**Official EMP Owner's Thread** - Page 121 - AVS Forum
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post #3601 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by whitedwarf View Post
Dedicated theatre room, with a single row of seats so would leave room at the back for 2 rear surrounds. Only for movie watching, no music.

My budget is probably more like $1500, but I'm looking to get the best bang for buck and going over various options.

Room is 4.5m long and 3.8m wide, pretty sure that's 15x12 (Sorry, coming from a non-US metric country )
That changes things. You may only have a choice of SVS (which is a great choice).
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post #3602 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post
It's always hard to factor in the cost of stands into a bookshelf price because you don't know if they even need stands, what stand they might think are ugly, etc. Hard to say if $50 stands will work for a pair or is it going to be adding $100/pr for stands. Your first setup of 3 towers for LCR makes me think you're using a transparent screen so you'll likely need stands
Yep, it's going behind a transparent screen into a recess wall, so how ugly a stand is won't matter really.

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In a room as small as yours, I'd be looking at a 5.1 system first. A room is considered small if it has a total cubic footage of no more than 1,500 cu. ft. (your room falls into that if you have 8 foot high ceilings). One can always add later on. For instance, right now I have a 3.1 system hooked up, and will add the surrounds later on when I get the ambition to run cables through the walls and above the ceiling. Once I do get the surrounds, I may opt for the inexpensive E3b's, but may go for the E5Bi's there as well (haven't decided yet -- it will depend upon how obtrusive they look on the wall, as much as anything else).

Since your room is small, your subwoofer requirements will be reasonable ones. At a minimum, I'd be looking at the SVS SB-1000 (sealed -- it should provide nice extension in your room), or the SVS PB-1000 (ported -- more output at around the 20 Hz level). It all depends upon what you are seeking. For mostly movies and getting as much slam and shaking within your room, I'd go ported. For mostly music, I may choose sealed because of the much smaller size. Price of admission = $500 per sub.

The number of subs depends upon how large your seating area is. Multiple subs allows for a more even and smoother bass response at a wider and deeper area. If you are only concerned about a couple of seats placed closely (like a couch), a single sub should give you that if placed properly.

Other high-quality subwoofers to look at are Outlaw Audio LFM-1Ex when it goes on sale. Hsu and Reaction Audio have several under $800 that will shake things up amazingly well. PSA has the XS15se (their lowest priced sub @ $800) that would be a monster in your small area. Note that both PSA and SVS prices include shipping to your home and shipping back to their factory (if not satisfied) during their trial periods. Hsu charges for shipping, but are priced accordingly (very reasonable prices). Reaction Audio includes shipping to your home. Check Outlaw Audio for their policy.
Ceilings are 9ft. I really like the look of the SB-1000, and a decent shout at $500, thanks for the recommendation.
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post #3603 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 03:08 PM
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So you're non-US? Where are you located? Not sure what's available in other places

Or did you just come here from a non-US place?

Panny 65st60 / Denon X1000 / EMP e55ti / EMP e56ci / EMP e5bi / (2) e1010i
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post #3604 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 03:24 PM
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Comparing a tower speaker with multiple drivers and a full sized cabinet to a bookshelf is never a fair game. I have owned the Pioneer bookshelves (bought them, returned them to Best Buy) and I just couldn't make them sound good and I felt the bass was poor and muddy. In my opinion they had lots of inaccurate bass, decent midrange and not very good highs.

Now, all EMPtek speakers have EXCELLENT midrange, are purposely light on the bass and have decent and slightly recessed highs (and the highs can be EQ'd to sound pretty damn good). The EMP can be described as a very detailed and accurate speaker and doesn't try to hit lows that some budget speaker can, but poorly.

If you were determined to have a theater with no subwoofer, the Pioneers towers are the way to go...but even then you miss alot of low content. Sounds like you are looking at subs, so IMHO, the EMP bookshelf speakers x 5 (I am pretty sure you can get a odd number of bookshelves by special request, otherwise, the smaller center would be second best) and the SVS sub is going to give you a great system at that price range!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
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post #3605 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post
So you're non-US? Where are you located? Not sure what's available in other places

Or did you just come here from a non-US place?
I'm in Australia, but my wife's brother lives in the US and forwards me stuff

Thanks again for the advice everyone, now let's hope for a BF sale!
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post #3606 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 03:49 PM
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5 RBH R5's and a VTF-15H ($800 right now at HSU..watch for a lower price or closeouts since they've got an MK2 now)...

That's like $1400 and would knock your socks off. That sub would absolutely destroy your room haha


Another thought...pick up 3 RBH r5C's (so you'll have multiple 5 1/4" drivers; greater efficiency, less comb, etc) 2 R5's and the VTF-15H. Probably put you around $1500 and have a slightly more dynamic front stage. Hate to say this, but the ARX A2 would be on my list also. 3 of those up front, with the A1's in back wouldn't be bad at all either.

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post #3607 of 3729 Old 11-14-2014, 06:29 PM
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The VTF-15 is a beast. I was very close to buying it for myself, and think I would have likely loved it. It's a great option at your budget. My room is 12 X 11 and I've got the SVS PC12+ in there. I promise you a sub of that size (if you're not familiar it is around the same size as the VTF-15) in a room that small is impressive.

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post #3608 of 3729 Old 11-15-2014, 08:34 AM
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Shipping a Hsu VTF-15 to Australia might take the value out of that proposition lol.
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post #3609 of 3729 Old 11-15-2014, 10:17 AM
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No idea what they have available in Australia though..

Panny 65st60 / Denon X1000 / EMP e55ti / EMP e56ci / EMP e5bi / (2) e1010i
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post #3610 of 3729 Old 11-15-2014, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post
5 RBH R5's and a VTF-15H ($800 right now at HSU..watch for a lower price or closeouts since they've got an MK2 now)...

That's like $1400 and would knock your socks off. That sub would absolutely destroy your room haha


Another thought...pick up 3 RBH r5C's (so you'll have multiple 5 1/4" drivers; greater efficiency, less comb, etc) 2 R5's and the VTF-15H. Probably put you around $1500 and have a slightly more dynamic front stage. Hate to say this, but the ARX A2 would be on my list also. 3 of those up front, with the A1's in back wouldn't be bad at all either.
+1 that would be a hell of a setup for the money
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post #3611 of 3729 Old 11-16-2014, 06:52 PM
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Is it safe to say maybe we should merge this with the RBH thread now guys?
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post #3612 of 3729 Old 11-18-2014, 06:52 PM
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As much as I like my EMPtek 10i10i, I pulled the trigger on an Outlaw LFM-1 today. 449.00 shipped was just to good to pass up. The EMP system will eventually move upstairs, as goal #2 of the upgrade is to get a front stage with ribbon tweeters for my theater room! Man, this hobby ain't cheap!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #3613 of 3729 Old 11-18-2014, 08:20 PM
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Congratulations, Elihawk! I hope the Outlaw works well for you. Are you thinking about the Ascends or the Philharmonitors ... or do you have something else in mind?
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post #3614 of 3729 Old 11-18-2014, 09:21 PM
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I would love to have the Ascends...but also considering the cheaper HTD level 3, I will have to check on the return policy.
The black Friday Outlaw special is rumored to be while supplies last, as the LFM-1 is being replaced. I didn't want to miss out on the 449.00 w/ free shipping special!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #3615 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post
As much as I like my EMPtek 10i10i, I pulled the trigger on an Outlaw LFM-1 today. 449.00 shipped was just to good to pass up. The EMP system will eventually move upstairs, as goal #2 of the upgrade is to get a front stage with ribbon tweeters for my theater room! Man, this hobby ain't cheap!
Congrats! You will get some really nice extension over the 1010i with that Outlaw.

Have you considered DIY for your theater room? You can get the SEOS kits with flat packs and assembled crossovers from DIY Sound Group for $200-300, and they will offer JTR-level performance at a fraction of the cost. Also, high efficiency speakers have great sensitivity, and almost any ordinary receiver can get you up to reference levels easily. Since it's a theater room, you could hide them behind an AT screen or just go with a flat black finish, and keep the sexier EMPs on display

Denon AVR-1713 | EMP E55Ti | EMP E56Ci | EMP E5Bi | BIC F-12
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post #3616 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post
As much as I like my EMPtek 10i10i, I pulled the trigger on an Outlaw LFM-1 today. 449.00 shipped was just to good to pass up. The EMP system will eventually move upstairs, as goal #2 of the upgrade is to get a front stage with ribbon tweeters for my theater room! Man, this hobby ain't cheap!
The LFM-1EX or Plus? If the EX is down to $450 that's crazy!

Make sure you post up how you like the Outlaw sub, comparison to the EMP, etc etc. I'm sure it'll kill the EMP in raw SPL, but I'm hoping the EMP can still sound decently as far as sound quality when that comparison happens.

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I would love to have the Ascends...but also considering the cheaper HTD level 3, I will have to check on the return policy.
The black Friday Outlaw special is rumored to be while supplies last, as the LFM-1 is being replaced. I didn't want to miss out on the 449.00 w/ free shipping special!
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Originally Posted by Transmaniacon View Post
Congrats! You will get some really nice extension over the 1010i with that Outlaw.

Have you considered DIY for your theater room? You can get the SEOS kits with flat packs and assembled crossovers from DIY Sound Group for $200-300, and they will offer JTR-level performance at a fraction of the cost. Also, high efficiency speakers have great sensitivity, and almost any ordinary receiver can get you up to reference levels easily. Since it's a theater room, you could hide them behind an AT screen or just go with a flat black finish, and keep the sexier EMPs on display
I can't recommend the HTD Level 3 after realizing it has a 2" midrange crossed at 725/18dB. Even the plots during the $1,000 speaker shootout showed the midrange to be a little 'meh', with 'hot' or exaggerated bass/midbass and a rising treble. Pretty much like a Klipsch speaker. That's pretty darn low for a 2" dome to go though. How many 2" or even 3" or 4" midranges do you see on high dollar and/or high quality speakers?

I'm with Trans on the DIY route. Something like the Fusion 10 or 1099's seem to be a huge hit if you have the time, skills and products to assemble and finish/paint. I think you can even buy the x-over's assembled now so mainly finishing the speaker is the main part. Next house will definitely have a dedicated theater/bonus room with an AT screen and some DIY speakers and subs behind it.

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post #3617 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 11:31 AM
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I was thinking more along the lines of the bookshelf, a two way speaker with no midrange driver, but my guess is that I would really miss the EMP mids! I think the DIY will have to be after I retire, which won't be for a few years (just hit my 50s). Not sure, but even the cheap ribbon tweeter have a "magical" sound that I really like (I own the SLS Q line speaker with small ribbon tweeter and while that speaker is very limited in bass and output, it sure is clear and detailed in the highs!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
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post #3618 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 11:49 AM
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I'd try to find some Martin Logan Motion 12's or 40's then (if you decided you wanted towers that is). I have no idea what the bookshelf models are, but they are ribbons also and damn do they sound incredible through the midrange and top end. Loved the Motion 40's at BB's Magnolia store. I'd be interested to see what you think of the HTD Level 3 bookshelves against the EMP's though. In that $1,000 speaker shootout, everyone thought the ARX sounded a lot like the Motion 12, which says A LOT for the price of the A5. If Jon (ARX owner) ever decided to up the quality on the exterior (quite a few issues with peeling, etc I've seen) and maybe make it a slightly larger tower (I think it's kinda small isn't it?) I'd be all over it.

The ARX a2 for left and right might fit your bill nicely

I've thought about calling/e-mailing HTD and ARX to ask if they wouldn't mind me doing a review of sorts. Good pictures, notes, etc. I could bring over someone who has owned Revel Salon2, B&W 802's, RBH T2's, etc etc for a bit more educated critiquing.

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post #3619 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post
I'd try to find some Martin Logan Motion 12's or 40's then (if you decided you wanted towers that is). I have no idea what the bookshelf models are, but they are ribbons also and damn do they sound incredible through the midrange and top end. Loved the Motion 40's at BB's Magnolia store. I'd be interested to see what you think of the HTD Level 3 bookshelves against the EMP's though. In that $1,000 speaker shootout, everyone thought the ARX sounded a lot like the Motion 12, which says A LOT for the price of the A5. If Jon (ARX owner) ever decided to up the quality on the exterior (quite a few issues with peeling, etc I've seen) and maybe make it a slightly larger tower (I think it's kinda small isn't it?) I'd be all over it.

The ARX a2 for left and right might fit your bill nicely

I've thought about calling/e-mailing HTD and ARX to ask if they wouldn't mind me doing a review of sorts. Good pictures, notes, etc. I could bring over someone who has owned Revel Salon2, B&W 802's, RBH T2's, etc etc for a bit more educated critiquing.
I'd be very interested in seeing that review.

Denon AVR-1713 | EMP E55Ti | EMP E56Ci | EMP E5Bi | BIC F-12
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post #3620 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 08:19 PM
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Put me down for a PLUS ONE on making that review happen. Arx never enters my thought process when thinking about speakers, for reasons unknown. I guess after hearing a couple low end Martin Logan models, I have always placed them in the "overpriced for what you get" category, much like I feel about Defintive Technology and B&W.

If it wasn't for geography, it would be really cool to get EMP owners together and do a review like that in person! I would be happy to host, but you would have to be a nut to want to come to Iowa and visit the cold in Nov- March!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #3621 of 3729 Old 11-19-2014, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
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Put me down for a PLUS ONE on making that review happen. Arx never enters my thought process when thinking about speakers, for reasons unknown. I guess after hearing a couple low end Martin Logan models, I have always placed them in the "overpriced for what you get" category, much like I feel about Defintive Technology and B&W.

If it wasn't for geography, it would be really cool to get EMP owners together and do a review like that in person! I would be happy to host, but you would have to be a nut to want to come to Iowa and visit the cold in Nov- March!
Had to laugh. For me, you'd be crazy to visit Iowa in the summer as well. Fall and spring are nice (originally from Clinton and lived several years in Cedar Rapids).
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post #3622 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 06:52 AM
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Ds, last winter was brutal, last summer was pretty mild! But your right, we do get our extremes here in the upper midwest. how long since you lived in CR?

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #3623 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 08:39 AM
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Everyone can come to Oklahoma, but honestly...no one ever knows if it's going to be 90 degrees, 12 degrees, raining, dry or if there's a tornado about to happen haha. Some unpredictable weather patterns for sure!

Eli, do you remember what ML's you heard? The Motion 40's I heard were really nice and quite a few people ($1,000 speaker shootout) say they sound just like the ML Motions. I can't say I'd pay $2,000/pair for them though. They're beautiful to look at and sound great, but at $2,000 or so...I'm going with Ascend Sierra towers or the RBH SX-6300/R. If I didn't have a little kiddo running around I'd definitely go with some beefy bookshelves and much better subs

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post #3624 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 02:20 PM
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When I got my EMP's it was between them and the ARX speakers. I love my EMP's but I would have loved to heard the ARX ones as well.

AVR: Denon 2112
Speakers: EMP Tek e55ti, Center- EMP Tek e56ci, Side Surrounds- EMP Tek e55wi, Rear Surrounds- SVS Prime Satellites, Sub- SVS PC12 Plus
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post #3625 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 03:07 PM
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AllenA07: That's the problem. There are so many high quality speakers to choose from and one can only audition a tiny fraction. I had the JBL Studio 530s in the front of the cue to order, and after that the Ascend Sierra 1s (and probably the Philharmonitors). I had already auditioned over a half-dozen speakers in audio stores. I stopped at the E5Bi's and didn't proceed any further. Although I would have loved to have heard those speakers, I've never really looked back, even though they would have been excellent choices.
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post #3626 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 05:08 PM
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Well bummer...would have liked to hear what you had to say about the Studio 530's. Not much on them, but everything I do read (mainly on the 530's and towers) sound like they enjoy them. Heard a lot about how they sound like a well executed horn for the price. The 590's are HUGE though haha

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post #3627 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 05:56 PM
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Bummer indeed, ousooner2. I really wasn't expecting to keep the EMP Tek. I mean, how good can a $225 / pair speakers be? Well, they were certainly good enough for me to keep and they integrated well with my PSA XS30 sub. I just figured, I'd send these back and order the JBLs and so on. On a side note, I was so sure I would select a different speaker that I purchased some pretty expensive stands to hold those that were big and weighed up to 40 lbs. So I admit the EMP Teks look a bit odd on such a large, heavy-duty stand .
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post #3628 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by dsrussell View Post
On a side note, I was so sure I would select a different speaker that I purchased some pretty expensive stands to hold those that were big and weighed up to 40 lbs. So I admit the EMP Teks look a bit odd on such a large, heavy-duty stand .
I have been looking for some really heavy duty stands. What kind do you have?
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post #3629 of 3729 Old 11-20-2014, 09:10 PM
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^ http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1 Just note that I didn't pay nearly that much for these. I got them at the right time for about $168 (still expensive, but not ridiculous like now).
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post #3630 of 3729 Old 11-21-2014, 05:46 AM
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I have been looking for some really heavy duty stands. What kind do you have?
I use some VTI DF series speaker stands for my surrounds on either side of my couch. They are very solid, with solid metal construction and you can fill the center tube with a weighted material and also run wires through them. On the bottom are adjustable spikes, and I have been very happy with the purchase. I also like that the curved design mimics the shape of the EMPs.

I should note the base itself is a solid piece of cast iron, and very heavy.

http://www.wayfair.com/VTI-DF-Series...DF-VI1164.html

They come in various sizes obviously, I went with the tallest for the surrounds.
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Denon AVR-1713 | EMP E55Ti | EMP E56Ci | EMP E5Bi | BIC F-12
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