Hyperion xxi- format agnostic alcons/trinnov mid century legacy mini-plf system - Page 12 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #331 of 354 Old 02-07-2017, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Gratuitous repost for the pending punch list record

Murat,


Step 1)
Pick your UHD Bd's from this list for best image for films Mastered in 4K.

Step2)
For Items mastered in 2k and upconverted there is still plenty of good ones, but for that check out the picture quality scorecards here.



About the mini-laser from C. Nothing will be more compact than that SINGLE QUIET One Piece for RGB during the next 3 years. The lenses for .98 chips are phenomenal with great entendue.

I know everything else, some may have a smaller head but attached via fiber umbilical to a laser driver/chiller box the size of a 10" sub woofer. However that company is not an American company and hard to communicate, there is only one technical guy that speaks English and he has thousands of cinemas to coordinate.

Barco will be slow to dellver a compact RGB laser product in one piece. THIS IS THE PIECE once it gets a modest contrast boost from it's incredibly high native of 5,0000:1. Which is in and of itself a 250% increase from everything else series 2.

When it comes to Ultimate Image Quality n dlp Wolfgang has stated DLP is way better than a 21,000:1 sony 5000 vaseline-o-vision.He4 will confirm that.

You will see the impressions from the Expert Viewers Club's curated backstage tour of all laser projectors at CINEMACON. You may need a screen fabric change but that is no big deal as the improvement in sound will be 50% more transparent. PLUS a Walter recal then, since the system is unfinished from my view.

UPMIXING PROBLEM:Perhaps HYPERION can then comport itself as DESIGNED for NEURAL-X priority #1 (50% weighed average preponderance), CINEMA LAYOUT ATMOS a close #2 (45%) and the Also rans get the 5%. We need to fix this Pronto, it is an ambarrasment that Neural-x does not sound as good as Dolby Surround in the prototype system designed carefully from the ground up to exploit FIRST AND FOREMOST FOR NEURAL-X. If it is Trinnov's fault it is something Walter and Trinnov have to figure out and Correct. Your DS vs NX observation was exactly the situation I found at the CEDIA. Like I said before I am very suspicious about German precision level matching and filtering selection. I warned you about the verisilidute sound bubble not being realistic possibility if it was conducted in a TOO-GERMAN Way. Walter's precision logic could very well be the reason we are throwing the baby with the bad water.

THIS SITUATION IS COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE because by coincidence Gary Reber brought his SUPRAMUNOUS Reference 11.1 auro recording (which i will dropbox you to rip to bd-I have rights to do that for select MOON clients from Gary since I write for WSR), when we switched from the Strato by hand to the samsung uhd bd to play at 4:30 pm before my all nite IMMERSION EXTRAVAGANZA at the OMNI, that simple procedure completely wiped out the bass management that Arnaud and Walter spent 1.5 hours setting up.

So I was complaining all nite to Walter and Alcons who agreed something was wrong but then we went to the epic dinner event break and it was not until later at 1:30 am sep 17 that Mark seaton asked to borrow the ipad as we were getting no LF in the mix, he found right there that all Bass management was gone from memory!!! He then proceeded by ear to tweak and generally applied what Tom described as a Rock And Roll curve, the interesting part is that we played at reference +14 the techno music video which you must get DEADMAU5 in Canada 2011. And it sounded better than the MINISTRY OF SOUND in London, the first Atmos dance club. Afterwards we played The 2nd Huntsman movie in Dts-x and it sounded quite good, not so previously with Walters (Perhaps TOO-GERMAN tuning). Then we PLAYED THE DEFINITIVE CR3 movie object scaling accuracy test with the TIGER TANK scene in Fury,we did so in DS vs Neural-X and right then and there it was crystal clear which UPMIXER IS BOSS.

So in no uncertain terms I do declare this:

HYPERION, WE HAVE A PROBLEM!

I will ask Tom and Walter to try fix it at ISE. There is much work ahead to fix this extremely poor implementation of the original designs' PRIMAL FUNCTION (just look at the proscenium encased perfectly angled width channels- it does not come any more perfectly designed tha that).

To quote Roger Quested, who quotes (and looks like) Winston Churchill quote: Please Do Not Bugger-Up my considered Design.

Back to Lasers:
Also the Thor is series 2, they struggle with 3D and UHD bd , because of unnecessary circuitry & validation.

It's time to dump the complexity of series 2 in my view.

The Christie series 3 is much more hdmi friendly and perfected for such Alternative content in China mini-cinemas via HDMI where 3D rules and HDR is deploying at an accelerated tempo.

So my crystal ball is crystal clear. Besides these wont ship till x'mas I suggest you look for the you-tubes from the Expert Viewers Club come March 30.

Cheers!
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post #332 of 354 Old 03-12-2017, 01:32 PM - Thread Starter
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post #333 of 354 Old 03-12-2017, 02:28 PM
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I already ordered it from Amazon but it is still out of stock
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post #334 of 354 Old 03-12-2017, 02:47 PM - Thread Starter
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It is also laden heavily with IMAX AR footage. Like Star Trek Into Darkness UHD/3D and Guardians of the Galaxy 3D. These are perfect for your setup. Promise.

Interstellar is also great in IMAx 2D.

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post #335 of 354 Old 03-13-2017, 11:37 AM
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I already ordered it from Amazon but it is still out of stock
Sorry Murat I think I ordered the last one in stock about 10 days ago or more. It really is amazing 3D and audio!!

JBL Pro Cinema-JTR subs-Sony projection
MANCHESTER UNITED!!
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post #336 of 354 Old 03-13-2017, 12:03 PM
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Sorry Murat I think I ordered the last one in stock about 10 days ago or more. It really is amazing 3D and audio!!
It's OK I'll wait a bit longer
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post #337 of 354 Old 03-14-2017, 03:59 AM
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Steelbook version is available on Amazon.de, but no Atmos: Ton
Deutsch (DTS-HD Master/High 5.1), Englisch (DTS-HD 7.1), Italienisch (DTS 5.1)
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post #338 of 354 Old 03-14-2017, 08:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Disney wants all of us to dip one or two more times. However when Tilda Swinton pushes the Doctor into the ASTRAL WORLD, shortly thereafter while he is on the trip she sttarts giving him a lesson that will task every speaker, one at a time from the widths channels back in HYPERION, on the rear left, right, widths, above centre.

This phenomenon is marked more robustly in this transfer of a MOVIE RELEASED at the cinemas in ATMOS but that can be heartily RECONSTITUTED not by using the DS upmixer but NEURAL-X although downmixed to 7.1 for the home. It looks like Disney is now going into UHD in germany with Ironman trilogie, it will not have ATMOS but Ironman 3 was released in the cinema in Atmos and reconstitution is possible, so i ordered that one.

Discs where that situation happens is actually more numerous at the moment than actual movies released in ATMOS for home. So this was an important consideration in Hyperion with the masterpiece siting of the widths channels, idf i can say so myself.Bowing.

And Murat regarding a previous rant of mine, I thought that Walter said that you guys preferred DS than NX as the upmixer as of Walter's next to last trip , I had admonished him that came hell or highwater he was to make the Neural-X sound best, same situation happened at CEDIA with Trinnov and Alcons, where DS sounded better. I was sort of disappointed, but he then informed me that you guys were indeed able to get the NEURAL-X to be the better sounding upmixer at the end. I can now sleep at night, And your wait for the Dr. will be the more sweet indeed.

That is why I want a full day with Walter dedicated to the next moons JUST FOR NEURAL-X. Of course ATMOS rules by a wide shot, but NEURAL-X gives us a few more hundred titles to get an experinece above legacy and often aproximating ATMOS.

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post #339 of 354 Old 04-07-2017, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
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post #340 of 354 Old 08-18-2017, 10:15 AM
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1.

2. Fabric, being selected with architect.
I love this thread!!!! Murat can you share some pictures of the fabric install, it has such nice clean lines.!!!
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post #341 of 354 Old 08-18-2017, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Lon the problem is that in europe the very best cabinet makers are the turks they have been doing quality woodworks for millenniums and not centuries, no dark age in Turkey.

The panels in moscow penthouse also were built in Ankara. I said that it would end up being uneven. The Turkish Builder said DO NOT WORRY. Then when I got there i got schooled. No wonder Trump builds his furniture over there. The Moscow City Penthouse is 2 blocks away from the now infamous Miss Universe pageant, i was there, but did not get the invite.

My advice to everyone else I can give you the name of the best Turkish woodworker or just make your life simple and do fabritrak, it guarantees a certain level of cleanliness that the prefabricated method that works so well when the Turkish artisans perform it , comes out uneven in this side of the pond.

Murat half of the images in photobucket are not viewable.
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post #342 of 354 Old 08-18-2017, 12:34 PM
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Yes Peter I was amazed at the craftsmanship. What a phenomenal theater
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post #343 of 354 Old 08-19-2017, 03:17 AM
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My advice to everyone else I can give you the name of the best Turkish woodworker or just make your life simple and do fabritrak
I cannot find any information on the acoustical and light transparency of the fabric they use to cover the frames. I am looking for material for (double) walls and lowered ceiling with aimed speakers (and acoustic treatment) behind them, so more of covering cavities instead of merely being stretched over acoustic panels. Is the FabriSpan suited for such purpose?

A good idea and understanding lies at the basis of every successful project.
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post #344 of 354 Old 08-19-2017, 04:23 AM
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I cannot find any information on the acoustical and light transparency of the fabric they use to cover the frames. I am looking for material for (double) walls and lowered ceiling with aimed speakers (and acoustic treatment) behind them, so more of covering cavities instead of merely being stretched over acoustic panels. Is the FabriSpan suited for such purpose?
Same here, looking for exactly the same thing.
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post #345 of 354 Old 08-19-2017, 05:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Children, children ...time to start the Immersion Worm Correct School of design thread.

Section 7 will be devoted to the history of fabric walls, in the meantime the shop drawings for Hyperion which I can Email by request the whole set, and the preparations made for overhead and the walls at LOGE are designed strictly for FABRITRAK or reasonable facsimile.

I blame in descending order of complicity Ruben of SMX ( who popularised the frame and fabric method in his build that everyone followed), Dennis who followed the cedia classes of Russ Herschelmann and Russ Herschelmann as the original mutilator of the PURITY OF LINES in concept. I delegated to Russ Herschelmann the heading of the 3 person home theater committee, during the Initial creation of CEDIA formation meeting. As one of the four people that conceived CEDIA as a hot shots network in that CEDIA Formation meeting a group of 40 representatives from the deep audio interest group budged in and commandeered the proceedings, but the CEDIA that ensued was far from the perfection oriented Home Cinema as an Art Form. A complete corruption ensued through the descendants of herschelman, who at the time did what i suggested.

As you know I have one strike and I am out but I will not seat Quietly and see companies and individuals using science and measurements in parsed selective partially eclipsed premises. Yes no one will be above scrutiny. So this may be my last thread if deep audio continues to act childishly and shortsightedly protective of their power. Take it instead for what it is, and intervention. I promise I will antagonize and challenge many ideas that you have come to own, do not take personal i have my reasons for this technical, aesthetic, or at the moment business practical I will identify.

In the meantime I will start and look at section 7.
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post #346 of 354 Old 08-21-2017, 08:01 AM
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Children, children ...time to start the Immersion Worm Correct School of design thread.
Against beter knowledge, I was initially hoping for a simple 'yes' or 'no', 'beter use this or that' kind of answer. What really surprised me though was that googling around I could not find much on this specific application. What I need is a fabric that is not a woven AT screen fabric, but for a large part does the very same thing (being acoustic transparent, being (more or less) not light transparent, being mountable on a frame) with added features like being lighter in weight and more stretchable, and produced in different colors. For now I only need the fabric and not the TRAk system, as I will be mounting it on light frames to be mounted on walls (as both panels and columns) and hanging from the ceiling (max 2.5 m wide panels), easily to be relocated and removed (magnets, velcro, 'wires with hooks' kind of attachments). It is for hiding speakers, cables, and acoustic treatments in my flexible experience center/ concept room/ sound lab which I will frequently re-model.

A good idea and understanding lies at the basis of every successful project.

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post #347 of 354 Old 08-21-2017, 11:26 AM
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Against beter knowledge, I was initially hoping for a simple 'yes' or 'no', 'beter use this or that' kind of answer. What really surprised me though was that googling around I could not find much on this specific application. What I need is a fabric that is not a woven AT screen fabric, but for a large part does the very same thing (being acoustic transparent, being (more or less) not light transparent, being mountable on a frame) with added features like being lighter in weight and more stretchable, and produced in different colors. For now I only need the fabric and not the TRAk system, as I will be mounting it on light frames to be mounted on walls (as both panels and columns) and hanging from the ceiling (max 2.5 m wide panels), easily to be relocated and removed (magnets, velcro, 'wires with hooks' kind of attachments). It is for hiding speakers, cables, and acoustic treatments in my flexible experience center/ concept room/ sound lab which I will frequently re-model.
Not sure about availability in your neck of the woods, but the simple answer is Guilford of Maine.

https://www.guilfordofmaine.com/acoustic

Lots of colors, textures, and specific acoustical performance available for each style.
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Master ARCOS Calibrator, Cedia Designer, HAA Instructor LIII, THX HT1+ HT2+ Video
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post #348 of 354 Old 08-21-2017, 12:04 PM
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Not sure about availability in your neck of the woods, but the simple answer is Guilford of Maine.

https://www.guilfordofmaine.com/acoustic

Lots of colors, textures, and specific acoustical performance available for each style.
I'll be using their fabric on the ceiling, my ID picked another company for the walls. Guilford of Maine offers a lot of variety and spec's the transparency. You can also get GIK pannels in any of their fabrics.
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post #349 of 354 Old 08-21-2017, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
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I want to design my own pattern optimal for video using stadium shaped geometrics 8 inches lon by 2, against charcoal, and three different colors like walnut, greige, and light charcoal, i'll draw it up one of these days. My question to you is How is the fabric being applied? With frames? Or with Fabritrak, fabritrak is almost always better unless you call in the Turks.
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post #350 of 354 Old 08-21-2017, 03:59 PM
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You can check out the photos I shared in this post. It might give you an idea how we did it over here. Acoustically transparent fabric was stretched over the wooden frames and stapled. Those frames have 4 or more male studs and can be installed on the permanently installed subframes which have matching female receivers Hyperion xxi- format agnostic alcons/trinnov mid century legacy mini-plf system
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post #351 of 354 Old 08-28-2017, 02:08 PM
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Murat,

How is the amplifier fan noise in the completed room? Where you able to suppress the fan noise or is it still loud/noisy? If it is still loud/noisy, could you state how much so? Does it distract from the movie experience? I am considering some speakers that require pro amplifiers and I might have no option but to place them in-room. Just looking for some feedback.
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post #352 of 354 Old 08-28-2017, 02:47 PM
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Murat,

How is the amplifier fan noise in the completed room? Where you able to suppress the fan noise or is it still loud/noisy? If it is still loud/noisy, could you state how much so? Does it distract from the movie experience? I am considering some speakers that require pro amplifiers and I might have no option but to place them in-room. Just looking for some feedback.
Kain, from this thread. Hope it helps.

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Greetings from Sochi...


Yes those 8 Sentinels are really noisy even when they are not feeding anything to the speakers, something I have to take when I return. Perhaps a thick dark glass pane or a double pane glass in front of the amps will help. Another problem with Sentinels is the heat they produce and they get their cold air from behind and pump it into the room from their front grills. I wish it was the other way around. Well, this what you get with pro equipment
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Please let me design the air cooling scheme for your rack. You will have to move the amps down and create suckout vents above taking air out back all behind the glass enclosure.
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I'm using my old custom made rack. Shelves will be reorganized to accommodate 2pcs https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1 to suck out the hot air which will be trapped behind the lass wall that will be placed in front of the Sentinel amps.
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Looks like the Glass panel is in. Very Patriotic color scheme.


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Very nice I've seen similar to those on some commercial cinema and concert racks and they will get the job done. Great pics the glass panes looks really cool. Rooms looking really really good!
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post #353 of 354 Old 08-28-2017, 03:07 PM
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Murat,

How is the amplifier fan noise in the completed room? Where you able to suppress the fan noise or is it still loud/noisy? If it is still loud/noisy, could you state how much so? Does it distract from the movie experience? I am considering some speakers that require pro amplifiers and I might have no option but to place them in-room. Just looking for some feedback.


Hi Kain,


Those sentinels are noisy for sure, but that glass panel in front of them helps a lot. I can not comment how much it suppresses as I didn't take any spl measurements. They can be still heard in the room when there is no noise in the room, but they are not distracting at all when you are watching a movie. I don't know what kind of pro amps you plan to use and how much fan noise they will generate, but if they are close to the noise levels of Sentinels you really don't want them in the room without making some sort of sound proofing cabinet with proper air circulation
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post #354 of 354 Old 08-29-2017, 12:09 PM
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Hi Kain,


Those sentinels are noisy for sure, but that glass panel in front of them helps a lot. I can not comment how much it suppresses as I didn't take any spl measurements. They can be still heard in the room when there is no noise in the room, but they are not distracting at all when you are watching a movie. I don't know what kind of pro amps you plan to use and how much fan noise they will generate, but if they are close to the noise levels of Sentinels you really don't want them in the room without making some sort of sound proofing cabinet with proper air circulation
Thank you.

The amps I am looking at are the Crown DCi 4|600N (max fan noise is 45 dB) and the Crown DCi 8|600N (max fan noise is 47 dB). I couldn't find anything on the fan noise specs of the Sentinel amps so I thought I would ask. The DCi amps are known to be quite efficient and have lower fan noise than most other pro amps. Any thoughts on how these fan noise specs compare to that of the Sentinel's?
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