so.

Any further off topic or trolling posts will be reported as such.


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post #206 of 273 Old 07-31-2010, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb View Post

Please no more Linux malware debate here- if you want to continue that discussion, please start a new thread "Linux malware issues" or similar.

This thread is for posting reasons *for* using Linux on a media PC or supporting media computers (Servers, mobile, etc)

If someone wants to start a thread in the Windows or Mac forums for posting reasons to use those OS's, you're free to do so.

Any further off topic or trolling posts will be reported as such.

You started the problem stating that Linux gives users protection which is not true. You may want to stick to just audio and I will stick to just computers. You may want to talk about Linux video and sound system. These two makes Linux be a more powerful operating system for a HTPC.

Linux mainly uses ALSA for audio. People uses ALSA just to duplicate audio to multiple channels and to work with sound daemons like PulseAudio. ALSA is a lot more powerful than people realize. It can be turned into a surround sound processor. The programming language that ALSA understands is LISP. It is not the easiest language to learn, but it makes ALSA be very powerful.

The video system in Linux supports deep color or 30-bit color. It can also support 36-bit color. What is required for this is a video card that supports this amount colors such as a workstation card from nVidia. What is ashame is client programs does not support 30-bit color, so they will have to be patch to support it.

Yes, Linux is free to use, but using to to run away from problems like viruses and other attacks is foolish. Also what is foolish is going crazy to be completely open source. This can not be done or else there will be gaps. If you want to play HD-DVD and Blu-Ray movies, you have to pay for commercial programs. Eventually Linux will get DRM and HDCP if we like it or not. If there is no HDCP, say good bye to HTPC. If there is no DRM say good bye to the ability to play back movies and TV shows, but everybody can be happy to say good bye to Flash. The only way to minimize the requirements of these protections everybody have to stop pirating content.

If people does not stop pirating content, HTPC running Linux will not fit in a home theater setting because it will not work. Sure Linux has a lot of capabilities that are mentioned earlier, but it comes useless if the protections are required in a home theater electronics.

What Linux is not designed for is low latency processing which is need for a media PC. Haiku operating system might be better as a media PC. Are you going to keep running from one operating system and then to the next in order to get back your freedom.
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post #207 of 273 Old 07-31-2010, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electroju View Post

You started the problem stating that Linux gives users protection which is not true.

You are wrong, it is true. When I used windows, I had to reinstall because of viral infections several times. And this is with an anti-virus program running.

Since I switched to Linux, I have never had a problem with trojans, viruses or any security related problems. And this is just my personal experiences. I didn't mention the tons of experts who also agree that Linux is more secure.

Quote:


What Linux is not designed for is low latency processing which is need for a media PC.

You have never heard of the Real-Time (RT) kernel? You don't seem to know enough about Linux to make any legitimate comments about it.
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post #208 of 273 Old 08-01-2010, 03:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterhead View Post



You have never heard of the Real-Time (RT) kernel? You don't seem to know enough about Linux to make any legitimate comments about it.

Agreed-

http://ubuntustudio.org/

http://ubuntustudio.org/LucidLynx

http://www.64studio.com/

http://www.google.com/search?q=ubunt...ient=firefox-a

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Ub...dioPreparation

Quote:


Real time (-rt) and Low latency (-lowlatency) kernels

You may want to install the -lowlatency kernel, you can simply do:

sudo apt-get install linux-lowlatency linux-headers-lowlatency



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post #209 of 273 Old 08-01-2010, 04:31 AM
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There also is the Planet CCRMA project from Stanford University (which I use). It takes a standard Fedora installation, and converts it to an audio studio type workstation.

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/software/
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post #210 of 273 Old 08-01-2010, 04:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electroju View Post

Security experts forgot about WINE, Crossover Office, and Cedega that Windows users to run Windows programs that are not yet have comparable native program in Linux. The use of these programs exposes your whole entire root. .

False

http://wiki.winehq.org/FAQ#head-96be...51f278b0d41014

By default, Wine runs Windows apps with non-root/non-Admin privileges. A user needs to explicitly run Wine as root for Win apps running under Wine to have root access-

Quote:


7.11. Should I run Wine as root?

/!\\ NEVER run Wine as root! Doing so gives Windows programs (and viruses) full access to your computer and every piece of media attached to it. Running with sudo also has these same risks but with the added bonus of breaking the permissions on your ~/.wine folder in the process. If you have run Wine with sudo you need to fix the permission errors as described in the next question, and then run winecfg to set Wine up again. You should always run Wine as the normal user you use to login.

For Linux systems, all ideas that Wine needs root can be solved through Posix Capabilities (http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/5737) or Posix File Capabilities (http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/li...-posixcap.html) or correcting other security settings.

As far as Windows programs are concerned, you are running with administrator privileges. If an application complains about a lack of administrator privileges, file a bug; running Wine as root probably won't help.



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