Definitive Technology Mythos Series Thread - Page 43 - AVS Forum
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post #1261 of 5578 Old 09-20-2009, 04:24 PM
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Ok so I'm on this quest to figure out the best way to wire the Mythos St speakers. Not going to go into what brands to use and why , I have my reasons for using what I use and it will probably change in the next few months. But the goal is to figure out the best way to manage the wires with full usability and service.
I heard wrapping in the powercord can effect Imaging, thats not proven but I feel better with the power cord out of the loop.
Here is a few pic's of my new way. breakdown of parts used.
DH Labs Silver Sonic Silver 14-2 speaker wire.
Vienna Acoustic Custom Silver 90 degree Banana ends
Audioquest custom ITA 1.1 sub cable ( built by me)
TechFlex braid wrap(around the sub and speaker cable
Analsys Plus Heat Shrink Tubing.




Here is the original way I usually Do ST speakers and I also do this in the field with both ST and STS. I might start leaving the powercord out but I don't know if anything will change either way. I usually wire my racks and subs with the powercord at 90 degrees if I have to cross paths. I try not to manage them together when I can.
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post #1262 of 5578 Old 09-20-2009, 04:37 PM
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Nice, neat job, Mantis. I love techflex and always use it on car installs and at home when speaker wire shows.
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post #1263 of 5578 Old 09-20-2009, 06:11 PM
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I have to get some speaker connectors like those.... The plugs I have now don't hold onto the speaker wire very well. If I move them or disconnect the speaker to clean and such the plug usually comes off the wire.
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post #1264 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Ascen5sion View Post

I figure that they under rate them, there is no way my Elite at 130wpc can be on par with a krell or MC at the same wattage. I wouldn't be running balanced for awhile, maybe never so maybe krell isn't a good option.... It 5250doesn't run balanced.. The Halo line does though. I have only run balanced lines twice and both were in car applications with adcom amps running subs.... I was using a line driver so you had to run it so... I hones't probably couldn't tell the difference in that application, But I am curious how much of a difference it makes.

That A51 isn't cheap, but it is $2000 cheaper than the MC.

Hi Ascen5sion,

Sorry for the delayed reply, my weekend activities were calling me. Hope you had a good one as well.

As for running balanced, It can make a big difference but it does require a few things to do so. The whole purpose of running balances connections is to eliminate as much noise as possible from your system so that all you hear is the truest representation of the recording. In order to accomplish this you pretty much have to be balanced from start to finish. There are some products out there which offer XLR Balanced cable connections but do not make use of truelly balanced circuitry within thus negating somewhat the advantages of that interconnect type. The Halo gear from Parasound uses balanced circuitry as well as offering balanced interconnects and this make the Halo products an excellent value considering the cost of doing this. You also need to have speakers sensitive enough to distinguish the subtle difference in output and bring that difference to the forfront for you.

Ultimately I would say this. Balanced connections and circuitry do make a difference but you have to decide if the amount of improvement justifies the increased cost in your mind. I chose to go with the 5250 because in my mind the difference was not justified especially considering the other equipment I was running. Keep in mind that a good pre-amp will eliminate most of the noise in your system, My 7100 from Parasound does not use balanced interconnects but it is wisper quiet compared to when I was using my Pioneer 56Txi for a pre-amp.

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post #1265 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by NOLA View Post

Are most of you M1 owners setting your speakers to large or small? I have ones in the front and a subwoofer. My AVR sets the fronts to large which prevents the LFE from going to the sub when listening to music.

It depends on the sub but most of the time you are better off setting your fronts to large when listening to music. You won't generaly have the super deep effect driven base like you do with movies so the need for a sub under those cercumstances is deminished. Subs also have a hard time keeping pace with the music and can end up sounding slow and muddy. If you feel you are not getting the base response you want out of the Mythos Ones alone then you can try playing with the size settings and crossover in order to involve your sub when listening to music.

I agree with Mantis for setting the M1's to small in the case of Home Theater use but would leave them set to large for music for a while before switching and see which you prefer.

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post #1266 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 10:48 AM
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Hey all! I just got the 683's installed and now looking for add a center. It has to go on the mantel so i am limited in depth. The mytho's is perfect. B&W has one but is is 899 and not looking to spend that right now. thinking the 8 or 9 (i know, not much difference but looks like i can get for mid 500's off ebay)

i have read about matching... is it going to sound completely strange? I cant believe it is going to sound bad..

what do you think??
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post #1267 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 01:48 PM
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I have a pair of ST's and a pair of Gem XL's I plan to use for a 5.1 system, I couldn't pass up the deals out there right now on the silver Nine center, will matching the Nine as a center with the ST's matter much vs using the Ten which is meant to be used with the ST's?

As I understand it, the Nine is the upper half of the STS towers and the Ten is the upper half of the ST tower. Since the going price for silver Nine's is $399 right now and Ten's are $899, is the difference in performance not worth that price disparity?

I also read somewhere that a pair of Nine's + a super cube is the same as a pair of STS towers, is this true?
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post #1268 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by barsantee View Post

Hey all! I just got the 683's installed and now looking for add a center. It has to go on the mantel so i am limited in depth. The mytho's is perfect. B&W has one but is is 899 and not looking to spend that right now. thinking the 8 or 9 (i know, not much difference but looks like i can get for mid 500's off ebay)

i have read about matching... is it going to sound completely strange? I cant believe it is going to sound bad..

what do you think??

Hey Barsantee,

I wouldn't necessarily say that it would sound bad or strange to match a mythos 8 or 9 with your B&W's but it will be a compromise. I can't honestly say that I have heard Definitve with B&W so I can't say for sure how different these two speakers will sound when used together but this will have an effect on the transition of sound when moving from one speaker to the next in your system. The Mythos are excellent speakers but they are designed to match other Definitive Technology speakers. That being the case it is hard to recommend using them with your B&W's

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post #1269 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barsantee View Post

Hey all! I just got the 683's installed and now looking for add a center. It has to go on the mantel so i am limited in depth. The mytho's is perfect. B&W has one but is is 899 and not looking to spend that right now. thinking the 8 or 9 (i know, not much difference but looks like i can get for mid 500's off ebay)

i have read about matching... is it going to sound completely strange? I cant believe it is going to sound bad..

what do you think??

It may not be optimal, but it won't sound "bad." In fact, it may be surprisingly good, especially if you have an AVR with an auto EQ feature.

My daughter has a pair of Paradigm Studio 100's coupled with an older Infinity center (because it fits her available space, which Paradigm's massive matching centers didn't).

I keep wanting her to upgrade, but every time I listen to her setup, I can understand why she doesn't. By and large, you just don't notice the discrepancy. After MCACC did its magic, there is no apparent change when a movie pans the sound across the front three speakers. Music, which would probably be more telling, rarely uses the center as anything but filler (if at all), so that doesn't seem to be a problem either. She could use better dispersion, but that isn't too much of an issue in her house unless she has guests watching TV (not all that often).

I still would recommend matching the center to the fronts if possible, but sometime compromises are necessary. The only way you can tell for sure how well it would work is to try it in your room. Try to find a dealer with a good return policy in case you are not happy with the results. I've found with a little effort you can find one that will sell at eBay competitive prices. (I'd probably start by PMing Jeff. )
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post #1270 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barsantee View Post

Hey all! I just got the 683's installed and now looking for add a center. It has to go on the mantel so i am limited in depth. The mytho's is perfect. B&W has one but is is 899 and not looking to spend that right now. thinking the 8 or 9 (i know, not much difference but looks like i can get for mid 500's off ebay)

i have read about matching... is it going to sound completely strange? I cant believe it is going to sound bad..

what do you think??

Absolutely not. The center and main speakers should match perfectly. Going with a different brand is not a option if you want you system to sound correct. B&W and Def Tech sound very different. I would not mix the 2. If you like your B&W speakers , then get a B7W matching center channel. In ceiling also could be a suitable option. B&W makes excellent in ceiling speakers. Go that route.
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post #1271 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Axxis Audio Jeff View Post

It depends on the sub but most of the time you are better off setting your fronts to large when listening to music. You won't generaly have the super deep effect driven base like you do with movies so the need for a sub under those cercumstances is deminished. Subs also have a hard time keeping pace with the music and can end up sounding slow and muddy. If you feel you are not getting the base response you want out of the Mythos Ones alone then you can try playing with the size settings and crossover in order to involve your sub when listening to music.

I agree with Mantis for setting the M1's to small in the case of Home Theater use but would leave them set to large for music for a while before switching and see which you prefer.

When ever you feel this way about a sub matched for music, you have the wrong sub in your system. When building a system , you should carefully pick the correct pieces to make sure they match for what you wanna to do with your system. If theater is all you are going to do then a slower muddy sub "might" be the way to go. I call them 1 hit wonders. Make a lot of noise but nothing usable.

The Mythos 1's in small and a good musical sub is the perfect way to set them up for double duty. Then you have full control over them and you can clean them and not allow them to try to play notes they have no business doing so. They are rated to 20hz but I feel that number is incorrect. They don't have any usable output down there. This is where a good quality musical sub would come in.
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post #1272 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:41 PM
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I ordered four Mythos Ones, from 6ave during the name your price event, about a week and a half ago. I just called 6ave, as I haven't received a ship notice yet. The rep stated that they do not have the M1s yet.......(long pause as he is offering no more info). I ask, do you know when those might arrive in your warehouse......(another pause again this time), no sir I don't have an ETA on those.

CS didn't impress me, he sounded tired, and maybe I did call too close to quitting time.

This is my first time dealing with 6ave. Have those of you who have purchased from 6ave before, did you get great service, or just so so service?

Those that ordered M1s during the Name Your Price sale, did you receive your M1s yet?

Thanks for your input.
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post #1273 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantis10 View Post

When ever you feel this way about a sub matched for music, you have the wrong sub in your system. When building a system , you should carefully pick the correct pieces to make sure they match for what you wanna to do with your system. If theater is all you are going to do then a slower muddy sub "might" be the way to go. I call them 1 hit wonders. Make a lot of noise but nothing usable.

The Mythos 1's in small and a good musical sub is the perfect way to set them up for double duty. Then you have full control over them and you can clean them and not allow them to try to play notes they have no business doing so. They are rated to 20hz but I feel that number is incorrect. They don't have any usable output down there. This is where a good quality musical sub would come in.

Yup, it all depends on the sub.

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post #1274 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by awanders View Post

I ordered four Mythos Ones, from 6ave during the name your price event, about a week and a half ago. I just called 6ave, as I haven't received a ship notice yet. The rep stated that they do not have the M1s yet.......(long pause as he is offering no more info). I ask, do you know when those might arrive in your warehouse......(another pause again this time), no sir I don't have an ETA on those.

CS didn't impress me, he sounded tired, and maybe I did call too close to quitting time.

This is my first time dealing with 6ave. Have those of you who have purchased from 6ave before, did you get great service, or just so so service?

Those that ordered M1s during the Name Your Price sale, did you receive your M1s yet?

Thanks for your input.

I ordered a Denon AVR 2310 from 6ave a month or so ago. It was never listed as back ordered on their Website. After a week of no shipping notice I called and found out they didn't have any and had no idea of an ETA. It ended up being about 2 1/2 weeks before it shipped but in the end I got it. I guess sometimes getting a good price forces you to wait a bit when it comes to 6ave.

Hopefully for you things move more quickly.
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post #1275 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 04:02 PM
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Over the last few pages I've seen a lot of people really jumping on the M one's with the great prices out there right now. I had the opportunity to demo the one's this weekend along with ST's and the difference was shocking. The ST's almost made the One's sound like stock television speakers when both listened to side by side. I had the rep use the same Denon 2310 receiver for both since that is what I have at home.

If you are looking for a good deal I'd almost spend the $400 and get silver nine's instead of one's after listening to them since they can be had for about 50% off MSRP right now just like the One's.

The Balanced Double Surround System (BDSS) drivers found in the ST, STS, Nine's and Ten really make a difference in the overall sound quality not to mention the newer tweeter they also have.

For anyone jumping on the ones right now, make sure you audition them prior to buying them because they definitely are not ST's or STS's.
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post #1276 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awanders View Post

I ordered four Mythos Ones, from 6ave during the name your price event, about a week and a half ago. I just called 6ave, as I haven't received a ship notice yet. The rep stated that they do not have the M1s yet.......(long pause as he is offering no more info). I ask, do you know when those might arrive in your warehouse......(another pause again this time), no sir I don't have an ETA on those.

CS didn't impress me, he sounded tired, and maybe I did call too close to quitting time.

This is my first time dealing with 6ave. Have those of you who have purchased from 6ave before, did you get great service, or just so so service?

Those that ordered M1s during the Name Your Price sale, did you receive your M1s yet?

Thanks for your input.

I think there are quite a few of us on this board in the same situation as you. I've spent some time researching this issue, and deftech is phasing out the entire silver Mythos line. They still have almost all of the Mythos silver line in stock in their warehouse but they won't be making any more. 6ave doesn't know when they will get more but the speakers are backordered and when I mentioned that deftech discontinued the line they confirmed that they will be receiving more and our orders will be filled, but the person may have said that because they didn't know any better...

I've decided I don't think it's worth worrying about this anymore and I'll just wait for 2 weeks to see if the status changes.

If anyone that ordered from 6ave gets their speakers or finds out any more information please post it here!
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post #1277 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Axxis Audio Jeff View Post

Hi Ascen5sion,

Sorry for the delayed reply, my weekend activities were calling me. Hope you had a good one as well.

As for running balanced, It can make a big difference but it does require a few things to do so. The whole purpose of running balances connections is to eliminate as much noise as possible from your system so that all you hear is the truest representation of the recording. In order to accomplish this you pretty much have to be balanced from start to finish. There are some products out there which offer XLR Balanced cable connections but do not make use of truelly balanced circuitry within thus negating somewhat the advantages of that interconnect type. The Halo gear from Parasound uses balanced circuitry as well as offering balanced interconnects and this make the Halo products an excellent value considering the cost of doing this. You also need to have speakers sensitive enough to distinguish the subtle difference in output and bring that difference to the forfront for you.

Ultimately I would say this. Balanced connections and circuitry do make a difference but you have to decide if the amount of improvement justifies the increased cost in your mind. I chose to go with the 5250 because in my mind the difference was not justified especially considering the other equipment I was running. Keep in mind that a good pre-amp will eliminate most of the noise in your system, My 7100 from Parasound does not use balanced interconnects but it is wisper quiet compared to when I was using my Pioneer 56Txi for a pre-amp.



No worries . When you talk about noise are you talking about the hissing at very loud volumes?? Sort of like back in the day when you played tapes at high volumes... Definitely appreciate the input on the Parasound. I don't know if I can wait till tax time lol, I am missing having an external amp already...
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post #1278 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 05:33 PM
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You mentioned that I should start PM'ing Jeff.... Who is jeff?


thanks!
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post #1279 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Ascen5sion View Post

No worries . When you talk about noise are you talking about the hissing at very loud volumes?? Sort of like back in the day when you played tapes at high volumes... Definitely appreciate the input on the Parasound. I don't know if I can wait till tax time lol, I am missing having an external amp already...

Yup, that hum/hiss you hear when you turn up the volume without a source playing is always there in the background of what you are listening to. When you eliminate that noise it makes a huge difference in the performance of your system.

I know what you mean about not wanting to wait... Gotta be careful, with this stuff you can get into trouble real quick! lol.

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post #1280 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by jcbudnyjr View Post

Over the last few pages I've seen a lot of people really jumping on the M one's with the great prices out there right now. I had the opportunity to demo the one's this weekend along with ST's and the difference was shocking. The ST's almost made the One's sound like stock television speakers when both listened to side by side. I had the rep use the same Denon 2310 receiver for both since that is what I have at home.

If you are looking for a good deal I'd almost spend the $400 and get silver nine's instead of one's after listening to them since they can be had for about 50% off MSRP right now just like the One's.

The Balanced Double Surround System (BDSS) drivers found in the ST, STS, Nine's and Ten really make a difference in the overall sound quality not to mention the newer tweeter they also have.

For anyone jumping on the ones right now, make sure you audition them prior to buying them because they definitely are not ST's or STS's.

I do agree with you that the STS pretty much destroy the Mythos 1's in every way but without the STS in the room, the Mythos 1's are very impressive. I also have demo'd them over and over again and as good as the STS are at everything they do, the 1's are a very good sounding speaker. What I noticed with them is setup. Setup setup setup setup. This is the key to them. Most wanna run them in "large" setting. I disagree. They sound much better with a small setting , 60hz crossover and a killer bottom end sub thats quick and musical. In this setup the STS now got something to worry about.
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post #1281 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 06:19 PM
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I've just about decided to pair some One's with a Rythmik sub and I expect the difference between that setup and STS's to be well less than a night and day difference. While the One's certainly don't dig as deep as the STS they offer more placement flexibility which could ultimately translate to better sound.
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post #1282 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by barsantee View Post

You mentioned that I should start PM'ing Jeff.... Who is jeff?


thanks!

See the post just before the one where I said that... or the one just after your post quoted above. (Jeff Sprowls aka "Axxis Audio Jeff")
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post #1283 of 5578 Old 09-21-2009, 11:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcbudnyjr View Post

Over the last few pages I've seen a lot of people really jumping on the M one's with the great prices out there right now. I had the opportunity to demo the one's this weekend along with ST's and the difference was shocking. The ST's almost made the One's sound like stock television speakers when both listened to side by side. I had the rep use the same Denon 2310 receiver for both since that is what I have at home.

If you are looking for a good deal I'd almost spend the $400 and get silver nine's instead of one's after listening to them since they can be had for about 50% off MSRP right now just like the One's.

The Balanced Double Surround System (BDSS) drivers found in the ST, STS, Nine's and Ten really make a difference in the overall sound quality not to mention the newer tweeter they also have.

For anyone jumping on the ones right now, make sure you audition them prior to buying them because they definitely are not ST's or STS's.

Lets not forget that the STS are 1500 each and the ST are 2000 each. I think most people looking at the discounted M1s aren't the target market for the STS/ST, or at least I wasn't...

And a lot depends on the sub used with the M1s. Comparing the STS with a Nine against an M1/M8 setup without a sub or without a proper crossover point is a very biased comparison.
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post #1284 of 5578 Old 09-22-2009, 04:21 AM
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I've just about decided to pair some One's with a Rythmik sub and I expect the difference between that setup and STS's to be well less than a night and day difference. While the One's certainly don't dig as deep as the STS they offer more placement flexibility which could ultimately translate to better sound.

I run the one's with a reference sub and I am very happy. I never had the opportunity to run the ST's next to the ones so I don't know how much better they sound. The only time I heard the ST's they were running with a large sub.. IMO I would rather have the M1's with the reference over the ST's alone.. I suppose the ST's must sound better considering they use a different midrange driver and tweeter I believe. Anyhow I am happy enough with the M1's (imaging is good) and a seperate sub not to feel this driving need to upgrade to the ST's anytime soon. I think you will be happy.
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post #1285 of 5578 Old 09-22-2009, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by awanders View Post

I ordered four Mythos Ones, from 6ave during the name your price event, about a week and a half ago. I just called 6ave, as I haven't received a ship notice yet. The rep stated that they do not have the M1s yet.......(long pause as he is offering no more info). I ask, do you know when those might arrive in your warehouse......(another pause again this time), no sir I don't have an ETA on those.

CS didn't impress me, he sounded tired, and maybe I did call too close to quitting time.

This is my first time dealing with 6ave. Have those of you who have purchased from 6ave before, did you get great service, or just so so service?

Those that ordered M1s during the Name Your Price sale, did you receive your M1s yet?

Thanks for your input.

I ordered 3 speakers from 6th ave in July during one of those name your price sale. 2 of them came within the week. The last was out of stock and did not ship for about 2 weeks. I did call them once, and them simply stated they were out of stock at the moment, but they would ship soon. In the end, I received everything, and it was very well packaged. My advice is just to have patience with them. Based on my experience, they seem a little undermanned for these sales, but will come through eventually.
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post #1286 of 5578 Old 09-22-2009, 07:44 AM
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This is what I was told by CS -

"Thanks for your e-mail. In regards to your inquiry, we sincerely apologize but we do not have an ETA; we expect it maybe within 2 weeks. Thanks."

For the price I'm fine with a little wait, but my main concern is them coming back and saying they aren't getting anymore silvers since I'm going to be craigslisting all my current speakers as soon as these ship.
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post #1287 of 5578 Old 09-22-2009, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veekay View Post

This is what I was told by CS -

"Thanks for your e-mail. In regards to your inquiry, we sincerely apologize but we do not have an ETA; we expect it maybe within 2 weeks. Thanks."

For the price I'm fine with a little wait, but my main concern is them coming back and saying they aren't getting anymore silvers since I'm going to be craigslisting all my current speakers as soon as these ship.

I'm stuck in this holding pattern too. They keep assuring me they're getting more in but I'm going to be severely irked if they end up not getting more and I don't find out until OneCall and HiDef are all sold out as well.
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post #1288 of 5578 Old 09-22-2009, 08:26 AM
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Thanks to all for your reply. I will wait patiently. The prices were really good, so I can't really complain. I just wanted to make sure others have received their orders from 6ave.

I will post back when mine ships.
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post #1289 of 5578 Old 09-23-2009, 07:24 AM
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I have been scouring replies about people's setups for the mythos series, but I was wondering how the setup of 2 Mythos One speakers for the Front L/R and then 2 Mythos Five speakers for the Rear surround. I am also thinking about getting Mythos Three for a center and then ED A3-300 for a sub.

My question is will the Mythos Five speakers sound good for the rear surround? I would like towers for the rear, so if the Mythos Five wouldn't sound good, I would upgrade to Mythos Ones for the rear. Since that is a few hundred dollars extra, I would probably have to sacrifice on getting a cheaper sub. I'm on a budget of around 2k, so that's the reason for the question. Sorry for asking a newb question. Thanks.
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post #1290 of 5578 Old 09-23-2009, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr7perfect View Post

I have been scouring replies about people's setups for the mythos series, but I was wondering how the setup of 2 Mythos One speakers for the Front L/R and then 2 Mythos Five speakers for the Rear surround. I am also thinking about getting Mythos Three for a center and then ED A3-300 for a sub.

My question is will the Mythos Five speakers sound good for the rear surround? I would like towers for the rear, so if the Mythos Five wouldn't sound good, I would upgrade to Mythos Ones for the rear. Since that is a few hundred dollars extra, I would probably have to sacrifice on getting a cheaper sub. I'm on a budget of around 2k, so that's the reason for the question. Sorry for asking a newb question. Thanks.

Conventional wisdom here would be to match the drivers. In other words, go for the Ones all around. I agree with that concept in theory, but fiscal realities must be addressed in the real world. Unfortunately, compromises have to be accepted by most of us.

All the Mythos speakers are voice matched, and blend very well together. The Fives would certainly sound good in your proposed setup. They lack some of the fullness of the Ones, and could run out of steam trying to keep up if played very loudly in large rooms, but this would barely be noticeable in "normal" use, especially, as surrounds.

Given the choice you pose, I'd go with the Fives and the better sub. Either approach entails compromises, but I think you'd find a weaker sub more disappointing in the long run than the Fives vs Ones in the rear.

I expect there will be disagreement posted, though.
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