**Official EMP Owner's Thread** - Page 209 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6241 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Thats exactly what I was expecting :-) for the room to rock..
I have x2100w Denon receiver. Should have enough juice i thought.
Will try with less toe in..
Does that have anything with the fact that these are 6ohm speakers while the surrounds are 8ohms?
yes, you have plenty of power. I doubt the 6/8ohm is the reason why your system isn't getting loud.
How high is your ceiling? Not sure what is wrong, but something is amiss. When you run Audessy, what levels/distances does it set your speakers at? Nice room, btw...

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and EMP e5Bi surrounds, Outlaw LFM1 Plus sub, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: Philharmonics- BMR in a 2.0 system, music only
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post #6242 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Thats exactly what I was expecting :-) for the room to rock..
I have x2100w Denon receiver. Should have enough juice i thought.
Will try with less toe in..
Does that have anything with the fact that these are 6ohm speakers while the surrounds are 8ohms?
I would pick up an SPL meter and see how loud your room is getting. That would be the first step in troubleshooting because your amp has plenty of power for these speakers.
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post #6243 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post
yes, you have plenty of power. I doubt the 6/8ohm is the reason why your system isn't getting loud.
How high is your ceiling? Not sure what is wrong, but something is amiss. When you run Audessy, what levels/distances does it set your speakers at? Nice room, btw...
Thanks Elihawk.
Ceilings are 8ft. attached are the Audyssey results. I tweaked them a bit to bump up the Sub and the Center by 2dbs after.
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7.1 HT Setup: EMPTek E55Ti (L&R), E56Ci (Center), E5Bi (side and rear surrounds), SVS PB-2000, DENON AVR x2100W, BENQ W1070, SilverTicket 110" screen
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post #6244 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenA07 View Post
I would pick up an SPL meter and see how loud your room is getting. That would be the first step in troubleshooting because your amp has plenty of power for these speakers.
Thanks, will read up on using the SPL meter, never used it. will pick one up over the weekend.
One thing i did not mention is that the surround sound is pretty good, its just the front stage that seems to be the problem.

7.1 HT Setup: EMPTek E55Ti (L&R), E56Ci (Center), E5Bi (side and rear surrounds), SVS PB-2000, DENON AVR x2100W, BENQ W1070, SilverTicket 110" screen
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post #6245 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Thanks Elihawk.
Ceilings are 8ft. attached are the Audyssey results. I tweaked them a bit to bump up the Sub and the Center by 2dbs after.
If you’ve done the following when running Audyssey, then ignore this post.

1. Make sure you use a tripod. Better yet, a boom with the mic attached at the end. Stand off to the side and keep yourself out of the soundstage area. Make sure each mic position is less than 2 feet away from the previous position. Keep the mic within the soundstage area when positioning.
2. After running the first mic position, check on the subwoofer trim level in the menu. It should read between -3 and -6 or -6 and -9 (I use the latter and run my sub 4 or 5 dB hot, others use the former). Adjust the gain level on the sub and redo the first test until you see those numbers. I’m surprised that your subwoofer distance was calculated at only 10.3 ft. I think that should be more than your front speakers, say like 15 feet (the sub number isn’t really a matter of distance, it’s a matter Audyssey considering the time delay of the sub). Anyway, once you are satisfied with the subwoofer trim level, redo Audyssey from the start and go through all 6 or 8 positions (depending upon your level of Audyssey).
3. Take note of how Audyssey has setup each speaker and subwoofer and write all the numbers down. Also check to see where Audyssey has crossed over your speakers/subwoofer. Make sure your speakers are set to "small". If unhappy, adjust to your preferences.
4. Anytime you add, subtract or move furniture in the room, or adjust speaker/subwoofer locations, rerun Audyssey.
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Movie area: EMP Tek R5Bi, RBH/EMP Tek R55Ti, PSA S3000i, Denon X2000, Oppo BDP 83.
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post #6246 of 6258 Old Yesterday, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Thanks.
LR speakers are actually in line with the center and about 1.5 ft away from side and rear walls. I had done those changes after the picture was taken.
When you say calibrate each speaker separately, what do you mean.. sorry, only thing that I have done so far for calibration is used the Audyssey method. can you please elaborate how I would do that? BTW, i have a Denon x2100w receiver not Yamaha.

You got me here, these are my first set of "real" home theater speakers :-) Was using a Sony HTiB 5.1 system before..
You can follow above steps by dsrussell's method. But here is the old fashion way to do it manually.

Have spl meter and set it to 75db or C weighted and slow response.

1. Play test tone and while seated in your MLP point the spl meter at 45 degrees toward celing whole time and do not make any sounds.....turn up your main volume knob til it reads 75db on the meter and then don't touch that volume knob anymore. (make sure the spl meter is pointed in same direction and in same spot for each channel in the ceiling, do not point it at the speaker)
2. Play the test tones on your Denon and adjust the left/right/center/surrounds levels only to 75 db. So if its reading 77db on left speaker then you turn left speaker level down in the denon to 75db and repeat for all speakers. Goal here is to get each speaker exactly or close to the same.
3. For the subwoofer you want to turn up the subwoofer's amp volume to 75db or little more than 75 depending on your taste when running sub test tone.
4. Double check and play each test tone (while maintaining same spl meter position for all channels) to make sure it all is 75db and check your distance/delays for your speakers in feet where you sit and make sure its correct.

Also check your crossover settings and run all your speakers to small and crossover at 80hz and make sure sub itself is set at bypass or highest setting.

This is how we manually do this since some of us have older avr and preamps that do not have audessey/ypao, etc.

Let us know if this helps!

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post #6247 of 6258 Old Today, 04:41 AM
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Thanks for all the inputs. I think I have some experimentation to do this weekend. Will report what I find.
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post #6248 of 6258 Old Today, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Agree. But i pretty much have to be in the -10 to -5db area for any movie content. Not sure if being this close to reference is a good thing, in terms of causing any danger to the receiver itself?
Yes, i played around with the front speaker positions. I have the center turned a little upwards with a wedge. The LR speakers are toed in (as in pointing to the MLP) and about 1.5ft away from the side and back walls (based on other posts i read on the forum).
Are you suggesting I should toe out, as in point them towards the side walls? let me know if i got it correct..
Yeah, that just seems to be where this setup is. I had a Yamaha before the Denon and I'd run it around -10. With the 2100, I run it much closer to reference. If you don't like it running it at reference, you can always change the scale.

I wouldn't worry about it unless it's getting really hot.
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post #6249 of 6258 Old Today, 05:27 AM
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I would wager those two seats in front of the sofa are playing a big part in the sound quality as well. You mention hearing the sound in front of you moreso than immersing you, it could be reflections from those seats. Generally you don't want anything between you and the speakers, I would pull them out and just leave the main sofa in there. Perhaps move it up a few feet as well so you are sitting closer.

Re-run Audyssey after doing this and see how things sound. I sit 10 feet away and generally listen at about -15dB with a weaker receiver and I often find myself turning it down in loud scenes.

You may also want to check Audyssey Dynamic EQ and Volume, they modify the sound for different purposes like reducing background noise and enhancing dialogue and surround effects. For a dedicated space you may want to turn these off and see how things sound.

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post #6250 of 6258 Old Today, 05:35 AM
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Hmm.. never thought about the 2 seats. Thanks for the tip. Will try that as well.
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post #6251 of 6258 Unread Today, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Hi folks,
Wanted to get some feedback from E55Ti and E56Ci users. I have them as my fronts and the E5Bi as the 4 surrounds.
What I feel is the front stage is not loud enough and seems far (in front) from the MLP.
My full set up is in my signature.
My MLP is about 14ft from the screen and the room is 12ft X 22ft.

Have anyone went through the same or have similar experience?
I have gone through calibrating using Audyssey multiple times, did the subwoofer crawl to place it correctly. Everything that I can think of and was suggested on this forum.

Would appreciate any input..
What are your final Audyssey settings? (Flat/Movie) / (Dynamic EQ, is it on/off) (Dynamic Volume, is it kight med, high). I have an Onkyo so my setting naming my be a little different.
Do you have any intelligent leveling compensation set. (usually a level offset for each source)
Is it low for each source? Blu Ray, TV, etc.
What sound process setting do you use (direct, Dolby, DTS, source seting, etc...)
Have you performed factory reset on the receiver?
Just trying to eliminate any setting issue.
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post #6252 of 6258 Unread Today, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post
What are your final Audyssey settings? (Flat/Movie) / (Dynamic EQ, is it on/off) (Dynamic Volume, is it kight med, high). I have an Onkyo so my setting naming my be a little different.
Do you have any intelligent leveling compensation set. (usually a level offset for each source)
Is it low for each source? Blu Ray, TV, etc.
What sound process setting do you use (direct, Dolby, DTS, source seting, etc...)
Have you performed factory reset on the receiver?
Just trying to eliminate any setting issue.
hi cadett.

1. Movie
2. Dynamic EQ On, Dynamic volume - Medium
3. No level offset for each source
4. Sound processing is based on source.
5. A few times, infact did a reset last week before I reran audyssey.

7.1 HT Setup: EMPTek E55Ti (L&R), E56Ci (Center), E5Bi (side and rear surrounds), SVS PB-2000, DENON AVR x2100W, BENQ W1070, SilverTicket 110" screen
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post #6253 of 6258 Unread Today, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by bgtighe23 View Post
If you want the EMP surrounds, now is the time to get them.
http://emptek.com/bs7661212368RR.php
Nice. I canceled my order for the R5Bi in favor of the Energy CB-10(only $100) and kind of regretted it. I just ordered a scratch and dent pair of R5Bi, just to quell my curiosity. Whichever I like least will be moved to rear surrounds so I can retire my Micros completely.
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post #6254 of 6258 Unread Today, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahulp001 View Post
Hmm.. never thought about the 2 seats. Thanks for the tip. Will try that as well.
yes, I am guilty of this as well...my second row couch is at the same "level" as my front theater speakers and you can hear difference in SQ. If you, or I want a second row, the seats should really be up on risers to get those ears above the front seating...

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and EMP e5Bi surrounds, Outlaw LFM1 Plus sub, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: Philharmonics- BMR in a 2.0 system, music only
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post #6255 of 6258 Unread Today, 12:14 PM
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If it's not your listening level, then it would be great if you can try with different AVR to eliminate each variable.
The Emptek system does play loud (again, depending on personal preference) in my sis's family room. It is a big room with cathedral ceiling.
The AVR is Yamaha TSR-7790, MV (master volume) set at -20dB.
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post #6256 of 6258 Unread Today, 12:24 PM
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Yeah, my Yamaha was significantly louder, but YPAO is so different from Audyssey. Plus it was about 5 years old, other than that fairly equivalent to the Denon x2100.

It really doesn't matter though what level you run a receiver if it isn't baking. I think the Denon sounds more subdued than the Yamaha. It could be that my ears a bit clogged up too, but the wife doesn't complain (much).
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post #6257 of 6258 Unread Today, 01:18 PM
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I too have noticed that my Yamaha sets my speakers "hotter" than my Denon. After a little play with speaker toe in and subwoofer gain, I reran YAPO recently and now, I won't go much below -20 dB. The Yamaha VX373 is now 5 years old and will likely be replaced soon, but I actually prefer it to my Denon (x1100)...

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and EMP e5Bi surrounds, Outlaw LFM1 Plus sub, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: Philharmonics- BMR in a 2.0 system, music only
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post #6258 of 6258 Unread Today, 01:43 PM
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I have the 867, so 2 years older than the 73 as I recall. I wonder if YPAO is the same on all the Yamahas? The Denons have different versions of Audyssey depending on which model you get. I really wanted to try the Denon/Audyssey since I have heard so much about it on the avrant podcast. $299 at a4l for the x2100 was too good a deal to pass up.
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