Have come to a realization--What's the BIG DEAL with these HI-FI SPEAKERS.... - Page 4 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 07:54 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post


Ever read all the horror stories about Audyssey and how people hate it because it ruins their bass well that is because people are use to the "house" curve, hence they like more bass. Audyssey flatness the FR, most times lowering the bass. This is part of making the system more accurate.

Audyssey will correct flawed speakers too, again making the system more accurate. So this begs the question.....If audyssey is modifying speakers FR, why not just buy speakers that are more accurate?? The answer is simple people enjoy inaccurate FR.


I disagree.

What you're doing with Audyssey is squeezing every individual, creative piece of work, into the parameters of the Audyssey equalization.

You're forcing every recording into a glass bottle and restricting the creative individualism and personality of every recording.

Every recording/mix is different. Or should be different.

Some artists/producers want the bass to completely dominate and punch you in the gut.

Some artists/producers want the bass to sit in the back as a subtle heartbeat to the song. Other's want it some where in the middle.

Some artists/producers want their guitar solos to jumpt out and float across the room. They want their solos to jump to the forefront and rip those notes acorss the soundstage.

Some artists/producers want the vocals and/or vocal harmonies to step out above the rest of the instruments and prodominately hoover to cresendos.

Every song is an individual, creative piece of work with it's own personality and ambiance. As well as their own individual little highlight's, nuances and bridges that are meant to be heard in a certain manner.

Sometimes it's a bass drum kick part. Sometimes it's a percussion instrument that's highlighted and thrown out at the listener.

That's what makes music and recordings so wonderful. When done creatively they each have their own character.

It all depends on the recording. Some bass lines pump along in the subtle background, because that's what the artist/producer intended. Some recording have a much more prominent bass line. That goes for other instruments and frequency ranges.

It all depends on what's on the recording and how it was mixed/produced.

Accuracy is not bottling up every recording in a shroud of one specific desirable equaliztion.

So no, you're not getting accuracy. Your getting conformed response.
TjMV3 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 07:58 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post

I disagree.

You can disagree but you are debating something difference and you really do not understand the Definition of audio accuracy from what you are posting so we can not even discuss this until we are on the same topic.

As I said, post that opinion in the audio theory forum, I would love to see what the experts say about that.

Would you like to post your background in the audio world and maybe what measurements/equipment you have to validate any opinion? I think it matters.

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #93 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 07:59 AM
Advanced Member
 
DamageMcRamage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 834
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 18
penn, I think you need to calm down a bit. This is just a hobby for some, and a pursuit of perfection for others. In the end we are all here for the same reason, we really like A/V. I love my modest system, but in no way will I pretend that I have the brains, passion or equipment that some of the members here have. We are all here to have fun, and learn something along the way. Lets not get the thread closed for some pointless bickering.

I like Ice Cream!
DamageMcRamage is online now  
post #94 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:02 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

This is a science forum, people may actually care about audio science.

Yes, I got that by the truly scientific nature of the original post for this thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Thats cool but maybe a little more consistency in what you get offended by would be appreciated.

Fair enough. Suffice it to say that you BOTH were acting a bit childish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Other then that, until proven otherwise I will say you guys are just speaker owners, with no background, no testing equipment, no experience in what Im talking about so you opinion will not be one with any teeth to it. its still a valid opinion for you guys but its definitely a very uneducated audio one.

If that is insulting to you, Im sorry but you really should post some of those thoughts in audio theory to maybe learn what parts are not accurate.

Oh, sticks and stones... But, you're right. In fact, you're absolutely right - at least about me - I can't speak for anyone else. I AM *just an owner*, one of the unwashed masses. I've been thought to be arrogant and egotistical by some, but you have shown me that there's an entirely different league out there when it comes to arrogance and ego - I'm so relieved- I'm an amateur!

But I DO have testing equipment - the two funny-looking round things on the sides of my head - some call them ears. Often, when the input signal is just right, there's a visual indication - the corners of my mouth turn up.

And before you cast too much judgement in your all-seeing, all knowing world, I spent many years in the Anti-Submarine Warfare world, so I know a little about sound propagation and signal processing. I just choose not to shove it down people's throats.

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #95 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:03 AM
AVS Special Member
 
lcaillo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Gainesville, FL
Posts: 3,459
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post

I disagree.

What you're doing with Audyssey is squeezing every individual, creative piece of work, into the parameters of the Audyssey equalization.

You're forcing every recording into a glass bottle and restricting the creative individualism and personality of every recording.

You seem to be confused about what Audyssey and similar systems do. They are not about making every recording sound the same. They are about compensating for the changes in how we perceive sound with volume and correcting for response errors in the system. I am not a big fan of Audyssey itself, but there is a case to be made for what it is trying to do. It has nothing to do with making everything sound the same, however.

Yes, calibration is important...every user should be calibrated.

Need electronics repair? A great place to start looking for a shop in your area: http://www.tvrepairpros.com/
lcaillo is offline  
post #96 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:04 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by DamageMcRamage View Post

penn, I think you need to calm down a bit. This is just a hobby for some, and a pursuit of perfection for others. In the end we are all here for the same reason, we really like A/V. I love my modest system, but in no way will I pretend that I have the brains, passion or equipment that some of the members here have. We are all here to have fun, and learn something along the way. Lets not get the thread closed for some pointless bickering.

The last page is calm discussion. Im extremely calm, I enjoy the debate....

The thread was pointless for the first two pages (they OP is a troll) atleast the last page has some detailed discusion and I think the two members are very confused on what the definition of accuracy is and how it relates to recorded playback.

Im here to learn what I can and teach what I know, if that offends people Im sorry but Im not out to please the world just to satisfy my only education needs.

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #97 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:09 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post


Some PhDs, some people actually in the recording industry, other experts may have a differing opinion then yours.


You're not talking about recording accuracy. You're talking about music playback. The reproduction of recorded audio.

There's a HUGE difference between accurately recording music and playing back in a typical home. That's seems to be a point your either over-looking or confusiing.

I'm sure those PHDs will be more than happy to point that out to you.

Furthermore, if those PHDs are the very same PHDs who have been trashing the quality of recordings/mixes and physical music media; then I'll pass on their "oh so scientific" knowledge. They are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #98 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:18 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLDWV View Post

Yes, I got that by the truly scientific nature of the original post for this thread.

The thread was a joke, we both know that! He questioned me by first mocking me then by later asking a valid question (Im sure he was mocking again). If you do not want science here, do not ask for it. Do not reply or disagree..just read/ignore and move on. Why do people post insults/arguements then run when science gets involved?

Quote:


Fair enough. Suffice it to say that you BOTH were acting a bit childish.


Hey, I posted an opinion on general speaker selection. Its a valid opinion that even the experts out there have commented on so Im just following what they have said already. People could just disagree and move.

Quote:


Oh, sticks and stones... But, you're right. In fact, you're absolutely right - at least about me - I can't speak for anyone else. I AM *just an owner*, one of the unwashed masses. I've been thought to be arrogant and egotistical by some, but you have shown me that there's an entirely different league out there when it comes to arrogance and ego - I'm so relieved- I'm an amateur!

But I DO have testing equipment - the two funny-looking round things on the sides of my head - some call them ears. Often, when the input signal is just right, there's a visual indication - the corners of my mouth turn up.

And before you cast too much judgement in your all-seeing, all knowing world, I spent many years in the Anti-Submarine Warfare world, so I know a little about sound propagation and signal processing. I just choose not to shove it down people's throats.

Then use the equipment/knowledge in your posts. That would be cool to know more about.

As for the ears comment....your brain controls what you interpet sound to be so I do not hold the ears in high regard for accuracy because proper test have proven people are wrong more about sound then they are right. Test have also proven that most people can not here Nulls in the FR, can not hear higher harmonic distortion and so on. Do not jump all over that statement and say "I Can here.....", I qualify it with most.

I have to ask, If you are happy with your systems, if you have no need to learn more about audio science why are you even arguing accuracy with anyone online? Im here to find a great deal weekly ($400 or so weekly goes to new products ), to learn and to educate.

Note: if you think all this opinion is just arrogance and ego and you are stuck with that mindset so be it but your bias towards me has little do with the accurate opinion I have posted.

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #99 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:19 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcaillo View Post

You seem to be confused about what Audyssey and similar systems do. They are not about making every recording sound the same. They are about compensating for the changes in how we perceive sound with volume and correcting for response errors in the system. I am not a big fan of Audyssey itself, but there is a case to be made for what it is trying to do. It has nothing to do with making everything sound the same, however.


Honestly, I have tried Audyssey. I worked with it for several months in one of my systems and that's the impression it left on me.

I do understand what it's supposed to do and what it does.

I'm certain that others (and yourself) view it differently. But I what I heard and felt about Audyssey was that it robbed a lot of the recordings of their individual character and personality. It homogenized the sound of every CD I put in.

Now, some recordings were less effected than others. I found that recordings that were more standard and plain, were pretty much the same with a slight adjustment ihn the overall EQ.

But those recordings that reall have some intersting ambiance, creative mixing and production ......were robbed of that personality and character.

That's what I heard and felt.

To each his own.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #100 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:19 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post

You're not talking about recording accuracy. You're talking about music playback. The reproduction of recorded audio.

There's a HUGE difference between accurately recording music and playing back in a typical home. That's seems to be a point your either over-looking or confusiing.

I'm sure those PHDs will be more than happy to point that out to you.

Furthermore, if those PHDs are the very same PHDs who have been trashing the quality of recordings/mixes and physical music media; then I'll pass on their "oh so scientific" knowledge. They are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

Read above what someone else posted, you seem to want to argue every corner of the debate with me.

I have said enough, the information is out there for you guys. You can learn or you can ignore. Its up to you.

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #101 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:22 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Why do people post insults/arguements then run when science gets involved?.

Who's running? What are you talking about?

I'm here discussing this with you.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #102 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:32 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Im here to learn what I can and teach what I know, if that offends people Im sorry but Im not out to please the world just to satisfy my only education needs.

Hey, I'm not the least bit offended, but DMcR is right - a civil, respectful debate is always going to be more productive than a flame-fest. And don't get me wrong, I'm not diss'ing you or your knowledge of audio theory. I'm sure you DO know more about it than I do. You just need to work on your presentation a little bit. OK, a LOT.

(My) Last word on accuracy - if it was ALL about accuracy, then we could take every set of speakers ever made into the test lab, come up with a numerical figure, and rank order them for price vs. accuracy - and be done with it. Right? People could just grab the table, look up their price range, and pick the highest ranked speaker in that range. They're guaranteed to be happy that way. No fuss, no muss, no need for this forum (except to house the list/table).

I'm not trying to say that accuracy isn't very important, it's just not EVERYTHING. Personally, I'm a big believer in auditioning speakers in your own home - as well as ones that are twice your target price - just so you know what you are or aren't missing.

Dang, I'm just not keeping up with these posts!

Look, if I ever have a cyborg over to the house, I'll be sure to point out how accurate my speakers are (he'll already know). I know you're a smart man, but do you know how rediculous it sounds to say that you don't trust your ears? What are you going to use to enjoy your speakers when you get them home? ( I suppose your butt can enjoy the bass...) In just about every speaker review I've ever read, the reviewer always includes his general impressions of how the speakers sounded to him/her. Science needs to take into account common sense sometimes.

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #103 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:41 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

The thread was a joke, we both know that! He questioned me by first mocking me then by later asking a valid question (Im sure he was mocking again). If you do not want science here, do not ask for it. Do not reply or disagree..just read/ignore and move on. Why do people post insults/arguements then run when science gets involved?
.

Seriously, there's nothing funnier to me than when guys like you come off from the start with some pompus, arrogant (and ultimately ignorant and belittling ) comments and then spend the rest of the thread backpeddling and lobbing out spinjobs to cover up and justify their own words and attitude.

To make matters funnier, you've spent several posts both being proud of your arrogance and trying desperately to defend it. Which is hilarious.

Simply make up your mind as to whether you're proud of it or if you want to backpeddle and make excuses for yourself. Pick one and go with it.

Yes, I was making fun of you in my first post to you. And you deseved it, despite your cries of victimization and martyrdom. If you can't take it, don't dish it out. And clearly that is the case, here.

You can continue calling me a troll all you want.

But my post history shows that I have been here for years, on this forum, discussing the different speakers I like/know and helping others with questions regarding models and brands. As well, several people have helped me along the way, without a hint of arrogance and rude snobbery.

Just because someone disagrees with you, doesn't make them a troll.

And I will continue to express my disagreement whether you like or not. Bite me.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #104 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

Read above what someone else posted, you seem to want to argue every corner of the debate with me.


Interesting. Because that's a VERY SIGNIFICANT corner in this debate.

Accuracy in recording is significantly different from the reproduction/playback of music in a typical home.

Audyssey is not the end all in what you call 'accuracy".

In fact, it's more inaccurate because of what it does and how it works.

It conforms every recording into a set room node EQ.


Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray View Post

I have said enough, the information is out there for you guys. You can learn or you can ignore. Its up to you.

What, was that the equivelent of "I'm taking my ball and going home! " ???
TjMV3 is offline  
post #105 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 08:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLDWV View Post

Hey, I'm not the least bit offended, but DMcR is right - a civil, respectful debate is always going to be more productive than a flame-fest.

It's mindboggling he thinks anyone was offended.

It wasn't offensive, it was funny and absurd.

Hence my poking fun at him.

I guess it's only fun to him, when he's doing the jabbing.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #106 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:25 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I know, but you're scaring the kids...

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #107 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:31 AM
otk
AVS Special Member
 
otk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,496
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLDWV View Post

Maybe we need to ask AVS to add a smiley that's got its thumbs in it's ears, tongue out, blowing a raspberry.


All this noise about noise.
♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫
Finding the acoustic sweet spot.
otk is offline  
post #108 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:33 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by otk View Post


Thanks! Wow! Who says the service around here stinks!?!

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #109 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:37 AM
Senior Member
 
02fx4dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 368
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Judging by the last few pages of this thread, I would say the troll has done his job well.
02fx4dude is offline  
post #110 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:42 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02fx4dude View Post

Judging by the last few pages of this thread, I would say the troll has done his job well.

...And now that he's gone back under his bridge, we may NEVER know if he'll part with his Bose Wave Radio...

I'll keep watching the classifieds...

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #111 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:43 AM
AVS Special Member
 
chirpie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Olathe, Kansas
Posts: 3,550
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post

1) Accuracy is at best an obscure and and vague concept in this home audio hobby.

That's odd, because I was able to measure my room's frequency response, eq a bass peak down from it's +6 db spike, and get smooth/less boomy bass as a result.

Of course we know what the artist wants, it's right there on the recording. But if they're plucking a bass guitar and my room is 6 db louder in that frequency range, you can bet that I'm not hearing what they wanted.

How then, is accuracy vague and obscure in this example?

How then, does it not serve the artist?
chirpie is offline  
post #112 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:49 AM
Senior Member
 
02fx4dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 368
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLDWV View Post

...And now that he's gone back under his bridge, we may NEVER know if he'll part with his Bose Wave Radio...

I'll keep watching the classifieds...

He just went to a different bridge...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1137214
02fx4dude is offline  
post #113 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:54 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Easyaspie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,310
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post

I disagree.

What you're doing with Audyssey is squeezing every individual, creative piece of work, into the parameters of the Audyssey equalization.

You're forcing every recording into a glass bottle and restricting the creative individualism and personality of every recording.

Every recording/mix is different. Or should be different.

Some artists/producers want the bass to completely dominate and punch you in the gut.

Some artists/producers want the bass to sit in the back as a subtle heartbeat to the song. Other's want it some where in the middle.

Some artists/producers want their guitar solos to jumpt out and float across the room. They want their solos to jump to the forefront and rip those notes acorss the soundstage.

Some artists/producers want the vocals and/or vocal harmonies to step out above the rest of the instruments and prodominately hoover to cresendos.

Every song is an individual, creative piece of work with it's own personality and ambiance. As well as their own individual little highlight's, nuances and bridges that are meant to be heard in a certain manner.

Sometimes it's a bass drum kick part. Sometimes it's a percussion instrument that's highlighted and thrown out at the listener.

That's what makes music and recordings so wonderful. When done creatively they each have their own character.

It all depends on the recording. Some bass lines pump along in the subtle background, because that's what the artist/producer intended. Some recording have a much more prominent bass line. That goes for other instruments and frequency ranges.

It all depends on what's on the recording and how it was mixed/produced.

Accuracy is not bottling up every recording in a shroud of one specific desirable equaliztion.

So no, you're not getting accuracy. Your getting conformed response.

I read this and I had to post. You don't understand what Audyssey does apparently. It is supposed to make your speakers and room response accurate, or as accurate as possible by flattening response. As far as what the producers or artists intend, that will come through in the mix. When your system is more accurately playing what is on the recording you'll here what the artist intended.

edit: I see that others have tried to get this through to you already.
Easyaspie is offline  
post #114 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 09:55 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by TjMV3 View Post


What, was that the equivelent of "I'm taking my ball and going home! " ???

It meant that you are stubborn in your position and there is no need to debate someone that is stuck in the same old "faith based" position. Its the same reason people do not argue about religion.

Your posts indicate that you have room for education and that you already have a set misunderstanding about "accuracy" and actually about Audyssey so no need to continue down a wasted road with you. If you want to understand more, just post your thoughts in the audio theory forum. I doubt you will bother because we both know the truth about your position here.

Quote:
Audyssey is not the end all in what you call 'accuracy".

In fact, it's more inaccurate because of what it does and how it works.

It conforms every recording into a set room node EQ.

Do you realize how silly that opinion sounds? Nevermind, I knew from your first "Haha, thats funny...." that you have no idea what we are talking about, this stuff is honestly going right over your head. Time to move onto something meaningful.

btw, I have never backpeddle once, my position is set and fixed with facts behind me as for belittling you? Well should not have mocked me, its really that simple...do not dish something out that you can not back up. I can back up my arrogance, my ego, I have done it all very successfully so I have no reason to back down to ignorance!

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #115 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
zero the hero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,360
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easyaspie View Post

I read this and I had to post. You don't understand what Audyssey does apparently. It is supposed to make your speakers and room response accurate, or as accurate as possible by flattening response. As far as what the producers or artists intend, that will come through in the mix. When your system is more accurately playing what is on the recording you'll here what the artist intended.

edit: I see that others have tried to get this through to you already.

You can lead a horse to water...
zero the hero is offline  
post #116 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:06 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02fx4dude View Post

Judging by the last few pages of this thread, I would say the troll has done his job well.

lmao, touche!

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #117 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:08 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by chirpie View Post

That's odd, because I was able to measure my room's frequency response, eq a bass peak down from it's +6 db spike, and get smooth/less boomy bass as a result.

Of course we know what the artist wants, it's right there on the recording. But if they're plucking a bass guitar and my room is 6 db louder in that frequency range, you can bet that I'm not hearing what they wanted.

How then, is accuracy vague and obscure in this example?

How then, does it not serve the artist?

How do you know it wasn't meant to be 6db louder?

Did you do take a look at the recording's original master waveform?

Was it a recently remastered disc? What kind of remastering was done? Was it brickwalled?

There's a lot of factors involved.

Are your speakers rear-ported? If so, how close to the backwall are they placed?

What about absorbtion materials or furniture in the room?

Listen, I'm not against using an equalizer in extreme cases with unusally bad rooms or really bad recordings. I do it myself. Just not with Audyssey. And certainly not as a permanent, all across the board solution for all of my music.


Like I said, I feel it robs the music/recording of it's character and personality. And some of that character and personality is in the way the recording is EQ/mixed and the kind of effects (panning...etc) used.

Ultimately I feel it robs the recording of it's nuances...it's ambiances and identity.

Accuracy is a very subjective concept when it comes to home audio. And that is the main point.

What some people see as accuracy in their Audyssey, I see as homogenation.

And homogenation to my ears, isn't accurate.
TjMV3 is offline  
post #118 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:08 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by zero the hero View Post

You can lead a horse to water...

It turns out I guess I beat the horses to water

Note to self : "take a different appoarch, shower them with kindness first...."

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #119 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:10 AM
Senior Member
 
RLDWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Martinsburg, WV
Posts: 261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02fx4dude View Post

He just went to a different bridge...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1137214


You're right! Damn that's funny! Quick, let's pack up this Jihad and take it over to that thread - it's not going anywhere anyway...

...there are also unknown unknowns. These are things we don't know we don't know." -D. Rumsfeld
RLDWV is offline  
post #120 of 175 Old 04-09-2009, 10:10 AM
AVS Special Member
 
TjMV3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easyaspie View Post

I read this and I had to post. You don't understand what Audyssey does apparently. It is supposed to make your speakers and room response accurate, or as accurate as possible by flattening response. As far as what the producers or artists intend, that will come through in the mix. When your system is more accurately playing what is on the recording you'll here what the artist intended.

edit: I see that others have tried to get this through to you already.

And my point is and has been this.....

It doesn't really work that way. To my ears, it does what you just quoted me as saying.
TjMV3 is offline  
Reply Speakers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off