Official DataSat RS20i thread. (Setup Tips, Questions,General Info, etc) - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 1998 Old 08-03-2013, 05:27 AM
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Nice. I nearly had one of those but the slimy grease ball took my bank transfer for it and I never saw the case. Just as well as I would never fit it in my rack now. Lol
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post #812 of 1998 Old 08-03-2013, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceenhad View Post

1 to 16 does not bypass any of the other processing as far as I can tell and certainly there are no warnings of such on the device.

That is correct. The processing chain of Dirac Live, active crossovers, 3rd octave EQ, PEQ and tone controls is always operational in both the AP20 & RS20i products.
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post #813 of 1998 Old 08-03-2013, 10:11 AM
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Please see the handy flow chart on page 2:

http://www.datasatdigital.com/docs/archive/.pdf

and on page 3:
Quote:
The input Digital Ch: 1 -> 16 does not allow Post Processing or Bass Management functions. Note that Digital Ch: 1 -> 16
refers only when using both 8 channel inputs together to form a 16 channel input. The individual 8 channel inputs can be processed as described in the previous section.

I only remembered this statement about no Post Processing, thinking it meant everything. As the flow chart shows, DSP and Decoding as well as BM are bypassed, but all other "Audio Processing" is maintained. Are there any consumer sources that would ever use 1-16?

@gdavies: The above flow chart also shows that 1,2 and 9,10 with the DD/DTS decoder in the the pathway. You would only use this if you have a balanced bitstream (undecoded) DD/DTS signal, a rare bird indeed. It so happens that my old Ayre SDI DVD player does output a balanced DD/DTS bitstream on XLR, so this is actually a useful feature for me.
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post #814 of 1998 Old 08-03-2013, 12:45 PM
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Ah no this was some jerk in my home country, UK. The only thing I've been stung on thus far. I'm sure it will happen again. There be some dirty, foul playing so and so's out there.
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post #815 of 1998 Old 08-04-2013, 02:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djnickuk View Post

Is that an OrigenAE case above the ap20?

Here is mine as well,

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post #816 of 1998 Old 08-05-2013, 01:20 PM
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Dan from Datasat USA has just posted as to what the dacs in the RS20i are

'The RS20i DACs are Burr-Brown PCM4104'

But as we know its nots just about the dac chipset, the analogue stage, IMO, is as or more important.
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post #817 of 1998 Old 08-05-2013, 06:42 PM
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+1

Same as the ones in the Audyssey Sound Equalizer.What's it use for the ADC?
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post #818 of 1998 Old 08-05-2013, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenLansing View Post

....What's it use for the ADC?

Burr Brown PCM4204
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post #819 of 1998 Old 08-06-2013, 02:21 AM
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How many tracks are there in each digital audio output?

Is the digital audio output 1 include a pair of L track and R track?
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post #820 of 1998 Old 08-06-2013, 02:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotus910 View Post

How many tracks are there in each digital audio output?

Is the digital audio output 1 include a pair of L track and R track?

I believe the standard DB25 to 8 x AES/EBU XLR snake for fitting to the RS20i's DB25 digital out socket allows for one connector per channel. I'm not sure if it is possible to use a DB25 to 4 x AES/EBU XLR such that each XLR carries two channels. Most devices I have seen with an AES/EBU input seem to use a single socket for a stereo (2 channel) digital input, so hopefully both wiring options are possible - though whether the 2 channel option would have sufficient bandwidth to operate up to the full 192 Khz sampling rate, I'm not sure?

Perhaps one of the more techie/knowledgeable guys on here can confirm? . . .
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post #821 of 1998 Old 08-06-2013, 02:58 AM
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I really need help of the issue, because my project is going to buy the RS20i,

then the AES/EBU output signal will going to "8 AES HD/SD embedder card",

that is why I need to solve the issue !!eek.gif
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post #822 of 1998 Old 08-06-2013, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

This is what bothers me. Why pay all this money for processing power and finally get the new DolbyHD card only to turn it off? I would rather listen to lossy formats than do that. Ideally I want to have bit-streaming and have the RS20i decode the loss-less codecs.

I have recently purchased a new Nad M50 streamer and decided t test out whether Datasat have addressed the 192/24 over coax issue. And they have.

It doesn't get downsampled it just automatically goes into direct mode so currently, if streaming a 192/24 file over coax into the Datasat you'll only be able to get 2 channel playback unless you map your speakers in the routing page.

This is not the case via HDMI. I have played a few 192/24 blu rays and these play fine, I guess being downsampled to 96/24.

I have fired off an email to Datasat to see if the coax input can be treated in the same way as HDMI.

I also noted that we can now apply neo x etc onto a 2 channel analogue input. Which is good.
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post #823 of 1998 Old 08-06-2013, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl_Huff View Post

Burr Brown PCM4204
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Thanks Carl.

That's also the same one used in the SEQ.
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post #824 of 1998 Old 08-20-2013, 03:49 PM - Thread Starter
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I am still trying to get the HTPC to play ball with the RS20i.
I have had the PC setup for bitstreaming via a proffesional, so the PC settings are correct for bitstreaming. He says, it could be a setting in the RS20i that needs to be set, so does anyone have any idea of how to get the RS20i to accept bitstreaming via a PC? (BTW, I tried other bluray playing software and still get the same static through the speakers)

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post #825 of 1998 Old 08-21-2013, 03:57 PM
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New update recently posted. Only three changes:

Improvements for V1.01.02
1.
Added HSR firmware update. Note: Current HSR5 update version is: Release 39 Version 11 Rev. 4 In the HDMI menu screen (System > Inputs > Input Options > Decoder Setup > HDMI), added an Update HSR Firmware” button. Programming will be retried once if it fails the first time. A power cycle must occur in order to update the HSR5 version text on the System Information screen.

2.
Added option to mute HDMI when there is no AIF input. This will prevent any possible noise issues being introduced into the RS20i from other equipment. In the HDMI Status menu screen (System > Inputs > Input Options > Decoder Setup > HDMI) this appears as a check box “Mute when HDMI AIF.chans=0 (normally on)”. Note: This option may need to be turned off when using some DIRECTV STBs to allow 2-channel playback on HDMI.

3.
Added option to generate an LFE channel when using Neo:X with a 2-channel input source.
a.
In the Decoder Setup menu screen this appears as a check box “Neo:X: Generate Sub from 2-chancontent” when DTS Neo:X is selected.
b.
Net command = @NEOXLFE [0,1] The parameter is 0 to disable or 1 to enable this feature.


I understand #3 but am lost on #1 and #2. What is HSR and why is it now getting this special treatment? What is an AIF input over HDMI?
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post #826 of 1998 Old 08-21-2013, 04:40 PM
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^^
Apparently the MDS HSR-5 HDMI board's firmware is being updated.

AIF is "Audio Interchange File Format (AIFF). The file extension for the standard AIFF format is .aiff or .aif." according to wiki. Not sure what sort of noise was the issue, as AIFF files are just like PCM wav. files regarding audio.

Now I have a question. >>Added option to generate an LFE [sic] channel when using Neo:X with a 2-channel input source.<< If anything, it generates a subwoofer channel. But nevermind. I am wondering why it needs this separate mode in order to do so. Presumably, if bass management is active in the RS-20i, any and all signals will be covered, regardless of whether they are stereo, 5.0, 7.1, or upmixed by Neo:X. So what does this mode do that was not happening already?

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post #827 of 1998 Old 08-21-2013, 06:06 PM
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Thanks Roger.

Here is a little info on the MDS HSR-5

http://www.mds.com/products/hsr

From your Wiki link I got this:
Quote:
Audio Interchange File Format (AIFF) is an audio file format standard used for storing sound data for personal computers and other electronic audio devices. The format was developed by Apple Computer in 1988 based on Electronic Arts' Interchange File Format (IFF, widely used on Amiga systems) and is most commonly used on Apple Macintosh computer systems.

It doesn't sound like something that one would use with the RS20i: computer source with audio in AIF format sent to the RS20i via HDMI? Plus this tidbit:
Quote:
This option may need to be turned off when using some DIRECTV STBs to allow 2-channel playback on HDMI.

Quote:
Added option to generate an LFE [sic] channel when using Neo:X with a 2-channel input source.
Taken at face value it means to me that the .1 channel is shut off with a 2-channel source. I'm guessing that BM would still be on and that bass would be routed from the Small speakers to the Large speakers. With the new option bass could be routed from the Small speakers to the Sub(s).
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post #828 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 12:21 AM
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AIF in this case is HDMI Audio Informatiom Frame not an audio format.

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post #829 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 02:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceenhad View Post

AIF in this case is HDMI Audio Information Frame not an audio format.
Thanks. Where is this defined?

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post #830 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 04:55 AM
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I am unsure as to the neo x LFE for 2 channel. I am currently listening to 2 chanel via coax input and neo x is happily running with an LFE channel. Perhaps this is for 2 channel analogue input?
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post #831 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 05:12 AM
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Hi Roger. Courtesy of the alway excellent Quantum Data examples and application notes
http://www.quantumdata.com/pdf/980_Protocol_Analyzer_AppNote_AudioDrop.pdf

My 780 tester has more basic tests for this item also which comes in handy more often than I would have hoped at this stage in the HDMI life cycle!

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post #832 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 10:09 AM
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Thanks for link, where it is actually referred to as Audio Infoframe. Not trying to be pedantic but a search on that term will give you all the hits and info you want.

Nick, interesting observation on the LFE channel and NeoX. Are you expanding to 5 or 7 speakers? Maybe it only applies to the HDMI input. Not really worth thinking too hard about.
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post #833 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 12:52 PM
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I'm expanding to 7 channel. No heights. Just a standard 7.x layout.

I am currently watching a 2 channel rip from my oppo via HDMI and the LFE channel is present with neo x as with the coax.
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post #834 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 01:47 PM
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Thanks, Neil. Now that I know the real name, it was easily found in the HDMI spec. wink.gif

As for Neo:X, it has its own internal bass management function for the convenience of product makers. Not sure if adds real value or just redundancy in something like the RS-20i that already has plenty of bass management.

Unfortunately, the naming confusion starts with DTS, as they call it an LFE output in their docs. But it is not really an LFE channel, per se.

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post #835 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

As for Neo:X, it has its own internal bass management function for the convenience of product makers. Not sure if adds real value or just redundancy in something like the RS-20i that already has plenty of bass management.
Is the DTS bass management an option that can be turned off by the manufacturers, so that there is one universal bass management for all sources (coded and LPCM)?

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post #836 of 1998 Old 08-22-2013, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
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Is the DTS bass management an option that can be turned off by the manufacturers, so that there is one universal bass management for all sources (coded and LPCM)?
The DTS code does not actually have the filters, so it can be ignored. IIRC, it just sums the signals together. I'm not sure of all the inner details. Perhaps it sums before the upmixing and applies latency compensation for the Neo:X algorithm. That would make perfect sense. All the product maker has to do is avoid performing the summing again.

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post #837 of 1998 Old 08-27-2013, 06:23 PM
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I am having a Datasat RS20i brought to my home for an in house demo from the Datasat representative. I have a 5.2 setup currently. I was wondering if you could give me any advice as to what you would absolutely be sure to test while he is here. At the moment we will be:

1. I will have him only setup speaker distances and volume calibration so I can hear what the core sounds like.

2. Then he will be setting up the room correction, which we will directly compare to the non-room correction version.

3. I will be testing mostly movies, but music will be on the menu as well (we are 98% movies, 2% music in my home).

I have read a few people having some issues and little bugs here and there and wanted to be sure there isn't anything to be alarmed about. Additionally, the fact this unit isn't 192 and there doesn't seem to be an absolute certainty if it will get it or not worries me. A unit that is supposed to be so upgradeable but yet this issue is only one alarm that goes off in my mind, coming from the Meridian 861 I am in now.

Any advice or information you feel would be helpful would be greatly appreciated.
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post #838 of 1998 Old 08-28-2013, 02:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro2be View Post

I am having a Datasat RS20i brought to my home for an in house demo from the Datasat representative. I have a 5.2 setup currently. I was wondering if you could give me any advice as to what you would absolutely be sure to test while he is here. At the moment we will be:

1. I will have him only setup speaker distances and volume calibration so I can hear what the core sounds like.

2. Then he will be setting up the room correction, which we will directly compare to the non-room correction version.

3. I will be testing mostly movies, but music will be on the menu as well (we are 98% movies, 2% music in my home).

I have read a few people having some issues and little bugs here and there and wanted to be sure there isn't anything to be alarmed about. Additionally, the fact this unit isn't 192 and there doesn't seem to be an absolute certainty if it will get it or not worries me. A unit that is supposed to be so upgradeable but yet this issue is only one alarm that goes off in my mind, coming from the Meridian 861 I am in now.

Any advice or information you feel would be helpful would be greatly appreciated.
Can I ask what your room is like? Treated, untreated? What speakers are you using? How is your low end?

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post #839 of 1998 Old 08-28-2013, 04:44 AM
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The unit plays back a 192/24 signal via HDMI absolutly fine. It will down res it to 96/24. If via coax then it will only play back in 2 channel. But not down resed.

Having said that, I haven't tried the latest firmware update, which bring full 16 channels of Dirac.

It's not a quick job to properly set the unit up. If done correctly with near field measurement for xover setting, sub time alignment ( rew ) and Dirac it should take a good 8-12 hours.

Having said that, a quick delay via physical distance measurement and spl levels can be achieved in under 5 mins and will show you what exactly its capable of!
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post #840 of 1998 Old 08-28-2013, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

Can I ask what your room is like? Treated, untreated? What speakers are you using? How is your low end?

My room is big and open, which extends on further to the other parts of the home. It is not a sealed room by any means and is completely untreated.

I am using ATC Active speakers. My low end absolutely rocks the whole structure of the home it feels like lol smile.gif. I can completely overpower my entire theater with it with complete ease, so there is plenty to spare when dialing it down for balance. Just last night we watched Oblivion and wow, that is absolute home theater ear candy. No painful highs, absolutely powerful lows. My wife and I really enjoyed it.

Are the DAC's upgradeable in this unit? How long are the breakout cables with the XLR connections on them (I assume that's what it is, since there is no XLR on the back of the unit per all the images I have seen of it).

Thanks!
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