Official DataSat RS20i thread. (Setup Tips, Questions,General Info, etc) - Page 157 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4681 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
And THAT is the crux of the matter. Is "when" in 60 days? 9 months? 5 years?
Very soon...

I know it sounds great and looks great.....but can we communicate with it? If not it is useless:)
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post #4682 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 08:55 AM
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post #4683 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 08:57 AM
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Very soon...
If I might paraphrase Bill Clinton: "It all depends on what 'very soon' means !!
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post #4684 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Wookii View Post
What processor are you running now Asif?
I'm just in the process of house hunting Gareth so everything is being packed away into storeage - new room will be taken care of by the Trinnov Altitude.

The Rs20i is an awesome sounding machine..just some aspects i wasn't happy with, with regards to channel count and new features.
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post #4685 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 09:36 AM
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I do understand some reluctance to "pre-announce" with specific dates. They would then become the next Emotiva - well known for missing announced dates by more than 2 years.

But they don't need to give specific near-term dates. Something like: "we are working on X,Y, and Z and these should be available to the market sometime in the next 18 to 36 months". Or whatever.

DTS:X was demoed in October by Datasat at CEDIA. It is now almost June -- 7 months later and STILL no update.

As noted, I still love what the RS20i does and certainly have no interest in getting rid of it - but ..............
Don't get me wrong, I still rate the sonic quality highly..it's just the support aspect - I'd like to know what datasat have in store for the owners of the reference unit. Dirac dimensions/unison, I can't remember which, was rumoured.

It's obviously not to the same level, but Dirac features in so many processors and pre amplifiers now..I'd again want to know what makes the Rs20i the reference standard. I'm pretty sure it was suggested the Ls10 audio quality is virtually the same as the Rs20i, so other than the more commercial orientated features carried over from the Ap20, I wish Datasat would give Rs20i owners something to look forward to.

The like of accurus and storm are already nudging the channel count for dsp based units. What's Datasat doing?

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post #4686 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 09:52 AM
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Don't get me wrong, I still rate the sonic quality highly..it's just the support aspect - I'd like to know what datasat have in store for the owners of the reference unit. Dirac dimensions/unison, I can't remember which, was rumoured.

It's obviously not to the same level, but Dirac features in so many processors and pre amplifiers now..I'd again want to know what makes the Rs20i the reference standard. I'm pretty sure it was suggested the Ls10 audio quality is virtually the same as the Rs20i, so other than the more commercial orientated features carried over from the Ap20, I wish Datasat would give Rs20i owners something to look forward to.

The like of accurus and storm are already nudging the channel count for dsp based units. What's Datasat doing?
FYI 9 processors are kind of a big deal

I know it sounds great and looks great.....but can we communicate with it? If not it is useless:)
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post #4687 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 09:59 AM
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FYI 9 processors are kind of a big deal
I have a truly superb and top notch response to that. It's very exciting and one which will please many owners of this thread..unfortunately I can't reveal it just now..but it'll be typed out soon in all its glory- just keep an eye on the thread
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post #4688 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 10:11 AM
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FYI 9 processors are kind of a big deal
Nine processors is impressive (in comparison: StormAudio seemingly has 'only' six). Time to get that power into action!
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post #4689 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 10:23 AM
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Imo... datasat biggest and most costly mistake was to get rid of genesis tech as uk disti. Neil was a real driving force behind it.
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post #4690 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 10:23 AM
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Nine processors is impressive (in comparison: StormAudio seemingly has 'only' six). Time to get that power into action!
Agreed. Storm has come close but a few years later. If you think Datasat is sitting around letting other manufactures "lap them" that would be a mistake. Being the first to do something is always harder. Many companies have taken what Datasat did and attempted to improve it. Yes if channel counts are all that matters there are better choices. If sound quality and reliability matter, Datasat is still the one to beat.

I agree that DTSx has been slow in delivery, but there are really good reasons for that to be the case. I guess lack of software may be a driving factor.
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My room is a transformer...

It gets wider at the front.

I currently have speakers for 9.2.4

JTR 212HTR for L/C/R
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Looking good. I'm assuming those are beer bunkers in the front on the floor. Very sensible, you don't have to go far to get a drink - just step forward, lift the door and fetch a cold one. Good thinking, SOWK!
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post #4692 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 12:28 PM
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I haven't spent a lot of time with my RS20 (hopefully that is going to change this month) as I'm still recovering from the whole house reno, lol. I had the opportunity of buying either the LS10 or the RS20, and decided the added flexibility and configurability of the RS20 was worth the money even if the 2 units sound the same. The LS10 cannot do with multiple subs what the Rs20 can do and that makes it worthwhile on its own, imho.

I'm not too upset about how long DTS-x is taking because I haven't even mounted my ceiling speakers yet. I had to chuckle about the Emotiva comment about announcing something waaaay in advance of it becoming available. I still have my Emotiva and it was a great sounding unit that hit way above it's price point in terms of sound quality and flexibility. I think it is a valid competitor to the LS10. But the added flexibility of the RS20 is what sets it apart from the crowd. The Trinnov is the only other unit that has similar functionality. I didn't need the additional channel count so was satisfied to get the RS20 and so far so good.
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post #4693 of 4756 Old 05-31-2017, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bogg View Post
I haven't spent a lot of time with my RS20 (hopefully that is going to change this month) as I'm still recovering from the whole house reno, lol. I had the opportunity of buying either the LS10 or the RS20, and decided the added flexibility and configurability of the RS20 was worth the money even if the 2 units sound the same. The LS10 cannot do with multiple subs what the Rs20 can do and that makes it worthwhile on its own, imho.

I'm not too upset about how long DTS-x is taking because I haven't even mounted my ceiling speakers yet. I had to chuckle about the Emotiva comment about announcing something waaaay in advance of it becoming available. I still have my Emotiva and it was a great sounding unit that hit way above it's price point in terms of sound quality and flexibility. I think it is a valid competitor to the LS10. But the added flexibility of the RS20 is what sets it apart from the crowd. The Trinnov is the only other unit that has similar functionality. I didn't need the additional channel count so was satisfied to get the RS20 and so far so good.
I can agree on that and I asked my distributor, who also has Trinnov, to have an exchange of my RS20i into a Trinnov and he said that I should stick with the Datasat because it is sounding better. I fully believe this, because I listened today to a DTS HD-MA 5.1 track - Flying daggers - and was amazed what Neural:X does with standard DTS tracks. Guys, my wish is, that you will have the new firmware soon and that you can experience Neural:X. It will be just amazing. No, my first name is not Donald here and I have the beta running on my RS20i and it is just amazing. I am looking forward to the final but 'The Great wall' was also amazing with Atmos. I have a 7.2.4 system and it is really amazing what Datasat and Dirac does with this set-up.
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post #4694 of 4756 Old 06-02-2017, 01:13 PM
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Cool

Okay i did not sign no stinkin nda, new platform modular..Tada! I hear that they flew in 12-20 dealers for a pow wow. And they signed NDA's I guess. But gossip in the immersive audio arena travels fast.

Good work datasat perhaps there is hope after all for best quality channel sufficiency and more than 16 digital outs at a time, and every channel with dirac. But be more focused on delivering timely.Do it right or don't do it at all is my motto.

But you need to make these things have some of the marantz functionality, ill chime in at a future time.
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post #4695 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 06:02 AM
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new platform modular..Tada!
New platform as in not building on RS20i?
Or modular additions to the RS20i?

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post #4696 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 06:42 AM
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New platform as in not building on RS20i?
Or modular additions to the RS20i?
My guess: It is a new platform/product (NOT an RS20i) and has more modular upgrade-ability than the RS20i. I would like to be wrong.

While I would be most disappointed (given the cost of the RS20i) in not having those new capabilities on my RS20i, that is the reality of technologies products. It is one thing to have the flexibility to, for example, add more inputs or physical outputs but quite different to, for example, be able to bypass the restrictions of whatever "chip" is creating limitations in addressable speaker count.

Whichever direction they move, at least it is doing something to stay active and alive in this market segment.

The only upgrade I personally have interest in is to get the HDMI inputs to ALL support 4K so I don't have to use an external 4K/HDR HDMI switch product. An extra HDMI would also be nice since I have a monitor in my equipment room. For those interested, I am now using this. My dealer has written a Control4 IR interface for it as well.

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post #4697 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 08:16 AM
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Like Chuck surmises I think new architecture....how i understood it.

PRETERNATURAL IMMERSOPHILE rAVe Best ATMOS DEMO CEDIA 2016. Most Envied Installation In Europe ( Until July). PREPARING SPECIAL CEDIA EXPO 2017 DEMO WITH ULTIMATE HDR PROJECTION AND HI-POTENCY ATMOS REFRENCE POST-DUB STAGE DCI KIT: IMMERSIONLAND. WHEN THE LIVING ROOM WALL RIVALS YOUR 100 MILLION DOLLAR VIEW... The path to meaningful change is often walked alone.
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Like Chuck surmises I think new architecture....how i understood it.
It is the only way...

Goodbye to a great audio and video genius and writer... JOHN GANNON. I enjoyed your friendship, wit and a nice long run we took around Indianapolis at CEDIA years back... and for buying my Runco 980 Ultra years back... you saved my ass! Rest in peace.
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post #4699 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 10:16 AM
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As superb sounding as it is, you couldn't help but feel the Rs20i was somewhat hindered by its Ap20 ancestry. A new machine from the ground up is good news and has plenty of potential. The balls in Datasats court...
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post #4700 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 10:25 AM
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The question is to what a degree a RS20i successor matters. Considering the competition from Acurus, Storm Audio, Lyngdorf and possibly even Emotiva for the 16 channel market between the Denon/Marantz level and Trinnov (most have Room EQ that a user can calibrate without a CI). And wasn't at least Storm Audio looking to support 32 channels for active crossovers and multiple speaker array setups?

In my (admittedly biased) opinion, unless this hypothetical successor has Dirac Unison and a multi-sub optimization algorithm, I'm not sure what the point would be.

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post #4701 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 10:37 AM
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Yes long gone are the days of sitting around with Phil at datasat HQ being told how the RS20i would serve us for the next decade or above with it's fully upgradable architechture. Then a few years later it's released that the unit can not ever go above 16 discrete channels due to its internal architecture.

I'm not interested in 16 + channels, if I was I'd have an altitude and make do with the sonic trade off between the two, I do prefer the sound of the RS20i.. it sounds warmer and more analogue.

But I would like the updated Dirac to be put on to the rs20i. To help step it apart from the LS10.
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post #4702 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 12:52 PM
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I had a chance today to watch/listen to a system using an RS20i with the DTS:X beta on it. All I can say is WOW. I mean simply, WOW!!!! Just like DTS was late to the party in the early days of Dolby, but eventually came out ahead, I have a feeling the same might happen with DTS:X.

I watched short pieces of two different movies: London Has Fallen recorded in DTS:X and the first few minutes of Bolt, recorded in regular DTS:HD. We started with Bolt and I was able to compare the DTS:X up-sampling against DSU. It was not even close. Everything about the DTS up-sampling was superior. Most surprising was the increased level of dynamics. That was not expected. We could play it one way then the other. And each time the differences were so very obvious. I really had very low expectations about the up-sampling approach but DTS is clearly doing something right.

I have watched London Has Fallen more than once, but again, listening to it with DTS:X was a whole new experience and again, the dynamics are superior. Easy to hear it with gun shots and explosions or big crashes. Really does increase the envelopment in the film.

As annoyed as I have been with the delay in getting this product to market, I will be most excited to be able finally get my system updated. Having now heard it, I want it sooner rather than later.

You are all in for a very huge increase in sound quality in your theaters. Or as our President would say ---- uuuuuuuge!!

I am pumped !!!!!!!!

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post #4703 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 02:06 PM
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I had a chance today to watch/listen to a system using an RS20i with the DTS:X beta on it. All I can say is WOW. I mean simply, WOW!!!! Just like DTS was late to the party in the early days of Dolby, but eventually came out ahead, I have a feeling the same might happen with DTS:X.

I watched short pieces of two different movies: London Has Fallen recorded in DTS:X and the first few minutes of Bolt, recorded in regular DTS:HD. We started with Bolt and I was able to compare the DTS:X up-sampling against DSU. It was not even close. Everything about the DTS up-sampling was superior. Most surprising was the increased level of dynamics. That was not expected. We could play it one way then the other. And each time the differences were so very obvious. I really had very low expectations about the up-sampling approach but DTS is clearly doing something right.

I have watched London Has Fallen more than once, but again, listening to it with DTS:X was a whole new experience and again, the dynamics are superior. Easy to hear it with gun shots and explosions or big crashes. Really does increase the envelopment in the film.

As annoyed as I have been with the delay in getting this product to market, I will be most excited to be able finally get my system updated. Having now heard it, I want it sooner rather than later.

You are all in for a very huge increase in sound quality in your theaters. Or as our President would say ---- uuuuuuuge!!

I am pumped !!!!!!!!
Expect that to happen very soon
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post #4704 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 02:30 PM
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Nowadays i design for these three priority levels , despite being an atmos superfreak:

Neural-X for Legacy codecs and modern music 45% importance
atmos native content 40%
the rest including the holding your head on a vice feeling sts-x and auro, with automatic being the great redemptor of the group 15%


I am very displeased with the dts-x holding your head in a vice grip effect, completely inorganic, atmos just flows freely.

As channel sufficiency becomes a general mantra i hope all new processors are not locked into the dts-x hardcoded holding your head in a vice stupidity. I hope it has room to deliver what it promised.
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post #4705 of 4756 Old 06-03-2017, 07:28 PM
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I am very displeased with the dts-x holding your head in a vice grip effect, completely inorganic, atmos just flows freely.
With my very limited exposure to DTS:X, I did not find that to be the case -- at all

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post #4706 of 4756 Old 06-04-2017, 12:53 AM
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Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy;53413[B
002]With my very limited exposure to DTS:X, I did not find that to be the case -- at all
Hi Chuck,

That is because you have heard systems following the latest best practices, probably, In my opinion these systems create the best experience for rows of 5 seats on average. That is not what I jumped head first into ATMOS during the gravity premiere at Dolby in October 2013. To recreate a dynamic multi object resolute superfluid holosonic scale accurate bubble around your head, put in simple terms. For my moon projects I aim to create a sweet spot such as we found at the cedia Alcons booth last year, there were maybe 20 seats, but on 3 seats alone, towards the back where the canopy of sound accidentally recreated what for 3 years i heard something i had given up as being too good to be achieved with a home atmos system, that experience reinforced the fact, just in those three seats that several here sat in and agree. Jeff, Mike Miles, Taker, Brad who redesigned his theater for just 2 rows of 3 after hearing that, well I guess we've broken away a shootoff of the immersive audio school of design, The Selfish Basterd's Club you can call us (and we will proudly wear the badge).

Basically when we create THE Listeners Exclusion Box, we weed out the leechers and by being more selective with more intimate focus, we aim to elevate the experience to it's most intensive manifestation possible psychoacoustically speaking, the same goes for the uwcg hdr. Like the creator in Blade Runner more real than real is our motto..

LEB this is a term defined i think from Arnaud. Typically the listeners exclusion box is defined by the tops in front of the furthest front row all the way to the back of the last row, then the right tops are aligned with the right arm of the rightmost seat and the left arm of the outermost left seat. That is what an exclusion box should be according to the rules.

But i rather be a selfish basterd any day over being a stupid basterd. A personal choice i'll admit.

FOREWARNING On the second next video (at restaurant) I was trying to translate in my head and forming a sentence of the fly, I was not criticizing Adam who has had 32 speakers at home (albeit horns so My nose remains pointing up at that clarification- horns do suckk so bad...), it's just that he said in the past that you cannot create a better-than-subwoofer experience by placing full Range Surrounds around a one time aligned seat. Bob Stuart said that in 1995 and it proved right for my lab the same year (since then subwoofers to me are a bit overrated) so he said something to that effect whatever, the point I was slowly trying articulate is that No subs can yield a better more natural bass. But hear it from the SUBBASS superfreak Himself Taker, that after him hounding me for 2 days with repeated "where is the bass?"took Mark Seaton 45 minutes of tweaking for him to be satisfied with a bunch of 18" drivers last cedia. After thanks to reconnecting source from kaleidescape to oppo last CEDIA to play Gary Rebers awesonme 13.1 auro (although really screw Auro sorry Barco - AUROMAX for orchestral music and old films yes! Auro NO) the surround processors memories for bass management that took 2 hours had vanished, ruining the sound for the first part of the all night birthday extravaganza, that Mark was able to save at 2 am. For which I am forever indebted.

There are six more channels added as we speak In The HIE mini-lab that when he was here. Also NO CENTER. When the speakers phantom well ....But if Dynaudio can sell me the unnessesarily bauhaus ornate new contour 25 center in a Focus classic line (the greatest aesthetical achievement in the history of dynaudio (which the esotar line is my reference since 1996 for not needing calibration except time alignment and volume matching- which blowing up woofers took me to Quested and Later Alcons but in my universe everything else sits in a pile on the bottom of a near bottomless pit). Succinctly stated, if you don't own any these three brands and Ill admit Dynaudio has the best potential for all passive 36 speaker setups, since the more speakers you add the less easy is to overload them, except the LCR and wides (we need focus 380 enclosure for the LEFT LEFT WIDTH and the mirror and centers for their exquisite 40 anniversary gloss birch speakers, which have 100,000,000 channel sufficient Penthouse with Wall to wall CLEDIS written ALL OVER IT (Think Miami 2020 where 500 32 channel systems can be sold, and powered by ATI digital amps, ill show everyone next year what is possible there). Of course there will be the typical AVARICE PARASTES copying my concepts in this next Miami immersive systems boom, but they will all get slapped with malpractice suits when they come up to the ankles of what my planned designs will be.*****





So in mydevelopmentlab, i ripped out all seats but one. And I have surrounded that seat with some classic dynaudio monolith floorstander discontinued focus 380's for lr and widths, focus 340 for surrounds, focus 260 for sides surround+ width fills using a pair of meridian 561 to extract via trifield, and four pole mounted excite 180 all cosmetically matched in walnut. This in a room reminiscent of a large suite in a Holiday in Express, the big prize in sight are those 2,000 multimillion dollar PH's going up in Miami for 2018-20. So you want to create incredible immersive audio without annoying neighbors too much, that is my suggestion that any company about to deliver a next gen platform copy some of these capabilities from Marantz, that and the remote. What an incredible remote that little marantz remote is. If I was Datasat I would buy it and slap the label on it. Touchscreens and High Spl High Adrenaline High Serotonin systems simply don't work together as the body reacts to the amazing immersion in many ways but starting by (you guessed it) sweat in the hands (see takers dead mouse video case in point) truly impossible controlling quickly on the fly. This is such a brilliant ergonomic design that works every time and the lit rubberised buttons and control logic is just a joy to use., I love John my programmer and best friend and soon to be partner with Brian on the Ultimate Screen masking rigs, but nothing in my 40 years doing immersive audio and video comes close to the marantz remote. not perfect just the closest to it. That remote and using fir filtering and other dsp to attenuate sound that travels through walls into a flat next to you. As unselfish as that sounds it is a great feature, that impacts minimally on the soundfield immersive wise.

In The Holiday Inn Express Lab Everything is time aligned to one seat. The exclusion box is created using the cinema formula. about 2 seats wide, but the angles are constant to the one seat so opens up a bit. The 4 misely tops (you need 10 to 14 (rerendered from the 10 a la cp-850/ims-3000)- 8 minimum)are within the separation guidelines identified by me based on latest iterations of the Damaske And Wagener seminal work.




This is the first Tops separation maximised layout as going in in NAIAD. It also will be the exact setup at CEDIA 2017 IMMERSIONLAND's red velvet seats to try prove concept. Am I a sucker for stress self flagellation or what?

In that selfish basterd of a reference setup, the fluidity of atmos vs. dts-x is extremely clear your head is virtually held by the fixed channels overhead, as you turn your head something is not fluid. In fact i despise DTS-X for whoring out their initial 32 channel concept with 3 speakers underneath the mains left center right. I do love Neural -X literally ranting for 2 minutes to the former Atmos director (What the hell were you thinking LEAVING OUT THE WIDTH CHANNELS! -he is now the ww head of cinema atmos Bryan Garcia and Adam witnessed that moment WHICH Had been preceded by 10 minutes flowing river of accolades Andrew Poulain is someone that is very intrigued by the selfish bastard school of channel sufficient design and is coming to listen to Naiad and Loge and maybe the next holiday inn express rig).

So for CEDIA we will cover the selfish basterd's seats in red velvet coverings, the rest are regular ballroom rental seats. I only wish there would be a processor that would give a clean digital signal to more than 16 channels because you can pick them apart a mile away which sound great and which border on crappiness. I know my standards are very cruel, but I believe we are getting closer than ever in our objective of clean, fatigue free, transparent sound with speakers every 15 degrees on the ATMOS 24 bed layer and 10 to 14 on the tops. In a small room, and don't say it can't happen because it does 24/7/365 in a Holiday Inn Express suite.

If at cedia again this year, do ask to be seated in the red velvet selfish basterd's seats. The only way people can without uncertainty write off the notion that I am a total lunatic on a disruptive immersive winding. At least I give some people the chance to listen to my madness and make up their own mind. Winner take all or .... crash and burn, such is the life on the edge of IMMERSIONLAND dot COM


****** A heartfelt personal thought:

OFF TOPIC BUT CRUCIAL TO OUR COMMON WELL BEING, and our children's and our...

I ONLY feel hate towards two kinds of people and if my skull could crack open and a beam could bounce off satellites and target every AVARICE PARASITE that has done harm to our noble cause, to vaporize that group of individuals along with the much worser personally detestable of all, those that have burned my mother's effigy in kind. She was the greatest human to ever walk this earth and IMMERSIONLAND would not exist without her, beautiful, self deprecating, a wonderful musician, a Yad Vashem Heroine seeking no recognition for herself but for her Friends that later reciprocated the favor to help escape from Fidel's firing squad. You name it she was all that.And she never ever lied. So effigy burning of my Mom is not acceptable, which has now happened 4 times directly connected to the Boston Area Audio Industry Market Intelligence Mafia which sadly appears to have infected the channel sufficient processor market, do the math 48 speakers and amps instead of 8, of course they need to control the gateway to that JUGGERNAUT OF ALL GRAVY TRAINS: THE SURROUND PROCESSOR. I have names and dates with pictures, but I am too busy fulfilling my life's dream, i'm going to be 59 this year time will run out eventually, I have undergone malicious deep pocketed personal attacks on my very existence since I first co-founded CEDIA but heavily intensified in September 2014.

FOR EXAMPLE a crime committed through same new england based Market Research firm who unimpugnable manslaughtered maliciously the living spitting image of my mother in Phrona Smith (RIP) in 2011 my epileptic girlfriend with a gumshoe stalker pointing a strobe flashlight at her face in ambush at my parking garage. AFTER ME WARNING 24 hours prior HIM NOT TO DO IT THE NEXT DAY BECAUSE MY EPILEPTIC GIRLFRIEND was visiting; she then dropped FROM A STAIRWELL and cracked her skull dying 3 months later. All because I was writing in this forum the truth that was inconvenient to their business interests. It is a trillion dollar industry the connected living room, these mystery shopping companies do more nefarious things than comparison shopping, they run black ops, harassment through private dicks has grown like skynet, and people are dying from it. I swear on my life. They also have multiple plants in the Trinnov thread that every time I say the insult equivalent of jaywalking they report me and i get banned from the forum, 20 years hanging out in this forum and 90% of my infractions are these cowards, New England audio mafia apparatchiks bidding black ops in the Trinnov Owners thread. Believe It or not. If I get banned forever ,cause one more strike and I am out of these hallowed walls forever, remember this post.


So If some mad scientist can device such CRANIAL WEAPONIZATION beam contraption, i will gladly donate my living body today for such brain weaponization, in order to banish from the face of what should be an ABSOLUTE TRUTH IMMERSIVE MARKETPLACE these lowlife murdering and intellectual property thieving thugs. iF THIS SOUNDS LIKE A KURT VONNEGUT jR. FICTION PASSAGE, REMEMBER ONE THING AND ONE THING ALONE. Like my mother I NEVER LIE... Help me stop MYSTERY SHOPPER/Market Research Firms BLOGGER-INTIMIDATION TACTICS.
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PRETERNATURAL IMMERSOPHILE rAVe Best ATMOS DEMO CEDIA 2016. Most Envied Installation In Europe ( Until July). PREPARING SPECIAL CEDIA EXPO 2017 DEMO WITH ULTIMATE HDR PROJECTION AND HI-POTENCY ATMOS REFRENCE POST-DUB STAGE DCI KIT: IMMERSIONLAND. WHEN THE LIVING ROOM WALL RIVALS YOUR 100 MILLION DOLLAR VIEW... The path to meaningful change is often walked alone.

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post #4707 of 4756 Old 06-04-2017, 03:15 AM
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Peter: Don't hold back. You should tell us how you really feel I must confess, your enthusiasm for this hobby is contagious (and, I might add, expensive )

I am, indeed, all over the idea of setting up a theater with A "selfish seat". My reasoning is that other than me (aka - selfish), not a single person who comes to our home to watch movies would know the difference between how it should sound and how it does sound. I can put some in the worst seat and they are still mesmerized by the experience. I have refused to buy into the notice of creating "good" seats for everyone when by doing so, by it's very definition, creates no GREAT seat.

And, at least in our theater, "holding my head in a vice" is not required to hear great audio - for DTS:X, Dolby or anything else. I have had that experience with previous systems, but with my current configuration of speakers, setup, calibration, processor and Dirac, has not happened.

That said, keep pushing the envelop. We all win by your efforts!!

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post #4708 of 4756 Old 06-04-2017, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
Peter: Don't hold back. You should tell us how you really feel

Be careful what you asked for but thanks for the segue to expose the true enemies of Home Theater, check added personal conspiration adventures notes that I added for the intrigue factor.

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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
I am, indeed, all over the idea of setting up a theater with A "selfish seat". My reasoning is that other than me (aka - selfish), not a single person who comes to our home to watch movies would know the difference between how it should sound and how it does sound. I can put some in the worst seat and they are still mesmerized by the experience. I have refused to buy into the notice of creating "good" seats for everyone when by doing so, by it's very definition, creates no GREAT seat.
SPOT ON and the genesis of what used to be called immersion 2025 now re-baptized for Hollywood consumption at CEDIA 2017 as IMMERSIONLAND.

Hopefully if the rest of my incoming kit does not get stolen, like The New England Audio Society ( IN THEIR POCKET)parcel service of choice FED EX who on purpose has been stealing every single shipment I happen to not warn the shipper. They falsified the bill of lading of a shipment for a camera that could see through clouds because the penthouse in moscow is cloudy all the time and Vlad wanted to see the Kremlin from the big screen, a video telescope. changing the FED EX number where the order became the lens mount and the lens but the camera disappeared, fed ex, my passport disappeared despite the consulate showing me their copy of the address on the envelope, multiple oppo players, a medeber 800 that I had left at Alans.

They steal from me impugned simply to Try give me a heart condition. But this time the digital amps from ATI INTENDED FOR THE express lab upgrade(and For sure ATI is unaware ) this is pure Boston Ft lauderdale organized malfeasance, this time guess who is going to get the attack?

read my next post and crack up!

PRETERNATURAL IMMERSOPHILE rAVe Best ATMOS DEMO CEDIA 2016. Most Envied Installation In Europe ( Until July). PREPARING SPECIAL CEDIA EXPO 2017 DEMO WITH ULTIMATE HDR PROJECTION AND HI-POTENCY ATMOS REFRENCE POST-DUB STAGE DCI KIT: IMMERSIONLAND. WHEN THE LIVING ROOM WALL RIVALS YOUR 100 MILLION DOLLAR VIEW... The path to meaningful change is often walked alone.
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post #4709 of 4756 Old 06-04-2017, 07:27 AM
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I had a chance today to watch/listen to a system using an RS20i with the DTS:X beta on it. All I can say is WOW. I mean simply, WOW!!!! Just like DTS was late to the party in the early days of Dolby, but eventually came out ahead, I have a feeling the same might happen with DTS:X.

I watched short pieces of two different movies: London Has Fallen recorded in DTS:X and the first few minutes of Bolt, recorded in regular DTS:HD. We started with Bolt and I was able to compare the DTS:X up-sampling against DSU. It was not even close. Everything about the DTS up-sampling was superior. Most surprising was the increased level of dynamics. That was not expected. We could play it one way then the other. And each time the differences were so very obvious. I really had very low expectations about the up-sampling approach but DTS is clearly doing something right.

I have watched London Has Fallen more than once, but again, listening to it with DTS:X was a whole new experience and again, the dynamics are superior. Easy to hear it with gun shots and explosions or big crashes. Really does increase the envelopment in the film.

As annoyed as I have been with the delay in getting this product to market, I will be most excited to be able finally get my system updated. Having now heard it, I want it sooner rather than later.

You are all in for a very huge increase in sound quality in your theaters. Or as our President would say ---- uuuuuuuge!!

I am pumped !!!!!!!!
You see, this is exactly my own impression. I also assume that the DTS:X update will be published very soon, because I couldn't find anything wrong with the beta, only some small things for my personal taste.

Peter, thank you for sharing your very interesting ideas here. My personal opinion about this: The problem with audio reproduction in general is, that there are no standards. The BBC did a lot of work on this in the 50ies and 60ies and established some standards, but these are outdated today - some still valid - and Dolby, DTS and Auro recommendations are what they are - no standards, just recommendations.
This is not so good but on the other hand leaves a lot of room for trying things out as you do. Thank you for your enthusiasm and sharing this with us.

Regarding your last paragraphs, I was shocked reading this and it is hard to believe but I read about people showing up in electronics markets, representing a specific brand but it is not their job to foster this brand, in contrary, their job is to discredit this brand they presumably represent. Crazy stuff. And how can they ban you here? This is something, I cannot understand.
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post #4710 of 4756 Old 06-04-2017, 10:35 AM
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I was not criticizing Adam who has had 32 speakers at home (albeit horns so My nose remains pointing up at that clarification- horns do suckk so bad...)

In The Holiday Inn Express Lab Everything is time aligned to one seat. The exclusion box is created using the cinema formula. about 2 seats wide, but the angles are constant to the one seat so opens up a bit. The 4 misely tops (you need 10 to 14 (rerendered from the 10 a la cp-850/ims-3000)- 8 minimum)are within the separation guidelines identified by me based on latest iterations of the Damaske And Wagener seminal work.
I don't have horn speakers in my Lab, Peter. Never did.

Time alignment is always to one seat. No other way to do it properly. You are still wildly misinterpreting the Damaske and Wagener picture, though.

Adam Pelz ,Acoustic Mafia - Hear No Evil
Master ARCOS Calibrator, Cedia Designer, HAA Instructor LIII, THX HT1+ HT2+ Video
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