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New dpi laser 4k

2K views 27 replies 7 participants last post by  ABSOLUTE ULTIMATE AV 
#1 ·
The HIGHlite Laser 4K @ $45,000 (3 chip DLP) looked great at CEDIA but I wished the showed a larger screen. Next door was the E-Vision Laser 4K @ $20,000 (single chip DLP). Again a small screen.

Both shipping "Q1 2017"

Curious as to why no comments. DPI use to be king of this high end group not so long ago.
 
#3 ·
It is hard to get info from DPI, they don't sent me any, and when I google next week's event to see what they are showing, Google shows a link, but DPI ****s it up. iitsec-2016
/
shows this instead:
http://www.digitalprojection.com/emea/ DPI always does this and then the info is not on that site anywhere. Sorry not worth messing with VPN's just to read some release or marketing announcement.

Christie has gotten slightly better at this, as it also used to lead one to pages without the promised information, just because of some random IP. Barco also lets one search three steps at least to finally arrive at the release.

Sony does issues releases, but when one tries to find the full release online one notices Sony blogs instead.

There are also plenty of companies that only sent releases to a handful of media/sites and then not include those in their own site's, Optoma and BenQ are recent examples.

So, Mike thanks for telling us about these new projectors. Hadn't seen any info on them yet. The latest upgrade to e-vision I had seen word on was 12KL. The earlier 25K 4K 3 DMD unit, DPI did not show at ISE, but when I stopped by there it turned out that AVStumpfl was using 4 of these in its 8K (processor/server) demo.
 
#4 · (Edited)
The HIGHlite Laser 4K @ $45,000 (3 chip DLP) looked great at CEDIA but I wished the showed a larger screen. Next door was the E-Vision Laser 4K @ $20,000 (single chip DLP). Again a small screen. Both shipping "Q1 2017" Curious as to why no comments. DPI use to be king of this high end group not so long ago.
One word: CONTRAST ;) These would have been great had the SONY VPL-VW5000ES and JVC DLA-RS4500 not existed... And whilst it's not of the same pricing bracket you may as well add the BARCO 6P LASER to that list as well, where despite its comparatively lower contrast its other performance aspects more than balance things out :)
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#5 ·
With the contrast mods the 6P (and Barco Xenon) look very good. I believe the trade off here (at least with the Barco) is Expanded Color vs HDR. I had a chance to see dual projector HDR (Sim), and have not seen anything close from Barco, Sony, or JVC (JVC did not show HDR but light output of single projector could not get the pop on a larger screen). The color on the Barco's are still the best I've seen. A dual JVC setup properly for HDR could be very interesting, time will tell.
 
#13 · (Edited)
The Highlite looks like it is using a WUXGA chip is there a 4k version? The Insight is 4K and based on the NEC cinema projector. Contrast ( on/off ) is at cinema level at best, the 4k chip is known for light scatter which reduces contrast unless serious contrast enhancements are incorporated.

The upcoming JVC's will have very high on/off with average ANSI. Stacking may drop the ANSI further. Not sure if aspect ratios will play nice with a 3 stack, that would be interesting to find out. This is an interesting concept.

The SIM2 HDR Duo is impressive. As mentioned one works the low end while the other handles the higher end. Interestingly one does not wash out the other but they are applying some secrete sauce they are not sharing.
The SIM2 HDR Duo puts out 8 to 9000 lumen's yet maintain's very deep black level's. I am not aware of any other consumer HDR projector that can match its performance. High on/off and ANSI on the screen at the same time with expanded dynamic range is eye popping. Legacy content benefits as well. Anyone wanting a demo I am in Fl. Note the SIM2 Duo is a 1080p system.

The Barco 6p uses spectral 3D. The lasers are in clusters, multiple sets of RGB running at once. The clusters can be dimmed. Dimming can have a a negative side effect. Black level and contrast are two different things it is possible to have high contrast yet poor black levels if the projector has to much light output. Depending on screen size a high contrast high brightness cinema projector may require light output to be knocked down or it still may not look very good. Contrast enhancement's will help but even when combined with dimming typically might still leave to much light on the screen. For those seriously into 3D you will appreciate the efficiency of spectral 3D.
If not into 3D then 6p laser ( not spectral ) allow's you run lasers at full power yet selectively powering on fewer RGB sets as another means of dimming.

All the above have pro's and con's, pick your poison :)
 
#17 ·
The Highlite looks like it is using a WUXGA chip is there a 4k version? The Insight is 4K and based on the NEC cinema projector. Contrast ( on/off ) is at cinema level at best, the 4k chip is known for light scatter which reduces contrast unless serious contrast enhancements are incorporated.

Units being released in March will be 4K chips.

Just got off the phone with DPI discussing a project.
 
#19 ·
The Highlite looks like it is using a WUXGA chip is there a 4k version? The Insight is 4K and based on the NEC cinema projector. Contrast ( on/off ) is at cinema level at best, the 4k chip is known for light scatter which reduces contrast unless serious contrast enhancements are incorporated. Units being released in March will be 4K chips. Just got off the phone with DPI discussing a project.
Thanks Mike!
 
#21 ·
I don't see how you are going to get "excellent" HDR with a 23' wide screen even with three JVC projectors running balls out. That is a gigantic amount of real estate to light up. I could probably get very good HDR on a 15' wide screen with 9,000 to 10,000 lumens but not 23' .HDR really requires one to lower the overall light you might get with SDR to get the great highlight effects of HDR. You're going to be getting about 115 nits in SDR with 10,000 lumens . I'm getting about 112 nits in SDR on a 14' wide screen with 1.3 gain of the Studiotech 130 and it's not enough light to do HDR any justice IMO.




Art
 
#23 · (Edited)
I don't see how you are going to get "excellent" HDR with a 23' wide screen even with three JVC projectors running balls out. That is a gigantic amount of real estate to light up. I could probably get very good HDR on a 15' wide screen with 9,000 to 10,000 lumens but not 23' .HDR really requires one to lower the overall light you might get with SDR to get the great highlight effects of HDR. You're going to be getting about 115 nits in SDR with 10,000 lumens . I'm getting about 112 nits in SDR on a 14' wide screen with 1.3 gain of the Studiotech 130 and it's not enough light to do HDR any justice IMO. Art
Thanks Art, you're absolutely right. Like I said, I'm looking to have my cake and eat it, but that target objective is something which is quite simply impossible to achieve at the moment... Wherein, I always like to think several steps ahead, and that's where I consider "excellent" HDR performance on a 7m/23ft wide screen resides... My realistic target and what I will be happy with achieving is over 30fL on a 7m/23ft wide screen, with 100% of DCI-P3 and 80% of BT.2020 WCG, and 'HDR-lite'... That's the realistic target that I am aiming for with respect to this particular home theater/cinema, and by my calculations a triple stack of the JVCs should achieve that
But I am considering many options at the moment, wherein that is just one of them... Where all of this of course is going to be reliant upon what is the actual performance of the JVC, which we don't know yet... And so I can't really firm up with respect to the JVC triple stack array until I have confirmed what is the JVC's real-world post-calibration performance with the DCI-P3 filter in place... where it's an idea that I am considering that could very well fall flat on its face depending on what performance the JVC actually delivers...

That said, I am more than open to suggestions with respect to what projector or combination of home theater projectors would produce the best image on a 7m/23ft wide screen as of right now ;):)
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#27 · (Edited)
I think it impossible to eliminate the blu hue on the jvc, blu L phosphors for me suck big time. Then there is the endemic Lack of spectra. YUCK! I am also opposed to the LCOS look, lcos has a bright future for doubling the light engines inside the one projector through one lens (incl 3d) I saw a prototype cinema unit from SONY which will not come to market as sony has bailed out of that market, but rumors abound about other less discriminating markets.

It is so damned easy to incorporate additional LIGHT ENGINES INSIDE ONE BOX because LCOS work on the principle of polarized light, a cinch, not so with trying to integrate multiple light engines within one projector for DLP, the Dolby patent.

I understand that in the foggy streets of London there is often a severe lack of spectra, and I am kidding because I have seen gorgeous colors by the serpentine from the flat at OHP, but you really need to take a vacation at Saint James Club in Barbados to internalize what you can absolutely not achieve with a JVC by virtue of the BLU-LP and the endemic anemic ansi LCOS have like a mild cataracts effect. If you want the most photorealistic least compromising option then the New Upcoming Christie stack is the way to go... but be warned you will fall if attempting to go to the loire during the occasional cavernous lack of light.

Brad Alan how can the sim2 method be used in Dolby Cinema and New Christie, I just don't see a way to have these profiled to do 3d right and then reformulate themselves one for dark and one for bright. I respectfully dispute that claim that sim2 method is akin to Dolby Cinemas, yes they look familiar to te eye effects-wise, but the 3d balance would be affected by the permanent cr. optics on the one projector.

Besides there is added bulk ounderneath the Dolby cinema shown above that is a second light engine within the projector. So Brad I think you are misinformed.

Not buying that.sorry :D.
 
#28 · (Edited)
Peter - I'll PM you to discuss the projector options further as it's off topic with respect to this thread...
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