Predictions for 2014 4K DLP consumer projectors - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 48 Old 09-11-2013, 08:00 AM
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There is UHD-1 (4k) and UHD-2 (8k). For the flat panel manufactures, 4K seems more than adequate. But they have large product development budgets and can turn out "the next big thing" in fairly short order. The projector manufactures and various light engine technologies require a longer development cycle due to the smaller scale of the two-piece projection market. Hence the logic for them to skip UHD-1 and go directly to UHD-2. As for content delivery, the NHK has already demonstrated several schemes for transmitting UHD-2, including over the air.
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post #32 of 48 Old 09-11-2013, 08:40 AM
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And with TI not willing to make 4K DLP DMDs for consumer projectors for another two years, the largest part of the competition are blocked from bringing anything 4K, so there is really only Sony and JVC that have panels to make 4K projectors for HT at the moment.

Must be frustrating for manufacturers of DLP projectors that they are subjects to the whims of TI.

Ti seems to be using most of their R&D on DMDs for Pico projectors, where they now has a new "tilt & roll" DMD where the mirros/pixels are 1/20th the width of a human hair.

That would make a hell of a high resolution DMD if they built this in normal .65, .95 or 1.38 sizes like the 1080p and 4K DMDs they have today.
Not very realistic, neither pixel wise nor image quality wise, but fun to think of.

Wish TI rather went for larger mirror/pixel sizes than the 1080p DMDs for their 4K HT DLP DMDs, like free the 1.38 4K DMD for HT machines.

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 90

http://www.engadget.com/2013/09/06/ti-launches-dlp-pico-projector-chipset-based-on-tilt-and-roll/
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post #33 of 48 Old 09-13-2013, 10:32 AM
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Don't leave out Epson, they've been working on their own LCOS for quite some time. I'm also sure they're working on UHD LCD panels too.

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post #34 of 48 Old 09-16-2013, 01:08 PM
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"And with TI not willing to make 4K DLP DMDs for consumer projectors for another two years.. "

Not sure this is true. Do you have a source on the inside at TI or is this speculation? My speculation would be that TI is diligently working on a UHD-2 (8K) solution to leap-frog UHD-1 (4K).
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post #35 of 48 Old 09-16-2013, 07:01 PM
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Pete, someone linked to this earlier, might have been coolscan: http://www.electronichouse.com/article/where_are_the_4k_home_theater_projectors/D4/
Quote:
Texas Instruments would not commit to any 4K future. In fact, none of the DLP projector makers I talked to said they had plans to offer consumer 4K products soon (aside from the one SIM2/Christie product), though one manufacturer said that Texas Instruments’ forecast to them put 4K projectors at least another two years down the road.
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The other part of the picture is the size of the market. “While 4K certainly has buzz, it is not the demand that we are truly seeing in the market this quarter,” notes Texas Instruments’ communications manager for DLP Kateri Gemperle in an email statement. It’s not that they can’t make a consumer 4K solution. They just won’t, at least for now, because they don’t think they’ll sell enough of them to warrant the investment. “DLP technology has absolutely no barriers to doing 4K resolution and beyond,” continued her reply.

 

 

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post #36 of 48 Old 09-16-2013, 07:03 PM
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Everything about TI is under the tightest ND anyone ever saw. Customers who buy TI chips and make or have made machines they sell can not disclose much of anything including the price they pay. There are really no insider sources to speak of and those that know a little will have their gonads legally cut off by TI if they leak anything.

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post #37 of 48 Old 09-16-2013, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Everything about TI is under the tightest ND anyone ever saw. Customers who buy TI chips and make or have made machines they sell can not disclose much of anything including the price they pay. There are really no insider sources to speak of and those that know a little will have their gonads legally cut off by TI if they leak anything.

Mark knows what can happen when one violates the tightest ND anyone ever saw.

Mark has a broken leg and ankle I understand.

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post #38 of 48 Old 09-17-2013, 02:11 PM
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“DLP technology has absolutely no barriers to doing 4K resolution and beyond,”

It's the "and beyond" that I speculate they are addressing. After all, you can always down convert from 8K to 4K when necessary.smile.gif
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post #39 of 48 Old 09-18-2013, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post

There is UHD-1 (4k) and UHD-2 (8k). For the flat panel manufactures, 4K seems more than adequate. But they have large product development budgets and can turn out "the next big thing" in fairly short order. The projector manufactures and various light engine technologies require a longer development cycle due to the smaller scale of the two-piece projection market. Hence the logic for them to skip UHD-1 and go directly to UHD-2. As for content delivery, the NHK has already demonstrated several schemes for transmitting UHD-2, including over the air.

Remember JVC has had an actual 8K projector, but announced it would not continue with it, opting for smaller and cheaper shift units. That's for professional/commercial markets, consumer markets, so don't expect JVC to come with 8 K for the consumer market, if it is even considered too expensive for the various commercial applications.

BTW, every 4K/8K LCD panel I saw this week has vertical white lines an inch wide evenly distributed across the screen.
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post #40 of 48 Old 09-18-2013, 10:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glimmie View Post

The problem with "upgradable" connectors is all high speed interfaces HDMI, DVI, Thunderport, HDSDI, SATA, are actually ANALOG!. Yes the transmission is digital but the actual electrical interface is an analog circuit. This is done as most high speed interfaces must stay out of saturation (a semiconductor design term). Unlike gate arrays, analog circuits are difficult to make field programmable especially at such high speeds. So it's doubtful we will see a programmable and upgradable HDMI interface.

The interface could be a card that is swapped out as needed, however there is no standard for the card interface. So the best you can hope for here is the display manufacture will supply an upgraded interface card when required. That's risky with the very short product life of today's electronics. And coupled with the small 4K user base for years to come, it's that much more risky.

While you might have had a good intention most of this post is poorly informed. Let me try and set a few things straight. Yes at high speeds a serdes will treat the input and output signal as analog in nature but this is due to the very limited channel bandwidth and signal reflections. The reason the signal is treated as analog doesn't have anything to do with saturation, but is done because the signal needs some processing to overcome the channel it is being transmitted over. A channel can easily have over 30dB of attention at nyquist rate and then you also have to deal with signal reflections that will cause further signal distortion. Things like transmitter pre emphasis, continuous time equalizer, decision feedback equalizer, clock and data recovery circuit are required to recover a signal with even a closed eye.

Things like connectors really don't limit future standards, connectors will always be one of the worst parts of any channel but they can be overcome with the previously mentioned techniques. Sad fact is that the datacomms used on consumer electronics are rather slow and existing products can easily handle any possible signal transmission rates. The future upgrades thing has nothing to do with a technical limitation but I suspect manufacturers just hedging their bets when they have no idea what connector/standard will become the accepted standard.
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post #41 of 48 Old 09-20-2013, 09:00 AM
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Pro market (cinema and so on) are reluctant to any form of competition on 4k DLP (tri, mono). At least from Barco and Christie point of view.

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post #42 of 48 Old 09-20-2013, 06:55 PM
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ti even not come with a smaller dci cinema 4k chip that they promise since some time so no way they comes with a small consumer
4k dmd anythime soon as the chip for consumers are must be even smaller that the small dci 4k chip.

one reason is the bad cr. the existing 4k dci chip have today.
the more the shrink the pixels the less fill ratio the dmd gets and therefore the cr. gets worse as the have more scattering light.
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post #43 of 48 Old 10-17-2013, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post

the cr. gets worse as the have more scattering light.

Yes but lasers do not scatter light...wink.gif
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post #44 of 48 Old 12-22-2013, 04:06 AM
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Here is some interesting information. No 4K DLP for the Home Market until 2015-
Quote:
First, a deal between Texas Instruments and commercial DLP cinema brands means no home theatre 4K DLP products can launch until 2015.

From here-

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/news/article/sim2-super-lumis-review/17392

Guess that will be when Sim2 will release the 4k Lumis smile.gif
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post #45 of 48 Old 12-30-2013, 02:16 AM
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i do not expect any big cr increase by using laser in a 4k dlp.
may we going from todays 1500:1 to 3000:1 in best case.

sony have there new 615 4k lcos that have today 12.000:1 without laser and speckle!
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post #46 of 48 Old 12-30-2013, 04:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.Mayer View Post


sony have there new 615 4k lcos that have today 12.000:1 without laser and speckle!

commercial units???
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post #47 of 48 Old 12-30-2013, 06:37 AM
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Google: Sony SRX-T615
and you will found any info you need.
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post #48 of 48 Old 01-01-2014, 09:44 AM
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Thank you
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