The official Theta Owners Thread - Page 297 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!


Forum Jump: 
 107Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #8881 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 07:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
stevekale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London
Posts: 1,199
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 146 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Subwoofers all have some group delay. Unlike some, I am not an engineer and/or I do not want to spend hours reading technical articles and trying to understand exactly what group delay is. All I know from a quick Google is that group delay applies to subwoofers with low frequency output. Barry at JL Audio told me that my f212 subwoofers have a 12 millisecond (ms) group delay. In audio terms, one foot = 1 ms delay. So I added 12 feet to my subwoofer distance in the CBIV menu. Barry explained that this really dials in the subwoofer. Now the group delay for other makes and models of subwoofer may vary some.
You can use REW to more accurately dial in delay and phase to align (a) multiple subs and (b) the subs to your mains

Demand greater honesty and transparency in high-end audio

With Theta, Egglestonworks and Krell since 1998!
stevekale is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #8882 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 11:54 AM
BP
Senior Member
 
BP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Suburban NYC
Posts: 441
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Steve and other CB Dirac users;
I don't post here too often but felt compelled to on this topic.
I wanted to add my voice to the others who have been amazed by the improvements brought to their systems by adding Dirac. It's worthy of a "wow!"
I have acoustic treatments which helped quite a bit. I knew there was room for improvement but I still enjoyed my system.
Then I demoed the KEF Blade Two speakers with Craig and George. While I still need another demo to cement my feelings about them, the demo of the Blades and several other similarly priced speakers made the shortcomings of my Aerial/JL 212's combo all too apparent.
So did a small new office system (Devialet and KEF LS50's), believe it or not!
John B @ Theta has always been a wonderful resource. He provided me with screen shots and some other documentation so I would be comfortable running Dirac.
Bottom line: it's like I have a new system!!!
The changes are so profound that I couldn't believe the sound I was hearing was from the same equipment. It has given my system a new lease on life!!! I just can't stop listening to it while my hands, feet and head are moving with the music. I am so engrossed now that I want to hear each cut through to the end to listen to what the engineer wanted me to hear.
The acid test was my wife! She has patiently sat and listened to changes I've made to the system through the years and always said "it sounded good before and sounds good now." This time she sat down, listened to a cut she knew and said "it's much clearer now!" 1st time in years she had been able to discern the difference. And that difference is audible from top to bottom!! Simply awesome!!
Now I am wondering what magic Dirac will bring to the KEF Blade Two.
When I return to my NY system in a few days the 1st change I will make will be to add some distance to the sub settings to accommodate their inherent delay.
There are times I love this hobby; this is one of them!:smiley:
bp
BP is offline  
post #8883 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 01:31 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Steve Bruzonsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Posts: 18,001
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Sonic improvements sometimes sort of lift a veil to some extent. ANd I have a great room with excellent Michael Greene PZC acoustic treatment. Yet Dirac has not lifted a small veil, but a BIG VEIL!

You mean you don't remember me? Back 1999 - 2003, I started and moderated the AVS Tweaks forum and also the AVS Special Guests forum.

My home theater at:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1158431
Steve Bruzonsky is online now  
post #8884 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 02:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Les Auber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 1,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I've been playing the game a few years now and understand. I've made changes that have lifted a veil. Some more than others. This is more like raising a curtain. A veil isn't near heavy enough.


Les

Les
Les Auber is offline  
post #8885 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 05:33 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Steve Bruzonsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Posts: 18,001
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Auber View Post
I've been playing the game a few years now and understand. I've made changes that have lifted a veil. Some more than others. This is more like raising a curtain. A veil isn't near heavy enough.


Les
Good one. And correct! I'll take you one further. Dirac Live is raising the curtain. And it raises the bar. One of these days Dirac Unison will raise the Titanic!

You mean you don't remember me? Back 1999 - 2003, I started and moderated the AVS Tweaks forum and also the AVS Special Guests forum.

My home theater at:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1158431
Steve Bruzonsky is online now  
post #8886 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 07:08 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Rod#S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,882
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 156 Post(s)
Liked: 36
I know Theta at a recent show in Newport had the new D3 DAC installed into the new CBIVa along with the new 8x2 HDMI 2.0, HDCP 2.2 card. Was there ever a shot of the rear of that unit? Also I'm curious if there has been any pictures of the CBV and the external 12 channel DAC that was announced at the same time as the CBV to partner with the unit to get it beyond the 12 channel internal limitation?

Rod#S is offline  
post #8887 of 8900 Old 07-04-2015, 09:31 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Les Auber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 1,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 15
The official Theta Owners Thread

Rod, I don't recall seeing any of that but maybe Craig or Jeff will share.

Steve, we could go down the whole thesaurus for superlatives but I think we all agree that Dirac is a game changer. That there's better coming is just icing the cake.


Les

Les
Les Auber is offline  
post #8888 of 8900 Old Today, 09:46 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Stereojeff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Whittier, CA USA
Posts: 1,567
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod#S View Post
I know Theta at a recent show in Newport had the new D3 DAC installed into the new CBIVa along with the new 8x2 HDMI 2.0, HDCP 2.2 card. Was there ever a shot of the rear of that unit? Also I'm curious if there has been any pictures of the CBV and the external 12 channel DAC that was announced at the same time as the CBV to partner with the unit to get it beyond the 12 channel internal limitation?
We've made several changes to our earlier plans. The 8 x 2 HDMI card was neither HDCP2.2 nor HDMI 2.0 compatible and will not be introduced. We will have a new 4 x 1 card shortly that is 2.2 and 2.0 that will become our standard offering. Pricing for use as a replacement card is not yet established.

The 6-channel DAC card is in production now. We will announce exact availability shortly.

The CB V has a new working title of CB-E (fifth letter of the alphabet). It is on a new chassis. Cosmetics will be in keeping with previous 'Blanca's but is changed significantly. It will be capable of 32 channels and will not need an external DAC.

The CB IVa will be available with up to 12 channels and will not expand beyond that footprint. It will definitely have Atmos and DTS:X. We are an Aurosound licensee and will add Auro-3D whenever Auro can supply the TI chip code.

Jeff
Stereojeff is online now  
post #8889 of 8900 Old Today, 10:29 AM
AVS Special Member
 
stevekale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London
Posts: 1,199
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 146 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Ready, fire, aim!! But good that the munitions eventually land on target.

Looking forward to the new DAC. Thanks for the update Jeff.


CBE: Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire. How about we nickname it Commander Casablanca!

Demand greater honesty and transparency in high-end audio

With Theta, Egglestonworks and Krell since 1998!

Last edited by stevekale; Today at 10:33 AM.
stevekale is offline  
post #8890 of 8900 Old Today, 10:42 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Rod#S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,882
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 156 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereojeff View Post
We've made several changes to our earlier plans. The 8 x 2 HDMI card was neither HDCP2.2 nor HDMI 2.0 compatible and will not be introduced. We will have a new 4 x 1 card shortly that is 2.2 and 2.0 that will become our standard offering. Pricing for use as a replacement card is not yet established.

The 6-channel DAC card is in production now. We will announce exact availability shortly.

The CB V has a new working title of CB-E (fifth letter of the alphabet). It is on a new chassis. Cosmetics will be in keeping with previous 'Blanca's but is changed significantly. It will be capable of 32 channels and will not need an external DAC.

The CB IVa will be available with up to 12 channels and will not expand beyond that footprint. It will definitely have Atmos and DTS:X. We are an Aurosound licensee and will add Auro-3D whenever Auro can supply the TI chip code.

Jeff

Thanks very much Jeff, great info. About the HDMI card, do you have plans on introducing say another card in the line up that would be 8x2? A 4x1 doesn't really cut it in today's world and it kind of sucks if we have to use up 2 card slots to get particularly 8 inputs. My card preference would be 8x2 on the HDMI front plus a card that has a least 1 balanced analog input and a digital card with at least one AES/EBU input and at least one USB input (preferably more). If all this was possible with the CBIVa plus 12 channels of D3 DACs (so 2 cards) that would be ideal.


If the CB-E is now going to have onboard 32 channels then the chassis must be going to be a behemoth if you stick to the audiophile XLR outputs and don't go the way of Trinnov and add DB25 outs thus facilitating the need for DB25->XLR break-out cables.?

Rod#S is offline  
post #8891 of 8900 Old Today, 10:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
stevekale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London
Posts: 1,199
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 146 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod#S View Post
If the CB-E is now going to have onboard 32 channels then the chassis must be going to be a behemoth if you stick to the audiophile XLR outputs and don't go the way of Trinnov and add DB25 outs thus facilitating the need for DB25->XLR break-out cables.?
A related question: is the latest that is it going to go wider (only) and hence use the same DACs (plug 'n play) as the CB IV/IVa, i.e. up to 6 channels per DAC, or is it going taller as well (e.g. 4x 8 channels) with different DACs? I note the very clever configuration of the D-3 - at least based on looking at the high res image - with what appears to be a master board which sits vertically and each DAC channel plugging in horizontally would lend itself to an 8 channel capable master board that's taller with standardised channel cards that are commutable from CB IV to the commander.

Demand greater honesty and transparency in high-end audio

With Theta, Egglestonworks and Krell since 1998!
stevekale is offline  
post #8892 of 8900 Old Today, 11:05 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Rod#S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,882
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 156 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Just thought of something else, is the CB-E still targeting running at 192/24 internally? If so are there still plans to try and get Dirac running at 192/24? If so that would be epic!

Rod#S is offline  
post #8893 of 8900 Old Today, 12:48 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Jim HTPC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South Florida
Posts: 1,303
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod#S View Post
Just thought of something else, is the CB-E still targeting running at 192/24 internally? If so are there still plans to try and get Dirac running at 192/24? If so that would be epic!
The reason DIRAC is at 96KHz is due to the current Xtreme DAC clock is running at 96KHz. I do not have info on what was ultimately decided on the new DAC. Last I heard the plan was to be able to do 192/24 with new Xtreme DAC boards. I do not know if this will further change DIRAC until an announcement is made.
Jim HTPC is online now  
post #8894 of 8900 Old Today, 12:57 PM
Advanced Member
 
Kishore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: San Diego
Posts: 521
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereojeff View Post
...

The CB IVa will be available with up to 12 channels and will not expand beyond that footprint. It will definitely have Atmos and DTS:X. We are an Aurosound licensee and will add Auro-3D whenever Auro can supply the TI chip code.

Jeff
Thank you Jeff for the update!

Maybe I am biased I think the IVa (for me IV would do be enough now to be honest) will be more than sufficient for most of folks in the middle..while folks with dedicated HT set-up would opt for the 'E' version.

Regards,
Kishore
Kishore is offline  
post #8895 of 8900 Old Today, 12:58 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Steve Bruzonsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Posts: 18,001
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post
The reason DIRAC is at 96KHz is due to the current Xtreme DAC clock is running at 96KHz. I do not have info on what was ultimately decided on the new DAC. Last I heard the plan was to be able to do 192/24 with new Xtreme DAC boards. I do not know if this will further change DIRAC until an announcement is made.
Actually, you have got it backwards I think. Theta has stated that the CBIV is 192/24 capable, but that as Dirac is only 96/24 for now they have chosen to have the CBIV process at 96/24. Dirac's software even for the PC had been limited to 96/24, and Dirac based on that software provided software for the CBIV which ported that 96/24 software to the CBIV, thus Theta is running the CBIV at 96/24 processing.
By late 2014 Dirac came out with new PC software which runs up to 192/24. I surmise that Theta has requested Dirac to provide programming for the CBE (and maybe CBIVA?) to run at 192/24? Or perhaps Theta will simply wait for Dirac to make available programming for Dirac Unison?

Theta must rely on Dirac for all of this third party software. So what we see and when may well depend on Dirac!

Meanwhile, Dirac Live at 96/24 is amazing and exceeds by far what I ever could have anticipated!

You mean you don't remember me? Back 1999 - 2003, I started and moderated the AVS Tweaks forum and also the AVS Special Guests forum.

My home theater at:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1158431
Steve Bruzonsky is online now  
post #8896 of 8900 Old Today, 01:06 PM
AVS Special Member
 
stevekale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London
Posts: 1,199
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 146 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Correct.

Although the D-2 is, according to Theta's website, still limited to 96kHz.

If the D-3 is importing the Gen VIII S3 tech into the CB then I'm sure it is 192/24 capable. I'm sure Jeff will chime in as to whether raising Dirac Live to 24/192kHz requires just a firmware change or a hardware change. I'd expect the former.

I'm in the Kishore camp for quite some time at least but a question: you're a IV owner running, say, 7.1 and are looking at expanding to the likes of IVa, Auro and DTX... what 4 channels are added/prioritised?

Demand greater honesty and transparency in high-end audio

With Theta, Egglestonworks and Krell since 1998!

Last edited by stevekale; Today at 01:10 PM.
stevekale is offline  
post #8897 of 8900 Old Today, 01:26 PM
Advanced Member
 
Bigmoviefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 631
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by BP View Post
Steve and other CB Dirac users;
I don't post here too often but felt compelled to on this topic.
I wanted to add my voice to the others who have been amazed by the improvements brought to their systems by adding Dirac. It's worthy of a "wow!"
I have acoustic treatments which helped quite a bit. I knew there was room for improvement but I still enjoyed my system.
Then I demoed the KEF Blade Two speakers with Craig and George. While I still need another demo to cement my feelings about them, the demo of the Blades and several other similarly priced speakers made the shortcomings of my Aerial/JL 212's combo all too apparent.
So did a small new office system (Devialet and KEF LS50's), believe it or not!
John B @ Theta has always been a wonderful resource. He provided me with screen shots and some other documentation so I would be comfortable running Dirac.
Bottom line: it's like I have a new system!!!
The changes are so profound that I couldn't believe the sound I was hearing was from the same equipment. It has given my system a new lease on life!!! I just can't stop listening to it while my hands, feet and head are moving with the music. I am so engrossed now that I want to hear each cut through to the end to listen to what the engineer wanted me to hear.
The acid test was my wife! She has patiently sat and listened to changes I've made to the system through the years and always said "it sounded good before and sounds good now." This time she sat down, listened to a cut she knew and said "it's much clearer now!" 1st time in years she had been able to discern the difference. And that difference is audible from top to bottom!! Simply awesome!!
Now I am wondering what magic Dirac will bring to the KEF Blade Two.
When I return to my NY system in a few days the 1st change I will make will be to add some distance to the sub settings to accommodate their inherent delay.
There are times I love this hobby; this is one of them!:smiley:
bp
What is opinion of the Kef Blade Twos?
Bigmoviefan is offline  
post #8898 of 8900 Old Today, 01:55 PM
Advanced Member
 
thezaks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Laveen, AZ
Posts: 996
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
Liked: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekale View Post
Correct.
I'm in the Kishore camp for quite some time at least but a question: you're a IV owner running, say, 7.1 and are looking at expanding to the likes of IVa, Auro and DTX... what 4 channels are added/prioritised?
My problem is that my room does not allow for surround channel speakers to be at ear level, since my family room is part of a great room that includes dining room and kitchen. So, my 4 surround speakers are ceiling mounted. I think the only additional speakers that I could do would be two ceiling speakers above the front left/right speakers and the VOG speaker. I'm not sure if any of those technologies will be able to handle that kind of configuration or not.

Dave
thezaks is online now  
post #8899 of 8900 Old Today, 01:59 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Jim HTPC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South Florida
Posts: 1,303
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Actually, you have got it backwards I think. Theta has stated that the CBIV is 192/24 capable, but that as Dirac is only 96/24 for now they have chosen to have the CBIV process at 96/24. Dirac's software even for the PC had been limited to 96/24, and Dirac based on that software provided software for the CBIV which ported that 96/24 software to the CBIV, thus Theta is running the CBIV at 96/24 processing.
By late 2014 Dirac came out with new PC software which runs up to 192/24. I surmise that Theta has requested Dirac to provide programming for the CBE (and maybe CBIVA?) to run at 192/24? Or perhaps Theta will simply wait for Dirac to make available programming for Dirac Unison?

Theta must rely on Dirac for all of this third party software. So what we see and when may well depend on Dirac!

Meanwhile, Dirac Live at 96/24 is amazing and exceeds by far what I ever could have anticipated!
No Steve,

We are talking DAC clock hardware. The current Xtreme's are physically clocked at 96KHz. Can't make the the DACS faster than it's internal clock speed.
Jim HTPC is online now  
post #8900 of 8900 Old Today, 03:46 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Steve Bruzonsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Posts: 18,001
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim HTPC View Post
No Steve,

We are talking DAC clock hardware. The current Xtreme's are physically clocked at 96KHz. Can't make the the DACS faster than it's internal clock speed.
Yea - we are both right, as when the CBIV came out (1) the Extreme D-2 DACs only clock at 96-24 AND (2) at that time, the only software for the CBIV and other SSPs provided by Dirac could do no more than 96-24!

You mean you don't remember me? Back 1999 - 2003, I started and moderated the AVS Tweaks forum and also the AVS Special Guests forum.

My home theater at:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1158431
Steve Bruzonsky is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Ultra Hi-End HT Gear ($20,000+)



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off