Originally Posted by cannga
But the Blu-ray down-mixers have distinct knowledge of who they are mixing for: home use where undoubtedly 99.99% is 7.1.4.
What do you mean by "Blu-ray down-mixers"? Are you talking about someone at the studio or an algorithm in a receiver?
How was this tested (how do you know it's exact wide and then ALL snapped to front), and more important is this algorithm confirmed by Dolby engineers?
Tested with Atmos soundtracks and test tones. Anyone is free to try it themselves. If you need confirmation from Dolby, you can write to them.
Why would a renderer not use side and front to render an object in between?
In theatrical Atmos, the speakers just outside the screen are analogous to wides at home. In home Atmos, wides are adjacent to the L/R speakers. In both cases, they're an extension to the front soundstage and used (mixed) with that in mind.
If a character in a movie walks off-screen, the mixer can pan his dialogue off screen to the wides. At home, if no wides are configured, it would be problematic if these sounds were split between the fronts and the surrounds. Home set-ups often have the surrounds rearward of the listening area, so dialogue intended to be just outside the screen would end up being heard from behind the listeners by anyone sitting outside the sweet spot. Not acceptable. Better to keep that sound in the front soundstage by dropping it into the L/R speakers.
Who documents that accurately this "increasing use" - article in industry mag, etc.? ... Who documents this "trend"?
Couple of examples:
1:55 mark: https://vimeo.com/115088528#t=115s
25 second mark: https://vimeo.com/156994297#t=25s
Outside edges? Aren't Dolby Wides actually in FRONT of L&R and have little, or nothing, to do with outside edge of screen?
In the Atmos renderer (theatrical & home), the front L/R speakers are the front corners of the base layer. In a movie theatre, those speakers are just inside the screen and the front surrounds (wides) are just outside the screen. In home Atmos, the wides are the next speakers over from the L/R (i.e., there are no speaker locations between them).
IIRC Grimani actually mentioned the goal for Wide is not for outside edge, but to fill in longitudinal space between front and side.
Grimani can use wides however he wants to, but it doesn't change the way Atmos rendering works nor the way it downmixes.