Which one would you buy ?.. Sony 4k or Sim2 Lumis.. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 46 Old 12-28-2012, 03:53 PM - Thread Starter
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If you have that extra cash which PJ would you buy?.. The SONY 4k or the SIM2 Lumis.
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post #2 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 12:08 AM
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All things ($) equal, I'd still take a full blown Lumis over the Sony.
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post #3 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 07:01 AM
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Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

All things ($) equal, I'd still take a full blown Lumis over the Sony.

The Sony will only be full blown when 4K arrives!tongue.gif
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post #4 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 09:54 AM
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I would and did take the Sony.

They both are very good with several important differences some based in the different chip technologies employeed and others based on the resolution of the panels and on the quality of the lenses.

The Sony can project 4K now, the Lumis never will be able to.

The Sony for whatever collection of reasons in my black pit room and Snowmat screen just presents a more realistic picture to my eyes. The Sony is a lot cheaper too both at MSRP and at street.


If I was given a Lumis, i would be happy and wouldn't buy a Sony and visa versa. Once 4K content becomes readily available, and I expect it will shortly through Odemax but not for the biggie movies, i would rush out. but not today. Both are great 2D 1080p machines but I still prefer the Sony.

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post #5 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I would and did take the Sony.
They both are very good with several important differences some based in the different chip[ technologies employe and others based on the resolution of the panels and on the quality of the lenses.
The Sony can project 4K now, the Lumis never will be able to.
The Sony for whatever collection of reasons in my black pit room and Snowmat screen just presents a more realistic picture to my eyes.the sony is a lot cheaper to, both at MSRP and at street.
If I was given a Lumis, i would be happy and wouldn't buy a Sony and visa versa. Once 4K content becomes readily available, and I expect it will shortly throu Odemax but not for the biggie movies, i would rush out. but not today. Both are great 2D 1080p machines but I still prefer the Sony.

As a fellow Sony 4K owner I'll raise a toast to that:


Now i have not had the chance to do an AB comparison with Sim2 but the ability of the Sony to accept 4K when the day arrives was a no brainer when it came to deciding which one of these 2 beasts to go for.
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post #6 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 02:33 PM
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As a long time early adopter, I plan to stay away from 4K until their is an abundance of new releases and at least a 2nd generation of hardware. Moreover, as that day approaches, there may be other hardware or software features needed by the projector to get the most of whatever this new 4K software offers. It's not guaranteed that when the new 4K software arrives, the current Sony will be able to play all features (or even all movies).

As one who got caught with a new JVC projector just a month or two prior to the release of the first generation of Blu Ray players, JVC (and their product literature) assured me that my new DILA had a DVI HDCP input. However, the DVI port was on the machine, but no HDCP. Thus my new state of the art G-150 DILA would not play HD DVD and Blu Ray material when they arrived. Thanks to a lot of bitching and Alan Gouger, I got a full refund. Never again will I buy a new piece of hardware before the software makes the market. Things can change.!biggrin.gif

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post #7 of 46 Old 01-01-2013, 06:30 PM
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As a long time early adopter, I plan to stay away from 4K until their is an abundance of new releases and at least a 2nd generation of hardware. Moreover, as that day approaches, there may be other hardware or software features needed by the projector to get the most of whatever this new 4K software offers. It's not guaranteed that when the new 4K software arrives, the current Sony will be able to play all features (or even all movies).

As one who got caught with a new JVC projector just a month or two prior to the release of the first generation of Blu Ray players, JVC (and their product literature) assured me that my new DILA had a DVI HDCP input. However, the DVI port was on the machine, but no HDCP. Thus my new state of the art G-150 DILA would not play HD DVD and Blu Ray material when they arrived. Thanks to a lot of bitching and Alan Gouger, I got a full refund. Never again will I buy a new piece of hardware before the software makes the market. Things can change.!

I totally agree. I will not be an early adopter again either. And I'm loving my Lumis right now, more than ever!
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Once 4K content becomes readily available, and I expect it will shortly throu Odemax but not for the biggie movies, i would rush out
No mainsteam " biggie movies " = no interest ( for me anyway ).

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post #8 of 46 Old 01-02-2013, 06:22 PM
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I have hung several of the Sony 4K's in the last few months and I have to tell you hands down if you are looking for a high end projector, there is no other.

Sony's Support is amazing. If you have a bad unit they will overnight you a new one.

This type of support and picture quality makes the Sony by far the best pick.

Sim2 over the years has done some awful things to dealers and to consumers as well as far as support and warranty claims etc.

Sony all day long..

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post #9 of 46 Old 01-02-2013, 09:06 PM
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Sorry to hear that - I have had nothing but great service from Sim2 - even when I wasn't working for AV Science.

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post #10 of 46 Old 01-02-2013, 10:05 PM
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I have had excellent service from Sim2 as an end user . I can't Imagine being able to correspond with some one at Sony on personal level instead of generic email from customer service department . But maybe things have changed .
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post #11 of 46 Old 01-02-2013, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VGI View Post

I have hung several of the Sony 4K's in the last few months and I have to tell you hands down if you are looking for a high end projector, there is no other.
Sony's Support is amazing. If you have a bad unit they will overnight you a new one.
This type of support and picture quality makes the Sony by far the best pick.
Sim2 over the years has done some awful things to dealers and to consumers as well as far as support and warranty claims etc.
Sony all day long..
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I've heard the same nightmare stories regarding Sim2. I'm happy with my Sony. Regardless if 4k content is released anytime soon, the projector does an excellent job with Bluray anyway.

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post #12 of 46 Old 01-03-2013, 01:16 AM
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What size screen do you have, Tony?

Unless someone has a preference for DLP over LCoS, I assumed it would mostly come down to screen size. The Lumis is 50% brighter for twice the price. If you need the extra light then there isn't much of a choice between the two.

 

 

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post #13 of 46 Old 01-03-2013, 05:42 AM
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14' wide microperf (scope). The Lunis was the only game in town in the under $40K range.
It's all about light output and it is still expensive for a bright, quality picture.

That said, I've had great service from Sim2 on the occasions I've needed it.

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post #14 of 46 Old 01-03-2013, 06:06 AM
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What size screen do you have, Tony?
Unless someone has a preference for DLP over LCoS, I assumed it would mostly come down to screen size. The Lumis is 50% brighter for twice the price. If you need the extra light then there isn't much of a choice between the two.

Yes. I would agree there. My screen is only a 10ft wide weaved screen so light output from the Sony is not an issue. If I was looking at 14ft or more, the Sony would likely not be an option for me. That's where Sim2 or DPI would need to step in.

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post #15 of 46 Old 01-03-2013, 10:43 AM
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Both Sim2 and Sony now have great customer service. Having a good dealer with connections on your side doesn't hurt either.

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post #16 of 46 Old 01-05-2013, 08:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Interesting observations here.
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post #17 of 46 Old 01-06-2013, 08:22 AM
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I'd throw in my two cents... A/B the Sony to the SIM if you can. Run a variety of material (I did this with my HT5000 to the Sony) and you will not buy the Sony IMO.

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post #18 of 46 Old 01-06-2013, 02:39 PM
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Happy New Year Art.

When one is comparing several of the best projectors personnel preferences of certain aspects of image quality come into play. With your size screen, I think that brightness would be a very important consideration and the Sim2 5000 puts out a lot more light than the Sony 1000ES does. There are also difference of technological limitations between DLPs and reflective LCDs. There are things that one does over the other that I think would also become determinative once ones personnel weighting factors come into play.

Regardless of those considerations, the Sony just won't put out enough light and its attributes won't shine with a perforated Stewart Studeotec. 130. I think if one were to have enough light and could use it on a non perfed Snowmat 1000, one's opinion might change. I was amazed how switching from the 130 to 100 made the 1000ES shine even though the picture was and appeared slightly dimmer. But these are both so good machines, if I owned one already I certainly wouldn't run out and purchase the other.

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post #19 of 46 Old 01-06-2013, 07:21 PM
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Mark,
Intrascene contrast and color are significantly better with 3 chip DLP. If you A/B, trust me, it isn't any sort of contest.

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post #20 of 46 Old 01-07-2013, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

Mark,
Intrascene contrast and color are significantly better with 3 chip DLP. If you A/B, trust me, it isn't any sort of contest.
Art

 

I think from the beginning these differences to varying degrees have always held true comparing the basic technology of DLP vs LCOS?

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post #21 of 46 Old 01-07-2013, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
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Mark,
Intrascene contrast and color are significantly better with 3 chip DLP. If you A/B, trust me, it isn't any sort of contest.
Art

I'm with Art on this one, after seeing the Sony at CEDIA my preference is still 3-chip DLP

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post #22 of 46 Old 01-07-2013, 09:58 AM
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I would agree re intrascene contrast between SXRD and 3 chip DLP. I don't understand why the colors would be superior one vs the other. Although there is no CMS in the Sony, supplying a CMS externally enables the colors to be nailed on the Sony and I know they can be nailed with the Sim2. Why would there be any difference?

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post #23 of 46 Old 01-07-2013, 11:13 AM
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Not sure, but Ken calibrated both in the A/B I did. I really liked what the Sony looked like by itself but I had to make a decision so I covered each, same source, same time and literally it was Alabama aganst my son's high school team. I just said box it back up.

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post #24 of 46 Old 01-07-2013, 06:14 PM
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Lumis (or even a Nero, which would be more $ competitive).

To me the Sony upconverted 4k image looks overly processed compared to the SIM2. I kept on noticing artifacts. SIM2 just gives you what's on the blu-ray, and does it amazingly. The Sony is a nice projector though - bright and good contrast.

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post #25 of 46 Old 01-08-2013, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

Not sure, but Ken calibrated both in the A/B I did. I really liked what the Sony looked like by itself but I had to make a decision so I covered each, same source, same time and literally it was Alabama aganst my son's high school team. I just said box it back up.

Art
And... Art is not getting the benefits of dynamic black. And Arts not the only trusted high end user who has kept the sim2 when A/Bing o Sim2. So, vs a Lumis, or any good 3 chip DLP, I stand by earlier opinion.
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post #26 of 46 Old 01-08-2013, 07:50 PM
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My only comment, that without adding a Lumagen, Ken could not nail the colors on the Sony because it does not have a CMS.

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post #27 of 46 Old 01-09-2013, 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

And... Art is not getting the benefits of dynamic black. And Arts not the only trusted high end user who has kept the sim2 when A/Bing o Sim2. So, vs a Lumis, or any good 3 chip DLP, I stand by earlier opinion.

I think Art initially prefered the Sony(at least in terms of resolution+viewings from close distance).

Although obviously there are other factors which make a great picture apart from resolution!
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post #28 of 46 Old 01-09-2013, 04:58 PM
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After side by side testing the VW1000 against the Sim2 Lumis 3D-S in a batcave with a 3m wide 2.35:1 screen I would definetly prefer the Sony. I was rather surpriced that the Sony beat the Sim2 in every aspect even intrascenecontrast and clarity/sharpness and deapth, I only brought my VW1000 to have something to compare the Sim2 against and was sure the Sim2 would blow the VW1000 away. But it was not the case, and to me this is a good example that DLP has played its part and is in need of evolution. To me the Sim2 Lumis 3D-S is a overhyped and overpriced projector and it disappointed me to see that. It was really no contest.

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post #29 of 46 Old 01-09-2013, 05:49 PM
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A bird told me TI is coming out with a new chip. I really have no clue as to what it will be but I would suspect a 4K chip for consumers suitable for both 1 and 3 chippers.

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post #30 of 46 Old 01-09-2013, 06:10 PM
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