Lexicon MC12 & other high end processors Vs Onkyo with Audessy - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 08:12 AM
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Not sure what point you're trying to make with the link, but it's a perfect example of how far RC technology has evolved since the publication of Meridian's white paper.

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post #92 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Not sure what point you're trying to make with the link, but it's a perfect example of how far RC technology has evolved since the publication of Meridian's white paper.
I posted the link just for informational purpose - not expressing an opinion on it - certainly not suggesting that they are incorrect. I thought the information might be useful to others.

It is my intent to be open about this issue.. In that trinnov link, they briefly touch on the time domain issues. I would like to hear more about the time domain issues - it is a subject which interests me and I am hoping that someone would post about that also.. now that the my original intent on starting this thread has changed..
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post #93 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 08:31 AM
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Fair enough....  Since I own a Trinnov pre/pro I can tell you that it provides RC throughout the entire frequency range with spectacular results.  Your friend, who "educated (you) about...equalization and its pitfalls" isn't as knowledgeable as you think he is.  Once again, I'd advise against making generalizations - "Audyssey and such" - about room correction technologies.  
 

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post #94 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 08:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Fair enough....  Since I own a Trinnov pre/pro I can tell you that it provides RC throughout the entire frequency range with spectacular results.  Your friend, who "educated (you) about...equalization and its pitfalls" isn't as knowledgeable as you think he is.  Once again, I'd advise against making generalizations - "Audyssey and such" - about room correction technologies.  

 
by the way, my friend who educated me.. i believe is very knowledgeable.. Years ago, he hired the THX people to do his audio.. Later on, as technology changed, he "upgraded".. to the JM Labs Grand utopias ($65,000/pair) - all five channels! Meridian processor (not sure which model now) into Mark levinson mono block amps ($10,000 to $20,000 range EACh - I forgot the model number.. its been a few years.. biggrin.gif).. Not all who spend big bucks know their audio/video.. but this person sure does! And yes, he is a member here and it is he who suggested I join this forum (in 1998 but i lost that username in 2001). BTW, his video is the $100,000 barco.. And yes, he is expert at video calibration too.. He is not one of those who "just hires" consultant.. totally, I respect his views.. and have done so, for 15 years. I realize its hard for you to accept, since you don't know him.. I doubt he is monitoring this thread. Some times, he is in the $20k+ forums..
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post #95 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 08:55 AM
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Fair enough....  Since I own a Trinnov pre/pro I can tell you that it provides RC throughout the entire frequency range with spectacular results.  Your friend, who "educated (you) about...equalization and its pitfalls" isn't as knowledgeable as you think he is.  Once again, I'd advise against making generalizations - "Audyssey and such" - about room correction technologies.  

 
by the way, my friend who educated me.. i believe is very knowledgeable.. Years ago, he hired the THX people to do his audio.. Later on, as technology changed, he "upgraded".. to the JM Labs Grand utopias ($65,000/pair) - all five channels! Meridian processor (not sure which model now) into Mark levinson mono block amps ($10,000 to $20,000 range EACh - I forgot the model number.. its been a few years.. biggrin.gif).. Not all who spend big bucks know their audio/video.. but this person sure does! And yes, he is a member here and it is he who suggested I join this forum (in 1998 but i lost that username in 2001). BTW, his video is the $100,000 barco.. And yes, he is expert at video calibration too.. He is not one of those who "just hires" consultant.. totally, I respect his views.. and have done so, for 15 years. I realize its hard for you to accept, since you don't know him.. I doubt he is monitoring this thread. Some times, he is in the $20k+ forums..

 

The fact he spent $10,000+ on amplifiers suggests he is far, far less knowledgeable than you have been led to believe!  Sorry. He seems to be of the school of audiofoolery which believes that $$$ = SQ.

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post #96 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 09:31 AM - Thread Starter
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The fact he spent $10,000+ on amplifiers suggests he is far, far less knowledgeable than you have been led to believe!  Sorry. He seems to be of the school of audiofoolery which believes that $$$ = SQ.
First.. please take the following as a joke.. Audiofoolery? Well it would be audiofoolery, if we were to hook up his Mark levinson with a low end speakers a low end system.. I don't know whether you have high end or low end system... but if one were to use it with a cheap audyssey processor and in expensive (Sub $20 k each ) speakers, it might possibly be audiofoolery of course.. biggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

Hey.. just teasing you.. Over the past 15 years, I have had many discussions with him, over audio and video. I bought equipment, most often based on his suggestions. I have total respect for the man - hence my attempt herewith to not allow him to be demeaned, albeit anonymously.. Some times, we have to stand up for those people, whom we respect and he is one of those.. With all his wealth, he is one of the most down to earth people and audio video discussions with him, are very informative and never authoritative.. He would never make a statement of "audiofoolery" about those people who own cheap receivers and speakers for example.. As much as people find value in low end items, you cannot assume that those with means are ALL not knowledgeable.. Many might well be.. and certainly, he is an exception and is truly knowledgeable - just my opinion of course.. Please keep in mind, that I make no such claim about my own prowess on audio/video.. I probably know 50% or less than him!
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post #97 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 09:38 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't quite follow you here - could you expand on this?  Do you perhaps have a really good room with extensive and properly utilised acoustic treatments?
Theaterroom With Qualia 004.jpeg

Btw, here is my theatre, with room treatment. Each of those red/green panels have 2" dense fiberglass board, backed with a loop carpet with foam backing. I have two such panels hung from the ceiling also. All the walls are covered with those panels. The entire wall, behind the screen is 10" deep fiberglass, covered with black fabric. This room was done, 19 years ago! Had I known then, what I know now, i would probably have done even more for acoustics and made the entire room turn black with automatic black drapes. I know I should do more acoustic treatment and change the entire carpet black etc.. but I dislike having to deal with contractors or having my life disturbed..... and hey.. I would rather spend time enjoying the content! Technology is getting better but some of us are turning older.. If you have not taken the mosquito noise test, I would encourage the 40+ crowd to try it.. You would be surprised biggrin.gif
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post #98 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 09:39 AM
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Do you not understand what they mean by: "while above 250Hz or so, attempts to modify the response can cause more problems than they solve."?
Do you not understand what they are doing below 250Hz? Equalization. The opposite of your claim that Meridian has an "aversion to equalization".
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Probably not a great idea to judge without knowing details.
But you're doing that throughout this thread: e.g., describing one of the companies that introduced equalization in surround processors as having an aversion to equalization.

By your own admission, you're "not up to date on latest Audyssey" but were willing to "judge without knowing details".

You're clinging to a 10-year-old approach to room equalization without understanding that the most current approaches and leading edge of those technologies (Trinnov, Dirac, ARCOS, Audyssey XT32, Lyngdorf) are ALL full range correction. Why would they ALL do full range correction if it was such a bad idea?
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post #99 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Do you not understand what they are doing below 250Hz? Equalization. The opposite of your claim that Meridian has an "aversion to equalization".
But you're doing that throughout this thread: e.g., describing one of the companies that introduced equalization in surround processors as having an aversion to equalization.

By your own admission, you're "not up to date on latest Audyssey" but were willing to "judge without knowing details".

You're clinging to a 10-year-old approach to room equalization without understanding that the most current approaches and leading edge of those technologies (Trinnov, Dirac, ARCOS, Audyssey XT32, Lyngdorf) are ALL full range correction. Why would they ALL do full range correction if it was such a bad idea?
Of course I understand that they are doing equalization below 250 Hz - In fact, I believe that I had asked that question earlier and someone said that they limit to 300 Hz and below.. in prior posts.. So.. this 250 Hz issue has been discussed.. and I was making my comments, with the assumption that meridian does equalize below 250 Hz. I just didn't happen to see that paper... which I liked reading.. I don't know that you read it before you posted it.. but thanks for posting it.. Technology has changed but equalization technology probably existed with them, at that time also.. Fundamentals of physics have not changed.. hence my comment about "meridian aversion"..... ""while above 250Hz or so, attempts to modify the response can cause more problems than they solve."

True, I do admit that I am not up to date on current Audyssey etc.. but I also noticed that someone posted that the latest generation audyssey has reduced (diminished?) high freq processing. He didn't mention the frequency range. I found his post to be interesting.. as opposed to a few others.

In case you didn't realize, I happen to start this thread. My intent is/was not to berate anyone's knowledge or belief. I have no problem with those of you who think audyssey is great. It might well be. I don't know.. yet.. I have also made the time frame of my experience (and limited knowledge) clear - I don't want to mislead anyone.. Absolutely, I am not an expert here.. I just post my beliefs and I enjoy learning - even if I am proven wrong.. I would rather learn than be right.

I had actually wanted to hear from those who own very high end processors - such as the Lexicon/Meridian/krell etc.. from those who have spent big $$$ and also have experienced the "low end" processors - to know their views.. Some liked going "down" to Okyo, others didnt. At this point, i find the results to be inconclusive, at best.

You do make a good point - why are so many companies doing full range correction, if it is such a bad idea. To this point, i would happily admit that they would certainly know a LOT more than me! biggrin.gif . some times, marketing could be driving it.. some times, actual quality..
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post #100 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:41 AM
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Of course I understand that they are doing equalization below 250 Hz - In fact, I believe that I had asked that question earlier and someone said that they limit to 300 Hz and below.. in prior posts.. So.. this 250 Hz issue has been discussed.. and I was making my comments, with the assumption that meridian does equalize below 250 Hz. I just didn't happen to see that paper... which I liked reading.. I don't know that you read it before you posted it.. but thanks for posting it.. Technology has changed but equalization technology probably existed with them, at that time also.. Fundamentals of physics have not changed.. hence my comment about "meridian aversion"..... ""while above 250Hz or so, attempts to modify the response can cause more problems than they solve."
If you understood that they were doing equalization, then you wouldn't have claimed they have an aversion to equalization. Can't be both simultaneously. You keep asking me whether I've read the paper, I keep wondering whether you understood the paper. Meridian has no aversion to equalization.

I also don't know why you can't understand that technology and methodology would progress (as is the natural course of those things) in the 10 years since that paper was published. The fact that ALL the latest room EQ technologies do full range correction, without violating the "fundamentals of physics", is a testament to that. It would have been abnormal if things hadn't changed in a decade.

But you keep clinging to 10-year-old approaches asthough research into room correction has been absolutely static over the last decade. What is it about this technology in particular that has you convinced that it cannot have changed/improved in 10 years?
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In case you didn't realize, I happen to start this thread.
In case you didn't realize, every single one of your posts happens to have the words "THREAD STARTER" on top. In all caps, no less. Kinda hard to miss.

For someone who claims they're open to discussing room correction technologies in pre-pros, you're acting completely closed to the idea that full range correction can be beneficial. Again, it can't be both simultaneously. You have to decide whether to shed those preconceived biases and actually have the discussion you claim to want.

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post #101 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:45 AM
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The fact he spent $10,000+ on amplifiers suggests he is far, far less knowledgeable than you have been led to believe!  Sorry. He seems to be of the school of audiofoolery which believes that $$$ = SQ.
First.. please take the following as a joke.. Audiofoolery? Well it would be audiofoolery, if we were to hook up his Mark levinson with a low end speakers a low end system.. I don't know whether you have high end or low end system... but if one were to use it with a cheap audyssey processor and in expensive (Sub $20 k each ) speakers, it might possibly be audiofoolery of course.. biggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

Hey.. just teasing you.. Over the past 15 years, I have had many discussions with him, over audio and video. I bought equipment, most often based on his suggestions. I have total respect for the man - hence my attempt herewith to not allow him to be demeaned, albeit anonymously.. Some times, we have to stand up for those people, whom we respect and he is one of those.. With all his wealth, he is one of the most down to earth people and audio video discussions with him, are very informative and never authoritative.. He would never make a statement of "audiofoolery" about those people who own cheap receivers and speakers for example.. As much as people find value in low end items, you cannot assume that those with means are ALL not knowledgeable.. Many might well be.. and certainly, he is an exception and is truly knowledgeable - just my opinion of course.. Please keep in mind, that I make no such claim about my own prowess on audio/video.. I probably know 50% or less than him!

 

I wasn't meaning to be disrespectful to anyone. Just pointing out that modern SS amps, operated within their design parameters and not driven into clipping, do not have a 'sound'. They all simply pass the input signal entirely unchanged (in any audible way) other than in amplitude. They have been doing this for a good many years now. So in a proper ABX blind test, your friend would not distinguish his $20,000 amp from a $1,000 amp - and there are literally thousands of blind tests which prove it.  My own system plays to about 105dB peaks (115dB bass peaks) with a flat (+/- about 3dB) frequency response 20Hz - 20Khz, clean, no clipping. My amps cost less than $2,000 for all three. Actually, it isn't entirely flat because I prefer a house curve that tilts up somewhat at the bass end and down somewhat at the top end - but in reality this gives a perceived flat.  Here's the FR graph:

 

The uptick in bass is deliberate and is mainly caused by applying Audyssey Dynamic EQ.

 

Here is the bass response with no smoothing applied. 7Hz - 100Hz (the XO region):

 

 

BTW, I sold my Mark Levinson amp ages ago. It gave me no better than I get today from amps that cost a fraction of the price, which is to be expected if one understands anything about the science behind amplifier design. It was a huge thing, very well built, but this was over 20 years ago. Maybe some amps did have a 'sound' of their own back then, but they don't these days, fortunately.

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post #102 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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sdurani, continuing on it with you, serves no purpose, other than stroke someone's ego.. which doesn't interest me..
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post #103 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:51 AM
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True, I do admit that I am not up to date on current Audyssey etc.. but I also noticed that someone posted that the latest generation audyssey has reduced (diminished?) high freq processing. He didn't mention the frequency range. I found his post to be interesting.. as opposed to a few others.
 

 

Audyssey XT32 corrects for the full frequency range, 20Hz-20KHz - what I was alluding to was the nature of the filtering for the higher frequencies. Sorry if I misled you there.

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post #104 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:52 AM
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sdurani, continuing on it with you, serves no purpose, other than stroke someone's ego.. which doesn't interest me..
Has nothing to do with ego but correcting factually incorrect information you posted.

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post #105 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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kbarnes701,
Thanks for taking the time to post in such details.
Glad you didn't mean disrespect but the word "audiofoolery" about him, bothered me - because I consider him a good friend.
No offense taken Kbarnes701.. Please don't worry about it.
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Clearly, you know a lot more than I do and I have no way of agreeing or disagreeing with you on the subject of amplifiers.. except with the following:

Originally, when I bought the Bryston 7bst amps, another friend - who is a professional audio installer, challenged me that the $400 crown amp is as good as my Bryston..

So, he set up a blind test, with a switch in my hand - using high current relays - same everything except switching between the amps.

Very easily, I could identify the Brystons.

BTW, on a side note.. I participated in another blind test.. at a local audio store..
He didn't give me the switch.. He kept the remote.
He switched electronically - between left and right, to blind test cables.
Wow.. the expensive cable sounded far superior..
I almost bought them.. but typically, I am not fooled easily. The difference was too much for me to believe it.
I thought about it.. realized he was changing the volume UP, just a little for the expensive cable biggrin.gif
Not all blind tests are equal.. biggrin.gif
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post #106 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Has nothing to do with ego but correcting factually incorrect information you posted.
I quoted your own link.. and factuality is self evident
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post #107 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 11:02 AM
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I quoted your own link.. and factuality is self evident
The paper demonstrated that Meridian was advocating the use of equalization, to the contrary of your claim.

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post #108 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
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300 Hz not 800Hz? You are correct. I simply forgot the number he told me.. but I do recall him saying that Room Eq by meridian is only for lower frequencies. I simply forgot the number he mentioned.. Anyway, my curiosity is, how come an obviously high end processor company like Meridian restricts its EQ to 300 Hz max, but others like Audessy are performing equalization over the entire spectrum. I am no expert but I am more supportive of the Meridian decision than the Audessy one..

Kal Rubinson's answer in page 1 of this thread..

You should read their AES paper on the topic. Basically, they state that the EQ is intended to correct for room modes/reflections in the sub-Schroeder frequencies because, above that point, one can deal easily with room effects with proper arrangements and treatments and not change the character of the system.

We had already discussed the meridian processing on page one of this thread.. Kal was the one who told me it was 300 Hz.. 25o or 300... same thing.. I have respect for some people here on avs ad kal rubinson is one of them
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post #109 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 11:33 AM
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....above that point, one can deal easily with room effects with proper arrangements and treatments
I wish that were true, but it ain't. It's an important first step, not IMO a comprehensive solution.

Ever measure frequency response at the listening position(s) for your room?

Quote:
...and not change the character of the system.
What's the technical definition of "character of the system"?
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post #110 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 11:52 AM
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...Anyway, my curiosity is, how come an obviously high end processor company like Meridian restricts its EQ to 300 Hz max, but others like Audessy are performing equalization over the entire spectrum. I am no expert but I am more supportive of the Meridian decision than the Audessy one..
Here's something else for you to ponder: Back in 2009 Harman published the results of blind tests of several RC products vs. no correction. All of the products evaluated utilized full-frequency correction. What they found is that, provided the RC met certain criteria - smooth response, downward slope - listeners preferred them to no correction.

And RC technology has continued to improve since that test.
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post #111 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 12:35 PM
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kbarnes701,
Thanks for taking the time to post in such details.
Glad you didn't mean disrespect but the word "audiofoolery" about him, bothered me - because I consider him a good friend.
No offense taken Kbarnes701.. Please don't worry about it.
Friends? smile.gif
Clearly, you know a lot more than I do and I have no way of agreeing or disagreeing with you on the subject of amplifiers.. except with the following:

Originally, when I bought the Bryston 7bst amps, another friend - who is a professional audio installer, challenged me that the $400 crown amp is as good as my Bryston..

So, he set up a blind test, with a switch in my hand - using high current relays - same everything except switching between the amps.

Very easily, I could identify the Brystons.

BTW, on a side note.. I participated in another blind test.. at a local audio store..
He didn't give me the switch.. He kept the remote.
He switched electronically - between left and right, to blind test cables.
Wow.. the expensive cable sounded far superior..
I almost bought them.. but typically, I am not fooled easily. The difference was too much for me to believe it.
I thought about it.. realized he was changing the volume UP, just a little for the expensive cable biggrin.gif
Not all blind tests are equal.. biggrin.gif

 

Sorry if the word 'audiofoolery' threw you for a minute there. It's a fairly common term in the circles I move in to mean, not really someone who is a fool but rather someone who has been fooled - there's a difference as I am sure you will agree.

 

Again, I can't really comment on the Bryston vs Crown amps as I don't have enough information. If this was some years ago, I can believe that there were significant differences between amps. This was certainly true around the era when SS amps were becoming commonplace. Many of them at that time were atrocious. But more recently, as knowledge and components have evolved, the differences between SS amps have melted away (assuming the amps are not broken and are working within their design parameters, eg not being driven into clipping).  it is also possible that your Bryston amp was significantly more powerful than the Crown amp, and therefore that the latter was being driven to clipping, which would certainly enable you to tell it from the amp that was not clipping - but this would constitute an improper test. When people compare modern amps (in a non ABX blind situation) they hear differences between amps every time - but the difference are caused by poor test conditions, or by improper level matching, or non-instantaneous switching and so on. The test conditions all but guarantee differences will be heard - but they are not differences in the amps, but caused by the way they are being compared. As you know, if one amp is, for example, even a minuscule bit louder than another, this will show up not as 'being louder' but as 'being superior'.

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post #112 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by audvid View Post

We had already discussed the meridian processing..
Meridian equalization. Calling it "processing" won't change what it actually is. IF you are open to discussing room correction, then at least dispense with the wordplay.

When it comes to equalization, you can either believe a 10-year-old Meridian paper that correcting above Schroeder is bad OR you can believe Trinnov, Dirac, Lyngdorf, Audyssey, Anthem, Harman, and even a DTS room correction proposal, that ALL correct full range. This isn't the Meridian vs Audyssey choice that you're describing.

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post #113 of 124 Old 09-29-2013, 12:41 PM
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Has anyone asked, 'Does Meridian even matter any more'?

I say not.

Dated principles and electronics. Almost like Lexicon, they're essentially out of the game. Use the George (from Seinfeld) method at looking at their papers of old: read them, understand their conclusions and act by doing the opposite.

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #114 of 124 Old 09-30-2013, 11:24 AM
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sdurani, continuing on it with you, serves no purpose, other than stroke someone's ego.. which doesn't interest me..

 

audvid, I don't think you are helping yourself with this denial of what you actually said, and Sanjay's correction of it. You said that you were not very fond of electronic EQ and to support that position, you cited Meridian which you said was 'averse to equalisation'. You took comfort from this as it supported your own view. But then Sanjay pointed out that, far from being 'averse' to electronic equalisation, Meridian were also one its early pioneers. That is really game, set and match and it is pointless to continue obfuscating and denying: what you said is what you said. Would it not be easier just to say you made a mistake, as we all do often enough, and move on? The blunt truth is that Meridian are clearly NOT averse to electronic equalisation. You may well be, of course, and nobody would deny that is your right, even while trying to persuade you that you might do better by exploring modern electronic EQ systems such as those mentioned in the recent posts. But Meridian clearly does not lend support to your view.

 

I hope you don't mind my saying this. I am not trying to be argumentative, but too many posts seem to have been expended on your denial of what you said. TBH, you have answered your own question, as posed in the thread title, and come to the conclusion that electronic EQ is not for you.

 

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The intent of my starting this thread was to see if I should buy one of the new Onkyo units, which is well within my price range (it was tempting) and I now am of the opinion that I should not do so.. 

 

Fair enough, so the thread seems to have run its course: you have asked and been answered and drawn your conclusion.

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post #115 of 124 Old 10-06-2013, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Meridian equalization. Calling it "processing" won't change what it actually is. IF you are open to discussing room correction, then at least dispense with the wordplay.

When it comes to equalization, you can either believe a 10-year-old Meridian paper that correcting above Schroeder is bad OR you can believe Trinnov, Dirac, Lyngdorf, Audyssey, Anthem, Harman, and even a DTS room correction proposal, that ALL correct full range. This isn't the Meridian vs Audyssey choice that you're describing.
The great thing about the new methods is that you can correct only Schroeder if you like or do full range correction. You are not limited. Meridian makes great stuff but they are going to have to advance their room correction.

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post #116 of 124 Old 10-06-2013, 08:36 AM
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You should read their AES paper on the topic. Basically, they state that the EQ is intended to correct for room modes/reflections in the sub-Schroeder frequencies because, above that point, one can deal easily with room effects with proper arrangements and treatments and not change the character of the system.

We had already discussed the meridian processing on page one of this thread.. Kal was the one who told me it was 300 Hz.. 25o or 300... same thing.. I have respect for some people here on avs ad kal rubinson is one of them
Dirac advises to use room treatments first.

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post #117 of 124 Old 10-06-2013, 01:38 PM
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The great thing about the new methods is that you can correct only Schroeder if you like or do full range correction. You are not limited. Meridian makes great stuff but they are going to have to advance their room correction.
Yup, that's the problem with the two companies (Meridian, Lexicon) that first released room correction in their products: it's almost a decade later and they haven't updated their room correction technology. Gentle tone adjustments above Schroeder will allow for timbre matching speakers so that sounds remain consistent as they move around the room. Like you said, if someone doesn't like it, it is useful to have the option to turn off correction above Schroeder without having to sacrifice bass and mid-bass correction below Schroeder.

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post #118 of 124 Old 10-07-2013, 06:51 AM
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Dirac advises to use room treatments first.

Doesn't everyone?  Using REQ without any prior attention to room acoustics will help but will give far from optimal sound.  I cannot recall any REQ manufacturer who does not support this.  

 

[Anecdote:  Peter Lyngdorf recommended that I push my main speakers into the room corners so that the improvement wrought by the original TacT 2.0 would be magnified.]

 

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Yup, that's the problem with the two companies (Meridian, Lexicon) that first released room correction in their products: it's almost a decade later and they haven't updated their room correction technology. Gentle tone adjustments above Schroeder will allow for timbre matching speakers so that sounds remain consistent as they move around the room. Like you said, if someone doesn't like it, it is useful to have the option to turn off correction above Schroeder without having to sacrifice bass and mid-bass correction below Schroeder.

Tone adjustment above the critical frequency is not quite the same as creating correction filters in that range.  FWIW, Meridian does offer tone controls in addition to, and independent of, MRC. 


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post #119 of 124 Old 10-07-2013, 11:03 AM
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Tone adjustment above the critical frequency is not quite the same as creating correction filters in that range.
I was referring to it as adjusting the tone to separate the concept from correcting each peak and dip in the high frequencies. "Creating correction filters" didn't describe that distinction.
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FWIW, Meridian does offer tone controls in addition to, and independent of, MRC.
So does my Lex and most every pre-pro with automated room correction. Which is why I deliberately avoided using the term "tone control", because those are separate features.

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post #120 of 124 Old 10-07-2013, 07:18 PM
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I was referring to it as adjusting the tone to separate the concept from correcting each peak and dip in the high frequencies. "Creating correction filters" didn't describe that distinction.
So does my Lex and most every pre-pro with automated room correction. Which is why I deliberately avoided using the term "tone control", because those are separate features.

 

Hmmm.  OK.  I was not referring to traditional bass/treble controls alone but tilt/rolloff, etc.  However, correction filters for the sub-critical range and more broad-band tonal adjustments above that is a useful functional arrangement.


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