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post #61 of 401 Old 11-12-2009, 07:45 PM
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Yep, been emailing Dan today.

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post #62 of 401 Old 11-15-2009, 03:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VGI View Post

Ok so here is the official news.. The Compli Blue is just about ready to ship.. Its expected to ship in the next 3-4 weeks and its awesome..


Pricing i can tell you will be 3-4K list and we should have final pricing in the next few days..

Has it started shipping?

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post #63 of 401 Old 11-15-2009, 08:05 AM
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Whats with the $3K - $4K list? Theta originally announced $2995. Mike Pontelle of ATI confirmed this to me shortly after CEDIA. Has Theta decided to do a bit more upgrading than just the power supply? Maybe they are now modding the SA edition from Oppo with better DACs?

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post #64 of 401 Old 11-15-2009, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve bruzonsky View Post

whats with the $3k - $4k list? Theta originally announced $2995. Mike pontelle of ati confirmed this to me shortly after cedia. Has theta decided to do a bit more upgrading than just the power supply? Maybe they are now modding the sa edition from oppo with better dacs?

hd-sdi?

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #65 of 401 Old 11-15-2009, 01:44 PM
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I don´t think you will see HD SDI, but from what I have heard the Compli Blu will have several other advantages over the Oppo, improved analog output to mention one, not power supply only.
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post #66 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 12:46 PM
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I just stubled on the Theta Compli Blu manual. It contains pictures of the OPPO with the label "Oppo" in the pictures:

http://www.thetadigital.com/download...s%20manual.pdf

They're not even trying to hide that there's an Oppo inside!

From the manual:

"The Compli Blu, like all the other transports before it, is based on a manufacturing kit
obtained from a third party, then optimized by Theta Digital's experts to bring it up to our
high standards. In the past, we've partnered with Sony, Phillips and Pioneer. This time,
we're pleased to partner with Oppo, whose recent transports have garnered quite a
following. Both Oppo and Theta Digital are delighted to bring this top performing product to
you, and to build upon the already desirable performance of the BPD-83 and establish yet
another benchmark of performance in the transport product category.
In this manual, you'll see a couple diagrams showing the original BDP-83 faceplate and
remote control. Where appropriate, we've edited the content, but since the graphical user
interface remains largely the same, as well as the features set, it was deemed sufficient to
include those original diagrams.
"
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post #67 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Armand07 View Post

I don´t think you will see HD SDI, but from what I have heard the Compli Blu will have several other advantages over the Oppo, improved analog output to mention one, not power supply only.

It sounds like it's a rebadged Oppo BD-83 SPECIAL EDITION. (Check out http://www.oppodigital.com/ - they recently introduced this model with improved Audio; new DACs etc.).
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post #68 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Nielsen View Post

It sounds like it's a rebadged Oppo BD-83 SPECIAL EDITION. (Check out http://www.oppodigital.com/ - they recently introduced this model with improved Audio; new DACs etc.).

Expensive badge.

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post #69 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Nielsen View Post

It sounds like it's a rebadged Oppo BD-83 SPECIAL EDITION. (Check out http://www.oppodigital.com/ - they recently introduced this model with improved Audio; new DACs etc.).

Why do you say a rebadged 83SE and not a rebadged 83? Is there something in the manual that is a clue?

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post #70 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

Expensive badge.

Mike

Particularly since the Oppo SE is about $800.

Will wonders never cease? --- the wonder being that Theta will probably sell scads of these guys to the clueless.

I'd be pretty surprised if the Bluray picture were any better and surprised if the HDMI out were any better and pretty surprised if the upconverted standard DVD's were any better. That leaves the analog out portion. So could I go buy the $800 Oppo, a digital cable and any number of great external DACS and still be ahead?
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post #71 of 401 Old 11-17-2009, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

Why do you say a rebadged 83SE and not a rebadged 83? Is there something in the manual that is a clue?

Theta's claim that it has improved audio circuits, etc.

I'm questioning if some of the improvements in the Compli Blu aren't the very same ones done by Oppo in the 83SE. (Why would Theta reinvent the wheel when they can buy a better one from Oppo )
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post #72 of 401 Old 11-30-2009, 08:14 PM
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Are they going to add lead weights to unit (as they did with their LD players) to make it heavier?
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post #73 of 401 Old 11-30-2009, 08:27 PM
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Maybe they will use GOLD weights to explain the higher price. Now, if they would have offered a balanced design with appropriate outputs like the Denon player.... SJ
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post #74 of 401 Old 12-01-2009, 02:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axatax View Post

Are they going to add lead weights to unit (as they did with their LD players) to make it heavier?

Don't act if that was pointless; weight equals stability, a factor even more important when playing back an analog format like LD.
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post #75 of 401 Old 12-12-2009, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Nielsen View Post

Theta's claim that it has improved audio circuits, etc.

I'm questioning if some of the improvements in the Compli Blu aren't the very same ones done by Oppo in the 83SE. (Why would Theta reinvent the wheel when they can buy a better one from Oppo )

I would expect them to do it at a much higher level than Oppo did with the 83SE.

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post #76 of 401 Old 12-12-2009, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

That leaves the analog out portion. So could I go buy the $800 Oppo, a digital cable and any number of great external DACS and still be ahead?

You could not do high-rez audio with external dacs and a digital cables. None of the high-end dacs accept HDMI.

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post #77 of 401 Old 01-20-2010, 07:49 PM
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I have to say, all cynical comments aside, that this looks like the most interesting of the hie-end, Oppo re-badge players. It is the least expensive, appears to have had a decent number of modifications, and looks really nice.

Given the timing, I'd expect that this player is not based on the Oppo special edition. Perhaps that will change over time, but in my case I don't care because I just need a digital transport.

I do wonder, though, whether this player will be able to access the oppo firmware upgrades, or if not, what kind of delay will there be getting updates onto the Theta site.

From looking at the manual, for example, it does not look like ti has the most recent firmware version (that includes the subtitles shift feature).

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post #78 of 401 Old 01-20-2010, 10:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ca1ore View Post

Given the timing, I'd expect that this player is not based on the Oppo special edition.

There is a dead give away proving your point in their specs. The audio specs are identical to standard Oppo player. Sadly, it seems that they did not remasure them but simply reprinted Oppo's specs. Would have been nice to know if the new power supply made any difference in analog specs.

Quote:


I do wonder, though, whether this player will be able to access the oppo firmware upgrades, or if not, what kind of delay will there be getting updates onto the Theta site.

They say they have changed the firmware. So there will likely be some delay.

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post #79 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 12:40 PM
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So which is a better player, the Theta Compli Blu or the Lexicon BD-30? And which one offers more value?
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post #80 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by KyaDawn View Post

And which one offers more value?

The Oppo !!!
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post #81 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KyaDawn View Post

So which is a better player, the Theta Compli Blu or the Lexicon BD-30? And which one offers more value?

Per www.audioholics.com it looks like Lexicon put the Oppo player in a Lexicon shell without doing any substantive changes. WOOPS!

Does the Compli Blu faceplate look the same as the old Theta Compli faceplate. Did Theta switch the drive and display because it results in less vibration on the drive, or because now the old faceplates work?

Will the better power supply stuff on the Theta version yield me better picture and/or sound using the Compli Blu solely as a HDMI transport?
If trustworthy reviews indicate this then I may be interested.

If you are using the Theta for its analog outs, then does it have the better ESS DACs in the Oppo SE edition. I hope so. But I have seen nothing to indicate this.

QUESTIONS, QUESTIONS, QUESTIONS

If money ain't the object and analog out is your game, I understand that Charles Hansen of Ayre Acoustics has outlined all the substantive changes that Ayre is making to the Oppo over at the Blu Ray hardware forum here at AVS.

It is possible that the Compli Blu may be a good buy for the buck for some of us. But I think in view of the above, I'll wait for the reviews.

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post #82 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post

If you are using the Theta for its analog outs, then does it have the better ESS DACs in the Oppo SE edition. I hope so. But I have seen nothing to indicate this.

We have data to indicate they do NOT use the SE platform. Here are the audio specs:

http://www.thetadigital.com/compli_blu_info.shtml

"Audio Characteristics**
Frequency 20Hz - 20kHz (±0.4dB)
Signal-to-Noise Ratio >110dB (A-weighted)
THD+N < 0.002% (1kHz at 0dBFS, 20kHz LPF)"

These are word for word, including the missing "response" in the first spec with Oppo standard edition. So if the power supply change makes a difference they are not able to show it (due to lack of testing or lack of difference).

Here are the Oppo SE audio specs:http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-83SE/

Frequency: Stereo 20Hz - 44kHz (±0.2dB), 20kHz - 96kHz (±1.1dB)
7.1CH 20Hz - 44kHz (±0.4dB)
Signal-to-Noise Ratio: >117dB (A-weighted, auto-mute off)
THD+N: < 0.002% (1kHz at 0dBFS, 20kHz LPF)
Dynamic Range: >104dB (24-bit unweighted)
Channel Separation: >106dB (24-bit unweighted)

It is a very strange world out there. Oppo licenses the base box to these people and then goes off and builds a higher end model than the higher end companies! If they were going to license something, they should have licensed the SE version and not sell it direct. Competing with your customer this way is a very odd way to do business. If I were in these other people's shoes, I would work in every possible way to find another platform now.

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post #83 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 05:53 PM
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The Theta is not based on the SE version. It was designed and tooled before the SE became available.
It is modified in the following ways per Theta:
Here is the core of what Theta Digital has done this time around to "turbo charge" an existing transport:


1.Heavy 16 gauge steel chassis for rigidity.


2.Positions of transport mechanism and display have been swapped. Lowering the mechanism allows for elimination an intermediary mounting bracket and long standoffs, resulting in greater rigidity.


3.Completely rigid mounted mechanism replaces the original spring mounted system.


4.Special 3M adhesive damping material used on drawer assembly, further reducing vibration energy.


5.RS-232 control is included as a standard.


6.Custom designed front panel PCB.


7.Custom designed analog power supply, which includes the following:


A.An 80 Watt ultra-quiet toroidal transformer.


B.Additional, independent 10 Watt transformer for Standby circuit.


C.A total of 7 Amps of power available to supply the unit.


D.Four independently rectified and regulated power supplies.


E.Over 40,000 uF filter capacitance, in small, low ESR multiples.


F.2 oz. gold plated copper used throughout.


8.Proprietary Theta Digital customized software for superior performance, and that can be easily updated through USB port on the rear panel, or via Ethernet connection to Theta Digital's website.


9.Standard thick, brushed aluminum alloy cover provides better sonics and aesthetics as it reduces vibration energy further.


10.1/2" thick Tower and Faceplate matches other Theta Digital products.

I am told it will be the equal of the original Compli as a Redbook Transport as well as Analogue DSD & DVD-A output. The SD-DVD Video will be much better owing to the Anchor Bay ABT processing of the Oppo.
Whether these improvements will allow this unit to best the Analogue outputs of the SE version will only be told by listening. At least it seems to be a lot more than the re-packaged Lexicon.
We will have one in house very shortly to compare to a Denon DVD-5910CI, Elite 09FD, and a basic Oppo 83. We hope to get ahold of an SE as well, and I think we will have access to a NuForce SE verson shortly. I will post. Regards, Norm
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post #84 of 401 Old 01-21-2010, 09:42 PM
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Well it seems that Theta at least made a solid attempt at improving the BDP-83 whereas the Lexicon is nothing more than a standard BDP-83 set in additional housing and with slightly changed firmware to show a Lexicon splash. Whether the changes that Theta made results in a real-world improvements remain to be seen, but I give them a lot more credit than Lexicon for actually attempting improvements rather than selling a simply re-badged Oppo, if the information in this thread is correct.
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post #85 of 401 Old 01-22-2010, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tyree91 View Post

The Theta is not based on the SE version. It was designed and tooled before the SE became available.
It is modified in the following ways per Theta:
Here is the core of what Theta Digital has done this time around to "turbo charge" an existing transport:


1.Heavy 16 gauge steel chassis for rigidity.


2.Positions of transport mechanism and display have been swapped. Lowering the mechanism allows for elimination an intermediary mounting bracket and long standoffs, resulting in greater rigidity.


3.Completely rigid mounted mechanism replaces the original spring mounted system.


4.Special 3M adhesive damping material used on drawer assembly, further reducing vibration energy.


5.RS-232 control is included as a standard.


6.Custom designed front panel PCB.


7.Custom designed analog power supply, which includes the following:


A.An 80 Watt ultra-quiet toroidal transformer.


B.Additional, independent 10 Watt transformer for Standby circuit.


C.A total of 7 Amps of power available to supply the unit.


D.Four independently rectified and regulated power supplies.


E.Over 40,000 uF filter capacitance, in small, low ESR multiples.


F.2 oz. gold plated copper used throughout.


8.Proprietary Theta Digital customized software for superior performance, and that can be easily updated through USB port on the rear panel, or via Ethernet connection to Theta Digital's website.


9.Standard thick, brushed aluminum alloy cover provides better sonics and aesthetics as it reduces vibration energy further.


10.1/2" thick Tower and Faceplate matches other Theta Digital products.

I am told it will be the equal of the original Compli as a Redbook Transport as well as Analogue DSD & DVD-A output. The SD-DVD Video will be much better owing to the Anchor Bay ABT processing of the Oppo.
Whether these improvements will allow this unit to best the Analogue outputs of the SE version will only be told by listening. At least it seems to be a lot more than the re-packaged Lexicon.
We will have one in house very shortly to compare to a Denon DVD-5910CI, Elite 09FD, and a basic Oppo 83. We hope to get ahold of an SE as well, and I think we will have access to a NuForce SE verson shortly. I will post. Regards, Norm

Before rendering a verdict on any universal players, consider this. If the Theta CBIII HDMI implementation delivers and outperforms MC audio over analog, all you'll ever need is a digital transport, and you need to evaluate all these mega buck players purely on their merits as digital transports (which will very likely take Ayre and the like out of the game). Same story if you already own Meridan, Halcro, Anthem, or any other high-end processor. In this scenario, - in a rational world - there would be no market for $5K+ universals. Except for the handful of purist who would want to use these epensive players to run SACD through the players convertors, and all the rest digital out.

IF Theta's CBIII HDMI (and Meridian HD621) turn out NOT to sound any better then running a top notch univeral through analog MC, theoretically the target market for $5K+ universals would be the new (post HDMI) analog die hards.

I think the dirty little secret is this. Mega bucks universal players with top notch analog output are NOT aimed at these post HDMI analog die hards (there are not enough of them). I suspect a custom HT installer selling a $50K+ package worth of electronics will find it easier to package a $5K+ universal into the project (that will only ever be used as a digital transport), than a $500 Oppo (this line item on the bill will be frowned on).

It would be very interesting to know how many universal players (with or without Blu Ray) out in the field with a few Gs worth of DACs and analog output electronics packed into them are in fact only used as digital transport. I suspect a lot. I know for a fact that all HT stores in ever walked into has set up their showroom running their very expensive source components as digital transports only.

So my theory is this gear is aimed the crowd that buy the most expensive components as a matter of principle. So high end manufacturers just need an expensive universal BR player in their product lineup, to be credible.

Incidentally, this is how Lexington can get away with repackaging the Oppo - most buyers will only ever use it as digital transport and video source, for which application it will probably be near SOTA. This all about marketing - not engineering.

All this nothwithstanding, if Theta knows their CBIII HDMI implementation will make the analog cricuits in their BR universal player obsolete, it will still make sense for them to release a reasonably priced (by high end standards) universal with matching Theta esthetics, rack mountable and possibly a bit better sounding than the Oppo as a transport. However, I think there is a reason they did not go all out and design a 10K player. It is a sign of their commitment to a digital source - all conversion in the CBIII architecture.
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post #86 of 401 Old 01-22-2010, 06:18 AM
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There are those when given 100% of something, will always want, and pay exhorbitant prices for, the perception of 101%.

Thank GOD for these people as the economy truly needs your illogical spending abilities at this point in time.

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post #87 of 401 Old 01-22-2010, 06:52 AM
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At 1080P24 and lossless, I see no need to spend over $500-$600. Anyone in this player category should be using HDMI if they know anything about surround processing. Analog is great but if you need it, there are a myriad of excellent SACD, CD only dedicated players that are far less $$.

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #88 of 401 Old 01-22-2010, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KyaDawn View Post

So which is a better player, the Theta Compli Blu or the Lexicon BD-30? And which one offers more value?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kucharsk View Post

Don't act if that was pointless; weight equals stability, a factor even more important when playing back an analog format like LD.

The K's have it in the snark department. I laughed. Twice.
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post #89 of 401 Old 01-22-2010, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterS View Post

There are those when given 100% of something, will always want, and pay exhorbitant prices for, the perception of 101%.

Thank GOD for these people as the economy truly needs your illogical spending abilities at this point in time.

Yes, some don't know a "black box" when they see one!!!@@@

"Doug Winsor" used to troll at some AV Forums as "Steve Bruzonsky"! My home theater at:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1158431
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post #90 of 401 Old 01-23-2010, 06:48 AM
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Steve,

Have you seen (or heard) one? ;-)

"Read Less, More TV." - Dr. Gregory House

"That which can not be questioned, can not be trusted." - Me

The Metropolis Home Theater

Blue Smoke Entertainment Systems - Affiliated
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