Cedia 2009: Theta digital news!!!@@@ - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Now that I hooked you - some who is attending CEDIA can post here with the latest Theta Digital news.

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post #2 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 12:41 PM - Thread Starter
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CEDIA will hopefully update us re info at Theta's current website:

http://www.thetadigital.com/faq.shtml

Casablanca III

Q: Is the Casablanca III compatible with HDMI?

A1: The Theta Digital's product development team are hard at work on several projects, including an HDMI 1.3 audio and video solution exclusively for the Casablanca III, for use with the Premium, the Superior II and the Xtreme D-2 DAC cards. (The discontinued Standard and Superior I DAC cards are not compatible with HDMI audio.) The final pricing has not been determined, but the product development team is estimating it will be around $4,000 USD to $5,000.00 USD to install the HDMI 1.3 audio and video solution in a Casablanca III. This option will likely become available this summer. Once installed, it will allow the Casablanca III to access and process the latest HD audio codecs from Dolby Labs and DTS. The video portion will be pass-through, to allow folks to use the HDMI video processor / scaler / transcoder / upconverter of their choice.

A2: The team is also working on an all-balanced higher resolution Digital Output card for the Casablanca III that will likely be released once the HDMI option is available. Final pricing of that new Digital Output card has not even been estimated yet, since it's still in the midst of development.

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post #3 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 01:24 PM
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Summer? 2010? $4000 - $5000? Is the pricing determined by charging $1000 for every year Theta has been late to the game with HDMI?

C'mon Steve, you know more than this. I could've written that press release last year and been right on!!!
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There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #4 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Summer? 2010? $4000 - $5000? Is the pricing determined by charging $1000 for every year Theta has been late to the game with HDMI?

C'mon Steve, you know more than this. I could've written that press release last year and been right on!!!

Jeff, since you are at CEDIA, we are waiting for your report and pictures!!

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post #5 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 03:09 PM
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From the forum you last moderated,"I spoke with Carl Nicholson at the Theta booth. The bad news is the HDMI card is not ready. He would not give me a definite date but I got the distinct impression that CES would be the launch date. The good news is they debuted the Compli Blue Blu-ray player. It is based on the Oppo unit, with the power supply and the digital and analog audio sections by Theta. I'll post pictures soon.'' Administration.

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post #6 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bulldogger View Post

From the forum you last moderated,"I spoke with Carl Nicholson at the Theta booth. The bad news is the HDMI card is not ready. He would not give me a definite date but I got the distinct impression that CES would be the launch date. The good news is they debuted the Compli Blue Blu-ray player. It is based on the Oppo unit, with the power supply and the digital and analog audio sections by Theta. I'll post pictures soon.'' Administration. Frack Theta.

That one. The one I left when they let DW post there. HA!

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post #7 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 04:30 PM
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Should be just in time for HDMI 1.4
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post #8 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 04:34 PM
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HDMI 1.4 equals more bandwidth, 3-D, and ethernet over HDMI... the latter being a big plus! (at least in limiting cables).


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There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #9 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 06:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bulldogger View Post

Ya know, I am actually relocating and building a new house http://www.architecturaldesigns.com/...8034FM&or=TRew house . Likely, I would not do an upgrade until next summer. It's a principle issue for me. Theta is not credible. IF I upgrade whenever the thing happens, this will be my last dealing with Theta. I am DONE. Blu-ray player from Theta? Never.

You are taking your Six Shooter out of its holster and aimin' it right at Theta? Sounds like you are ready to get in bed with The Bland. Almost makes ya wish ya went with Halcro. HA! HA!

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post #10 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 06:23 PM
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Yep, may well jump ship too. Its gotten absurd, even dishonest. I've had it.


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post #11 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 06:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post

You are taking your Six Shooter out of its holster and aimin' it right at Theta? Sounds like you are ready to get in bed with The Bland. Almost makes ya wish ya went with Halcro. HA! HA!

I don't see the humor here. Sure I butt heads with you and Bulldogger but I was waiting to here the 'I told you so' talk this week and ultimately, I wanted to see how Theta handled this. I mean, the banter is all in fun but getting HDMI is serious if you care about home theater. I was secretly rooting for you guys to get it .. For all your guys' sakes, I was hoping you'd get your HDMI, 1080P24 pass through and lossless.. If Theta truly is pushing this until next year, who'd really wait or will it really come as an upgrade? They may be planning to do what Lexicon found to be necessary, trade in the analog box for an HDMI one. I didn't really want to be the one saying 'I told you so' but I am shocked if I was right all along!?


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There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #12 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 06:35 PM
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**crying**

If were even close, they would show something! This is VERY dissapointing!

My Theta has been sitting on the side awaiting the upgrade. I have been using the Onkyo DTC 9.8 in the meantime, and it does an amazing job with Digital sources (analog input - not so much). However, I am not going to wait 12 more months for this to arrive, as it will be done and over with before then.

HDMI 1.4 is coming. I bet it will be available within 6-8 months. First truly outstanding, audiophile piece which supports it fully will get the cash I put aside for Theta.

VERY DISSAPOINTING!


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post #13 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 06:56 PM
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**crying**

However, I am not going to wait 12 more months for this to arrive, as it will be done and over with before then.

HDMI 1.4 is coming. I bet it will be available within 6-8 months. First truly outstanding, audiophile piece which supports it fully will get the cash I put aside for Theta.

VERY DISSAPOINTING!

I gave up on Theta a year ago...using the Integra 9.8 while the CBIII collects dust. I have tried to sell my CBIII but no takers. Perhaps Theta can purchase it back for parts?
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post #14 of 501 Old 09-10-2009, 08:09 PM
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As for resale, we're stuck keeping it until the upgrade comes out -- if it comes out.

I've been using the Onkyo too, but pulling the L/R outputs and running them from the Theta for music. Thought my days as a switchboard operator were coming to an end.


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post #15 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 01:41 AM
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As for resale, we're stuck keeping it until the upgrade comes out -- if it comes out.

I've been using the Onkyo too, but pulling the L/R outputs and running them from the Theta for music. Thought my days as a switchboard operator were coming to an end.

You and Shumi raise the other big factor in all this. It is one thing to keep being spoofed by Theta, but if you did want to move on and reclaim some money back from the considerable amount invested in the CBIII, the thing has practically no re-sale value.

This whole saga began with those deliberately misleading posts from Theta's former owners on Theta's website and this forum back in 2007. It seems that despite ATI taking over and supposedly providing Theta with the resources they needed to get the thing done; Theta still do not have the required engineering capability to deal with the complexities and constantly evolving nature of HDMI.

I expect Theta realise that most current owners could not justify selling their CBIII's at tremendous loss and will just hang on to them; even if they take the unit out of their systems. From Theta's point of view, while current owners might be aggravated and some may even dump the brand forever, enough will keep their CBIIIs so that if the upgrade ever is done there will be a pool of people who will be fairly guaranteed to buy it. IMHO, it has been this that helps Theta justify continued investment from it's parent company.

Sean
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post #16 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 07:49 AM - Thread Starter
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I've been warning folks for a long time now to buy something "inexpensive" like the Integra DTC 9.8 to tide them over hoping Theta will come thru with the HDMI 1.3 upgrade, not to newly get into a Theta CB3 until the chicken has hatched from the egg. Despite that foolish OB at that "other forum" accusing me of leading the blind when he hadn't read my posts.

Due to all the delays, whatever the reason (actually, I know of a large reason for the delay, that you don't know, but I am sworn to confidentiality on that), putting new money into a CB3 is foolish at this point, - until HDMI is out and reasonably available as an upgrade path. And unless that occurs, folks will be justified to feel that they have been mislead by Theta. I am "hoping" HDMI will eventually come out in 2010 sometime and that the upgrade will have the nickname "The Bland's Folly" but yea
folks are quite justified to consider The Bland as a audio video Nostradamus re the end of (not the world) Theta Digital.

As for the Theta Blu Ray Player - hey, give us two of them, one simply as a HDMI transport, and one with the upgraded multi-channel analog outputs. That makes more sense assuming Theta intends and does come thru with HDMI 1.3 on the CB3. At this point a big assumption.

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post #17 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 08:13 AM
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Steve,

I think that at this point, unless they implement HDMI 1.4, and are amongst the first to get it out the door working, no one will care. Since this is the way things are going, at this point I will wait and see.


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post #18 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 10:38 AM
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This is pretty scary stuff. This morning I starting thinking about converting my CBIII to a high end paperweight or doorstop. But is there any single device available that can access the new bluray codecs and still sound as good as the CBIII with extreme dacs on redbook cd?

For a while I had a loaner Integra and for cd play it was just not as detailed and involving.

Steve
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post #19 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 11:09 AM
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I hope Evelyn is not laughing hard somewhere on a yacht!!! Someone should dig up her posts on this. I can't recall exactly when (# of years ago) or the thread title.


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There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #20 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 11:11 AM
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actually, I know of a large reason for the delay, that you don't know, but I am sworn to confidentiality on that)

This is exactly the kind of nonsense that has to stop. Trickles and rumors through private sources. Theta's major asset outside of their technology at this point is the installed base who may still be interested. They need to come clean. I work in marketing/advertising -- done right (like their digital), it is their best move. Let us know exactly what's going on, level with us -- it creates goodwill between the company and consumer, and in this case, might reestablish some trust. Whatever is going on, their marketing/PR has been headless.


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post #21 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 11:22 AM
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Actually, it likely doesn't matter what the delay cause is this time as Theta is on their 5th delay excuse. I think Peter is right, no HDMI 1.4 no go.

Why bother with an expensive HDMI solution (1.3) at the dawn of it's demise?

This is the time ATI should be fast at work on HDMI 1.4 and be the leader in the newest technology rather than the caboose on the train of advancements.


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There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #22 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 11:30 AM
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Not sure what the value to me is of HDMI 1.4, though admittedly haven't thought it through. 3D is some years away from worthwhile home use for many reasons, and I'm sure the transmission standards will have changed by that time. Ethernet over HDMI? Don't see the big deal, but might well be missing something. As for greater bandwidth, I expect that to be well ahead of the software for quite awhile. Gaming maybe, but 4K movies files won't be on a disc, and the availability, methodology and bandwidth to download them is also distant, to say nothing of any kind of user base w/4K pjs.

Thinking out loud here before really thinking, but why is HDMI 1.4 important? Seems like just another stop in the road and not a particularly compelling one.


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post #23 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rblnr View Post

This is exactly the kind of nonsense that has to stop. Trickles and rumors through private sources. Theta's major asset outside of their technology at this point is the installed base who may still be interested. They need to come clean. I work in marketing/advertising -- done right (like their digital), it is their best move. Let us know exactly what's going on, level with us -- it creates goodwill between the company and consumer, and in this case, might reestablish some trust. Whatever is going on, their marketing/PR has been headless.

I agree, the vague "I know something you don't" stuff is just pointless and a little egotistical frankly. To me, whatever the reason for the delay, it is another example of Theta not meeting their own timetable, further casting doubt on their credibility and Theta have a big credibility problem IMHO.
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post #24 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 12:08 PM
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The real issue I have is Theta's silence, they made a specefic claim about summer arrival, if that is not the case they need to be forthcoming, silence is very amateur.

Oh and yes Steve your comment is also very immature, how does your secret knowledge help the forum discussion?
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post #25 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 12:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccaff View Post

This is pretty scary stuff. This morning I starting thinking about converting my CBIII to a high end paperweight or doorstop. But is there any single device available that can access the new bluray codecs and still sound as good as the CBIII with extreme dacs on redbook cd?

For a while I had a loaner Integra and for cd play it was just not as detailed and involving.

Steve

How good is the Meridian 861, which has an HDMI add on, for redbook CD?

How good is the new Classe HDMI surround processor on redbook CD?

That I don't know.

But yea the EXtreme DACs are darn fine as is the Six Shooter preamp. But it would be nice to someday get the rest of the package but who knows?

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post #26 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 12:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LJG View Post

The real issue I have is Theta's silence, they made a specefic claim about summer arrival, if that is not the case they need to be forthcoming, silence is very amateur.

Oh and yes Steve your comment is also very immature, how does your secret knowledge help the forum discussion?

How does anything here help the forum discussion???

Your first paragraph is right on point!!!@@@

I will accept your criticism on "immaturity" since you are a designated expert my friend. HA!

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post #27 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post

How good is the Meridian 861, which has an HDMI add on, for redbook CD?

How good is the new Classe HDMI surround processor on redbook CD?

That I don't know.

But yea the EXtreme DACs are darn fine as is the Six Shooter preamp. But it would be nice to someday get the rest of the package but who knows?

I feel for the Theta owners as I went through something very similar a few years back when I had a fully loaded TAG AV192R (i.e. with deinterlacer + scaler +...) only to find out that 3 months later they were pucrahsed by IAG and that was the end of the AV192R...

I took a chance that my intuition was right and got out of my AV192R and moved to Meridian and could not be happier...while Meridian has there own way of doing things which is somnetimes problematic the HD621 + 861 does sound terrific and, perhaps admittedly bias, I have no thoughts of moving / upgrading to something else as the combination (also have a Meridian 800 for redbook CD playback over MHR) sounds great!

I wish -- truly do -- all the Theta owners well...

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post #28 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 12:56 PM
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You need to just give up on theta. I have even moved on from Halcro and now use the Simaudio cp-8. It is one hell of a processor. It just works. Even with the new Halcro 220 (as good as it was) it still had its faults. The Cp-8 has worked from the start just plug and play, not one glitch and the quality of the music is much (i say) much better then the Halcros. I was one of the first to buy the Halcro and I hated to jump ship, but when I find a product that is this good, I just have to move on. Also with the economy the way it is there are deals to be made.
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post #29 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 01:00 PM
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in today's world, I wouldn't recommend the Halcro unless it is used and the price is extremely good. I wouldn't recommend a new one at all as it is too quirky and HDMI 1.2. We are simply in the dark ages with SSPs.. Though the Simaudio appears to be a new light.


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post #30 of 501 Old 09-11-2009, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogger View Post

The good news is they debuted the Compli Blue Blu-ray player. It is based on the Oppo unit, with the power supply and the digital and analog audio sections by Theta. I'll post pictures soon.'' Administration. Frack Theta.

Very interesting, any ideas on release date and prices ?

Btw, HDMI 1.4 is 2160p capable too, don't forget that guys.

[]s,
Fernando
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Reply Ultra Hi-End HT Gear ($20,000+)

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